Looking at that starting five...yuck. This teams ceiling would be 38-40 wins tops IMO. The NBA has changed, you don't put nothing but role players around your star player and expect to make the post season. Cousins is not LeBron...this team would remind me of the Cleveland Cavaliers teams when Bron first got there, it was strictly him by himself and a bunch of role players/spacers while winning 50 games...yeah, Bron can do it. That's the only guy in the league that can win with average talent.
cousins don't know nothin bout what up
- Thread starter Big Cuz 15
- Start date
You might as well kiss that dream goodbye. Star free agents won't come here, regardless of what DeMarcus does IMO. Why should they? This team has a bad track record, rightfully so. Players only come here to either boost their stats/value or come because no other teams are paying them what Sacramento is willing to. The best way to acquire another star player is via trade or draft IMO.
I hear what you are saying but I think you are missing the point. One, a franchise player and front office should be on the same page, and if they are not on it is a lack of communication. Communication is a two-way street and the player needs to bear his degree of responsibility for quality communication to occur.
Boogie had a TERRIBLE relationship with Karl, as has been revealed after the fact, as a lot of indications during suggested it was far from perfect. The slate has been wiped clean. What has Boogie learned as result of this experience? Apparently nothing, at least with regard to extending out to his new coach and having a heart-to-heart.
Two, watch Boogie's answers RE: draft picks and don't tell me that is NOT a guy giving his tacit disapproval of the moves. Basically his body language and tone is "Can you belief these buffoons drafted two big men when they have ME?! How dare they?!"
Joerger and Castellaneta and Vlade (at least as a player) have experienced success. They've won. Boogie hasn't won jack squat. Just for this reason alone Boogie needs to be more humble and show more faith in their decision-making. If he is discontent with the moves, which is perfectly within his right, he needs to approach the decision-makers and try to understand their thought process, instead of shrugging and rolling his eyes. Thats what you do when you are an adult. You don't passively aggressively vent to the media.
I am not trying to create drama where it doesn't exist but you would think after ALL the frustration Boogie has experienced, he would be interested in unity and harmony, relieved Karl has been exiled. But he's indifferent to it because he doesn't know anything but dysfunction. This is what he knows this is where he feels most at home, when there is an underlying conflict and a chance to deflect when collective underachievement ensues.
Boogie had a TERRIBLE relationship with Karl, as has been revealed after the fact, as a lot of indications during suggested it was far from perfect. The slate has been wiped clean. What has Boogie learned as result of this experience? Apparently nothing, at least with regard to extending out to his new coach and having a heart-to-heart.
Two, watch Boogie's answers RE: draft picks and don't tell me that is NOT a guy giving his tacit disapproval of the moves. Basically his body language and tone is "Can you belief these buffoons drafted two big men when they have ME?! How dare they?!"
Joerger and Castellaneta and Vlade (at least as a player) have experienced success. They've won. Boogie hasn't won jack squat. Just for this reason alone Boogie needs to be more humble and show more faith in their decision-making. If he is discontent with the moves, which is perfectly within his right, he needs to approach the decision-makers and try to understand their thought process, instead of shrugging and rolling his eyes. Thats what you do when you are an adult. You don't passively aggressively vent to the media.
I am not trying to create drama where it doesn't exist but you would think after ALL the frustration Boogie has experienced, he would be interested in unity and harmony, relieved Karl has been exiled. But he's indifferent to it because he doesn't know anything but dysfunction. This is what he knows this is where he feels most at home, when there is an underlying conflict and a chance to deflect when collective underachievement ensues.
Yes and no. Consider for a second, who is the bigger offensive weapon: Cuz, or IT? How about Cuz or Gordon Hayward? Teams built like that, without any true #1 at all, are serious threats to make the playoffs because they take care of business on the other end. Is Avery Bradley, Jae Crowder, Evan Turner, Jared Sulinger really any more punchy than Avery Bradley, Darren Collison, Aaron Afflalo, Omri Casspi? Yet those were the support scorers in Boston. In Utah Hayward is backed up by Derrick Favors, Rodney Hood, and another guard like Burks, Mack, or maybe old Joe Johnson this year. Hill will give them 10-12 now.
