Harrison Barnes

[pdxKingsFan]

The Barnes hate isn't justified. Keegan is in a slump too, should we bench him? If Barnes plays really well for a whole year, do you look to trade him 10 games into the following year if he is in a slump?

Don't know what it is but it was alluded to on the radio yesterday Keegan is dealing with a personal matter and probably shouldn't be playing.

Barnes is on the end of an expiring contract and giving us nothing. It's fine if he plays out the season and we move on, but it will prove the people who thought we should have gotten out of him a year or two ago right.

 

[The_Jamal]

The Barnes hate isn't justified. Keegan is in a slump too, should we bench him? If Barnes plays really well for a whole year, do you look to trade him 10 games into the following year if he is in a slump?

I do dislike the "3rd option, 4th option" argument. It's as if Tom Brady is looking through all the different routes for the play he called. Barnes is an efficient scorer who can rebound and has decent defensive versatility. His shots start going in again and this thread will disappear to the nether realm of pages 2 and 3.

Keegan is a rookie 9 games into his career. Barnes is a 10 year vet getting paid $20million this season. Of course there's different expectations, he's supposed to be the 3rd best player on the team.

People can gripe and moan, but he's a major reason why the Kings record is what it is right now. He's not just struggling, he's flat out fallen off the face of the earth. We could live with him being bad defensively last season because he was such an effective shooter/scorer. But he's lost another step on D and has been by far the least efficient scorer with a 48% TS. WHILE PLAYING THE MOST MINUTES OF ANYONE.

Him, Holmes and outside of like 2 games, Davion, have been major major disappointments this season.

 

[Kingster]

If we wait until the deadline it will be too late. Hopefully when the December moratorium arrives also with teams that are trying to compete this year there will be some urgency to see what Barnes and Holmes can bring them and maybe we get a useful piece back. If we don't move on before the deadline we're a lotto team unless they suddenly figure out a way to fit into what Brown is doing.

You could be right. I was disappointed both of them weren't traded in the off-season. Unfortunately, it seems like decent trades rarely occur during the season weeks prior to the trade deadline because for the most part there is no sense of urgency to trade for most teams. They seem to need the force of deadline to urge them to action.

 

[TaxMan]

I know it doesn't work this way, but Barnes is having a not great, but respectable season if you eliminate the two Warriors games. Those were by far his worst two games, and I suspect that it is a matchup that is bad for him. If you eliminate the two Warriors games he is averaging 12/6/2.5, which is not terrible.

The interesting thing is Barnes' shooting splits. On two point shots he is shooting

Season: 50%- 23/46 (2.55/5.1 per game).
Career- 49% (3.8/7.7 per game)
Kings Career- 52% (3.45/6.65 per game)

So he is right on his normal average. The interesting thing is the volume. 2.5 less shots per game from his career average and 1.5 less shots per game from his Kings average. So he is shooting the same percentage from two, just on less volume.

From three point range, the problem is opposite. He is shooting the same amount of threes as his career average (but less than his Kings average), but making WAY less.

Season-- 5/30- 16% (.55/3.3 per game)
Career- 38% (1.3/3.5 per game)
Kings Career- 39% (1.7/4.3 per game)

If you could get him to his normal level of aggressiveness inside, while increasing his efficiency to a more normal level from outside, you would add an extra two and three per game, and you would be talking about Barnes averaging around 16/6/2.5 (i.e. right around his career averages).

That said, I have no idea why he is less aggressive inside and less accurate outside, but he isn't as far off as the stats would suggest, at least offensively.

This is a great post, and I believe the numbers you've got here, but my eye test feels like he's missed (not only missed, but airballed) and inordinate amount of layups and bunnies this year. It's really weird....

 

[Woot!]

Unfortunately this year it's on him when he can't hit spotted up open threes. I thought he'd be a valuable piece this year so perhaps in my case it's too high expectations but I just can't with him right now.

Yes, it's on him that he can't hit open 3's. 9 games into the season. He's in a slump. It happens. Fox got off to an absolutely crappy start last year. He was in a slump

9 games in, Barnes has a 37/17/80 shooting split. Awful.
In 6 October games last year, Fox had a 37/17/61 split. Even worse!

