Grades v. Raptors 1/4/2013
- Thread starter Bricklayer
- Start date
jcwkings
All-Star
Also we NEED a 3pt shooter out there at all times with Cousins, Garcia is by nature a spot up shooter, he also happens to play good team defense and gets more deflections and blocks than any other player we have. Isaiah, Tyreke, Salmons together doesn't work because all 3 are by nature guys that like to shoot off the dribble or get in the lane. None of those are known for their spot shooting (although Isaiah and Salmons are at least capable).
A second unit of
Brooks/Jimmer
Tyreke/Jimmer
Johnson/Tyreke
Robinson
Cuz/Hayes/JT
and Thornton when he's back as well works and allows Tyreke to instantly come in and be the primary ball handler. If anything Salmons should be the one to eventually work into the second unit, since he and Tyreke are very similar players.
A second unit of
Brooks/Jimmer
Tyreke/Jimmer
Johnson/Tyreke
Robinson
Cuz/Hayes/JT
and Thornton when he's back as well works and allows Tyreke to instantly come in and be the primary ball handler. If anything Salmons should be the one to eventually work into the second unit, since he and Tyreke are very similar players.
PurpleHaze
All-Star
I just can't make up my mind on this poll - I'll let other experts decide
jcwkings
All-Star
In defense of Hayes, he is most effective when he is guarding a low post option. We haven't seen a top low post scorer in quite a few games. He will surely be needed tommorow night to guard Lopez.
Gary
All-Star
If the team is playing like it is when Evans comes back then it's something you shouldn't mess with. A lot of coaches do the same thing when players are back from injury and their team is playing extremely well (except really really good teams that are expected to win every night). He will probably come off the bench for a few games then they will re-evaluate things and see where they can go with it.
If we were losing though then all of that goes out the window, and you immediately start him. You just don't tweak a good thing because it could backfire.
They bring back players slow to make sure they don't hurt themselves. You never willingly move your #2 player to the bench otherwise. That I can agree with.
Bricklayer
Don't Make Me Use The Bat
Guys who want Tyreke off the bench are the usual suspects.
Same way if Cousins sits out a few his own non-fans will return in force doing their best to weasel him too.
Tyreke was our best player when he went down, by a lot. And notably our best defender, and our best passer. If we have ANY chance to make a serious run at things this season, and we likely don't, but if we have ANY chance its int eh pairing of that Reke and this Cousins. Which is, BTW, the same thing I have been saying for several years now. A team with this Cuz, and that Tyreke, is not just a team that wins a few surprising ones to jar its somnulent fans, its actually a good team. Not hard to acheive either. Jason remains Jason. Salmons steps back. Isaiah stays out of the way. And we squeeze the bench minutes, which would only be a postive for us. Voila.
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jcwkings
All-Star
Nobody is saying to permanently bring Tyreke off the bench. Let him start off the bench while he gets his cardio back. Then when the time is right re-evaluate our situation and see how he can eventually be inserted back into the starting unit. I just like Isaiah in there because he gets us into our offense fastest, and Garcia because he is a spot up shooter by nature and plays above average defense overall.
Gary
All-Star
When you are a team that traditionally loses who are on a winning streak, yes, coaches do that. They will work him back in, but for now they are not going to want to mess up what they have.
They will work him back in, but I would prefer Evans comes off the bench for at least 5 games before they think about inserting him into the starting lineup. That would give Smart enough time to tweak the rotations to get the most out of his players.
Ditto. I want IT out there as long as possible with Cousins for now. As a Kings fan I am loving the basketball right now. It's like a house of cards, I don't want to mess with it because it could all fall down if you put a card in the wrong place. I would rather sit back and enjoy it from a distance and be cautious with any future cards I want to place on the house.
Poor analogy, but I am sure you get the idea.
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Henkel
Starter
Gary suggestion is at least reasonable. Be cautious if you have to, eventually though your second best player has to work with your best player consistently.
We haven't even talked about Thornton yet. To many mouths to feed to be honest, hope we find a way to trade a couple of these guards before the deadline.
