Bibby needs to go

DaMan

DaMan

Starter
#61
#61
DirkAB said:
Don't get me wrong SAR isn't a bad player, I like him. I just don't think he's what this team needs as long as Brad Miller is playing along side of him. He silently plays pretty consistent, but his rebound is sorely lacking. I think Bibby and SAR would be much better players with a center that could play with his back to the basket. This team needs a solid post presence and slasher. Not that SAR isn't a solid player I just don't see him as a solid post presence, he doesn't suck in the defense at all.

BTW after reading 2 sentences of your last post I could tell you weren't George Defazio (because your post made sense), he posts at another Kings forum under the name DaMan. Did you come up with that screen name yourself or are you familiar with that other forum?
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We have totally oppsite views on what this team needs but i do respect your opinion. To me Brad needs to go for a def mined center who could rebound. Brad and shareef are both soft but shareef is able to give us 20 plus points when given the right amount of points and is a nice low post presense. And we need a superstar player like Paul Pierce that could be our number one option and sar could be our number 2. And in my opinion we might have to trade bibby for a more pure point guard like Andre Miller, who thinks pass first but that might not be needed. And sar defense is not that great it is just decent, that is way we need a def minded center just to cover his defence flaws.

Yea, i came up with it on my own when trying to find a name for my fansty basketball leauge at the last min,:D lol.
 
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JJ22L

JJ22L

Starter
#63
#63
I dont think he needs to go. What he needs to do is calm down on the quick shots, and try to establish movement in the offense. I cant count how many times i yelled "WHAT THE @#!$@!# ARE YOU DOING" during the past couple games when either he'll run it down to the last second to shoot or hell shoot it within the first 3 seconds, and THATS what disrupts our flow. For the kings to win the entire team needs to get involved, and Bibby needs to be the one to do that. Thats what made them so pretty to watch in the past. And that is the exact reason they won in the past.
 
DaMan

DaMan

Starter
#64
#64
SacTown said:
Digging your own grave!!!!!!!

You think we're in deep now? Bibby leaves, we'll never get out.

I've got an idea, instead of trading our 'core' players, why not trade everyone else to suit them, doesn't that make more sense? :rolleyes:
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Man, this team his been heading down hill since Webber left, he was the heart and sole. He had the talent to hide his teammates short comings (he is truely a great player) but every since he has left they have come out. And we have tryed to get players that could fit around the current core but by adding shareef and bonzi but it has not work. We can't try to copy a cheap vision of what we had in tha past. It is time for something new and new faces we can't keep living in the past, even though most of us still want to.
 
JJ22L

JJ22L

Starter
#66
#66
Ya- something needs to happen- we are trying to push a square peg through a circular hole...no matter how talented we look on paper..it dosent equal greatness if it dosent work on the court, which it obviously hasn't.
 
DaMan

DaMan

Starter
#67
#67
JJ22L said:
I dont think he needs to go. What he needs to do is calm down on the quick shots, and try to establish movement in the offense. I cant count how many times i yelled "WHAT THE @#!$@!# ARE YOU DOING" during the past couple games when either he'll run it down to the last second to shoot or hell shoot it within the first 3 seconds, and THATS what disrupts our flow. For the kings to win the entire team needs to get involved, and Bibby needs to be the one to do that. Thats what made them so pretty to watch in the past. And that is the exact reason they won in the past.
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But the problem is this is not the the old Kings where we where one of the bests teams in the leauge and that team is not coming back. We are losing and we need changes and now we have Bonzi as our go to guy at the end games to take last shoots. We need to stop living in the past.
 
JJ22L

JJ22L

Starter
#68
#68
I agree that we need changes, and im not living in the past, im just saying he needs to distribute. Right now hes playing like a shooting guard...which he cant be doing. Brad playing like a pg is a direct result of that..and its throwing off our balance. People NEED to be traded..the old kings are dead, that was never in question. I'm just saying if Bibby is going to play under the title "point guard" he's gotta live up to it. Then again Bibby might of been the right thing for that type of offense, and the one we are moving towards (away from Princeton) isn't going to compliment him, which means he needs to be moved..just so many questions...that to be honest im glad i dont have to deal with because it would stress me the !@#! out....

