Brady Heslip to Kings?

[pshn80]

Speaking of Hume and Mills- some quotes for you:

John Stuart Mills:
"In this age, the mere example of non-conformity, the mere refusal to bend the knee to custom, is itself a service. Precisely because the tyranny of opinion is such as to make eccentricity a reproach, it is desirable, in order to break through that tyranny, that people should be eccentric. Eccentricity has always abounded when and where strength of character has abounded; and the amount of eccentricity in a society has generally been proportional to the amount of genius, mental vigor, and moral courage which it contained. That so few now dare to be eccentric, marks the chief danger of the time" and also: "Originality is the one thing which unoriginal minds cannot feel the use of"- it's clear where Mills stand... right beside Vivek.

David Hume:
"Nothing is more usual and more natural for those, who pretend to discover anything new to the world in philosophy and the sciences, than to insinuate the praises of their own systems, by decrying all those, which have been advanced before them" and also: "Where men are the most sure and arrogant, they are commonly the most mistaken, and have there given reins to passion, without that proper deliberation and suspense, which can alone secure them from the grossest absurdities"

I'm taking Hume's side on this one...

Thanks for posting this both because of its bearing on Bricklayer's comments and because
I haven't done that reading myself. I suppose I am an eccentric as referred to by Mills, at least on the subject of PDA this week.

 

[Albatros]

Clippers just opened up a roster spot....

 

[pshn80]

First of all, you're absolutely correct that Kings fans would rather see wins than to see Nik develop...and I count myself among those who want to see the wins.

Next, this thread was started with the idea of 'Here we ago again, the FO is bungling things up again.'

Now I understand that you're not as down on the FO as most others (which actually doesn't make much sense to me considering what I thought I gathered from you in a different thread...but that is sort of irrelevant to this topic) and so you're coming in and trying to balance out the narrative and bring some calm to the discussions so that people won't go over-board.

As I mentioned, (the very first thing I said) I'm not going to rip the FO for this move.
But just because I'm not going to rip them doesn't mean that it's a good move.
And for a variety of reasons which I have outlined, I don't think it's a good move, mostly due to the timing.

If the Kings were winning and Nik was playing well, then sure I could see bringing in Heslip on a 10-day to see if he could add some extra scoring punch.
But for a team spiraling out of control...PDA needs to be thinking about making moves which might actually have a chance of stopping the bleeding.

Since I don't seem to be getting my point across in saying that it is not a great move right now, to bring Heslip on a 10-day, let's look a bit more closely at both the timing and the details of how it would play out as things currently stand.

1.) The team is in chaos right now.
2.) We are seeing the players revert back to selfish basketball and they are starting to look like players who are only out to play for themselves rather than play for the team.
3.) We have a top 10 pick who was reported (and arguably is) the best shooter in the draft.
4.) But due to the NBA being a whole other animal he is struggling to adjust to the speed and physicality of the players.

5.) In the last 10 games, the most minutes Stauskas has played has been 23 (when Ben got into early foul trouble) and the least minutes have been a paltry 5 minutes.
6.) In those 10 games he is averaging 13.3 minutes a game and here is the important thing...he is only averaging 3.3 shots a game.
So he is a designated shooter who spends most of his 13.3 minutes a game in the corner hoping to get the kick-out...and he's only getting 3.3 shots a game.

So...again, what does bringing in Heslip accomplish?

Say you play him 5 minutes a game for a couple of games.
If he gets shots at the same rate as Stauskas, he will be due for about a single shot a game.(Maybe 2)
Even if he makes all of his shots (1-2 a game) for 3 games, what does that accomplish?
Do you sign him to a contract? (extremely doubtful)
Are we winning those games because of those made shots? (doutful)

And if we are not signing him to a contract and we are not winning games, then what is the point, other than to reduce Stauskas' minutes from 13 a game down to 8?

I don't know why people feel the need to defend the FO on a small move that has pretty much zero upside and has multiple down-sides.

If we do bring him in, my guess is that if he does get onto the floor, it's very possible he won't get the ball to even have a chance to get his shot up.
The only way he gets significant minutes (7+) is if we are involved in a blow-out.

The FO destroyed this team and they have to make some big moves to get this ship above water.
While not a disastrous move by any means, bringing in Heslip right now, with what is going on, is actually pretty unfair to Heslip, because there is no way he's going on the court with the other Kings and getting any sort of fair shake to display his shooting.
And in fact, I wouldn't be surprised if the players actively avoided getting him the ball.
They are obviously not happy with what is going on, and I can't see any way that they would go out of their way on the court to get the ball to someone like Heslip when they are having problems getting the ball to Ben and Nik.

A ten day signing at any time for any player does't deserve 47 lines of argument for or against. Hasn't happened yet?

 

[The_Jamal]

I love spot-up shooters more than anybody, especially next to a dominant big man, and we have exactly one of those guys right now. So why not? At the very least, it pushes Nik to get the best out of him. Competition brings the best out of players. I think drafting Nik certainly put Ben's game into shape as he all of a sudden had a top 10 lottery pick coming to take his job. Perhaps Heslip can do the same for Nik

 

[bajaden]

I love spot-up shooters more than anybody, especially next to a dominant big man, and we have exactly one of those guys right now. So why not? At the very least, it pushes Nik to get the best out of him. Competition brings the best out of players. I think drafting Nik certainly put Ben's game into shape as he all of a sudden had a top 10 lottery pick coming to take his job. Perhaps Heslip can do the same for Nik

If you watched Nik play in college, you would know that he doesn't need anyone to bring out the best in him. He's a very competitive player and a gym rat that's always working on his game. He's in a situation right now that many in the NBA have been in. He's a rookie on a short leash. That means he's looking over his shoulder everytime he makes a mistake. The worse thing you could do is give him one more reason to look over his shoulder. His problem right now is two fold. He mentally thinks he has to be perfect when he goes out there, and that perception is being backed up by fewer and fewer minutes..

