[Grades] Grades v. Nuggets 1/25/12

Who would you start at SF next game?

  • Salmons

    Votes: 2 3.8%
  • Garcia

    Votes: 4 7.7%
  • Greene

    Votes: 34 65.4%
  • Outlaw

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Honeycutt

    Votes: 12 23.1%

  • Total voters
    52
  • Poll closed .
#31
This is how a bad fit turned into a disaster -- Father Time jammed a fork in John's back sometime last year, and now he's been pretty much worthless out there. Time was he was a good man defender who didn't get beat to the hoop very often, and just had problems with power guys going over or through him. On the other side of the floor he had a quick first step and could get to the hoop as well as any non-star level player. But the longer you watch this sluggish older version of John the more you realize that just isn't coming back. This is a guy who significantly impaired Kobe 3-4 years ago, and now he can't move his feet fast enough to stay in front of 6'10" Danilo Gallinari?

Is it that? I don't know if it is. There were moments early where Salmons seemed to be OK. I can't see a guy at 32 years old falling apart like this. Not in almost every aspect of the game at least.
 
#32
You have to start Cisco and I would use Honeycutt to back him up. Either move Salmons to the bench or start him next to Cisco. If it were me I'd roll out this lineup next game:

PG: Evans
SG: Fredette
SF: Cisco
PF: Hayes
C: Cousins

Fredette and Garcia are the two best shooters on this team, it's not hard to figure out, best shooters = better shooting most nights. Stick one in one corner, stick the other in the other. Evans can drive and dish to them, Cousins and Hayes can look for them off of backcuts and out of the post. Yes, it's that easy.
So Hayes is back for sure next game?
 
#33
This is how a bad fit turned into a disaster -- Father Time jammed a fork in John's back sometime last year, and now he's been pretty much worthless out there. Time was he was a good man defender who didn't get beat to the hoop very often, and just had problems with power guys going over or through him. On the other side of the floor he had a quick first step and could get to the hoop as well as any non-star level player. But the longer you watch this sluggish older version of John the more you realize that just isn't coming back. This is a guy who significantly impaired Kobe 3-4 years ago, and now he can't move his feet fast enough to stay in front of 6'10" Danilo Gallinari?
Maybe he has a 50 lb weight stashed in his chin muff??
 
#36
You have to start Cisco and I would use Honeycutt to back him up. Either move Salmons to the bench or start him next to Cisco. If it were me I'd roll out this lineup next game:

PG: Evans
SG: Fredette
SF: Cisco
PF: Hayes
C: Cousins

Fredette and Garcia are the two best shooters on this team, it's not hard to figure out, best shooters = better shooting most nights. Stick one in one corner, stick the other in the other. Evans can drive and dish to them, Cousins and Hayes can look for them off of backcuts and out of the post. Yes, it's that easy.
Sadly, I have a feeling we're the only team in the league where one of our "best" shooters is finding it hard to hit the rim on his shots every other game. I have no clue what happened to his shooting. Did you see the quality of bricks he put up this game? I'm talking about Garcia btw. Heck one wasn't even a brick because it didn't hit anything but air.
 
#37
Sadly, I have a feeling we're the only team in the league where one of our "best" shooters is finding it hard to hit the rim on his shots every other game. I have no clue what happened to his shooting. Did you see the quality of bricks he put up this game? I'm talking about Garcia btw. Heck one wasn't even a brick because it didn't hit anything but air.
Yeah there was one on the NBA highlights package that was closer to the front row than it was to the basket.
 
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#38
Some silver lining here:

Fredette has now strung three solid offensive outings together.
IT broke his shooting slump, albeit in garbage time when Denver didn't care about defense. He and Fredette combined to shoot 7-11 from three point range. For once, the team had a respectable three point percentage.
Honeycutt hustled in his debut and got an and-one and broke up an oop.
Cousins continues to carry the team as best he can.
Offensively, the team looked better than they have for quite a while. 44% shooting and 45% from three.

Bad: Transition defense killed us against the nuggets last time and it does it again. Honestly, if we had three guys back in transition each possession, this game would have been in range. Instead, we let long boards go to outlet passes for easy lay-ins and dunks.
Denver did a great job at finding passing lanes down low in the set offense. I lost track of how many passes went to guys on the weak side who had snuck in behind Cousins.
Smallball. (Outlaw, Jimmer, IT and Salmons all on the floor at the same time. Ermm, okay.)
Smallball getting outrun on the break by 6-10 Gallo and a 32 year old 6-9 Al Harrington.
 

Kingster

Hall of Famer
#39
This is how a bad fit turned into a disaster -- Father Time jammed a fork in John's back sometime last year, and now he's been pretty much worthless out there. Time was he was a good man defender who didn't get beat to the hoop very often, and just had problems with power guys going over or through him. On the other side of the floor he had a quick first step and could get to the hoop as well as any non-star level player. But the longer you watch this sluggish older version of John the more you realize that just isn't coming back. This is a guy who significantly impaired Kobe 3-4 years ago, and now he can't move his feet fast enough to stay in front of 6'10" Danilo Gallinari?
It's bizarre that he should lose so much at age 32. Are we sure that he woke up and lost a step? Or maybe he just didn't want to play here the moment he got traded?
 
#41
It's bizarre that he should lose so much at age 32. Are we sure that he woke up and lost a step? Or maybe he just didn't want to play here the moment he got traded?
If that's the case, and we have no way of knowing that, but if it is, he needs to be benched. I don't care that he's a vet, i don't care that he's their highest paid player, etc. If he doesn't want to play, bench him and let someone like Honeycut or Greene get those minutes.
 

