An offseason plan

[funkykingston]

So it's TDOS and with the conversation around Coach Joerger signing starting to die down a bit I figured I'd give a shot at my summer fixes for the roster.

First I'm trading Rudy Gay on draft night. Supposedly Chicago offered Mirotic, Snell, Noah's expiring contract and their draft pick for Rudy Gay and Ben McLemore. I'd revisit that trade and offer Gay for Mirotic and the pick. If necessary I'd throw in Ben for Snell but I'd rather not.

If Chicago accepts that deal then on draft night the Kings would have:

Cousins/Koufos
Cauley-Stein/Mirotic
Casspi/Anderson (he's not opting out)
McLemore/Belinelli
Collison

and the #8 (assuming no lottery luck good or bad) and #14 picks my ideal situation is that the Kings nab Kris Dunn at #8 and Timothe Luwawu at #14. If Luwawu is gone I'd probably take Sabonis, Valentine or Beasley but it's my scenario and with the Jazz grabbing Demetrius Jackson and the Suns taking Chriss, Luwawu is there for the Kings.

So now the Kings have:

Cousins/Koufos
Cauley-Stein/Mirotic
Casspi/Luwawu/Anderson
McLemore/Belinelli
Collison/Dunn

and they have a little over $31 million in cap room.

Pay $20 million for Harrison Barnes, $7 million for Courtney Lee (two year deal?) and around $4 million for Seth Curry. Then use the Room Exception to bring back Quincy Acy at $2 million or so and sign a big body for the third string center. Moreland works for that. Anderson is the 16th man on a 15 man roster and is waived.

Cousins/Koufos/Moreland
Cauley-Stein/Mirotic/Acy
Barnes/Casspi/Luwawu
Lee/McLemore/Belinelli
Collison/Curry/Dunn

With the expectation that Luwawu is groomed as the future starting SG (likely taking over the job when Lee's contract ends) and Dunn starts as the 3rd string PG and works his way up to eventually being the starter.

Shooting, defense, a solid bench, a couple of rookies with potential, a stretch four that shot 40% from downtown and put up very comparable stats to Ryan Anderson but who would cost far less and a new starting SF who shoots well, defends well (including PFs when wanting to go small) and comes from a championship organization.

I'd be happy with that team.

 

[pshn80]

I'm not knowledgeable about players not on the Kings team but I like what you offer as a plan for next year. Thanks for sharing it.

 

[206Fan]

My biggest problem with this is probably our lack of scoring options. No real #2 guy, and a fringe #3 in Collison.

Barnes at this point, isn't much of a shot creator. He's hidden in GSW's offense a lot, and I think it has less to do with them having Steph/Klay/Green, and more with him not actually able to be create his own offense. Drafting Luwawu feels a bit redundant since we already have Barnes at SF. I know you said you want to groom him into a SG, but I'm not so sure that his shooting will ever be anything other than average. He's only 21, so there would be lots of time to improve on that.

Lee is a good quick fix for our SG. I could see Ben easily taking over his spot if he improves enough.

Overall, I like the idea behind it, but I think we're lacking too much of a real scoring option. I think if you drafted a more offensive-oriented player at 14, it would make things much better. I really love Barnes going forward at SF. However, this feels like a mini-rebuild to me. I'm not sure that this would be the direction the FO wants to move towards.

I think if we kept Rudy, the team would look a lot better, with Barnes at SG.
Cousins/Kofus
WCS/?/Acy
Gay/Casspi
Barnes/McLemore/Belinelli
Collison/Curry/Dunn

We do miss out on Mirotic and Luwawu, but having a solid #2 option seems like it would be better.

 

[funkykingston]

Yeah, it's a tough thing because there just aren't many available #2 options in free agency and I'm not sure the Kings have enough pieces to trade for one.

I also don't view Gay as a true #2 option given his struggles when asked to carry the scoring load.

 

[Padrino]

Yeah, it's a tough thing because there just aren't many available #2 options in free agency and I'm not sure the Kings have enough pieces to trade for one.

