Bee: Forwards shelve feud, join forces

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Forwards shelve feud, join forces
Thomas, Abdur-Rahim complement each other as starters on Kings' new-look frontline
By Sam Amick - Bee Staff Writer
Last Updated 12:08 am PST Tuesday, November 14, 2006


Circumstance can be quite the mediator.

Take Kenny Thomas and Shareef Abdur-Rahim, the dueling power forwards who have had their share of tense moments in the past two seasons and one infamous fight long before then.

Since Kings center Brad Miller went down for at least a month on Nov. 4 (torn left foot tendon), Abdur-Rahim has been asked to fill his spot at center. And suddenly, it's the harmonious Thomas & Abdur-Rahim show in the paint. The combination has worked well thus far, with the Kings going 3-0 since the new duo was formed.

Kings coach Eric Musselman has been pleased to see his big men playing so nicely.

"I think they have great court chemistry together," he said. "The interior passing between the two, I think, has been really impressive."

There was, to recap, the in-game shouting match in a game against Seattle last April, and the training camp dust-up in early October that restarted the dialogue of their relationship. Then, of course, there is the root of the discussion, a Jan. 21, 2002, fist-flying melee that took place when Abdur-Rahim was with Atlanta and Thomas played for Houston and resulted in three-game suspensions and $15,000 fines for both players.

But the question of whether they are chummy enough to barbecue together away from the floor is only slightly relevant to the basketball objective. Musselman said he sees two players with the ability to get along.

"In the time that I've been here, I think they like each other," he said. "To me, the incident in practice happens all the time. There's been a lot more, when that curtain has been pulled, that happens when the guys are competing and playing hard."

History aside, the early returns on the pairing have been positive, with both players finding each other for open looks and the only fighting coming for rebounds. Thomas continues to defend well against some of the best power forwards in the game, while Abdur-Rahim is adjusting to life as a small-ball center, scoring when needed in the post.

"Me and Reef played together last year," Thomas said. "He brings the length, and he's a great post guy. He's been helping me on the boards. It's unfortunate that Brad's out, but he's stepped up."

For the record, both players wish their conflicts had all been in private, with neither the fan base nor the media watching. When asked whether the "feud" had been overblown, Thomas said simply, "Next question," before offering a brief stance.

"It never started," he said. "It never started again. Next question."

Abdur-Rahim said outside perceptions have magnified reality.

"I think it's probably more overblown, if you ask me," he said. "From the outside looking in, I could see what it is they would think it could be. But I don't have anything personally against him, and I don't think he has anything personally against me. He's my teammate, I pull for him, I want him to do well just like I want us to do well.

"I can understand it, with the history and the situation as far as us playing the same position. But nothing really happened that would make us personally not like each other. We're cool."

Past circumstance, it seems, was the instigator. When Thomas came from Philadelphia to Sacramento in a February 2005 trade, he had started for the majority of his previous five seasons. Abdur-Rahim, meanwhile, signed a $29.3 million deal during the offseason in 2005 with every intention of starting for all five seasons of the contract.

"Really, honestly, if we probably played two different positions, it would be nothing," Abdur-Rahim said. "I think because we play the same position, compete for the same minutes, and both of us want to be on the floor, then it's more something to talk about."

About the writer: The Bee's Sam Amick can be reached at samick@sacbee.com.
 
Circumstance can be quite the mediator.

Bingo.

We'll know more if and when Brad gets back and the selfish interests come into conflict once again. Easy to be "friends" when the other guy no longer represents a threat to your PT.
 
As a hypothetical Bricklayer....lets assume that we win 3 out of every 4 games we play while Miller is sidelined and Reef is filling in as our starter. Lets take the hype further and assume that Coach Muss makes what IMO would be the correct decision and leaves the starting 5 which has been successful intact. IF all of the assumptions were to come to fruition, how do you think Brad Miller would handle being the 6th man. I am honestly not familiar enough with his personality to know the answer to this question. It does seem as though Brad Miller is a team first guy who would be averse to creating rifts. If he did accept his demotion, how do you guys think his game would translate as a bench player logging around 22-25 minutes per game? It really would not surprise me if we are faced with this very dilemma three weeks from now.

Another quick question for anyone: does anyone know how well/poorly his rehab is going as of now. Does anyone else think all the work he put in during the offseason, while improving his game, may very well have been too much physically. These big boys carrying near 300lbs need their off-season to heal. The human body is simply not designed to carry that much weight.
 
I can answer part of your question. Brad Miller isn't one of those "I have to start" type of guys, from what I've seen. On the other hand, I hate to see any player lose his starting slot because of an injury.

It isn't a matter of rehab so much as a matter of simply allowing the plantar fascii time to mend. It's different from what Peja and Doug suffered, from what I understand, in that the tendon actually tore... I think.
 
Brad's come off the bench for us before, why not do it again if we're still on a roll?

I agree totally. If SAR and KT are happy starting together- and more importantly, we're WINNING with that combo- why not stay with it?

I think starting the game is overrated.

Remember back in the day of J-Will when he was fun, flashy and slightly out of control- he was our starter, but Bobby Jackson was our 4th quarter finisher- often getting a bulk of the minutes down the stretch. To me, that is more telling.
 
the title sounds like they're teaming up to defeat the insidious lakerman in castle Staples but it's really just something that should have happened from the beginning instead of being all pi**y over playing time. hopefully it stops being an issue when miller is back.
 
I said (not here) but to fellow kings fans at work that even during preseason those two seem to have a good chemistry on the court. Thomas always looks for an open SAR.
 