Bricklayer

Don't Make Me Use The Bat
#42
Not necessarily though -- that's why I said the fork was stuck in last year. This is why his performance fell off last year for the Bucks -- you could see this coming on and he just wasn't the same guy coming back from that injury. And now even worse. And for some guys it just starts earlier than others. Not all 100% physical too. You get a little pain, you get comfortable, you lsoe a little of that love for the game or passion -- and how much passion did he have to start?
 
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#43
Some silver lining here:

Fredette has now strung three solid offensive outings together.
IT broke his shooting slump, albeit in garbage time when Denver didn't care about defense. He and Fredette combined to shoot 7-11 from three point range. For once, the team had a respectable three point percentage.
Honeycutt hustled in his debut and got an and-one and broke up an oop.
Cousins continues to carry the team as best he can.
Offensively, the team looked better than they have for quite a while. 44% shooting and 45% from three.

Bad: Transition defense killed us against the nuggets last time and it does it again. Honestly, if we had three guys back in transition each possession, this game would have been in range. Instead, we let long boards go to outlet passes for easy lay-ins and dunks.
Denver did a great job at finding passing lanes down low in the set offense. I lost track of how many passes went to guys on the weak side who had snuck in behind Cousins.
Smallball. (Outlaw, Jimmer, IT and Salmons all on the floor at the same time. Ermm, okay.)
Smallball getting outrun on the break by 6-10 Gallo and a 32 year old 6-9 Al Harrington.
I'm awfully sorry but from my seat at the game, the bright spots you point out were not there.
Fredette: We always knew he could shoot but defense? Sorry. On offense, handling the ball. Sorry. If relying on that for victories pick a different season.
Cousins: We have already known what great talent he has. Stamina? Up and down the court more than 3 times? Sorry.
IT: Great, but our present and our future aren't there.
The horror of the team far out-paled any glimmer.
Something has to happen NOW.
 

Kingster

Hall of Famer
#44
Not necessarily though -- that's why I said the fork was stuck in last year. This is why his performance fell off last year for the Bucks -- you could see this coming on and he just wasn't the same guy coming back from that injury. And now even worse. And for some guys it just starts earlier than others. Not all 100% physical too. You get a little pain, you get comfortable, you lsoe a little of that love for the game or passion -- and how much passion did he have to start?
http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/s/salmojo01/splits/2011/

I must be missing something. Look at the monthly FG% of Salmons last season. With the slight exception of one month, his FG% went up each month. Where did this injury occur?
 

rainmaker

Hall of Famer
#45
This might have turned into the best thread I've ever seen on kingsfans. Certainly better than the game.

I was going to make another point, but seem to have lost it along the way for some odd reason....
 
#49
Grant N. is soooooooooooo ripping this team now. Might as well call them heartless, gutless, and clueless.
You have any problem with that? I was at the game last night and think anything Grant might have said is justified. What is the organization going to do about the horrible condition of our team?
 

Bricklayer

Don't Make Me Use The Bat
#50
You have any problem with that? I was at the game last night and think anything Grant might have said is justified. What is the organization going to do about the horrible condition of our team?
Grant's typically an overemotional boob talking out of both sides of his mouth. There are certain things that seem fairly obvious, but you panic and you can really screw yourselves. The only condition would be if this team had quit on its second coach in a month. Otherwise the "moves" to improve are likely more subtle. I don't even know if you can trade some of our worst debris, but Hickson for help before he loses all value. Any "pile of our non-core cheap kids" for a big contract you don't want type of deal has to be considered. But otherwise the "moves" include getting back our best defender and leading score from injury, the coaching staff being allowed to bench Salmons, and our schedule lightening up so we are playing the Warriors and Wizards every night instead of Denver and Memphis. But you can't panic.
 
#51
Brick, on the grades. I am a great appreciater of what you do and thankful for it. You're too kind in a assessing their performance last night. Everyone but Thomas's grade should be reduced one whole grade. Even then it is probably too high. Put another way, if Garcia and Salmons weren't there we did not have a close game as your ratings would suggest. Keep on truckin'. Thanks.
 
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Glenn

Hall of Famer
#53
It seems to me that Smart loses track of who has contributed what. Aren't his assistants supposed to whisper in his ear. It also may be that he is playing his players into shape and therefore we get weird lineups. I don't know but when Greene actually looks good for awhile and then is ignored I wonder if someone on the coaching staff should be saying something. The assistants aren't there just to keep stats are they?

Maybe Smart will just have to look at tapes the way the rest are expected to do and maybe he will learn something about his substitutions or lack thereof. This isn't a knock on him or at least not a major knock but there are times where I think he just simply forgets. 6'6" guy guarding a 6'10" guy. Seems basic to try the 6'11" guy who plays the same position. Am I right about what an assistant should be doing?

I have also had concerns about Tyreke's feet and the minutes he is playing but so far, do good.
 
#54
It seems to me that Smart loses track of who has contributed what. Aren't his assistants supposed to whisper in his ear. It also may be that he is playing his players into shape and therefore we get weird lineups. I don't know but when Greene actually looks good for awhile and then is ignored I wonder if someone on the coaching staff should be saying something. The assistants aren't there just to keep stats are they?

Maybe Smart will just have to look at tapes the way the rest are expected to do and maybe he will learn something about his substitutions or lack thereof. This isn't a knock on him or at least not a major knock but there are times where I think he just simply forgets. 6'6" guy guarding a 6'10" guy. Seems basic to try the 6'11" guy who plays the same position. Am I right about what an assistant should be doing?

I have also had concerns about Tyreke's feet and the minutes he is playing but so far, do good.
That might tie into his learning/conditioning while in the game philosophy. Some time in the game he decides we've already lost, so he'll just use the rest of the minutes to practice. Still doesnt explain the Salmons getting roasted by Gallinari thing though.