[Grades] Grades v. Bucks 3/23/11

For the rest of the season who should start?

  • Reke/Thornton

    Votes: 28 56.0%
  • Reke/Beno

    Votes: 7 14.0%
  • Beno/Thornton

    Votes: 5 10.0%
  • Beno/Thornton/Reke

    Votes: 10 20.0%

  • Total voters
    50

Bricklayer

Don't Make Me Use The Bat
See? Maybe we have not quit on the season after all. A good solid win over the boringest team in basketball as both our guards fought to prove that it was the OTHER guy who should go to the bench with Reke returning.


Official Boxscore


Garcia ( D- ) -- played a remarkably crappy game. Delfino was just lighting him up trhoughout the early going, and Cisco had absolutely nothing back the other way. Was even missing his layups. Better on Delfino after half, but kept on missing, including numerous little chippees, and eventually Donte took over full time and Cisco watched from the bench. If we lose this, this is an F. As is, I gave a tiny bump because of the imprvied defensive play in the third. But that's as far as I can go.

Cousins ( B- ) -- pretty good start aggressive around the hoop, and another one of those nice top of the key passes to a cutting Beno. Able to overwhelm Mbah a Moute with his size. Good power move throguh Mbah a Moute to start the third, but then something seemed to snap. Got over eager and had back to back travels shuffling his feet trying to make his move. Picked up a third travel a few minutes later and had lost his head. Actually asked out of the game late in the 3rd, and when the wish was granted never returned. I don't know what happened here. Was playing a good game and on his way to potentially very big 20-10ish type numbers again, and then just seemed to lose focus, and ultimately quit on the game. I don't pretend to understand this stuff. Seems just so at the mercy of his emotions that he must almost be in a fog sometimes. Control your emotions young man, lest they control you!

Dalembert ( B+ ) -- competed well throughout, and essentially neutralized Andrew Bogut, who is sometimes wildly overrated, but stil one of the league's better centers in this sad center starved era. Was competitive from the start -- Bogut dropped a nice move on him one way, so Daly came back and did the same the otther way. Reversed the passing relation ship with Cousins, stepping up top to get Cousins hi low for an early hoop. Nice passses to a cutting Beno too. Blocked Bogut on the Bucks final possession of the half. Was playing stout defense, even when scored over, and in the second half anchored us as we squeezed the most offensively inept team in the league. Lost a ball off his leg at the 2:30 mark that could have hurt us, but good boardwork down the stretch on both ends helped us put it away.

Thornton ( A- ) -- candidate #1 for the "other guard" position, standing 6'4" tall and putting up 27pts 6rebs 4ast...Marcus Thornton! Another strong game out of a guy who has averaged a cool 22pts 4reb 4ast since moving into the starting lineup. Showed all the offensive weapons, and they are myriad -- drained an open three off a double on Cousins. Used a nice physical shoulder bump to clear space over Salmson and drained a J. As soon as he saw Dooling on him, immediately and physically into the post to draw foul. Committed a bad turnover up top with a dumb and unnecessary behind the back pass to nobody off the dribble, which led to a Bucks breakout. And had a few too many TOs trying to do thigns that can't be done, like grabbing d-boards and throwing Cousinsesque full length hail marys to guys leaking out. But in general continuing to show things other than scoring. Caught an airballed shot by Beno and in one motion dropped it over to Dalembert for the layin. Used his hops on the offensive glass -- I am still a littel confused aobut how the annoucers, Jerry in particular, were downplaying his athleticism. He's nto Gerald Wallace, but he's fast, strong, and can jump. Not sure what else you are looking for? Didn't win it with a brillaint rush down the stretch, but did drop in his second long three to push us back out to a 5 pt gap with 4:15 to go. And gee, doesn't his game look better when he's taking 3 threes, as he did tonight, rather than 12 or whatever it was in the mess against Cleveland.