I also don't view Gay as a true #2 option given his struggles when asked to carry the scoring load.

personally, i'm very amenable to the idea of trading rudy gay, because i've decided that i'd much rather watch the kings struggle to score than watch the kings fail to defend, especially since joerger arrives with a mandate to improve this team's defense. so if trading rudy shores up other roster deficiencies, particularly on the defensive end, then i'm likely to be supportive of it. the problem is that the kings don't have a lot of obvious trade pieces, and given rudy's scoring ability and his favorable contract (under newly-exploding salary cap conditions), it seems like a possible avenue for balancing the roster a bit...

 

[Hoovtrain]

Ideal offseason

 

[ForlornKing]

What do you guys think about Ryan Anderson now that we have DJ as our coach?

I was under the assumption there was strong mutual interest, but now with Dave I'm not sure he fits.

 

[funkykingston]

personally, i'm very amenable to the idea of trading rudy gay, because i've decided that i'd much rather watch the kings struggle to score than watch the kings fail to defend, especially since joerger arrives with a mandate to improve this team's defense. so if trading rudy shores up other roster deficiencies, particularly on the defensive end, then i'm likely to be supportive of it. the problem is that the kings don't have a lot of obvious trade pieces, and given rudy's scoring ability and his favorable contract (under newly-exploding salary cap conditions), it seems like a possible avenue for balancing the roster a bit...

To me the Kings have the following trade pieces:

Rudy Gay
Darren Collison (only if Rondo is re-signed)
Kosta Koufos
Ben McLemore
Marco Belinelli

Of course for the right offer you'd trade anyone but realistically the Kings aren't trading Boogie, outside of a massive deal you don't trade away WCS and Casspi's production/price ratio is through the roof.

Our SGs wouldn't yield much (with Marco even dealing him for nothing other than capspace - for say a future 2nd rounder with no salary coming back - might prove difficult) and Darren is the presumptive starter unless Rondo is re-signed. Koufos is on a reasonable deal but hasn't played well alongside Cousins so it's possible he could be dealt for a player of similar talent but who plays a position that makes more impact for the Kings.

But even when throwing the #8 pick in the mix I'm not seeing a combination of assets that would give the Kings a second scorer - one who compliments Cousins and is also a good defender. Jimmy Butler? If Chicago would take what the Kings can offer that'd work but I wouldn't want Rondo back in that situation as it leads to a backcourt with very poor outside shooting. But between Collison & Casspi? That could work.

Otherwise the Kings landing the #2 pick and getting Ingram is about the only other way I can see Sacramento getting a legit second scorer who pairs well with Cousins.

In that scenario you just need a stopgap SF until Ingram comes along, grab a guy like Wade Balwin at #14, re-sign Rondo and still grab Lee (and maybe a SF like Solomon Hill) or you let Rondo walk and throw big money at Fournier/Bazemore while bringing back Curry.

Cousins/Koufos/Moreland
Cauley-Stein/Mirotic/Acy
Casspi/Hill/Ingram
Lee/McLemore/Belinelli
Rondo/Collison/Baldwin

or

Cousins/Koufos/Moreland
Cauley-Stein/Mirotic/Acy
Casspi/Hill/Ingram
Bazemore/McLemore/Belinelli
Collison/Curry/Baldwin

both sound pretty amazing to me. Ingram isn't KD, he just isn't. He doesn't move as fluidly, isn't as much of a cold blooded scorer and is actually less physically developed than Durant who famously couldn't bench 185 lbs for a single rep at the combine. But Ingram will be a very good shooter and scorer and I think he can become a very high level defender at the SF spot.

I'd love some lottery magic this time around, especially with a draft that is less than stellar and falls off pretty hard after the first two guys.

 

[twslam07]

Barnes isn't going to sign here. He's going to have the same offer from more attractive teams.

You also won't be able to sign Lee for just $7 mil. He's going to be at $10 mil minimum with probably a cap around $12-$13 mil.

The offseason works out so much better IF we draft Dunn. Curry as a backup PG scares me a bit. He played well last year, but he's still a bit of an unknown commodity. Having Dunn (who's also an unknown commodity) allows us two shots at a solid backup PG. Dunn also gives us the ability to have a star PG later down the road.

