How Do Conley and Law stack up against the 2008-draft's PGs

[beb0p]

I'm a little curious cuz next year's draft is supposed to be loaded with talented PGs. The wisdom according to some is that we wait until next yr to draft a PG, even if Mike Conley or Acie Law is available.

Unfortunately, I don't watch HS bb, so I don't know much about the PGs in the 2008 draft, many of whom is about to enter college.

However, let have some fun and say, if you have to rank Conley and Law together with next year's PGs, how would you rank them? Below are some of my thought on the 2008 PGs, all the HS prospects' are based purely on mock sites' description so it's probably a little to way off base. Nonetheless, here goes:

1) OJ Mayo. PG/SG. 6'5. Supposedly very athletic and can score at will. But is he a PG? His game supposedly consisted of taking quick shots and creating shots for himself, but has good vision and can create for others when needed. Still has to learn to control the tempo. That just doesn't sound like a PG to me. That sounds like an all-around SG. Maybe a taller AI or shorter T-Mac. I think whoever drafts Mayo still need to look for a PG to compliment him.

2) Derrick Rose. PG. 6'3. A more athletic Jason Kidd? Like Conley and Kidd, Rose can't shoot but can really run a team. He sounds similar to Conley and maybe good enough to be one and done.

3) Eric Gordon. PG/SG. 6'3. Undersized SG. Still has alot to learn to play lead. Sounds to me he needs at least two yrs to work on being a PG.

4) Darren Collison. PG. 6'1. UCLA. Very quick, can shoot and run a team.

5) Jerryd Bayless. PG. 6'3. Shoot-first PG. Needs to improve playmaking.

6) Ty Lawson. PG. 5'11. UNC. Good quickness, decent shooter and can run a team.


Right now, I'd put Conley and Law ahead of Eric Gordon, Bayless and Lawson. Gordon and Bayless sounds like the next Antonio Daniels/Flip Murray until they show they can play PG. Lawson is good, but not Conley/Law good.

OJ Mayo may be future all-star but he is simply not a PG.

So here is how I rank them as PG:
1. Derrick Rose.
2. Darren Collison / Mike Conley
4. Acie Law
5. Eric Gordon
6. Jerryd Bayless
7. Ty Lawson

Collison and Conley are tied cuz I simply can't decide who's better - it's like picking between Kevin Johnson and Jason Kidd (okay, best case scenario). Derrick Rose is top because of his Kidd like intangibles plus size and athleticism. IMO, Acie Law easily triumphs the two tweeners and Ty Lawson.

So in essense, if we pass up Conley/Law this yr; we'll have to get Rose/Collison next yr to get equal or better value. Thus, I say if a PG is available and it's the best player possible, we take him. Even if 2008 is supposed to be a deep PG draft.

What do you think?

 

[Vlade4GM]

It would be hard for me to consider Gordon a PG, more like a small SG like Ben Gordon. Maybe Bayless if he can pull off an Arenas type role.

As far as Mayo, I don't think he will be a PG in the NBA or at least he'll play SG more. However I think he easily CAN be a PG, he definitely has the ability for it just like Wade does, but whether he'll accept a PG role I don't know. I could see 25-7 numbers in his future though.

1. Derrick Rose
2. Darren Collison
3. Jerryd Bayless
4. Mike Conley
5. Acie Law
6. Ty Lawson

Collison is the much better shooter, facilitator, defender, and leader than Conley IMO. Conley (he will never ever be even in the same mold as Kidd) doesn't have that much more size and athleticism for me to ignore the other factors. Deciding between Bayless and Conley, I just asked myself who would I rather take my chances on and I said Bayless despite Conley easily being more pure of a PG. I think Bayless has the intangibles to improve enough to be a servicable PG as far as his facilitating skills, but will definitely be more of a scorer. Bayless will be the much better overall player and that's what gives him the edge to me. I had some trouble with Law and Lawson, but Law is just way more polished and is much more of a known quantity than Lawson. Lawson is more physically gifted and more of a pure PG, but he's still very raw and doesn't have a real go to move despite having elite quickness.

 

[Gary]

Can you imagine if we were to get Mayo next year, and Oden this year?

Ugh.. Gary...

I get these throughts in my head about if we were to get lucky in the lottery. I don't think next year Mayo will be #1, so we would only have to get real lucky once

Imagine though...

PG-Mayo
SG-Martin
SF-Garcia
PF-*sigh*
C-Oden

That would be a team that could/would contend for years to come. Hell, Throw in Miller at the PF and he would probally be in the top 10 for assists in the league.

 

[nbrans]

I haven't seen the high school seniors play other than on YouTube clips, but Derrick Rose looks like just about one of the most athletic people on the planet.

My problem with Conley and Law is that they're not as athletic as the point guards that have recently come into the league and the young whippersnappers who will be coming in the next few years. I agree with Vlade4GM about Collison, who possesses more quickness PLUS more shooting ability than Conley and Law, and with another year of seasoning I think will be a really strong prospect. If Ty Lawson can harness his athletic ability he's yet another young fast point guard.