The moral of the story is - we based our success off of the Princeton style O and then placed players around it to be successful. This year we have kept the same style but put players that dont compliment it. Either one of two things needs to happen, a change in style or a change in personel AGAIN to compliment it (even though alot of teams in the league have either figured out how to defend it, or stop it in general). If Petrie ends up choosing a change in style you can say bye bye to alot of our coaching staff.
 
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DaMan

DaMan

Starter
#69
#69
JJ22L said:
I agree that we need changes, and im not living in the past, im just saying he needs to distribute. Right now hes playing like a shooting guard...which he cant be doing. Brad playing like a pg is a direct result of that..and its throwing off our balance. People NEED to be traded..the old kings are dead, that was never in question. I'm just saying if Bibby is going to play under the title "point guard" he's gotta live up to it. Then again Bibby might of been the right thing for that type of offense, and the one we are moving towards (away from Princeton) isn't going to compliment him, which means he needs to be moved..just so many questions...that to be honest im glad i dont have to deal with because it would stress me the !@#! out....
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I agree with u. It lookes like the more we move away from the princeton offence the more and more the short comings of the core 3, that webber was hinding, starts to stick out. We have Brad who is soft and plays like pg, we have a pg in bibby who plays like a sg and Peja who can't do anything but shoot. Our best players are our two new guys, shareef and bonzi. To me we need to trade 2 or maybe the whole big three to be successful again.
 
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JJ22L

JJ22L

Starter
#70
#70
DaMan said:
I agree with u. It lookes like the more we move away from the princeton offence the more and more the short comings of the core 3, that webber was hinding, starts to stick out. We have Brad who is soft and plays like pg, we have pg guard who plays like a sg and Peja who can't do anything but shoot. Our best players are our two new guys, shareef and bonzi. To me we need to trade 2 or maybe the whole big three to be successful again.
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Sadly- im in full agreement :(. We need passion on this team....who on this team would elbow KG like peeler did...or punch fox in the face...thats when there was heart and pride..not that im promoting the violence...but its really sad now when i see miller knock a pg half his size down and get excited because i think the kings are "being all tough"
 
DaMan

DaMan

Starter
#71
#71
JJ22L said:
Sadly- im in full agreement :(. We need passion on this team....who on this team would elbow KG like peeler did...or punch fox in the face...thats when there was heart and pride..not that im promoting the violence...but its really sad now when i see miller knock a pg half his size down and get excited because i think the kings are "being all tough"
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Great post, Funny, Sad, but True
 
DaMan

DaMan

Starter
#72
#72
I agree that we need changes, and im not living in the past, im just saying he needs to distribute. Right now hes playing like a shooting guard...which he cant be doing. Brad playing like a pg is a direct result of that..and its throwing off our balance. People NEED to be traded..the old kings are dead, that was never in question. I'm just saying if Bibby is going to play under the title "point guard" he's gotta live up to it. Then again Bibby might of been the right thing for that type of offense, and the one we are moving towards (away from Princeton) isn't going to compliment him, which means he needs to be moved..just so many questions...that to be honest im glad i dont have to deal with because it would stress me the !@#! out....

JJ22L said:
The moral of the story is - we based our success off of the Princeton style O and then placed players around it to be successful. This year we have kept the same style but put players that dont compliment it. Either one of two things needs to happen, a change in style or a change in personel AGAIN to compliment it (even though alot of teams in the league have either figured out how to defend it, or stop it in general). If Petrie ends up choosing a change in style you can say bye bye to alot of our coaching staff.
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We should just move away from Princeton off we can't keep on trying to find new players to fit it. We should use a whole new system and yea your right that means bye bye RA and coaching staff.
 
JJ22L

JJ22L

Starter
#73
#73
Ya - kinda looks that way. Fans are going to hate it - but it needs to be realized that all teams go through droughts. Without the low points in life you wouldnt be able to recognize the high ones.
 
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pdxKingsFan

pdxKingsFan

So Ordinary That It's Truly Quite Extraordinary
Staff member
#74
#74
The notion that because Bibby is not a "pure" PG it is hampering the team is silly. Phil Jackson won 9 titles without a pure PG. The Spurs have a scoring PG. Chauncey Billups? Not a pure PG. There have been a lot of pure PGs on the teams that lost out to those teams though. Even Steve Nash who has been mentioned a few times is a gunner.

Besides, if we move Bibby to get a pure PG, what offense is that PG going to run coming in at mid-season? Will it fix the defensive deficiencies of our front line?
 
