Fire Gentry!
- Thread starter New Era
- Start date
SacTownKid
Hall of Famer
Not having a team that remotely resembles a modern era team is beyond any coach, but Gentry has already shown some things about just how horrible Lukes offense was. If they missed the window to make a coaching change boost, at least Gentry will be able to get these players shined up a bit. Luke Walton tanks every asset around him.
SacTownKid
Hall of Famer
That was it, lol. He did say he was keeping some of Lukes system in, haha.
Gee, thanks Al!
ockingsfan
Starter
Coach really needs to decide on either Fox or Haliburton. Both needs the ball in their hands to excel and they both become too passive when they are on the floor together.
Time to pick. I think we go back to Fox and Hield starting back court and bring Hali with Mitchell off the bench as the 2nd unit. Push the pace with the first unit and bring back the pace that made Fox special. Because right now, the starting backcourt looks dysfunctional.
Time to pick. I think we go back to Fox and Hield starting back court and bring Hali with Mitchell off the bench as the 2nd unit. Push the pace with the first unit and bring back the pace that made Fox special. Because right now, the starting backcourt looks dysfunctional.
Groovygreg
Starter
Exactly! The Kings have no discernible offensive scheme. I’ve been thinking and saying this ever since Walton took the reins.
steelevt
All-Star
i was willing to give it a chance because davion's defense was really good to start the year but these past few games, he's just getting bullied and his offense isnt making up for the drop in defense. We were fine with fox and ty splitting the ball handling and buddy at SG. Adding another pg just puts ty, fox and buddy out of position. Fox/buddy and Ty/TD or any combo would have been fine. Unfortunately with barnes and Moe out, we dont have any good wings and have to play buddy and TD at the 3
KingsFanSince85
All-Star
He had a heavy hand in it. It’s silly to believe an assistant he hired that buys into the same beliefs he did would actually change anything.
Gentry said during his PC that he and other assistants aligned with Walton’s decisions. So what should anyone expect to change? Aside from some new players getting into the rotation, all the boneheaded decisions Walton made each game is going to surface with Gentry too. So coaching being among the problems is not off the hook just yet.
While Bobby Jackson and Doug Christie may not be ready for the gig yet, there was far more of a chance they’d stray from the Walton system of beliefs. Christie was new and not yet fully tainted and Bobby Jackson clearly seems to be doing different things in Stockton (And in SL).
SacTownKid
Hall of Famer
It's really funny because I wonder if these coaches/players like TT's teammate presser blast from the other night realize that in 15 years Kings fans have seen and heard all of these things before? The shots from the end of the bench by the hustle guy mean nothing, and while we appreciate the sentiment, we've heard it from the coach and there's yet to be an answer in it while not coming up with some sort of gameplan other than "well I believe in what the other guy was doing"?. At some point Gentry, the finger points back at you and what you do with it. So far you're 0-1 on the "or else" banter. We don't want band-aids, we want verifiable concept. Some of it has come but it's hard for an interim guy to keep trying to rattle the players before the questions of roster change come up. And even if they do, the key word is "INTERIM". Who is the potential change going to benefit?
sactowndog
All-Star
or maybe given it’s the xxx coach over the last how many years people will figure out coaching can’t fix a badly constructed roster. Anyway. Didn’t want to bother with 10 pages of Bagley hate…. Anyone want to clue me in on why Bags isn’t playing now?
Bayley had non-covid illness.
Dude, you've absolutely beaten the daylights out of the straw man that the Kings' dysfunction was ALL Walton's fault.
Who're you debating with?
SLAB
Hall of Famer
It’s me trying to wrap my head around people thinking this team was talented enough to make a run, and it was all coaching holding them back. Never understood it.
steelevt
All-Star
I think the reason people had a glimmer of hope was because we were playing above .500 against one of the hardest strength of schedule. It’s not like all of our wins were against bottom dwellers. And some of the losses were close with us being it it til late in the 4th. People thought the wins were in spite of Walton and not because of him. So if they players were good enough to beat Portland phx and Charlotte and kept it close vs Utah and such, why not believe they could play decent or just not suck as bad with Walton gone?