As a hypothetical Bricklayer....lets assume that we win 3 out of every 4 games we play while Miller is sidelined and Reef is filling in as our starter. Lets take the hype further and assume that Coach Muss makes what IMO would be the correct decision and leaves the starting 5 which has been successful intact. IF all of the assumptions were to come to fruition, how do you think Brad Miller would handle being the 6th man. I am honestly not familiar enough with his personality to know the answer to this question. It does seem as though Brad Miller is a team first guy who would be averse to creating rifts. If he did accept his demotion, how do you guys think his game would translate as a bench player logging around 22-25 minutes per game? It really would not surprise me if we are faced with this very dilemma three weeks from now.

Another quick question for anyone: does anyone know how well/poorly his rehab is going as of now. Does anyone else think all the work he put in during the offseason, while improving his game, may very well have been too much physically. These big boys carrying near 300lbs need their off-season to heal. The human body is simply not designed to carry that much weight.
never thought of it before but bringing brad off the bench may work..

something id like coach muss to try when brad comes back...

reefs playing pretty well with kenny and the fact that we now have a posting center (whos tall enough at 6-9 to 6-10 i think :)) and i can see brad bring effective by hitting jumpshots from all over the court when coming off the bench!

:)
 
i agree.

he didn't seem to mind when webber came back back in... 04, i don't see why it would be a big deal this year.
I know that this is beating a dead horse AND opening up a can or worms, but Webber > Thomas and Abdur-Rahim.

And anyway, Miller was brought here to be the center, so technically Miller was coming off the bench in deference to Divac. Miller shouldn't have to defer to Abdur-Rahim.
 
I beg to differ. If we keep winning w/ Reef & KT in the starting lineup there's no reason for Brad to come back and start. We're starting to develop good chemistry as a team and just like Reef was benched for the best interest of the team when he came back Brad should also.
 
The problem is we cannot make a blanket assumption that winning with SAR/KT = always winning with SAR/KT. I think that we have been very fortunate to have been playing against teams where the small ball has worked well for us. Once we start hitting the teams with the bigger front courts, I have my doubts that our success would necessarily continue.

My opinion is that you use what you have available and what works against a given line-up.
 
The problem is we cannot make a blanket assumption that winning with SAR/KT = always winning with SAR/KT. I think that we have been very fortunate to have been playing against teams where the small ball has worked well for us. Once we start hitting the teams with the bigger front courts, I have my doubts that our success would necessarily continue.

My opinion is that you use what you have available and what works against a given line-up.

I agree. However, this lineup is obviously working to our advantage right now. So far this season Brad has not been absolutely essential to our team that's why I don't think he should start when he comes back if we're still winning.
 
What we're doing is making the assumption that we are winnign BECAUSE of the Reef/KT combo, which is a leap to say the least. How about we are wining because we are playing at home against bad teams? That has a tendency to do it too. And of course lumpy the three headed parapalegic clown could be manning the middle if we consistently get 70 out of our 3 starting smalls.

Its a lot like saying the Bulls won 72 because of Luc Longely. No...he was just there.
 
It is actually nothing akin to the record setting Chicago Bulls team. KT and Reef play well together and provide decent rotation on the defensive end. Luc Longley started simply because the league required 5 players to be on the court. Reef can score 20 on any given night and Kt gets around 10 boards per. That was a nice try, however, to once again diminish the positive things which they bring to this Kings team. I simply do not understand your constant bashing of those two.:cool:
 
It is actually nothing akin to the record setting Chicago Bulls team. KT and Reef play well together and provide decent rotation on the defensive end. Luc Longley started simply because the league required 5 players to be on the court. Reef can score 20 on any given night and Kt gets around 10 boards per. That was a nice try, however, to once again diminish the positive things which they bring to this Kings team. I simply do not understand your constant bashing of those two.:cool:


I, on the other hand, understand perfectly well why you constantly whine about the "bashing" as thogh it personally aggrieves you. But I think its high time it stopped.

Reef can score 20 on any given night (perhaps), but if he doesn't, we win anyway. Kenny can grab 10 a night, and yet if he gives us 2 and 6 we win anyway. Reason for that. They are largely along for the ride, could be repalced by dozens of other players and we'd win just as much if not more. We win games at the 1, 2, 3, and just try not to lose them too bad at the 4, 5.
 
What we're doing is making the assumption that we are winnign BECAUSE of the Reef/KT combo, which is a leap to say the least. How about we are wining because we are playing at home against bad teams? That has a tendency to do it too. And of course lumpy the three headed parapalegic clown could be manning the middle if we consistently get 70 out of our 3 starting smalls.

Its a lot like saying the Bulls won 72 because of Luc Longely. No...he was just there.

Ok..................now why do you got to bring Luc into this converstaion!!!!!!!!! You guys are always trying to get me going!
 
I, on the other hand, understand perfectly well why you constantly whine about the "bashing" as thogh it personally aggrieves you. But I think its high time it stopped.

Reef can score 20 on any given night (perhaps), but if he doesn't, we win anyway. Kenny can grab 10 a night, and yet if he gives us 2 and 6 we win anyway. Reason for that. They are largely along for the ride, could be repalced by dozens of other players and we'd win just as much if not more. We win games at the 1, 2, 3, and just try not to lose them too bad at the 4, 5.

The Kings wouldn't have won last night without Reef's 20. This is still a team game, Bricklayer, and the Kings need all five guys to hustle and contribute to win. No one should cart some guys off and say "this guy contributed to the win but this guy didn't" just because they're not your favorite players. Like them or not, Kenny and Reef's hustle, rebounding, defense and Reef's offense have been a big part of the Kings' success. But you act like they're bystanders. If you replaced them with scrubs, the result is not the same. They may not be a championship level frontline, but I don't see why they shouldn't get credit as well.
 
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