I know its been 10 years since we've seen it here, and only a few years in the entire 30 year history of the Sacramento Kings, but if you take care of business on defense, you can absolutely make the playoffs as a tough defensive squad with a single exceptional scorer. And that's if your scorer is just a 2nd tier guy. Our scorer was the 4th leading scorer in the NBA last season. So yes you're right, most signs point toward us adopting that plan. But its a plan that has flat out worked in the past with the right personnel and coach. And we have the coach to be comfortable in it.
Here's another supporting cast for a single scorer, backed by a strong defense: Walt Williams, old Spud Webb, Brian Grant, Olden Polynice.
Or another: Mo Williams, 33yr old Big Z, Delonte West.
Or just about any of Pat Riley's big center teams.
But it means that the rise and fall of team is going to finally depend on the defensive columns. In Sacramento a long succession of crapty owners and offensive obsessed front offices have steadfastly refused to ever play this way in this town. But it may finally be coming. Hold the opponent under 100 every night, let Cuz do the heavy lifting, and keep the point totals low enough that a pile of 12-15pt scorers can reach them.
25 for Cousins
15 for Bradley (lst year total)
15 for Collison
12 for Afflalo
12 for Omri
that's 79. +20 from everybody else (WCS, Koufos, Temple, Barnes, possibly Skal etc.)
and under any Kings regime in a decade we lose going away with that kind of point total. But Dave Joerger teams allowed 94.6, 95.1 and this year with all the injuries 101.3.
I know its been 10 years since we've seen it here, and only a few years in the entire 30 year history of the Sacramento Kings, but if you take care of business on defense, you can absolutely make the playoffs as a tough defensive squad with a single exceptional scorer. And that's if your scorer is just a 2nd tier guy. Our scorer was the 4th leading scorer in the NBA last season. So yes you're right, most signs point toward us adopting that plan. But its a plan that has flat out worked in the past with the right personnel and coach. And we have the coach to be comfortable in it.
Here's another supporting cast for a single scorer, backed by a strong defense: Walt Williams, old Spud Webb, Brian Grant, Olden Polynice.
Or another: Mo Williams, 33yr old Big Z, Delonte West.
Or just about any of Pat Riley's big center teams.
But it means that the rise and fall of team is going to finally depend on the defensive columns. In Sacramento a long succession of crapty owners and offensive obsessed front offices have steadfastly refused to ever play this way in this town. But it may finally be coming. Hold the opponent under 100 every night, let Cuz do the heavy lifting, and keep the point totals low enough that a pile of 12-15pt scorers can reach them.
25 for Cousins
15 for Bradley (lst year total)
15 for Collison
12 for Afflalo
12 for Omri
that's 79. +20 from everybody else (WCS, Koufos, Temple, Barnes, possibly Skal etc.)
and under any Kings regime in a decade we lose going away with that kind of point total. But Dave Joerger teams allowed 94.6, 95.1 and this year with all the injuries 101.3.
If the assertion is that DMC needs to be in step with what the front office is doing is it your opinion that the onus is on Cousins to call them up and ask them to explain it? Because that's what it sounds like to me. If the front office and the franchise player need to be on the same page then to me the GM is the one that needs to explain the front office's plan to the player. It's their plan after all. I think it's strange that you think the fact that no one has clued him in to what the front office is thinking is an error on the part of Cousins. If the CEO of my company decides that I'm important enough that he wants to outline company strategy to me then great. But I wouldn't think of walking into his office and demanding to know what the long term plan is.
I'm guessing Cousins is acutely aware that his reputation around the league (fairly or not) is that he's a cancer and a coach killer. So I believe him when he says he just wants to do his job and control what he can control. He doesn't want to be seen as influencing the direction of the roster etc. So I very much doubt that he's going to call Vlade and demand updates.