As some have mentioned, I don't like the lack of scoring potential on this team. Collison would be the #2 scorer here. Gay struggles as the main guy, yes, but could you imagine Collison? Could you imagine if Cousins was out for a stretch of games?

As I have already pointed out, I think Koufos needs to be dealt. Cauley-Stein was most effective at C last year, so you're either making Cauley-Stein less effective by playing him exclusively at PF or you're paying someone $9 mil to sit the bench. Ideally, I'd want to sign Aldrich for around $4 mil and have Cauley-Stein get all of the backup minutes at C. Then you bring in a stretch 4 who can log 20ish minutes (Nicholson?) while Casspi gets some PF minutes as well (Casspi was most effective at PF last year while Gay was awful at PF). Then you add Acy for depth. Cousins/Cauley-Stein/Nicholson/Aldrich/Acy/Casspi is a pretty strong big man rotation. It doesn't have the flashy names but it will be as effective as any frontline in the NBA.

Then you have Gay & Casspi logging all of the SF minutes with Collison, Curry, & Dunn getting all of the minutes at PG.

But then you have the SG spot. We need to fill it with a 3 and D SG ideally but I'd be happy with Bazemore, C. Lee, Crabbe, Fournier, or S. Hill. Bazemore will be heavily pursued & Crabbe/Fournier are RFAs. Lee & Hill are the most realistic since we have the coach connection with Lee, Hill is a little under the radar, & both are UFAs.



If by some chance our pick lands in the top 3, I'd seriously consider talking to the Bulls about Butler, and try to make another trade happen that brings Millsap here. I haven't really thought through this scenario, but something like a Collison/Butler/Casspi/Millsap/Cousins would be pretty darn strong.

 

[kingsboi]

Atlanta might have a fire sale, call them up and see who they are willing to get rid of. They have intriguing pieces that will help any team.

 

[andjel]

Last year it was Karl/WCS/Ben clicking is enough for playoff. We got one of three.

With the new coach and WCS being a real deal we only need to find someone to step into Ben's starting slot and we have enough money to keep Rondo and plug hole at SG if we chose so.

Now if some trade comes our way, sure, but it is not mandatory any more.

 

[bajaden]

Yeah, it's a tough thing because there just aren't many available #2 options in free agency and I'm not sure the Kings have enough pieces to trade for one.

I also don't view Gay as a true #2 option given his struggles when asked to carry the scoring load.

I'm not sure that you have to have a true number two option. Who is the main number two option on the Spurs? I could make an argument for more than one player. With the right offensive scheme, I think you can do it by committee so to speak. One of the reasons I liked going after Anderson in freeagency is because he gives you a legit guy on the floor with Cousins that can score. Which is why I was leaning toward a three man rotation of Cousins, Anderson, and WCS. Of course that sort of screws up your deal with the Bulls.

 

[bajaden]

What do you guys think about Ryan Anderson now that we have DJ as our coach?

I was under the assumption there was strong mutual interest, but now with Dave I'm not sure he fits.

Let me put it this way. Joerger was so desperate for shooting that he benched Zack Randolph and inserted Jeff Green into the starting lineup. Me thinks he would have loved to have Ryan Anderson.

 

[bajaden]

Last year it was Karl/WCS/Ben clicking is enough for playoff. We got one of three.

With the new coach and WCS being a real deal we only need to find someone to step into Ben's starting slot and we have enough money to keep Rondo and plug hole at SG if we chose so.

Now if some trade comes our way, sure, but it is not mandatory any more.

I will be stunned if Rondo is on the team next season. Joerger is all about defense, and Rondo doesn't defend. Joerger is about ball movement, and Rondo doesn't move the ball. Plus Rondo will probably cost us around 20 mil. That's three reasons why he shouldn't be back.

 

[funkykingston]

I will be stunned if Rondo is on the team next season. Joerger is all about defense, and Rondo doesn't defend. Joerger is about ball movement, and Rondo doesn't move the ball. Plus Rondo will probably cost us around 20 mil. That's three reasons why he shouldn't be back.