Conley and Law are old-school guys. Conley's sort of like Andre Miller and Law's sort of like Sam Cassell, but the era where you want someone like Miller and Cassell is gone. It's sort of like thinking Jeff Hornacek could be your shooting guard now -- the game has changed, guys are way more athletic, and the old school point guard is a thing of the past. The new guys (Chris Paul, Deron Williams) are old school point guards AND they're ridiculously athletic. The bar has been raised. You have to be more athletic.

I just can't get excited about Conley and Law.

 

[Vlade4GM]

I think this is actually going to be more of an intriguing freshman class than this past year's. Rose and Beasley are my favs, I like Mayo too but the guy seems like too much of a head case to be trusted with a franchise.

 

[Smills91]

I haven't seen the high school seniors play other than on YouTube clips, but Derrick Rose looks like just about one of the most athletic people on the planet.

My problem with Conley and Law is that they're not as athletic as the point guards that have recently come into the league and the young whippersnappers who will be coming in the next few years. I agree with Vlade4GM about Collison, who possesses more quickness PLUS more shooting ability than Conley and Law, and with another year of seasoning I think will be a really strong prospect. If Ty Lawson can harness his athletic ability he's yet another young fast point guard.

Conley and Law are old-school guys. Conley's sort of like Andre Miller and Law's sort of like Sam Cassell, but the era where you want someone like Miller and Cassell is gone. It's sort of like thinking Jeff Hornacek could be your shooting guard now -- the game has changed, guys are way more athletic, and the old school point guard is a thing of the past. The new guys (Chris Paul, Deron Williams) are old school point guards AND they're ridiculously athletic. The bar has been raised. You have to be more athletic.

I just can't get excited about Conley and Law.

Who would be your top 10 that you'd pick over Conley or Law then?
I undestand oden/durant at 1/2 but from there on who would you like to see the Kings draft?

 

[nbrans]

Who would be your top 10 that you'd pick over Conley or Law then?
I undestand oden/durant at 1/2 but from there on who would you like to see the Kings draft?

I'm not totally sure yet, but I wouldn't be excited about the Kings drafting a point guard or shooting guard, and would be fine with trading up or out of the draft. But there are plenty of really good 3/4/5s in this draft without having to draft Conley or Law.

Right now my own personal top 10 goes:

1. Oden
2. Durant
3. Horford
4. Jianlian
5. Brandon Wright
6. Hibbert
7. Noah
8. Brewer
9. Thad Young
10. Jason Smith

 

[LPKingsFan]

Just as soon take Collison next year (will likely be availalbe in the 7-12 range, so we wouldn't even have to suck that much more) and get a big this year, whatever it takes (shipping Bibby and Artest, etc).

 

[HighFlyingMonkey]

Conley's athleticism is underrated, but Rose's just completely blows him out of the water. Watching YouTube clips of him really take your breath away.

I am actually in favor of trading up in this draft to grab a big. Maybe, if Minny's in love with Corey Brewer, we can trade Bibby + 10th for Davis, Filler + 7th. A really good big like Horford, Wright, or Jianlian could be hanging out there.

If trading up is not possible, I'd like us to take Conley with the 10th.

Edit: BTW, Collison is not better than Conley. Not even close.

 

[Smills91]

I'm not totally sure yet, but I wouldn't be excited about the Kings drafting a point guard or shooting guard, and would be fine with trading up or out of the draft. But there are plenty of really good 3/4/5s in this draft without having to draft Conley or Law.

Right now my own personal top 10 goes:

1. Oden
2. Durant
3. Horford
4. Jianlian
5. Brandon Wright
6. Hibbert
7. Noah
8. Brewer
9. Thad Young
10. Jason Smith

Jianlian over B. Wright???????

If I had to take out Conley and Law from my top ten it would look like this:

1) Oden
2) Durant
3) Horford
4) B. Wright
5) C. Brewer
6) R. Hibbert
7) J. Wright
8) J. Green
9) S. Hawes
10) J. Noah

Not a fan of the Jianlian mystique.

 

[nbrans]

Jianlian over B. Wright???????

To me Jianlian has much more potential. He's just as athletic as Wright and has many offensive skills. Wright scares me for a top 4 or 5 pick because he doesn't really dominate games and I question whether he's going to be the rebounder or shotblocker that he would need to be to justify that pick since right now he's so limited offenisvely. His upside is undeniable, but I really like Jianlian's.

 

[Smills91]

To me Jianlian has much more potential. He's just as athletic as Wright and has many offensive skills. Wright scares me for a top 4 or 5 pick because he doesn't really dominate games and I question whether he's going to be the rebounder or shotblocker that he would need to be to justify that pick since right now he's so limited offenisvely. His upside is undeniable, but I really like Jianlian's.

Wow, I see it completely reversed...Wright IMO would be a #1 pick in many previous drafts and many future drafts...he's slotted at #4-5 in this draft because it's so stacked.

 

[nbrans]

Wow, I see it completely reversed...Wright IMO would be a #1 pick in many previous drafts and many future drafts...he's slotted at #4-5 in this draft because it's so stacked.

