ESPN says Kings have decided to KEEP George Karl
- Thread starter kingjatt
- Start date
Cousins is currently one of the top 10 players in the NBA. Probably one of the top five in terms of overall talent.
But it's worth pointing out that among the group from the last 35 years DeMarcus Cousins has the highest usage rate (a couple of them broke 32% in a season but none of them ever got closer than that to DMC's 35% this season) and the lowest shooting percentage (a more than 12% difference between Boogie and the leader - Shaq) and maybe more concerning is that EVERY single one of those guys listed - O'Neal, K. Malone, M. Malone, Sir Charles, Dream and CWebb made the playoffs their first season.
Boogie has had poor rosters around him. He's had terrible coaching. I agree that he's the most dominant offensive center in the NBA and I've never seen a man his size do the things he does. And he's also improved dramatically as a defender. But if we're going to make the leap to putting him in the rarified air of HOFers and some of the best bigs to play the game I think the question needs to be asked of why he can't elevate his team.
Chubbs
Starter
Finally used a familiar IP?
km23
Bench
And look how well Karl's system is working out.
Dbeltz24
Bench
A well put together response.
I
Im Still Ballin
Guest
This just might be the luckiest day in Sacramento Kings history. We've been blessed to keep this man. This deserves celebration.
Yes and in the little known but time honored tradition, said legends greatest fan shall enter the hall of the ignored. Dont worry, your sacrifice will soon be forgotten.
ParniValjak
All-Star
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HereWeBoogie
Hall of Famer
This franchise is just the worst
ParniValjak
All-Star
BTW, a lot of the issues with our transition D stem from the pace we are playing at. Better perimeter defenders would help but there is little doubt that the pace at which we are playing has a fair bit to do with out inability to defend in transition.
Dbeltz24
Bench
Who bit what?
SacKings384
Starter
Guessing someone got the banhammer?
King Baller
All-Star
Well there were some other guys that affected those usage numbers. Guys like Kobe, Wade, Stockton, Dr. J, Clyde, Bibby and Peja
Dbeltz24
Bench
Well there were some other guys that affected those usage numbers. Guys like Kobe, Wade, Stockton, Dr. J, Clyde, Bibby and Peja
All guards and small forwards. No big men you listed.
I
Im Still Ballin
Guest
I'm glad Vlade decided to keep George. After all, that resume speaks for itself. We just need some winners on the roster now.
Ron
Starter
Trolling??
King Baller
All-Star
Those guys PLAYED WITH the Big Men that were listed with a lower usage rate than Big Cuz.
Usage percentage is an estimate of the percentage of team plays used by a player while he was on the floor.---> http://www.basketball-reference.com/about/glossary.html
Well there were some other guys that affected those usage numbers. Guys like Kobe, Wade, Stockton, Dr. J, Clyde, Bibby and Peja
I get where you're coming from, but in terms of their rookie years when ALL of those guys made the playoffs, Kobe was 18, Wade wasn't in the league, Stock only started half the games and averaged 23 mpg, Clyde wasn't a rocket and Webb had yet to join forces with Bibby and Peja. Barkley did play his rookie year with Dr. J who was nearing the end of his career but was still a 20 ppg scorer.
And while Wade and Kobe have been usage monsters (around 32% for their careers with Wade getting close to Boogie's 35% this season in 2009 and Bryant surpassing it a couple times)
the reality is that both Isaiah Thomas and Rondo have a higher career usage rate than Stockton and Bibby slots right between Rajon and Thomas. Rudy Gay has a higher career usage rate than Peja and is almost equal to Drexler's.
And back to our 27 & 11 bigs of the last 35 years, Boogie averages more fouls and more turnovers per minute/game than all of them as well.
Let me be clear - I don't think Cousins is what's wrong with the Kings. Their record without him shows that he's one of the only things right with the Kings. But he's not above reproach. He still hasn't gotten more efficient from the field, still hasn't learned to not make dumb fouls, still hasn't cut down on his turnovers, still argues with refs and ruins defensive possessions on the other end and still hasn't shown the mental toughness to not get taken out of games and to fight to get his team back in difficult situations.
Is it fair to look at a guy putting up 27 & 11, being the last line of defense for a team with terrible perimeter defense, who has shown his team can rarely win without him and levy criticism his way when there are other glaring issues with his teammates and the coaching?
No, it really isn't. EXCEPT that if you really want to be that HOF big man, that all-time great player that his stats and my eyes have shown that he can be then you have to say it is. Because you can't be an all-time great that constantly demoralizes your own team with tantrums and who doesn't shore up some obvious (and correctable) weaknesses.
Cousins is a great player. Is he an all-time great player? His individual numbers say yes. His lack of team success says no. Watching him play I think, well he sure as hell should be if he can change a few things. We'll see.
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Livinthedream
All-Star
Seriously George. We know you're happy. Now go prepare for the Philly game.