Udrih ( A- ) -- candidate #2 for the "other guard" position, standing 6'3" tall and putting up 25pts 6rebs 6ast...Beno Udrih! Was missing more short jumpers than he was hitting in the early going, but was repeatedly freeing himself with backdoor cuts and taking passes from various bigs -- classic Princeton stuff that we've seen more and more of as Cousins and Dalembert have settled in as good hi low passers. After a poor turnover up top late in the third while trying to feed Cousins that led to a Bucks breakout, came back to hit the tough steadying layup, and then a pass ahead on the break to give us back the lead going into the 4th. Defensive energy was better than its been in weeks for him and was hustling and getting his hands on a lot of balls. Jennings was obviously never a facotr at all as Beno badly outplayed him. In and out on the little jumper up 2 with 52 seconds to go, but hit 3 of 4 FTs down the stretch after the Bucks resorted to intentionally fouling.

Bench

Greene ( C+ ) -- got the call early as the first man off the bench with Cisco getting killed out there, and got a couple of hoops, including a follow of his own miss to just beat the 24 second clock at the end of the quarter. Not able to slow Delfino either, however, and made a bad mistake turning the ball over on an inbounds just before the end of the quarter, but recovered to challenge and possibly deflect the layupo attempt so that we did not get hurt. Was back to log heavy minutes after half as well, inclduign the entire stretch run as Cisco just could not get it going. Delfino would hit a couple of more shots, but they were few and far betwen and outside of one wide open three mistake, heaviuly contested. Donte was far from spectauclr, and generally let Beno and Thronton do our talkign for us, but he played defense and made a handful of nice plays, including a little baseline jumper on a nice Beno feed in the 4th, a poke steal up top as well to start a break, and excellent defense on Delfino at the 2:40 mark forcing an airball and keeping us up 4.

Thompson ( C+ ) -- looked bad before half, as he basically got schooled by his old teammate/backup, Jon Brockman, who looked absolutely tiny out there against our frontline and yet had Jason confused (admittedly not the most difficult task). Got an offensive foul running over old friend Brockman, then a loose ball foul trying to keep Brocklman off the pffensive glass. And then sat while Westphal went wiht a thick body to match a thick body in Jackson. Struggled again in the early 4th in relief of Cousins before finally coming alive in the mid-4th with a dunk on the break, then moving without the ball, and grabbing a strong rebound. Added a hi low feed to Daly for the dunk to put us up 4 with 3:30 to go. Missed a gimme chip on a beatuiful setup by Thornton with a minute to go, because that is kind of his defining trait, but fortuunately Daly was there to clean the glass and save the day,. Huge offensive rebound with 20 seconds to go to get us the ball back up 2, and immediately cleared it to Beno before he got fouled and had to shoot the FTs himself. Late surge and rebounding power this grade despite the long patches of not goodness.

Jeter ( D+ ) -- into the game to match up with an even minnier man in Earl Boykins. Struggled with his size in the 4th, getting shot over on one end, and blocked the other. Hit a three for his highlight.

Jackson ( B- ) -- brought in in place of JT to bang with Brock,anm for a few minutes. Ironic given his rebounding. Dropped in several little jumpers. Advanced over the ineffective JT in the roation in the second half, but did not provide much more and it was JT who got the call down the stretch.
 
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I called out JT after the Bulls game and said that I was ready to trade him. I recognize a good game when I see one, and let me be the first to say that this was the kind of game I'd like JT to have if he's going to be our 3rd big for the long run. He rebounded, played good D and finished at the rim well. That's all I'm asking for, and he delivered against the Bucks.

Also, I like us using Beno as a slasher. From what I've seen he has one of the best touches around the rim and finishes reverse lay ups on a consistent basis, rarely gets it blocked and just has good patience and timing to get the shot off. Tyreke still doesn't have the kind of touch that Beno has, to be able to just catch the ball while cutting, go up and finish on the other side. Neither does Garcia.

Somehow I felt that defense actually won this one for us, starting in the 3rd quarter. It was some of the best D that I've seen them play in a long long time. Rotations were good, didn't give up open lanes, and a lot of their points were just Carlos Delfino hitting tough shots much to my disgust, because I was getting sick and tired of them playing "don't cry for me argentina" every damn time he scored.
 