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Chupacabra
Starter
This is still an open point of debate. I maintain that the group is talented enough. The team sucks because of some combination of flaws other than talent.
Kingster
Hall of Famer
As others have said, individually there are talented players on this team. Collectively, they don't work. If mental toughness is a "talent", yes, they don't have it. They are a fragile group, a leaderless group. Until a major trade happens, nothing will change with this team.
Sorry, but I just have to come back to Fox. He takes 30 shots against the Lakers in the first game, then he takes 9 shots in this game. What the F is up with that??!! That has nothing to do with talent. Fox has boat-loads of talent. But it's smothered by his depression that he's carrying around with him like a 100 lb weight. He deigned to give us two baseline-to-baseline drives in this game, by my count the first two of this season. Thank you for your service, Fox. He deigned to give us one brilliant all-out defensive effort in one episode in the first half. Again, thank you for your service, Fox. But where oh where is the consistent effort? He doesn't have it in him. He's trudging every day to his sucky job, unhappy with his life. Remember when Walton said he'd like Tyrese to imprint his personality on this team? I think Walton was also saying, "I don't want Fox to imprint his personality on this team." Depression, woe is me, it's soooo hard. At this point, the team is prisoner to Fox's "life sucks" attitude. Until it changes or until he's gone, nothing will change.
Sorry, but I just have to come back to Fox. He takes 30 shots against the Lakers in the first game, then he takes 9 shots in this game. What the F is up with that??!! That has nothing to do with talent. Fox has boat-loads of talent. But it's smothered by his depression that he's carrying around with him like a 100 lb weight. He deigned to give us two baseline-to-baseline drives in this game, by my count the first two of this season. Thank you for your service, Fox. He deigned to give us one brilliant all-out defensive effort in one episode in the first half. Again, thank you for your service, Fox. But where oh where is the consistent effort? He doesn't have it in him. He's trudging every day to his sucky job, unhappy with his life. Remember when Walton said he'd like Tyrese to imprint his personality on this team? I think Walton was also saying, "I don't want Fox to imprint his personality on this team." Depression, woe is me, it's soooo hard. At this point, the team is prisoner to Fox's "life sucks" attitude. Until it changes or until he's gone, nothing will change.
Yes. Walton had to go. For a myriad of reasons, he had to go. Poor planning, poor development, in-game decisions, etc.
That said,
I don't know why people thought a light switch would just flip. It takes time to implement change. That is why this move should have been made over the summer. But it wasn't. You can get guys playing harder, and you can change up rotations, but if the system is fundamentally flawed, which we know to be true, it's not going to fix itself overnight. The coach in me says that I wouldn't expect anything dramatically different until after the break, or during an extended homestand.
Having Gentry slide in at this time creates an additional problem, as he probably also knows he's just a placeholder until the end of the year. Again, with an off-season to make wholesale changes, he could have done a more thorough change. I think he would have been more successful in this scenario. A new coach coming in from the outside would be more inclined to scrap pretty much everything that wasn't working, given the understanding that if you bring in a new guy, that means he's the man for beyond just the end of this season.
The best you can hope for here is some player development and minor tweaks, unfortunately.
That said,
I don't know why people thought a light switch would just flip. It takes time to implement change. That is why this move should have been made over the summer. But it wasn't. You can get guys playing harder, and you can change up rotations, but if the system is fundamentally flawed, which we know to be true, it's not going to fix itself overnight. The coach in me says that I wouldn't expect anything dramatically different until after the break, or during an extended homestand.
Having Gentry slide in at this time creates an additional problem, as he probably also knows he's just a placeholder until the end of the year. Again, with an off-season to make wholesale changes, he could have done a more thorough change. I think he would have been more successful in this scenario. A new coach coming in from the outside would be more inclined to scrap pretty much everything that wasn't working, given the understanding that if you bring in a new guy, that means he's the man for beyond just the end of this season.