I'd argue that Rondo only costs $20 million if there's another team out there willing to pay $19 but outside of that I agree. I could see the Knicks trying to appease Melo by going hard after Rondo. But beyond that? What is the market for Rajon Rondo? I'm fond of saying that GMs will always climb over each other to offer dumb deals to guys each offseason and with the cap going way up it's going to get worse, but really who is shelling out big money for Rajon Rondo this offseason? He only works in certain systems, only works as a starter, only works with coaches willing to give him a lot of free rein, isn't a good shooter, can't be on the floor in crunch time and showed little interest in defending this year.

I loved watching Rondo play this year. He really is a maestro on offense. But if you want an offense that moves the ball he's not your guy. And if defense is important to you, he's not your guy. And if you think there's any chance you butt heads with him over how you want to run things, he's not your guy. Rondo and Casspi probably benefitted the most from Karl's offense. I'm not sure that would be the case with Joerger.

But even for people that believe that Rondo is a better option than Collison, it's hard to argue he's THAT much of a better option. Not $10-$12 million better anyway.

We'll see I guess.

 

[andjel]

I will be stunned if Rondo is on the team next season. Joerger is all about defense, and Rondo doesn't defend. Joerger is about ball movement, and Rondo doesn't move the ball. Plus Rondo will probably cost us around 20 mil. That's three reasons why he shouldn't be back.

All valid concerns. If Rondo walks for any of the above reasons, we have enough money for two guards we would need.

My point was that even if Rondo does not walk (assuming that 11-12 mil will be enough to keep him and coach decides so), we have enough money to plug SG hole.

 

[Noble]

I don't understand why people want to trade Rudy Gay, he's our only other player that could get you 20 a night besides Cousins and now a former coach of his in Memphis is here as Head Coach. Rudy Gay is an OLYMPIAN basketball player, I really don't understand the hate for this guy.

Rondo can leave, yes he had amazing assist numbers but he really doesn't do much else, plus will cost a boatload of money. Collison should start and would much rather have him as our future point guard under Joerger.

 

[Glenn]

I don't understand why people want to trade Rudy Gay, he's our only other player that could get you 20 a night besides Cousins and now a former coach of his in Memphis is here as Head Coach. Rudy Gay is an OLYMPIAN basketball player, I really don't understand the hate for this guy.

Rondo can leave, yes he had amazing assist numbers but he really doesn't do much else, plus will cost a boatload of money. Collison should start and would much rather have him as our future point guard under Joerger.

Rudy is not perfect. That's meamt to be a joke. I want to see Rudy under a coach he may like. Karl was not exactly who he was expecting. Perhaps and I hope so, Rudy still has some gas in the tank and would play hard on a team that wins. I wasn't convinced he knew what his role was but then I always see the optimistic side. Maybe he will play better with a coach who suits him.

Who knows unless there is a trial.

 

[Jojimbo]

So it's TDOS and with the conversation around Coach Joerger signing starting to die down a bit I figured I'd give a shot at my summer fixes for the roster.

First I'm trading Rudy Gay on draft night. Supposedly Chicago offered Mirotic, Snell, Noah's expiring contract and their draft pick for Rudy Gay and Ben McLemore. I'd revisit that trade and offer Gay for Mirotic and the pick. If necessary I'd throw in Ben for Snell but I'd rather not.

If Chicago accepts that deal then on draft night the Kings would have:

Cousins/Koufos
Cauley-Stein/Mirotic
Casspi/Anderson (he's not opting out)
McLemore/Belinelli
Collison

and the #8 (assuming no lottery luck good or bad) and #14 picks my ideal situation is that the Kings nab Kris Dunn at #8 and Timothe Luwawu at #14. If Luwawu is gone I'd probably take Sabonis, Valentine or Beasley but it's my scenario and with the Jazz grabbing Demetrius Jackson and the Suns taking Chriss, Luwawu is there for the Kings.

So now the Kings have:

Cousins/Koufos
Cauley-Stein/Mirotic
Casspi/Luwawu/Anderson
McLemore/Belinelli
Collison/Dunn

and they have a little over $31 million in cap room.

Pay $20 million for Harrison Barnes, $7 million for Courtney Lee (two year deal?) and around $4 million for Seth Curry. Then use the Room Exception to bring back Quincy Acy at $2 million or so and sign a big body for the third string center. Moreland works for that. Anderson is the 16th man on a 15 man roster and is waived.