The main difference is that Fox was posting those numbers on 19 FGA/game vs. 8.4 for HB. HB's performance is hurting the team. But he's shooting even less, and with the additions of Monk, Huerter, Murray and Sabonis the Kings have plenty of firepower to make up for his woes. OTOH, given his offensive centrality, Fox's suckitude was killing the team.

Let's not pretend like we haven't seen this before, people.

 

[pdxKingsFan]

Yes, it's on him that he can't hit open 3's. 9 games into the season. He's in a slump. It happens. Fox got off to an absolutely crappy start last year. He was in a slump

9 games in, Barnes has a 37/17/80 shooting split. Awful.
In 6 October games last year, Fox had a 37/17/61 split. Even worse!

The main difference is that Fox was posting those numbers on 19 FGA/game vs. 8.4 for HB. HB's performance is hurting the team. But he's shooting even less, and with the additions of Monk, Huerter, Murray and Sabonis the Kings have plenty of firepower to make up for his woes. OTOH, given his offensive centrality, Fox's suckitude was killing the team.

Let's not pretend like we haven't seen this before, people.

Respectfully I don't think Fox and Barnes are apples to apples comparisons. But I get it. But I think Barnes has been trending down after being red hot early last season so we may be seeing a real decline not a slow start. Maybe I am misremembering that part.

 

[Woot!]

Respectfully I don't think Fox and Barnes are apples to apples comparisons. But I get it. But I think Barnes has been trending down after being red hot early last season so we may be seeing a real decline not a slow start. Maybe I am misremembering that part.

I honestly don't understand your not-apples-to-apples point.

In any case, the truth is that if HB were hitting 40% of this 3's right now I doubt this thread would exist. There's little reason to think that a guy who just turned 30 and famously takes care of his body has started a precipitous physical decline - and none to believe that a "real decline" explains why a guy shooting 39% from 3 in 4+ seasons in Sacramento is shooting 17% so far this year.

If something is wrong with him that might help explain this - something physical, emotional, whatever - they should sit him until he recovers. (I actually think he's trying harder than anyone else on the floor to play the push-the-ball-and-1/2-second-or-less style Brown wants, which may be part of his problem.) Absent that, the simplest, most obvious answer is: he's slumping horribly.

Maybe they should sit him anyway.

Or maybe a guy who has shot 38% or better from 3 for each of the last 4 full seasons should be allowed to do what most every other player is allowed to do - try to play himself out of it.

 

[pdxKingsFan]

I honestly don't understand your not-apples-to-apples point.

Because Fox is a PG best served using his quickness to drive to the basket or pass back to the open 3. Barnes shoots the open 3 and at this point his athleticism is more a hinderance than a benefit. Fox is a lot more than a shooting split but right now Barnes IS his shooting split.

 

[Woot!]

Because Fox is a PG best served using his quickness to drive to the basket or pass back to the open 3. Barnes shoots the open 3 and at this point his athleticism is more a hinderance than a benefit. Fox is a lot more than a shooting split but right now Barnes IS his shooting split.

Fox wasn't *that* much more than his split - not on 19 FGA/game he wasn't. If you're saying that Fox somehow more than made up for it vs. HB in spite of shooting equally badly on more than twice as many shots, we disagree. The flip side of HB often not being as aggressive as many of us like is that, unlike Fox and Buddy, the fact that he won't keep chucking means that he also won't kill you on his bad days.

 

[pdxKingsFan]

Fox wasn't *that* much more than his split - not on 19 FGA/game he wasn't. If you're saying that Fox somehow more than made up for it vs. HB in spite of shooting equally badly on more than twice as many shots, we disagree. The flip side of HB often not being as aggressive as many of us like is that, unlike Fox and Buddy, the fact that he won't keep chucking means that he also won't kill you on his bad days.

They're also at very different ages and stages of their career, plus Fox is locked into a contract while Barnes should be playing for what might be his last big pay day. I just don't see them as offering comparable things on or off the court, so just pulling up shooting splits isn't a good way to compare what they bring today or moving forward. One is the guy we have for better or worse opted to build the team around and the other is a complimentary player who will be your third or fourth option currently playing like the 8th.

 

[Entity]

Harrison is steady. Once he sees where he is needed he fills that gap

 

[macadocious]

Harrison is steady. Once he sees where he is needed he fills that gap

This is a family board sir