The best you can hope for here is some player development and minor tweaks, unfortunately.
captain bill
All-Star
For people who think this team has talent that is being misused, Gentry failing to unlock that talent over a handful of games doesn’t exactly disprove anything. He’s got a .461 record over 1,000+ games.
bajaden
Hall of Famer
When I read Fire Gentry, I thought it had to be a joke! I mean really, what would that accomplish? Gentry isn't the problem! The problem starts at the top with Vivek, and works its way down to the locker room. This team is a mess, and I doubt there's a coach in the NBA that can fix it. Not with this current roster. A roster made up of 100 guards and 200 centers, some of which are merely collecting a pay check. In the 2nd half of last nights game, we had a team made up of losers. No, not all of them! Holmes and Metu busted their butts when they were on the floor, but everyone else just threw in the towel when they got punched in the face.
As a famous boxer once said, the question isn't whether your going to get hit with a punch, the question is what are you going to do after you've been hit? I hate to say this after 15 years of enduring this same crap, but this team needs to be torn apart and rebuilt from the ground up. Something that should have been done when Vivek bought the team. Instead he's been trying to put band aids on the team ever since. I have no doubt that Vivek wants to win, but his problem is that he wants to win with his stamp on the team. His stamp got us Stauskas! His stamp fired Mike Malone after hiring Mike Malone.
Its well know that Vivek wanted to hire Doug Christie as our new head coach until all the rest of management talked him out of it. No disrespect to Doug, but he's had little to no experience coaching, just like Vlade had little to no experience as a GM. How did that work out for us? At least now Doug won't have to hear the fans chanting, Fire Doug in the arena, because that's what would happen with this team.
Everyone wants Fox to be the leader of this team. The problem is, Fox isn't a leader, even if he were to state that he's the leader of the team, if no one follows, then who is he leading. That's not a knock on Fox! He is who he is, and a leader isn't one of them. My problem with Fox is that he's seems to be getting used to losing. I hope I'm wrong about that, but his body language seems to emit that at times. Not to mention, it bugged me to see half our team yucking it up with the Lakers after they just got done kicking our butt's. Yeah, I know, its common for players to do that after a game, and if our record was 14 and 8, instead of 8 and 14, I wouldn't have cared. But it's not!
We've had the core of Barnes, Fox and Buddy for about 4 years now, and it's added up to around 34 or 35 wins every year. Last year we added Haliburton, and not much changed. That's not to say they aren't talented, but that for some reason it's not working. Blame it on whatever you want! The parts don't seem to fit together. Throw in bad coaching and you have the usual result. What's that definition of insanity? To keep doing the same thing and expecting a different result. The only answer I can think of is to blow it up. Stop trying to fix it and rebuild it from the ground up.
Believe me, I'm the last person that wants to do something like this. I'm old enough where I hesitate to buy green banana's anymore. I'd like to see this team become legit competitors before I head to basketball heaven. But I don't see any other way. If you think Ben Simmons is going to cure our ill's, I have some swamp land in Florida I'd like to sell you. I'd like to finish by saying that I sincerely hope I'm wrong about all this. That someone has an answer other than a rebuild.
As a famous boxer once said, the question isn't whether your going to get hit with a punch, the question is what are you going to do after you've been hit? I hate to say this after 15 years of enduring this same crap, but this team needs to be torn apart and rebuilt from the ground up. Something that should have been done when Vivek bought the team. Instead he's been trying to put band aids on the team ever since. I have no doubt that Vivek wants to win, but his problem is that he wants to win with his stamp on the team. His stamp got us Stauskas! His stamp fired Mike Malone after hiring Mike Malone.
Its well know that Vivek wanted to hire Doug Christie as our new head coach until all the rest of management talked him out of it. No disrespect to Doug, but he's had little to no experience coaching, just like Vlade had little to no experience as a GM. How did that work out for us? At least now Doug won't have to hear the fans chanting, Fire Doug in the arena, because that's what would happen with this team.
Everyone wants Fox to be the leader of this team. The problem is, Fox isn't a leader, even if he were to state that he's the leader of the team, if no one follows, then who is he leading. That's not a knock on Fox! He is who he is, and a leader isn't one of them. My problem with Fox is that he's seems to be getting used to losing. I hope I'm wrong about that, but his body language seems to emit that at times. Not to mention, it bugged me to see half our team yucking it up with the Lakers after they just got done kicking our butt's. Yeah, I know, its common for players to do that after a game, and if our record was 14 and 8, instead of 8 and 14, I wouldn't have cared. But it's not!