Cousins/Koufos/Moreland
Cauley-Stein/Mirotic/Acy
Barnes/Casspi/Luwawu
Lee/McLemore/Belinelli
Collison/Curry/Dunn

With the expectation that Luwawu is groomed as the future starting SG (likely taking over the job when Lee's contract ends) and Dunn starts as the 3rd string PG and works his way up to eventually being the starter.

Shooting, defense, a solid bench, a couple of rookies with potential, a stretch four that shot 40% from downtown and put up very comparable stats to Ryan Anderson but who would cost far less and a new starting SF who shoots well, defends well (including PFs when wanting to go small) and comes from a championship organization.

I'd be happy with that team.

I like the bulk of your plan but I don't want to throw that much money at Harrison Barnes, I would much rather get into a bidding war with the Magic and spend whatever it takes to pry Fournier away. I do like going after Lee though if we don't decide to go after Bazemore or Fournier. If we trade away Rudy I'd like a guy like Solomon Hill or Marvin Williams if we can get snatch one of them. I hope Rondo walks and takes a deal with the Knicks or something, I just hope the new FO doesn't overpay for him if he stays.

 

[KingMilz]

To me any off season plan starts with Evan Fournier he's the only guy out there that's realistic for us to get that's also young (with upside) and at his best could be a All-Star level type player and a viable 2nd option ( while being a good team guy). I don't see that in any other guy we have mentioned including Ryan Anderson/Kent Bazemore (both are near max'd out). If we do get Evan than we can move Rudy Gay much more easily and not worry as much about scoring. Could we sign both Ryan Anderson/Evan if we get rid of Rudy Gay in a salary dump type move to a team out there? Even Anderson scares me some and I have said if we could sign Teletovic at a way cheaper price I would do that to.

I'm not a fan of Mirotic at all he basically is a chucker without much else and we can't go into this season even with Dave. J. relying on Mclemore to be a starter that ship has sailed. I dom't want to see Rudy Gay/Rondo on the team for years they have had some inconsistent effort (despite who is coaching) and we can't go into a season not knowing if guys will show up.

We need to get player that show up to play all the time and that fit well into a team scheme (which Evan 100% does). I would also look into the PJ Tucker situation with the Suns I'm sure they will be developing Warren/Booker like crazy next year and they might look to move some of there vets.

 

[KingMilz]

Rudy is not perfect. That's meamt to be a joke. I want to see Rudy under a coach he may like. Karl was not exactly who he was expecting. Perhaps and I hope so, Rudy still has some gas in the tank and would play hard on a team that wins. I wasn't convinced he knew what his role was but then I always see the optimistic side. Maybe he will play better with a coach who suits him.

Who knows unless there is a trial.

I think Memphis fans feel somewhat different about that.

 

[Sac.1989]

im fine with rudy. What we do at PG and SG is key

 

[funkykingston]

im fine with rudy. What we do at PG and SG is key

I actually feel the opposite. I think I'd rather have Rondo/Casspi than Collison/Gay.

 

[Sac.1989]

I actually feel the opposite. I think I'd rather have Rondo/Casspi than Collison/Gay.

i dont think we're on opposite ends

We'd both agree Casspi is a key member but we need to sort out our underperforming SG rotation - that is priority 1 for me, Rondo fits into that decision process as a backcourt member also and will affect what we do depending on if we bring him back.

Rudy is a factor as is Collison because they are the most tradeable but i dont go outright looking to shop either unless they directly result in a wining trade and talent brought in to shore up our guard play.

 

[Glenn]

i dont think we're on opposite ends

We'd both agree Casspi is a key member but we need to sort out our underperforming SG rotation - that is priority 1 for me, Rondo fits into that decision process as a backcourt member also and will affect what we do depending on if we bring him back.

Rudy is a factor as is Collison because they are the most tradeable but i dont go outright looking to shop either unless they directly result in a wining trade and talent brought in to shore up our guard play.

