bajaden
Hall of Famer
My span, if you need to know was about five years of bad basketball and five years of good basketball. Unfortunally when they started winning, they priced themselves out of my market. I'm not going to go over the entire history of the Kings organization. We've already done that. However, they had ample opportunity to draft better players, and it had nothing to do with their position. They drafted Joe Kleine when they could have drafted Karl Malone.. They drafted Kenny Smith when they could have drafted Kevin Johnson. So yes, the front office didn't have a clue what they were doing.
My point is that I never went to games and thought they were intentionaly trying to lose. Were they incapable of winning? Yes. There is a difference.
By the way, in another thread, you questioned whether I was a fan or not. In my opinon thats a condescending attitude and unnecessary. I have always tried to be respectful of you and I expect the same in return. I may see the glass half full and you may see it half empty, but in the end, I think we both want the same thing. A winning team.
PFFFT!!
Starter
ohh you know picking topics here and there that interest me and checking things out from afar. Also trying to teach my 2 1/2 year old how to pass the basketball when dad goes out and shoots the rock. Not working Im afraid.
PFFFT!!
Starter
Maybe he's a 2-guard and wants to take the shot himself?
Anyway, good to see you around. Long time since the old "Kingslut" days, huh?
he does want to shoot. Needs to build some muscles though. Ahhh yes, Kingslut. I totally forgot about that.
That was like 7 or 8 years ago. Ouch.
tyrant
Starter
im sure douby and the other kids can show their stuff against this wretched defense in a 40 minute practice. you have this large entity called the NBA, and you need playing time to get better in it. its the coach's call, so far he's done nothing but prove he can be a moron in more than a few ways. he and muss were surely separated at birth. and you have this large gap of air between the coach and the owners because none of them have a clue on how to get this team back into the playoffs. theres no competence and no trust. granted you wont make dumb decisions all the time, but its been bad decision after bad decision ever since we traded webber.
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Hawes was also under the knife at the beginning of the season....
Big Cuz 15
All-Star
if the philly seventy six urrrrrrrrrzzzzzzzzz can play their youngsters and win games...... why can't we? gotta look at the hed coach. 6rs are exciting, young and WINNING. they don't have a roster w a badass franchise player either.
Big Cuz 15
All-Star
this is freakinng wonderful hearing how douby is a waste of a draft pick. THATS WHAT YOU GET WHEN YOU PICK LATE IN THE DRAFT. you get that by winning meaningless games. get a late draft pick and keep this retarded cycle of giving ridiculous contracts to aged vets put only straps our cap for the next 5 yrs. I hope he gets a award for surpassing last yrs game total and frame it. this season has been pathetic. three cheers for mediocriteeee!
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upinsmoke
All-Star
Big Cuz 15
All-Star
one and half word, re - build.
Kevin Martin was picked 26th overall in 2004. Do you consider him a wasted pick?
Big Cuz 15
All-Star
no, how many players are picked in the late 1st round that don't turn out to be anything special? people are complaining its a lousy pick. well, move on up then if you want to be able to pick from a bigger pool of talent.
Big Cuz 15
All-Star
it's pointless when your mathematically eliminated from the playoffs and when you aren't developing talent.
I had a theory that the draft has fewer pleasant surprises than it did in the old days, before the NBA was big money. So I did a quick re-examination of the draft, like a simplified version of Brick's chart, but starting in 1991 instead of 1985, and looking only at All Stars (there have been no HOFers drafted since then anyway).
Here are the chances of being an All Star, based on draft position, for '91-'07.
#1 pick: 65% chance
2-5 pick: 40% chance
6-10 pick: 16% chance
11-30: 5% chance
31-60: 1% chance
Undrafted: much less than 1% (2 out of untold hundreds)
Here are the chances of being an All Star, based on draft position, for '91-'07.
#1 pick: 65% chance
2-5 pick: 40% chance
6-10 pick: 16% chance
11-30: 5% chance
31-60: 1% chance
Undrafted: much less than 1% (2 out of untold hundreds)
Although none of us have seen Reggie's job description, I propose that the key to Reggie's job is to do what his bosses tell him.