Somehow I felt that defense actually won this one for us, starting in the 3rd quarter. It was some of the best D that I've seen them play in a long long time. Rotations were good, didn't give up open lanes, and a lot of their points were just Carlos Delfino hitting tough shots much to my disgust, because I was getting sick and tired of them playing "don't cry for me argentina" every damn time he scored.

It probably helped that we stuck our best defender (when motivated) on him too.
 
I feel the need to reflect here for a second.

Somewhat ad nauseam, this forum (myself included) has bashed Petrie for his consistently unproductive trade history. With that being said, this Thornton guy is pretty good. Like, I think I would have traded Martin for him straight-up good. Like, Landry for Thornton looks like a steal good.

If Thornton continues to produce like this, I feel this deserves recognition as a +1 in the Petrie column.
 
His biggest issue is getting caught badly on screens. Not a terrible one on one defender

Not exactly. Watch the Bucks game again and see how many times he just totally didn't see his man (who would be at the side outside the three point line) just cut to the basket. He was laying off a lot as the ball was on the other side of the court, as if double-teaming the big man like in a zone kinda thing. But then his man would just cut baseline and Thornton wouldn't see him at all. Happened several times
 
Regards poll, as has been said, Tyreke will need to come off bench for awhile, and with only 12 games left awhile could likely be most of rest of season. But if he sees what his role has to be and does that he could start after 3-4 games with Beno with Thornton getting big minutes off bench for he and/or Beno.

Missed game on TV but seems Kings can play better on road, maybe due to less fan pressure? Guard play won this along with really good defense.
 
Thornton tends to just look lost on D, not unlike the rest of the team.
At least he has the tools to be a tough defender, and he's young, so it's not hopeless like Beno and his predecessors.
 
Didn't vote in the poll because I don't think I have a preference. In fact what people have faulted Westphal for might work in the Kings favor. Play it one way on Friday and see how it goes. In any event we will see a rotation of the three. Thornton, the new guy in town, has to prove himself first. And then Tyreke has to re-prove himself in this new combo. I'm hoping for the best.
 
Out of all people I didn't expect Delfino to drop 30 on us but besides that, nobody else on the Bucks did anything too much to hurt us. I don't get how that team won 45+ games last year and to drop off soo badly in one year with almost the same players. Anyways, Cousins had I believe two or three travels in a row and I don't think we saw him since. Westphal actually did good by keeping Dalembert/JT out there because they hustled and moved their feet well as well as Donte when he came in. However, what disappointed me was that the team didn't look to go in the post every single time to Cousins when he had Mbah A Moute on him for christ's sake, he kept getting the ball at the top of the key or tried to dribble through his legs again to try to get past a SF. He needs a big man coach badly, he needs to use that body, you can't let a SF guard you and get away with it, not with the big body he has and skill set, unacceptable in my book. A win is a win though, so I'll enjoy it til Friday.
 
I don't mind bringing Evans off the bench gradually after he returns and reintegrates into the team, but at some point (maybe not before the end of the season) he will be totally healthy and you've just got to start him.

The discovery of Thornton as an efficient volume scorer takes a lot of the scoring burden off Evans. His shooting % should improve and more importantly, I'd like to see him focused more on defense. Evans has the potential to be the Artest of guards, a defensive monster who can also bully his way inside.

At some point I think the Evans/Thornton duo's performance will demand they start, and Beno can be a reliable leader of the second unit.
~~
 
I would bring Reke along carefully for reasons of health than anything to do with his court play. He recovered either with rest or the voodoo medicine. I don't trust any of it. In any case, we will see the Marcus/Reke combo enough to know how it will work.
 
I feel the need to reflect here for a second.

Somewhat ad nauseam, this forum (myself included) has bashed Petrie for his consistently unproductive trade history. With that being said, this Thornton guy is pretty good. Like, I think I would have traded Martin for him straight-up good. Like, Landry for Thornton looks like a steal good.

If Thornton continues to produce like this, I feel this deserves recognition as a +1 in the Petrie column.