And let's not pretend that the Kings moves this offseason have met with resounding approval from fans. Lots of people hammered the draft picks and the free agent signings. Plenty of guys hated bringing in Matt Barnes. STR had a whole piece on how signing Tolliver and letting Acy go was a terrible choice. Some wanted Rondo brought back. Lots of people frustrated that Seth Curry wasn't resigned. Clearly Vlade & co aren't explaining themselves to Cousins. So he's left just like the rest of us to try and figure out what the plan is. I fail to see how that's his fault. If the team wants Boogie to understand the strategy they should explain it to him.
*Side note - why do you have Ken Catanella's name as "Castellaneta" and in italics? Weird autocorrect? Or something else? I only ask because usually when I see something written like that (italics for emphasis) in response to someone else it's because it's done as a correction. A proper spelling or grammatical usage following an initial mistake. I do a lot of copywriting and proofreading in my job so those sorts of things jump out at me.
I'm guessing Cousins is acutely aware that his reputation around the league (fairly or not) is that he's a cancer and a coach killer. So I believe him when he says he just wants to do his job and control what he can control. He doesn't want to be seen as influencing the direction of the roster etc. So I very much doubt that he's going to call Vlade and demand updates.
And let's not pretend that the Kings moves this offseason have met with resounding approval from fans. Lots of people hammered the draft picks and the free agent signings. Plenty of guys hated bringing in Matt Barnes. STR had a whole piece on how signing Tolliver and letting Acy go was a terrible choice. Some wanted Rondo brought back. Lots of people frustrated that Seth Curry wasn't resigned. Clearly Vlade & co aren't explaining themselves to Cousins. So he's left just like the rest of us to try and figure out what the plan is. I fail to see how that's his fault. If the team wants Boogie to understand the strategy they should explain it to him.
*Side note - why do you have Ken Catanella's name as "Castellaneta" and in italics? Weird autocorrect? Or something else? I only ask because usually when I see something written like that (italics for emphasis) in response to someone else it's because it's done as a correction. A proper spelling or grammatical usage following an initial mistake. I do a lot of copywriting and proofreading in my job so those sorts of things jump out at me.
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Given that your team the Celtics won a lot of games this past season without superstars and a great coach, you of all people should know what impact that has.
You practically had a great season at the back of Isaiah Thomas and a bunch of good to great role players.
On PG debate, I do find it somewhat hilarious that some 12 months ago, people we very happy to go into the season with Collison as our starting PG and wanted us to get a serviceable veteran back up for him. Now that we are back to Collison as a starter 12 months on all of a sudden we need a major upgrade at PG position.
You practically had a great season at the back of Isaiah Thomas and a bunch of good to great role players.
On PG debate, I do find it somewhat hilarious that some 12 months ago, people we very happy to go into the season with Collison as our starting PG and wanted us to get a serviceable veteran back up for him. Now that we are back to Collison as a starter 12 months on all of a sudden we need a major upgrade at PG position.
Or how Budenholzer took over the Hawks and turned them from a middling 40+ win team into a 60 win contender with essentially the same roster.
I'm not saying Joerger will have that sort of impact or that he's a top flight coach. Those things will have to be determined. But simply that it IS possible for a coach to have that sort of impact. Especially when the roster is tweaked to work with the schemes he plans to implement.
I'm not saying Joerger will have that sort of impact or that he's a top flight coach. Those things will have to be determined. But simply that it IS possible for a coach to have that sort of impact. Especially when the roster is tweaked to work with the schemes he plans to implement.
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indeed. some names just move the needle. beyond budenholzer and joerger, here's a few others of note: brad stevens, steve clifford, and rick carlisle. a good coach with the right approach can turn a talent gap into an asset. now, can any of those coaches contend for a championship without the superstar talent necessary to do so? no, probably not. the nba is and has always been a star's league. but can such a coach elevate a roster lacking in top tier talent into a playoff team? absolutely. all five of these guys have already done it. and if joerger is able to accomplish that in sacramento, then it's good enough for me.