I agree with you there -- although Jianlian would also probably be #1 in another draft as well.

 

[Bricklayer]

Jianlin is no mystique -- in fact of all the draft prospects this year, its actually precisely Jianlian and B. Wright who I think have the most impressive fundamental skillset (outside of Durant).

 

[nbrans]

It's also worth noting that Jianlian went up against some of the best frontcourt players in America and held his own in the Worlds.

 

[LPKingsFan]

Kings 08-09:

Darren Collison
Kevin Martin
Boris Diaw
Yi Jianlan
Tiago Splitter (or comparable late first pick)

Get 'er gone, Geoff.

 

[Vlade4GM]

To me Jianlian has much more potential. He's just as athletic as Wright and has many offensive skills. Wright scares me for a top 4 or 5 pick because he doesn't really dominate games and I question whether he's going to be the rebounder or shotblocker that he would need to be to justify that pick since right now he's so limited offenisvely. His upside is undeniable, but I really like Jianlian's.

That's not how UNC plays. Can't fault him for that.

 

[HighFlyingMonkey]

To me Jianlian has much more potential. He's just as athletic as Wright and has many offensive skills. Wright scares me for a top 4 or 5 pick because he doesn't really dominate games and I question whether he's going to be the rebounder or shotblocker that he would need to be to justify that pick since right now he's so limited offenisvely. His upside is undeniable, but I really like Jianlian's.

Must have missed the USC game

 

[nbrans]

Must have missed the USC game

21 and 9 is a good game, no doubt, but USC hardly had a frontline. Against Georgetown he was mostly invisible.

Also, he only broke 10 rebounds one time all season. One time! Sure, you have Tyler Hansbrough next to you, but I would think he should have broken 10 a few more times. I wonder about his hunger.

I see his talent, he's got fundamentals and athleticism, but when I watched him this season it just didn't seem to all come together. I would be thrilled to have him on the Kings, I just wouldn't put him ahead of guys like Oden, Durant, Horford and Jianlian, who have put it together against good competition.

 

[Vlade4GM]

21 and 9 is a good game, no doubt, but USC hardly had a frontline. Against Georgetown he was mostly invisible.

Also, he only broke 10 rebounds one time all season. One time! Sure, you have Tyler Hansbrough next to you, but I would think he should have broken 10 a few more times. I wonder about his hunger.

I see his talent, he's got fundamentals and athleticism, but when I watched him this season it just didn't seem to all come together. I would be thrilled to have him on the Kings, I just wouldn't put him ahead of guys like Oden, Durant, Horford and Jianlian, who have put it together against good competition.

Jianlian is no stud on the boards either and he doesn't exactly get praised for his assertiveness.

 

[nbrans]

Jianlian is no stud on the boards either and he doesn't exactly get praised for his assertiveness.

It's not just about the rebounds. Jianlian has a polished offensive game and some definable skills. Wright doesn't really have a post game, doesn't really have much of an outside shot, and until he develops those things (which is no sure thing), he's going to be a guy who you have in there for his athleticism, and presumably for rebounds, putbacks and shotblocks. Only he wasn't actually that good of a rebounder and shotblocker in college. He definitely could change some games with his athleticism, but does he have the motor and intensity to be that type of a player?

Jinalian has a role and something he can do well. My problem with Wright is that he doesn't exactly do the things well that he's supposed to be doing well to be the kind of player you and I would want him to be in the NBA.

 

[kyo2002]

Like Rose. Okay on Mayo. Don't like Gordon and Conley.

 

[beb0p]

Thanks for all the input. Sounds like quite a few people is impressed with Derrick Rose.

As for te new breed of PGs, Chris Paul is without a doubt an old-school yet athletic guard. But I don't think Deron Williams fits the athletic category. He is not a speed demon and that was his biggest knocks when he came out of UI. I still think a PG who can think fast always beat one who can run fast. PGs like Kirk Hinrich, Luke Ridnour, Marcus Williams, etc, are not particularily freakish athlete but those guys will be around for a long time, and Law and Conley maybe in those company.

Lastly, I don't see Mike Conley as slow. He's not Tony Parker or Darren Collison, but he's pretty fast in the games that I saw. All in all, I prefer Conley or Law to swingmen like Green, Brewer or Julian Wright.

 

[ParniValjak]

Thanks for all the input. Sounds like quite a few people is impressed with Derrick Rose.

As for te new breed of PGs, Chris Paul is without a doubt an old-school yet athletic guard. But I don't think Deron Williams fits the athletic category. He is not a speed demon and that was his biggest knocks when he came out of UI. I still think a PG who can think fast always beat one who can run fast. PGs like Kirk Hinrich, Luke Ridnour, Marcus Williams, etc, are not particularily freakish athlete but those guys will be around for a long time, and Law and Conley maybe in those company.

Lastly, I don't see Mike Conley as slow. He's not Tony Parker or Darren Collison, but he's pretty fast in the games that I saw. All in all, I prefer Conley or Law to swingmen like Green, Brewer or Julian Wright.

Not sure I prefer Conley to Brewer but I do prefer him to Greem and Julian Wright.