King Baller
All-Star
Funky I will just concede your point with reservations
I don't feel like researching all those rosters when those guys were rookies. But something tells me if I did I would see a roster like---> http://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/GSW/1994.html
Funky I will just concede your point with reservations
That Warriors team might have made the playoffs without Mullin. But Shaq's Magic definitely wouldn't have. I don't want to go team by team, and we don't really need to. Every time I hear a litany of reasons why Cousins is a clear HOFer and another litany of reasons of why he's never made the playoffs it just doesn't track for me.
Cousins has never had enough talent around him to have a real contending team. But a guy who is projected as an all-time great should have been enough to pull his team into an 8th spot at least once by now.
It's such a pointless argument to begin with-- the playoffs thing. For the first 3 years of DeMarcus' career we had owners here who were actively trying to tank the team and move it to a different city. They cut every single cost they could manage to cut. We had the smallest scouting department in the league, we hired coaches nobody else wanted because they were dirt cheap, we traded draft picks for cash, we traded down in the draft to save cash, we traded our 5th overall pick in the middle of his rookie season for expiring contracts! It was a disaster. Nobody is winning under those conditions.
He's had 2 1/2 years now under new management. His first year the entire roster was changed out except for a few players. It was a complete start from scratch re-build with a first year coach at the helm who was told that wins and losses were less important than establishing a winning culture (hah! if only they'd just stuck with that). Then last year we looked like we might be headed to a playoff spot and then Malone was fired and we know how that went. This season we're still competing for a playoff spot. DeMarcus has only had one and a half seasons where the organization was actually trying to win and one of those was sabotaged by epic mismanagement.
It takes a very selective memory to turn these events into Cousins not being good enough to lead a team.
He's had 2 1/2 years now under new management. His first year the entire roster was changed out except for a few players. It was a complete start from scratch re-build with a first year coach at the helm who was told that wins and losses were less important than establishing a winning culture (hah! if only they'd just stuck with that). Then last year we looked like we might be headed to a playoff spot and then Malone was fired and we know how that went. This season we're still competing for a playoff spot. DeMarcus has only had one and a half seasons where the organization was actually trying to win and one of those was sabotaged by epic mismanagement.
It takes a very selective memory to turn these events into Cousins not being good enough to lead a team.
King Baller
All-Star
Except he caught the Kings in an era of bad ownership. The Maloof's were cash poor and making trades to raise cash by the time they drafted Boogie. While Vivek helped save the Kings for Sacramento, he also fired the only Coach who has connected with Boogie.
ParniValjak
All-Star
So what happens when we lose to Philly tomorrow?! Do we fire Karl then?
Is this the same as PDA saying Corbin is our coach for the remainder of the season?
This thing will get a lot uglier than it already is. The franchise is seriously testing everyone's patience.
Is this the same as PDA saying Corbin is our coach for the remainder of the season?
This thing will get a lot uglier than it already is. The franchise is seriously testing everyone's patience.
Sorry, I was referring to the thread, which started out as one thing and somewhat inevitably ended up being another discussion of DMC.
IfAt1st
Starter
AGAIN, you prove you are one of the few posters on here that keeps their eye on the ball, and knows the recent history of the team.
I would go further and say that this organization + players has only been actually trying to win (with him playing) for about a combined half of a season since Demarcus was drafted!
Last year, only the first 15 games count, and this year there have been a minimum of 15-20 games already where the players and coaches didn't particularly care whether they won.
Really, Demarcus SHOULD be immune to the critique of "look at the record - has his team won?" - it's simply ignoring the reality of this franchise to remotely make that claim.
Happy to oblige.
Thanks for the kind words.It's occurred to me somewhere in the course of all this George Karl discussion that the losing has gone on for so long now that a good number of the members here may not have even been around for the glory days period of 1999-2005, not to mention the giddy streak of losing seasons which preceded it when we were happy just to have a team to root for. And where people fall on the scale of assigning blame this season could depend entirely on when you first became a fan and what your own personal relationship with the team has been. Indeed the most difficult part about nearly losing the team and then miraculously finding a way to keep it was when a new owner came in who shared none of our history and proceeded to play through a number of the same mistakes we just went through with the last owners. I kindof watch through the cracks in my fingers a bit, but it's just the unfortunate reality of our situation. I can't begrudge anyone their own personal fan experience.
So... for those people out there who've only known DeMarcus scrunching up his face and throwing up his hands at the refs after foul calls and one coach after another coming in as a potential savior before being unceremoniously shown the door and picked apart on the way out -- first of all, I feel sorry for you. That's a rough start. Secondly, trust me that DeMarcus' antics aren't as bad as you think they are. In terms of players who tend to generate mixed-feelings in their own fanbase, there have been way way worse. And lastly, take it as a public service that the wiser (and sadly, more physically fragile) members of your favorite fan community would endeavor to offer perspective on what true misery is and how you don't necessarily want to plunge down that canyon we're teetering on the edge of because the words "things couldn't get much worse" are what goes through everyone's mind... right before they proceed to do exactly that.
PS -- Grant Napear gets no excuses though. He should know better.