We haven't even talked about Thornton yet. To many mouths to feed to be honest, hope we find a way to trade a couple of these guards before the deadline.
Once they started playing well together we just need to hunt for third big and we would have a pretty solid team I think.
And then when he volunteers to come off the bench after an injury everyone rags on him saying he's not a leader, should start to help us win blablablabla
It's amazing how much better we are when Demarcus Cousins plays like Demarcus Cousins. Even the pre-season playoff predictions don't look too off-kilter when you look at a do-it-all low post monster on the block and a firing-on-all cylinders Tyreke on the wing. Players like that make up for a lot of other terrible personnel decisions. Oh that we could just get them both at the same time for once this season. That's a New Year's resolution I'll gladly get behind.
theclash4u5
Starter
Personally I like the idea of bringing Tyreke off the bench, at least until MT23 comes back. Smart loves his "take all starters out at the same time" rotation, so why not have one of the starters with T-Rob, JJ, Brooks and Hayes? Garcia has been a really good veteran presence for this team, and he, Salmons and Cousins play together pretty damn well.
Bricklayer
Don't Make Me Use The Bat
It's amazing how much better we are when Demarcus Cousins plays like Demarcus Cousins. Even the pre-season playoff predictions don't look too off-kilter when you look at a do-it-all low post monster on the block and a firing-on-all cylinders Tyreke on the wing. Players like that make up for a lot of other terrible personnel decisions. Oh that we could just get them both at the same time for once this season. That's a New Year's resolution I'll gladly get behind.
No no. I hear we are going to trade both of them together for Jared Sullinger, and if we are very very lucky, Avery Bradley (Celts = suckers! Ha!).
Bricklayer
Don't Make Me Use The Bat
this happens so often around here. Aiming for mediocrity. Cuz is playing flat out great. But the rest of that lineup is a joke by NBA standards. Cuz being Cuz is enoguh for us to eke out victories over weaker teams, with roleplayer support. But he needs a major helper out there before we start slamming into Memphis/Miami/OKC etc. this month.
I am sure Reke will ask to come off the bench his first game back, becuase he has repeatedly done that and proven to be an unselfish teammate. But this lineup out there is a patch, not a longterm solution. I actually think Marcu would be more disruptive to it than Reke, because Marcus doesn't want to pass the ball. Reke will fit right in, and juice the defense as well.
My thoughts exactly. I might even go so far as to suggest that Evans could thrive in this new "system"...
I would think so. Especially if guys keep making shots. How many times have we all pulled our hair out because Evans would get people wide open looks but no one could knock them down. And with the passing lately I think he will set up even more guys knowing there is a much better chance he actually gets the ball back.
I was thinking the same thing. I think Thornton could be excellent fodder for the trade mill. I'm sure there's a contending team out there that could really use his talents and we might actually be able to get back something useful.
Gary
All-Star
I am not trying to be rude or obnoxious but why I believe the FG% was so low when Evans would distribute was because a lot of the time there was next to no time on the clock, and since we don't really have many "spot up shooters" they weren't able to dribble and shoot like they are accustomed to. If Evans comes back and is all about the team play and the team thrives then all the better. If he comes back and puts up his stats but the rest of the team starts sucking again then we have to look at the situation and see where to go. Anyhow, enough of Evans. I didn't come here to talk about Evans, I am stoked that the team is winning.
My dreams is for the Kings to win and get back to the playoffs with a steady young core of players. If we are winning then I don't care who takes us there. If we start losing again then I will call out the players... Except for Thompson. That dude is a rock and he's turning into my favorite King player.
JJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTT
Let's talk about how good Thompson has been this year, shall we? His shot selection is awesome this year. Remember the terrible layups he used to take and would constantly miss? Also, his offensive rebounding and putbacks are amazing. I see no reason why we couldn't win with Thompson. Every team needs a guy like him who does the dirty work on the offensive glass. It's hard to talk about players who are doing well lol. It's much easier to criticize then it is to applaud.