Last I heard, Jerry and Geoff were both talking about playing the kids. If Reggie is trying to massage his own ego (and/or Artest's) by playing the vets instead, that's not doing his job, that's going on some sort of personal diversion.
upinsmoke
All-Star
Pointless? cmon buddy its about the bottom line of putting butts in the seats. Maybe not for this year but next year if the kings can win 40 people might think "hey things are looking up"
No franchise players?
Hmm, Iverson sure helped with the following:
Andre Miller - December 19, 2006 Acquired from Denver along with Joe Smith and two first round draft picks in the 2007 NBA Draft for Allen Iverson and Ivan McFarlin.
2007 76ers draft picks: Thaddeus Young (12th) and Daequan Cook, who turned into Jason Smith
2004 76ers draft Andre Iguodala, 9th pick.
You haven't been watching sixers ball if you don't think Iguodala is badass. He's a perfect fit for that team.
This isn't just a motley assortment of youngsters. They were put together with a purpose.
...and they're in the East.
Packt
Starter
I blame management for all the missteps. They wasted last year and they wasted this year. I know Petrie has said they don't tell the coach who to play, but is there no goal, no contingency plan at least?
I don't care too much about who plays now. You can't turn a chump into a champ in pointless games. However, they should be preparing for the summer. Trade bait should be put on displayed. Specifically Douby, if it means playing more than Martin, do it. Figure out Ron, if he isn't in your long term goals decide how to handle it. Beno, Shelden, Brad, now is the time to decide who is going to be here next year.
I don't care too much about who plays now. You can't turn a chump into a champ in pointless games. However, they should be preparing for the summer. Trade bait should be put on displayed. Specifically Douby, if it means playing more than Martin, do it. Figure out Ron, if he isn't in your long term goals decide how to handle it. Beno, Shelden, Brad, now is the time to decide who is going to be here next year.
Bricklayer
Don't Make Me Use The Bat
No, Reggie's job is to do whatever he can to help the franchise. Period. When winning matters, what he can do to help the franchise is win. When player development matters, what he can do to help the franchise is develop players. We have alreayd lost the season. Winning no longer matters. Developing players does.
Reggie's problem would appear to be two fold, or maybe just one or the other. Either a) his massive ego will not allow him to do his job, which at this point is develop players and help us in our offseason. Or b) he is too selfish to do his job and wants to pad his coaching resume for the day he gets fired and needs to get a new job. There is of course the c) option: that his bosses are either idiotic or spinless and sanction the whole thing. come to think of that is more likely to be an "and" than an "or" option.
Bricklayer
Don't Make Me Use The Bat
Well...I have been watching them. And no, they really werent' put together with much of a purpose. Or at least not this purpose. Not this year. Not this soon. They have a second rate star, no real #1 offensive option, an old PG and roleplaying PF, and then a bunch of kids at various stages of development. The plan there was obviosuly for the future, and nothing the matter with that. Seemed like they were doing a solid job of stockpiling, albeit without landing the big star they will need eventually. But this recent success...farily remarkable, and well ahead of schedule like Portland. No way this was the plan, not this soon. But as you say, they are in the East, so get yourself to 38 wins and you have a solid shot at the playoffs.
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Entity
Hall of Famer
What talent are you talking about. Our last 4 draft picks
Kevin Martin- I'd say he has been developed into our start pg and leading the team in ppg.
Francisco Garcia- one of the best defensive players and 3pt shooters on our team and #1 guy off the bench playing behind Martin and Artest hard to start but, has developed into a good NBA player
Quincy Douby- tried to have him at pg didn't work. Therefore stuck behind Martin and Garcia at the SG position. So anymore development or playing time for him probably takes away the development of Garcia and Martin.
Spencer Hawes- No training camp. Coming off surgery. Only 19 years old and has had good playing time lately until the ankle injury. With all those variables I think he is coming along quite nicely.