JJ22L

JJ22L

Starter
#75
#75
lets see- well Phil Jackson had a certain Michael Jordan...uhh Popvich has a one Tim Duncan..not to mention ginobli..parker..anyone on that team can step up...the pistons have stars...lets see the kings have....uhh....(could go forever with these dots)

What im saying- is those teams didnt need pure point guards....as of now we have NO star that can take over so that a "pure pg" is irrelevent...yea lets see the lakers have kobe bryant...you dont say...wow you see that lakers point guard...

The only exception i can see is stockton he was literally a pure pg in a sense..but he had Malone who was a star
 
DaMan

DaMan

Starter
#76
#76
JJ22L said:
Ya - kinda looks that way. Fans are going to hate it - but it needs to be realized that all teams go through droughts. Without the low points in life you wouldnt be able to recognize the high ones.
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I don't live in sac town so can u tell me how it was when the kings sucked (before the Jason willams,VDs, and etc) its like nobody seems to remember that time period.
 
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JJ22L

JJ22L

Starter
#77
#77
Thats because alot of fans go dormant when their team starts losing. People dont like to back a losing team to be honest. Kings fans in general are different, i know tons of people that backed em in the 90's when they were the sux. Were just a loyal bunch, well cept on this board where we get hostile and argue with each other when we start to lose...:D
 
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DaMan

DaMan

Starter
#78
#78
JJ22L said:
lets see- well Phil Jackson had a certain Michael Jordan...uhh Popvich has a one Tim Duncan..not to mention ginobli..parker..anyone on that team can step up...the pistons have stars...lets see the kings have....uhh....(could go forever with these dots)

What im saying- is those teams didnt need pure point guards....as of now we have NO star that can take over so that a "pure pg" is irrelevent...yea lets see the lakers have kobe bryant...you dont say...wow you see that lakers point guard...

The only exception i can see is stockton he was literally a pure pg in a sense..but he had Malone who was a star
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I agree with all u said. When u have MJ and Pippen u don't need a point guard. And also Billups is great point guard he just scores when he team needs him too and that team is a def minded team too, thats goes along with tony and the spurs also.
 
DaMan

DaMan

Starter
#79
#79
JJ22L said:
Thats because alot of fans go dormant when their team starts losing. People dont like to back a losing team to be honest. Kings fans in general are different, i know tons of people that backed em in the 90's when they were the sux. Were just a loyal bunch, well cept on this board where we get hostile and argue with each other when we start to lose...:D
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that is true:) , LOL
 
DaMan

DaMan

Starter
#80
#80
pdxkingFan said:
Besides, if we move Bibby to get a pure PG, what offense is that PG going to run coming in at mid-season? Will it fix the defensive deficiencies of our front line?
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That is way we move Brad for a more def minded center and rebounder.
 
pdxKingsFan

pdxKingsFan

So Ordinary That It's Truly Quite Extraordinary
Staff member
#81
#81
JJ22L said:
lets see- well Phil Jackson had a certain Michael Jordan...uhh Popvich has a one Tim Duncan..not to mention ginobli..parker..anyone on that team can step up...the pistons have stars...lets see the kings have....uhh....(could go forever with these dots)

What im saying- is those teams didnt need pure point guards....as of now we have NO star that can take over so that a "pure pg" is irrelevent...yea lets see the lakers have kobe bryant...you dont say...wow you see that lakers point guard...

The only exception i can see is stockton he was literally a pure pg in a sense..but he had Malone who was a star
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I don't disagree, although the Pistons are still generally considered a team without a "superstar", they were similar to the defensive version of the offensive minded Kings team concept. My point is that if we trade Bibby we have to replace Bibby and all of our other faults which are the real reason we're losing games will still remain. Bibby may not be a superstar but aside from the season opening slump he has been consistently good to very good.

Also note that Jackson's teams all needed two superstars. Jordan, Pippen, Shaq and Kobe - none of em have gotten it done alone and one of them is looking really foolish for trying.
 
JJ22L

JJ22L

Starter
#82
#82
pdxKingsFan said:
I don't disagree, although the Pistons are still generally considered a team without a "superstar", they were similar to the defensive version of the offensive minded Kings team concept. My point is that if we trade Bibby we have to replace Bibby and all of our other faults which are the real reason we're losing games will still remain. Bibby may not be a superstar but aside from the season opening slump he has been consistently good to very good.