Unci03 and I have watched Heslip play countless games, so trust me, if you think Nik's defense is bad, wait till you see Brady's. Right now, I don't think Nik's minutes are being limited by his offense, but by his defense. As pointed out, Nik is averaging around 3 shots a game. Hardly enough to matter one way or the other. And, If he makes 2 out of 3, no one says anything. If he misses 2 out of 3, the world comes to an end. In reality, neither stat is meaningful. Until he's getting 8 to 10 shots a game, there's really no way to judge him. Every player is different. Some are thoroughbreds and some are quarterhorses. You can't make one into the other. Right now Nik is in a quarterhorse role, and he's better suited for the thoroughbred role. Not saying he deserves it, just saying that's where his strengths are. If we eventually can't use him that way, then we should trade him for another need. With emphasis on the word eventually.

What I mean by thoroughbred, is that Nik is a multi-talented player. He has a great feel for the game and understands the game. If all your going to do is plant him in the corner and have him spread the floor, then your wasting a lot of his talent. He's a very good passer who see's the floor extremely well. He's outstanding at setting back screens to free up big's. He runs the pick and roll very well, which was his bread and butter at Michigan. He's a player, that the more he gets into the flow of the game, the better he becomes. So right now he's stuck in that rookie, you have to earn your minutes role. And that's fair. To be honest, rather than Heslip, I'd rather go out and get someone like Jody Meeks, and then send Nik down to the D-League so he can get some minutes.

Of course with the system our Reno team is using, I'm not sure that's a good idea.

 

[The_Jamal]

If you watched Nik play in college, you would know that he doesn't need anyone to bring out the best in him. He's a very competitive player and a gym rat that's always working on his game. He's in a situation right now that many in the NBA have been in. He's a rookie on a short leash. That means he's looking over his shoulder everytime he makes a mistake. The worse thing you could do is give him one more reason to look over his shoulder. His problem right now is two fold. He mentally thinks he has to be perfect when he goes out there, and that perception is being backed up by fewer and fewer minutes..

Unci03 and I have watched Heslip play countless games, so trust me, if you think Nik's defense is bad, wait till you see Brady's. Right now, I don't think Nik's minutes are being limited by his offense, but by his defense. As pointed out, Nik is averaging around 3 shots a game. Hardly enough to matter one way or the other. And, If he makes 2 out of 3, no one says anything. If he misses 2 out of 3, the world comes to an end. In reality, neither stat is meaningful. Until he's getting 8 to 10 shots a game, there's really no way to judge him. Every player is different. Some are thoroughbreds and some are quarterhorses. You can't make one into the other. Right now Nik is in a quarterhorse role, and he's better suited for the thoroughbred role. Not saying he deserves it, just saying that's where his strengths are. If we eventually can't use him that way, then we should trade him for another need. With emphasis on the word eventually.

What I mean by thoroughbred, is that Nik is a multi-talented player. He has a great feel for the game and understands the game. If all your going to do is plant him in the corner and have him spread the floor, then your wasting a lot of his talent. He's a very good passer who see's the floor extremely well. He's outstanding at setting back screens to free up big's. He runs the pick and roll very well, which was his bread and butter at Michigan. He's a player, that the more he gets into the flow of the game, the better he becomes. So right now he's stuck in that rookie, you have to earn your minutes role. And that's fair. To be honest, rather than Heslip, I'd rather go out and get someone like Jody Meeks, and then send Nik down to the D-League so he can get some minutes.

Of course with the system our Reno team is using, I'm not sure that's a good idea.

Oh, you don't have to sell me on Nik. If you remember, I was right there with you when saying Nik was one of my favorite prospects in this draft outside of Wiggins, Parker and Embiid.

I guess what I'm suggesting is to bring someone to push Nik how we did with Ben over the past season and a half. Even if it's just in practice.

 

[bajaden]

Oh, you don't have to sell me on Nik. If you remember, I was right there with you when saying Nik was one of my favorite prospects in this draft outside of Wiggins, Parker and Embiid.

I guess what I'm suggesting is to bring someone to push Nik how we did with Ben over the past season and a half. Even if it's just in practice.

Yeah, I knew you were an advocate of drafting Stauskas. I wasn't referring to you, but generalizing with my comments. I have no real objection to bringing in someone to push Nik, but I would rather it be someone that might actually help the team. Heslip would be lucky to see the floor. I'm sure you saw him play in college. He's just a one note samba. He shoots, and then he shoots again. He handles the ball OK, but that's about it. Really much ado about nothing.

 

[ParniValjak]

Thankfully he has signed with Igokea in ABA league formerly known as the Adriatic League

 

[chief bromden]

Thankfully he has signed with Igokea in ABA league formerly known as the Adriatic League

Clears space for Stauskas. Maybe Nik will be the new Heslip.