Beno-(non draft pick) young pg and is our starting pg now for sure since the trade of Bibby.
So tell me sir what young players do you speak of we are not developing?
Sheldon Williams who was only trade fodder and and was stuck to the end of the Bench in Atlanta?
Quincy Douby- not a pg, to small for sg and stuck behind 2 other good young players at that position. Not to mention he doesn't have a good head on his shoulders.
Basically your young "TALENT" are Beno, Martin, Garcia, and Hawes.
You act as if we have 4 or 5 22 year olds getting DNP's everynight. Thats not the case.
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SacKings7
Starter
I think he means that the young guys that you listed should be getting the majority of the minutes while getting valuable experience, instead of the vets playing 40mins a game and the young guys just playing to give the other guys a few minutes rest. I like Reggie a lot more than Musselman, but each game we win now is costing us a better draft pick. We're pretty much stuck in 11th spot in the West, but there's 3 or 4 teams in the East with a worse record than us who are fighting for the playoffs, and who all want to win
upinsmoke
All-Star
Great point except Martin is a sg but im sure that was a typo. Furthurmore i stand by my comments on Reggie that worrying about the draft is not his problem, I doubt GP has told Reggie to stop trying to win.
Entity
Hall of Famer
Well the vets play positioins that the young guys don't play. As I stated if you think Williams is a "talent" you don't have very high hopes for the team anyway. Hawes has gotten good playing time considering age and injury's. Missing training camp set Hawes way back and the fact that Brad Miller has had one of the best years of his career impeeds his time as well. All in all I have seen Spencer's potential and I am sure his minutes will be increased alot next season and should be ready to take over the starting job after next season and he will still be only 21 years old and had 2 years experience in the NBA.
Big Cuz 15
All-Star
for players to "DEVELOP" they need playing time. did we know what we had with kevin before or after he started getting playing time? the PG experiment with quincy is futile with reggie yanking him out as soon as he makes a mistake. players need to make mistakes in order to learn, to improve.
shelden needs to get out there and play. whether he stays long term or not, we'll find out what we are going to do with from consistent minutes. as for mikki mouse, k9, SAR - we already know for a fact they won't be with the team after their contracts expire.
isn't salmons the 1st swingman to come off the bench? when did garcia unseat him for this slot?
hawes, the guy better be damn good if we're picking him in the lotto! lotto players are supposed to be good or skilled. thats why they are picked in the lotto.
you act like players getting 4-10 mins is developing. the only thing they are developing is their towel waving technique with the extra time on the bench.
proposed solution instead of just bitching..
1) if the reggie isn't willing to develop them or continuing his quest to make the playoffs. he needs to put these young guys in the D league and get that experience. quincy would be a great candidate for this so he could work on his PG skills (that is if they are still trying to convert him).
2) sit the vets and tell em this is for the future of the kings.
Entity
Hall of Famer
to put K9 and SAR in you argument as if they are playing is pointless. KT is uninjured and hasn't played a min in over 2 months so don't act as if he is taking time away from anybody. One other note you might want to pay attention to is if you just sit Moore and Miller guess what that does to their trade value vs. getting double doubles.
I don't care if Douby plays 100 min a night he is not a significant part of the kings future in the starting lineup. Sheldon Williams should not be a significant part of the kings future even coming off the bench.
Douby is not better than Beno,Martin,Garcia, or Salmons all of which whom he has to beat out for playing time. Douby is a SG and i am sorry he is not getting Martin or Garcia's PT. As for pg Beno is just better so why sit these young guys in favor of that young guy. Unless Douby grows 9 inches and gains 90lbs he isn't going to be a King after his rookie contract and neither will Williams. Players like those 2 guys are a dime a dozen in the FA market year in and year out.
Some players will not develop regardless of PT. A crappy movie isn't any better if you add an hour to it. Titanic would have been awesome if they started it when the boat started sinking.
Quincy can't D league at this point. Basically you're looking at another set of contract enders.
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