You are right it is NOT Boogie's onus to go to the front office and figure out what they are up to, UNLESS he has a problem with what they are doing! Unless he is confused over the strategy and philosophy and how he fits. And he clearly is. That's when you become proactive instead an attitude of passive resignation, shrugging your shoulders and rolling your eyes and conveying your tacit disapproval to the media. THAT IS NOT A LEADER! That's a big baby who wants to play the victim card or reserve it for down the road.
You think Curry would say, "I don't know what the heck this front office is doing signing KD....why do they need another MVP when they got me?" No. Because he's a winner. And if he had a problem with it he would express concern to pertinent party in private. Obviously Boogie did not say I don't know why the Kings drafted Papa, but that's what his tone and body language implied. A player has the right to question decisions, but passively venting to the media is not mature way to handle when your GM is a text or phone call away.
And don't group the fans and Boogie into the same category. Obviously the franchise player and keyboard GM do not have the same access to the decision makers running the show. Vlade and Co. are NOT obligated to explain their personnel decisions to Boogie. This is true. But an alleged professional who has been through a lot of turmoil and failure who claims to hate losing needs to take more ownership over his professional situation instead of pretending to be victim of circumstances. It is weak and undermines those who ultimately want him to succeed.
* I just copied that out of Google and it copied incorrectly.
You think Curry would say, "I don't know what the heck this front office is doing signing KD....why do they need another MVP when they got me?" No. Because he's a winner. And if he had a problem with it he would express concern to pertinent party in private. Obviously Boogie did not say I don't know why the Kings drafted Papa, but that's what his tone and body language implied. A player has the right to question decisions, but passively venting to the media is not mature way to handle when your GM is a text or phone call away.
And don't group the fans and Boogie into the same category. Obviously the franchise player and keyboard GM do not have the same access to the decision makers running the show. Vlade and Co. are NOT obligated to explain their personnel decisions to Boogie. This is true. But an alleged professional who has been through a lot of turmoil and failure who claims to hate losing needs to take more ownership over his professional situation instead of pretending to be victim of circumstances. It is weak and undermines those who ultimately want him to succeed.
* I just copied that out of Google and it copied incorrectly.
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So instead of having the maturity to make the private call to Vlade to clear up his so-called confusion, Cousins makes a public tweet instead? He just wants to control what he can control so he makes a public statement about his confusion? C'mon. I may not think Vlade is the greatest choice for GM, but I sure as heck don't believe he doesn't communicate. Isn't that what he does? Communicate? What's the central reason that people love Vlade in the Kings community? He's a charming communicator; he's able to bring people together. Doesn't the slogan hold: If you can't get along with Vlade, you can't get along with anybody?
The only way this possibly works is if Boogie gets his assist to turnover between 1.2 to 1.5 (or better). His career ratio is 0.7. If your intention is to have Boogie do the "heavy lifting" you need to trust him with the ball as facilitator and finisher. He's not proven trustworthy in six seasons due conditioning temper and low post arsenal. Maybe this improves with slow down system and better spacing and a better SG production but ultimately it comes down to execution no matter how savvy the play sets happen to be. And Boogie has never played in games that matter and is subject to lack of poise and patience. When he actually plays in game that matter, say while chasing a 7th or 8th seed, this lack of poise and patience is likely to rear its head. That's why this strategy of Boogie as #1 and vague #2 scorer is dubious at best. I mean it could work but Papa * could * also make the all-star team in 2o17.
What public tweet?
And why does he need to clear up his confusion? He stated that his role is to show up and do his job and let the front office do theirs.
It seems like people want Cousins to WANT to be involved in the team's strategy for the roster. He clearly doesn't. And honestly, if he WAS involved in the moves the team was making then people would hammer him for being over involved, wielding too much power and grousing that players should play, coaches should coach and the GM should assemble the roster.
He's staying in his lane and only gave a direct answer to a question that was asked.