I agree that it needs to be a winning trade. This team needs stability and not simply making trades to keep shuffling bodies around. I think that is very difficult prospectively to make such a determination because what lead to a player's play or lack of play last year would be a huge question mark. Did Gay suddenly get older or was he disenchanted because he thought he was signing a contract with a team that had Malone as a coach?

My guess is that Joerger and Malone are very much alike therefore Gay might play like he did under Malone. There is no exact way of knowing but that's a reasonable measuring stick in my book.

 

[pshn80]

An off-season plan:
1. Fire Karl. done
2. Hire a new coach. done
3. Decide if Cuz goes or stas. done
4. Deal with draft pick.
5. Complete coaching staff.
6. Decide on Rondo and our FAs.
7. Act to solve starting SG need.
8. Act to solve defensive wing problem.
9. Act to solve 4th big man need.
10. Orchestrate.

 

[whozit]

An off-season plan:
1. Fire Karl. done
2. Hire a new coach. done
3. Decide if Cuz goes or stas. done
4. Deal with draft pick.
5. Complete coaching staff.
6. Decide on Rondo and our FAs.
7. Act to solve starting SG need.
8. Act to solve defensive wing problem.
9. Act to solve 4th big man need.
10. Orchestrate.

Orchestrate is too close to jazz band. Might cause a relapse but the first nine are good.

 

[bajaden]

I don't understand why people want to trade Rudy Gay, he's our only other player that could get you 20 a night besides Cousins and now a former coach of his in Memphis is here as Head Coach. Rudy Gay is an OLYMPIAN basketball player, I really don't understand the hate for this guy.

Rondo can leave, yes he had amazing assist numbers but he really doesn't do much else, plus will cost a boatload of money. Collison should start and would much rather have him as our future point guard under Joerger.

Can we stop with the word Hate? Just because someone doesn't think that Rudy is a good fit for what the organization is trying to do, doesn't mean he hates Rudy. I'm sick and tired of this extremism crap. I'm not saying we need or want to trade Rudy. But I'am saying that trading Rudy is a possibility because of the type of team that Vlade, and now Joerger, have alluded to. They both have stated they want more ball movement, and Rudy is not a ball mover.

Now we can speculate all we want about Rudy adapting to the style, but when a player gets to Rudy's age, he is for the most part what you see, and no major changes are going to occur. Rudy is a very good isolation player, and if he could do the other things needed, it wouldn't be a problem. But he has never shown himself to be a good passer, or a good off the ball player. Just not in his makeup. Rudy has s tendency to disappear off the ball. Doesn't make him a bad player, just a bad fit for a team that wants to move the ball.

Look, one of the things necessary for building a winning team is having every piece on the team fit together. For every players skill set to fit what the team is trying to do on the floor. How many times have you seen a team sign a couple of top players in the league and have it not work out. It wasn't about talent, it was about not fitting together. It's not as simple as saying well, he's a 20 point scorer, therefore, were going to be really good. Nope, doesn't work that way. The team might be better with a 12 point scorer who does all the little things that fit better. I'm not a star gazer. I could care less about that kind of stuff, and I realize that a lot of people are. I'm about winning. I'm about results. Having said that, I know that you have to have stars on your team. Stars represent talent, that's why they're stars. And you can't win without talent. It just has to be the right talent. Easier said than done.

 

[ElRey]

@funkykingston I like your offseason plan, but I'm not sure about offering big money to Harrison Barnes. He looks like he will be a average to good player from what I've seen of him. Nothing to suggest star status. I'd actually rather have Rudy than Harrison Barnes. At least Rudy can create a shot.

 

[macadocious]

I have a feeling that Ken Cantenella has an extremely good sense at what value contracts will be in the next two years. This started this past year when a player like Aminu got $8MM per season and people thought that was crazy. I have a feeling that we will sign a FA that we all think is a huge over pay, but then we will pick someone up as well that will seem like an underpay in comparison.

FYI, I don't see anyway Conley is coming here. I think his Max contract value is $25MM per season. That is over 1/4 of our cap space on a PG that is probably just at the crescendo of his career. Paying a guy like that 100MM+ for 4 years seems to not be feasible unless we cut bait with all our traceable assets for cap space.