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Gary
All-Star
Yes. If he could accept the role like Martin did in OKC he could be a real asset to a team. If he's sent to a winning team I would be willing to bet he would accept the role more so than playing for a losing team. We could actually get something for him. Maybe a young SF, or a backup big (that has decent size?). A team might overpay for services like he could offer.
Bricklayer
Don't Make Me Use The Bat
I have distinguished you from fellow guys who don't get it with Reke, in that you really don't. And hey, I meant that as a compliment of a sort. Its a far far better thing to simply be blinded by stubborness and prejudice than to actually intentionally court it. Basically here is what happened to you: you made a snap judgemnt before the draft. Were determined to not like the pick. Determined to not like the style of play. And most recently have been determined to not update your viewpoint despite changes noticeable to everyone looking at it fairly.
Reke does NOT stop the ball anymore, anymore than any star player. His passes have been much quicker for a long time now. He was creating faster and earlier than anyone on the team when he went out. Using his own offense to set up others. And the TEAM statistics bore that out -- after we shipped IT to the bench and Reke snapped into gear we scored MUCH more than we had either in the early season with him on the sidelines, or at any point until the recent Cuz revolution. The shooting numbers went up for everyone in that lineup. You just could not trust Big Cuz to be there though. If he had we would have been in very good shape.
You are not alone in your prejudice by the way. Fans are often slow to come around. The casual ones because they just don't follow and so work on old intel and broad generalizations. The less casual because the nature of fanhood demands dedication to a cause, and it takes some strength of will to disengage and come around on things. Nonetheless it is patently wrong at this point. I don't know what Reke will come out of this injury. After getting his game in synch I have no idea how the knee and time off might effect it. But I know exactly the player who was out there BEFORE the injury, and that guy's got nothing to do with this mythological chemsitry destroyer you are perpetuating as a danger.
In a lot of ways Reke made us respectable for a stretch of the earlier seaons for the same reasons Cousins is making us respectable now-- by giving us an unselfish star level centerpiece. Now put the two together both playing in that mode...and we could be more than just respectable. Through all the muck and the grime and the wails of pain from the fanbase and everything else, that is still there waiting to happen if we'll just get out of the way and let it and fate doesn't throw us any more curveballs.
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Gary
All-Star
It's not a matter of being right or wrong right now, we just see different things. I know we both watch pretty much every game, and some games more than once. You obviously see something that I don't see and I see something that you don't see. Could it be your affection for said player blinding you? In my mind yes. Could it be the animosity I have for said player playing in positions that I feel that he will fail at which is blinding me? In your mind yes.
Time will prove who was right and who was wrong, but the stubbornness could get in the way of actually saying it.
If what you say is true (which we both saw something different or it wasn't a large enough sample size for me to notice) and we are winning when he comes back then (like I said above) all the better! If we start losing again then we have to step back and evaluate, without making excuses for any players on the Kings (Except Thompson) who a lot of people have their blinders on for.
You do realize though what you said goes for the people that are Reke "huggers" as well right?
If we keep on winning then we will turn into one large happy family again like before.
Time will prove who was right and who was wrong, but the stubbornness could get in the way of actually saying it.
If what you say is true (which we both saw something different or it wasn't a large enough sample size for me to notice) and we are winning when he comes back then (like I said above) all the better! If we start losing again then we have to step back and evaluate, without making excuses for any players on the Kings (Except Thompson) who a lot of people have their blinders on for.
You do realize though what you said goes for the people that are Reke "huggers" as well right?
If we keep on winning then we will turn into one large happy family again like before.
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Kingsfan23
All-Star
Not naturally a Cousins fan, and this stretch of good basketball has only made me more despondent towards him. He's been underwhelming and worse than last season all season, and now once the team is out of the playoff picture he is picking up his play. Makes me think that this is an effort issue
Mm yes Cousins is such a bad player, never puts any effort on the court. Let's quickly trade him while his value is high so that Jared Sullinger can lead us to the playoffs instead!
Gary
All-Star
So y = r cubed over 3. And if you determine the rate of change in this curve correctly, I think you'll be pleasantly surprised.
RDRR = Har-de-har-har.
Simpsons fan here.
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