Cousins does enough to legitimately take him to task for that I certainly don't think we need to create imaginary offenses to criticize him over.
And why does he need to clear up his confusion? He stated that his role is to show up and do his job and let the front office do theirs.
It seems like people want Cousins to WANT to be involved in the team's strategy for the roster. He clearly doesn't. And honestly, if he WAS involved in the moves the team was making then people would hammer him for being over involved, wielding too much power and grousing that players should play, coaches should coach and the GM should assemble the roster.
He's staying in his lane and only gave a direct answer to a question that was asked.
Cousins does enough to legitimately take him to task for that I certainly don't think we need to create imaginary offenses to criticize him over.
It perpetuates an attitude of divisiveness and perception of dysfunction when the teams best player says " I have no idea what we are doing". And this is where Boogie is most comfortable, in this realm of deflection and excuse. Here's what is going to happen:
Boogie is going to be GREAT on Team USA. He is going to be hustling and engaged and unselfish and help lead the team to GOLD. This is the Boogie that Kings fans deserve! But this is not the Boogie the Kings fans have gotten.
The difference between Team USA Boogie and Kings Boogie is there is NO conflict or tension between the individual and the collective. This same attitude should pervade when he puts on the SAC uniform. Then the team can come together instead of split at the seams annually through the magnitude of his acrimonious nature and presence.
Boogie is going to be GREAT on Team USA. He is going to be hustling and engaged and unselfish and help lead the team to GOLD. This is the Boogie that Kings fans deserve! But this is not the Boogie the Kings fans have gotten.
The difference between Team USA Boogie and Kings Boogie is there is NO conflict or tension between the individual and the collective. This same attitude should pervade when he puts on the SAC uniform. Then the team can come together instead of split at the seams annually through the magnitude of his acrimonious nature and presence.
Come on. I know Cousins has had a crapty attitude, but the Kings have not helped by surrounding him with terrible players, whiffing on draft picks, going through 5-6 coaches, etc.
Tell me which player since entering the NBA had to go through as much BS as Cousins? I'll give you the only other name..... Ben McLemore.
Drafting BUST Jimmer. Drafting BUST T-Rob. McLemore?? Drafting BUST Nik Stauskas.
Let's go back and look at that 2011 draft. People forget how much we screwed up. We traded BENO UDRIH+7TH for JOHN SALMONS+10. How can people continue to overlook the fact that we could've had Brandon Knight or Kemba Walker....but instead we ended up with Jimmer!!!!!!!
In that very same season...PETRIE traded conditional 1st and Omri Casspi for JJ Hickson. You know that pick we constantly talk about owing to the damn Bulls? Yes. That one. Guess what? His ass didn't even want to play for us, and ended up putting an amazing 37% FG. Let's get even more juicy.. LOL HE WAS WAIVED 35 games into the season. Kings just traded a promising 3rd year player+1st round pick for JJ Hickson whom we waived less than halfway into the season lmao.
At least we claimed Travis Outlaw off waivers right?
This team has been dysfunctional since day 1 for Cousins. The Kings are dysfunctional as hell. He has NEVER used the Kings' dysfunctionality as an excuse for his own issues.
Hell, his coach(GEORGE KARL) tried to rally against up against him and wanted to trade him for a garbage core of Lawson-Faried. How did Cousins respond? 26.9pts 11.5rebs 3.3asts 1.4blks 1.6stls. He never completely gave up on the team. Yes he played with a crapty attitude at times, yes he cried, yes he complained, but he also showed up and played his ass off almost every night.
Tell me which player since entering the NBA had to go through as much BS as Cousins? I'll give you the only other name..... Ben McLemore.
Drafting BUST Jimmer. Drafting BUST T-Rob. McLemore?? Drafting BUST Nik Stauskas.
Let's go back and look at that 2011 draft. People forget how much we screwed up. We traded BENO UDRIH+7TH for JOHN SALMONS+10. How can people continue to overlook the fact that we could've had Brandon Knight or Kemba Walker....but instead we ended up with Jimmer!!!!!!!