We've had the core of Barnes, Fox and Buddy for about 4 years now, and it's added up to around 34 or 35 wins every year. Last year we added Haliburton, and not much changed. That's not to say they aren't talented, but that for some reason it's not working. Blame it on whatever you want! The parts don't seem to fit together. Throw in bad coaching and you have the usual result. What's that definition of insanity? To keep doing the same thing and expecting a different result. The only answer I can think of is to blow it up. Stop trying to fix it and rebuild it from the ground up.
Believe me, I'm the last person that wants to do something like this. I'm old enough where I hesitate to buy green banana's anymore. I'd like to see this team become legit competitors before I head to basketball heaven. But I don't see any other way. If you think Ben Simmons is going to cure our ill's, I have some swamp land in Florida I'd like to sell you. I'd like to finish by saying that I sincerely hope I'm wrong about all this. That someone has an answer other than a rebuild.
Exactly.
Which is NOT the same as saying "lose Walton and the Kings magically transform into a .650 team." I saw much more excitement about kicking Luke to the curb than about hiring Gentry, per se. Gentry is preferable to Walton, but hardly an inspiring choice. And you're hardly giving the *new* guy his best shot when you bring him in mid-season. AND no coach - not Luke, not Alvin - should be held responsible for whatever the hell ails De'Aaron Fox. That's much more about his personal psychology than about his added muscle or schemes that don't fit his skill set.
Coaching is also only partly responsible for why the Kings' best offensive player so far this year can only get NINE FGA/game over his last five games played and is down to 12/game on the season after getting 16+ in 4 of the first 6 games. HB - the ONE guy on the team who can get freebies and consistently make them - ranks behind Fox, Buddy, TD, Davion and Metu in FGA/36. Etc.
Point is that the Kings have looked both playoff-worthy and like bums last year and this year under Luke. In the span of, what, five games, they have looked very good and terrible under Gentry. When coaching is constant and you regularly see the wild fluctuations we've become used to with the Kings, it's not just about coaching.
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Luke really was a big part of the problem.
Gentry, I am not a fan of, but I think honestly I'd be surprised if he wants the job long term. Poor guy just went out and apologized to everyone after only a week on the gig and a bunch of players that clearly haven't responded to having their idiot coach sacked.
This really marks a low point of the post Adelman era for me.
Gentry, I am not a fan of, but I think honestly I'd be surprised if he wants the job long term. Poor guy just went out and apologized to everyone after only a week on the gig and a bunch of players that clearly haven't responded to having their idiot coach sacked.
This really marks a low point of the post Adelman era for me.
Kingster
Hall of Famer
"You're in danger of becoming the next Tyrone Corbin." So says James Ham about Gentry after he watches Hield's gawdawful play without Gentry taking him out of the game. Ham thinks Hield should sit a minimum of five games for his stupid play in the Lakers game, both on offense and defense.
Kingster
Hall of Famer
He wasn't used to losing when they beat Portland and the Lakers consecutively. He wasn't used to losing when he shot the ball 30 times in LA. But now all of a sudden he's used to losing on his home court when he takes nine shots against the same Lakers?
SacTownKid
Hall of Famer
Nobody is going to question that part of it, but it's the coaches job to deal with it, right or wrong.
bajaden
Hall of Famer
I honestly don't know! You tell me! Tell me how any coach can win with this team when he has no idea what he's going to get out of any player on the team other than maybe Holmes and possibly Barnes. Will the real Fox please show up. Ditto Haliburton! I won't even touch Buddy other than to say that he needs to be gone off the team. He is a horrible defender, and he makes absolutely bone headed plays game after game. After turning the ball over with the Kings down five, he then fouls Westbrook putting him on the line. And then with the game seemingly going south, he launches a three from downtown Stockton with around 20 seconds left on the shot clock. Inexcusable!
At that point, the whole team seemed to go into that, here we go again mode and they just threw in the towel. In a span of around 8 or 9 minutes we went from being up 15 to the game was over. I'm not a fan of Westbrook, but I'll give him this. There is no quit in him. He never stops believing he can win. I think he puts up empty stats at times, but I'll never question his desire to win. I'm not upset that the Kings lost the game, I'm upset at how they lost the game.
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