Agreed. And I'll take this occasion for a little rant.

Martin was essentially a salary dump and cleared capspace that we can use this summer.

Noc and Hawes for Dalembert (if we resign him and we should) is nothing short of brilliant. Bring on the naysayers I'll slay you one by one.

Landry for Thornton is insanely good.

Now, a note: you can't judge a trade. Why? Becuase it means different things to the teams involved. You can't just match up the players. The move depends on the team context. Was the Martin trade good FOR US? Yes. The Hawes trade good for us? Unbelievably. The Thornton trade good for us. Outstanding.

I'm so effing tired of the Petrie bashers. He's made questionable moves. Some of those may have been with the Maloofs meddling. But the dude is one of, if not the best drafter in the league... and that DOES include the mind games of hiding your true intentions. Our FO had the entire league thinking we were salivating over RUBIO. And we quietly pick the ROY. There was some luck involved with getting Cousins. But still... there is all kinds of posturing, decoying, etc that goes on. The man has been aces for going on two years now in just about every move. Probably coinciding with the Maloofs finally letting up and handing the reigns over.
 
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Cousins ( B- )
I don't pretend to understand this stuff. Seems just so at the mercy of his emotions that he must almost be in a fog sometimes. Control your emotions young man, lest they control you!

I don't understand either. It's obvious that at a certain point there is no control. Doesn't change my impression of him and it doesn't make him a bad person as some people say. He knew what was happening and asked out. An odd move but we are working with something very unusual. He and we will have to work around it as best as possible.
 
Wait, what? Cousins asked out of the game? I didn't know that. Why? What for? Didn't hear anything on the Bucks broadcast.
 
Wait, what? Cousins asked out of the game? I didn't know that. Why? What for? Didn't hear anything on the Bucks broadcast.

Cousins traveled three times in rather quick succession and obviously was very upset at himself. It's the kind of shuffle the feet before dribbling kind of travel. I'm surprised another team's announcers didn't take the opportunity to be critical of him. I guess you could say he slipped into a fog of negativity and probably knew he couldn't think well enough to play. I think that's a reasonable explanation.
 
Wait, what? Cousins asked out of the game? I didn't know that. Why? What for? Didn't hear anything on the Bucks broadcast.

You could see it when he did it. No idea of the details. Was coming downcourt, looked disgusted, said something and motioned to the sideline.
 
I think Cousins had just committed a real sloppy turnover and then ran by Westphal and asked him to take him out.

On the Thorton athleticism thing. I think Jerry is confusing athleticism with hops. Jermaine Taylor has hops. Thorton is just average when it comes to jumping, so it makes Taylor look more more athletic when he's on the court because he's always throwing down alley oops.
 
Agreed. And I'll take this occasion for a little rant.

Martin was essentially a salary dump and cleared capspace that we can use this summer.
Let me assure you, Petrie has done just fine, always has always will. When he retires I'll be the first to put his "jersey" in the rafters.
Noc and Hawes for Dalembert (if we resign him and we should) is nothing short of brilliant. Bring on the naysayers I'll slay you one by one.

Landry for Thornton is insanely good.

Now, a note: you can't judge a trade. Why? Becuase it means different things to the teams involved. You can't just match up the players. The move depends on the team context. Was the Martin trade good FOR US? Yes. The Hawes trade good for us? Unbelievably. The Thornton trade good for us. Outstanding.

I'm so effing tired of the Petrie bashers. He's made questionable moves. Some of those may have been with the Maloofs meddling. But the dude is one of, if not the best drafter in the league... and that DOES include the mind games of hiding your true intentions. Our FO had the entire league thinking we were salivating over RUBIO. And we quietly pick the ROY. There was some luck involved with getting Cousins. But still... there is all kinds of posturing, decoying, etc that goes on. The man has been aces for going on two years now in just about every move. Probably coinciding with the Maloofs finally letting up and handing the reigns over.

Let me assure you, Petrie has done just fine, always has and always will. Nothing stands in the way of a winning Kings team except a little time and $20 million worth of NBA talent.
 
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