In that very same season...PETRIE traded conditional 1st and Omri Casspi for JJ Hickson. You know that pick we constantly talk about owing to the damn Bulls? Yes. That one. Guess what? His ass didn't even want to play for us, and ended up putting an amazing 37% FG. Let's get even more juicy.. LOL HE WAS WAIVED 35 games into the season. Kings just traded a promising 3rd year player+1st round pick for JJ Hickson whom we waived less than halfway into the season lmao.
At least we claimed Travis Outlaw off waivers right?
This team has been dysfunctional since day 1 for Cousins. The Kings are dysfunctional as hell. He has NEVER used the Kings' dysfunctionality as an excuse for his own issues.
Hell, his coach(GEORGE KARL) tried to rally against up against him and wanted to trade him for a garbage core of Lawson-Faried. How did Cousins respond? 26.9pts 11.5rebs 3.3asts 1.4blks 1.6stls. He never completely gave up on the team. Yes he played with a crapty attitude at times, yes he cried, yes he complained, but he also showed up and played his ass off almost every night.
The only way this possibly works is if Boogie gets his assist to turnover between 1.2 to 1.5 (or better). His career ratio is 0.7. If your intention is to have Boogie do the "heavy lifting" you need to trust him with the ball as facilitator and finisher. He's not proven trustworthy in six seasons due conditioning temper and low post arsenal. Maybe this improves with slow down system and better spacing and a better SG production but ultimately it comes down to execution no matter how savvy the play sets happen to be. And Boogie has never played in games that matter and is subject to lack of poise and patience. When he actually plays in game that matter, say while chasing a 7th or 8th seed, this lack of poise and patience is likely to rear its head. That's why this strategy of Boogie as #1 and vague #2 scorer is dubious at best. I mean it could work but Papa * could * also make the all-star team in 2o17.
Yes indeed, when watching those Riley grit and smash great center teams I often said to myself, "self, this cannot possibly work unless his CENTER improves his A/TO ratio!"
Career A/T ratios:
Ewing 1.0/3.0 = 0.3
Mourning 1.1/2.6 = 0.4
Hakeem 2.5/3.0 = 0.8
Moses 1.3/3.1 = 0.4
O'Neal 2.5/2.7 = 0.9
Admiral 2.5/2.4 = 1.0
Yao 1.6 to 2.7 = 0.6
Dwight 1.5 to 3.0 = 0.5
vs.
Blob's only way this can possibly work with Boogie ratio: 1.2 to 1.5 (at least!)
So yes, obviously as always with you, all Boogie has to do is be considerably better than any of the great HOF centers of the modern era, in fact 2 or 3 times as good as some of them, and then MAYBE we can have a shot at him not ****ing up a simple single scorer defensive system.
Yeah because Papa looks like hot garbage. We need to make the next step forward right now and AT BEST Papa is a couple of years out from being a decent NBA role-player. It was definitely telling that Boog called out Skal, and then for Papa, basically said he doesn't understand it. We've had a lot of reaches in our time. Stauskas, Jimmer, Douby, etc. But at least those busts were trying to fill a need that we had. Papa looks awful AND he doesn't fill a need. One of the worst draft picks I've seen. Things could change of course, but that's how it looks right now.
To be honest the fact that Boog hasn't requested a trade ala Melo and Dwight tells me enough about Boog's character. If I was rotting away on this team with the talent he has I'd be pissed as hell. These little outbursts are fine to me. I cursed at the TV for a few minutes straight after the Papa pick, and I don't even play on the damn team.
I have no doubts in my mind that Papa will be another one of those busts...I know it's not fair to judge him at 19 years old, but something just doesn't seem right with him. I can't read into the future or anything, so I'd love to be proven wrong, but deep down...I have zero faith in this prospect. I will take that if Skal becomes a productive player and possibly Malachi too...Cousins number two won't even be here long term IMO.
