Buddy Hield
- Thread starter edwardyoung111
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LPKingsFan
All-Star
Ugh the disrespect to Horford and Millsap
I expect more from you ESP47
Yeah, miss me with the "contention or bust" nonsense, as if fans of a team that hasn't sniffed the second round in nearly 15 years can turn up their noses at being merely very good on the way to potentially being great. The 1998 team didn't have an obvious path to contention did it? That team took years to grow its way to the conference finals contender that we knew and loved (with a few adroit trades and signings along the way). It wasn't built in a day.
Chris Webber is a cusp HOF player. Who do you think has that potential on this team?
What conversation are you replying to here? I don't see anyone talking about contention or bust. It's not like we have a first round playoff team and are looking to blow it up because we want championships. I'm sure everyone here would be perfectly fine with a first round sweep, as long as we just made the playoffs in some manner or another.
LPKingsFan
All-Star
Yeah, my bad, your conversation for some reason made me think of these sentiments, but perhaps they would have been best shared in the personnel moves forum, where I more often see this kind of position advocated. Carry on.
SacTownKid
Hall of Famer
There are different levels in the HOF so saying such and such is in the hall of fame or on the cusp doesn't necessarily represent a true bar. I think Fox has serious potential and while I'm not sure he'll be as prolific as someone like Gary Payton I think he can do some of the same things defensively if he develops. Buddy could potentially reach a Reggie Miller level. Players like T-Mac, Vince Carter (he'll get in IMO), Mutomobo, Ray Allen all represent different levels and types of players. Some mostly stats guys. So, if the production ability is there and you combine winning it's possible to be in the conversation. Going back to the initial premise, they need to put their most capable players in a position to succeed as individuals in order to identify where they are on some sort of scale. Playing role players over your real talent at this point and losing anyway is shooting for a far lower tier than they should.
Role has everything to do with opportunity when related to individual accolades like HOF. For instance, Isaiah Thomas in Boston, had he stayed there his whole career putting up 25 ppg do you think he's in the convo for HOF? So far in his career no other team he's been on has given him that same chance. That will ultimately define where he ends up once his career is over.
SacTownKid
Hall of Famer
It's not contention or bust, it's about wasting your time not building towards the eventual road blocks on the path towards contention. The Raptors say hi. That 98 team over the course of time was augmented to matchup with the real teams of the time. They had DC to combat Kobe, size to play against Shaq with Vlade and Pollard. Petrie knew who he had to get through and attempted to remain versatile to beat the Mavs, Jazz, and Lakers of the world. It's not like he was running from it like some teams are right now. The truth is the rules of the game have screwed up a large chunk of what you are able to do as a team to stop the other teams. The physicality and size of that era won't work now (although if you had two dominant post bigs grit and grind could be that answer but no team has that), just like the flashy small ball mismatching wouldn't work nearly as well then as now because the way the game was called would find most of these teams gobbled up in the paint and beat up on the wing.
I agree that they need to start playing the real talent. Joerger made some comments about the players really needing to earn their minutes this year and I'm hoping that means guys like Buddy start playing starters minutes while vets like Temple, who's minutes have no bearing on a future playoff run, spend more time on the bench. You just never know with Joerger. It's like one minute he seems like he really gets it and then the next he makes an old man "get off my lawn" type move.
Yeah Isaiah's role in Boston could have landed him in the hall of fame if they would have kept that team together and had a real long playoff run with them but Isaiah's problem is that he needs a team built specifically to his strengths and weaknesses in order to be an MVP caliber player. He doesn't do well in an environment where he is asked to bend. It's everyone around him that needs to change for him and that's why he's finding it difficult to find success anywhere else. You could very well be right. There could be some hall of famers that are in because they were in perfect scenarios for their play style and others that will never make it could and could have been first ballot if they were on different teams.
SacTownKid
Hall of Famer
Pretty much, and the question is whether the playing field from rookies to the vets is even. I get a little sketched when I hear coaches say things like players have to earn their minutes or earn it in practice because that's typically just a coach setting up the canned explanation of why he does what he does. If Buddy didn't "earn" his spot last year I don't know what else he can do. Zbo certainly didn't "earn" his spot last year yet there he was, in his spot.
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