Also note that Jackson's teams all needed two superstars. Jordan, Pippen, Shaq and Kobe - none of em have gotten it done alone and one of them is looking really foolish for trying.
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lol im assuming you mean kobe..and i totally agreed with that until he made dallas his b!@#@....even then though you could argue it took kobe AND phil to pick the lakers back into a winning record, which again would be me agreeing with you. And saying Detroit is a defensive version of the offensive kings is a perspective i never thought about before - i agree. But ya- change is needed, it'll hurt...but the way i figure it...this season the kings have been like a broken arm that we let sit...it healed wrong..and we gotta rebrake it to fix it...its gonna hurt..but in the long run its better.
 
DaMan

DaMan

Starter
#83
#83
pdxkingsFan said:
Bibby may not be a superstar but aside from the season opening slump he has been consistently good to very good.
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Bibby shoot 8 for 24 against the bobcats and had 0 dimes last night that is not good for a pg guard and not very consistent, this not the some bibby we are used to seeing.
 
DaMan

DaMan

Starter
#84
#84
JJ22L said:
lol im assuming you mean kobe..and i totally agreed with that until he made dallas his b!@#@....even then though you could argue it took kobe AND phil to pick the lakers back into a winning record, which again would be me agreeing with you. And saying Detroit is a defensive version of the offensive kings is a perspective i never thought about before - i agree. But ya- change is needed, it'll hurt...but the way i figure it...this season the kings have been like a broken arm that we let sit...it healed wrong..and we gotta rebrake it to fix it...its gonna hurt..but in the long run its better.
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I have agreed with every little thing u have said tonight.:D
 
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pdxKingsFan

pdxKingsFan

So Ordinary That It's Truly Quite Extraordinary
Staff member
#85
#85
Sorry - I flew from pdx to sac tonight so did not know how bad he did tonight! Still I think of the alleged "core" Bibby is the only one helping us at all. Peja is as good as gone so we need to get something while we can and Brad is looking awful but likely will be coveted by a team that compliments him better. Of course if we got Artest for Peja, Brad might turn back into that mean SOB he was before he got here. If Bibby needs to go he should be the final piece to go not the first.
 
pdxKingsFan

pdxKingsFan

So Ordinary That It's Truly Quite Extraordinary
Staff member
#86
#86
JJ22L said:
lol im assuming you mean kobe..and i totally agreed with that until he made dallas his b!@#@....
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He's still never going to win another ring all by himself and completely destroyed the Lakers in the process of finding that out. He ran Shaq off to the East which basically restructured the entire league.

And Phil still gave him the smack down because he could have broke Wilt's record if given the chance the other night. You can't tell me he didn't want that, no matter what he says in post game interviews.
 
DaMan

DaMan

Starter
#87
#87
pdxKingsFan said:
Sorry - I flew from pdx to sac tonight so did not know how bad he did tonight! Still I think of the alleged "core" Bibby is the only one helping us at all. Peja is as good as gone so we need to get something while we can and Brad is looking awful but likely will be coveted by a team that compliments him better. Of course if we got Artest for Peja, Brad might turn back into that mean SOB he was before he got here. If Bibby needs to go he should be the final piece to go not the first.
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He did have 22 points at least, and i agree he should be the least piece to go.
 
weyah

weyah

G-League
#88
#88
mike today has no assist snapping his streak of 527 games of dishing out. but i dont think he is to be blamed. the way he drops dimes is good its just the person he is passing to misses the shots... and that won't be recorded as an assist if thats the case...
 
B

bcfy

G-League
#89
#89
if you really think of it, it doesn't really make sense...

let say we trade bibby to the so called "pure point guard"....what can we really get from it? we lose a point guard who can score 19 points and dish out about 4.7 assist per game, and in return we get maybe something like 10 points and 6 or 7 assists from the "pure point guard"?

Since the weakest part of our defense is we lack a shot blocker, can this "pure point guard" make that much improvement on Kings' defense? can he really get that many assists when our offensive run through our big mens? can he become the team leader on the court?

I understand people are frustrated when our team is losing, and it is reasonable to think of some big trade...but I just can't see how trading Bibby for other point guards is making any sense, coz our problem is not really on the PG position, and there aren't that many better PG in this league.
 
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