A Twelve Man Rotation in 2006 ?

quick dog

Starter
What will the 2005-2006 Kings look like? What will Adelman do with a deep bench of healthy players? Next year would be unusual even without trades and fancy acquisitions. With seven good players on the bench, what will happen?

Bibby will undoubtedly be the team leader again next season because he is still the best true Point Guard on the team. Without Brad in the line-up, the offense has to go through Mike. Next year, he will probably get some additional rest.

Mobley will probably keep his job as starting Shooting Guard next season because he has broad skills and may be more consistent during stressful periods than his competitors for that position. He would have to screw up to lose his job.

Stojakovic will also keep his job as starting Small Forward next season because he is still a terrific long-range shooter and one of the best defenders on the team. He is also 6’10” tall.

Miller will be Adelman’s first choice for the Power Forward position next year because he is the only big man on the team who can consistently run the high-post offense with creative and accurate passing. He is also a reliable mid-range jump shooter. His job is secure at a height of 7 feet.

Skinner will be the starting Center next year because he is the best inside defender on the team.

House may be retained by the Kings because he is currently the second-best true Point Guard on the team. He has also demonstrated amazing consistency for a new bench player.

Jackson will come off the bench again because he can change a lethargic, poorly played, game instantly with effort and athletic skills. He is the “special cavalry” that all great generals keep in reserve to win close and contested battles.

Thomas will probably be used as a Small Forward behind Peja and a Power Forward behind Brad. I expect Thomas to get significant minutes next year as a result of his tenacity, athleticism, and skills. I still think Brad and Peja will start ahead of him. He will come in with Bobby and do serious damage.

Songaila will play a role similar to Thomas, substituting at either forward position. However, he won’t get much playing time unless he becomes dramatically proficient at the high-post passing game that is so prized by Adelman and “Coachie”. The young Lithuanian's future is in his own hands. If he consistently makes good passes and critical mid-range jump-shots, he has a chance to stay on board and contribute. I think he will.

Ostertag may be retained for mass in the paint and shot-blocking. He will not play much with Skinner and Miller healthy. His ;ethargy this season may have signed his "trade" warrant.

Evans is in a tough spot with Mike, Bobby, Cutino, and Eddie on the team. He will be in almost the same situation as Gerald Wallace was a few years ago, a superior athlete languishing at the end of the bench. I suspect that he will be retained for special occassions because of his athleticism, his ability to play Small Forward, and his ability to defend quick players. Much like Darius, Corliss, and Gregg, his future is in his own hands.

Williamson, like all the other deep bench players, will have to excel to get minutes. He is another "specialist".

Martin – I think he will be waved because we have so many guards. Like other Kings guards before him, he will probably thrive somewhere else.

Daniels – He will be waved because we have so many guards.
 
I dont' think we can assume that Mobley will be with next year, additionally.....Peja our best defender?????...does anyone else think that is a little off?
 
Mentioned before, if we come back with more than half of those same players its probably a bad sign. Too many ok players, not enough of the right kind of players.
 
SacRoyals said:
I dont' think we can assume that Mobley will be with next year, additionally.....Peja our best defender?????...does anyone else think that is a little off?

If Peja is our defensive stopper, we're in trouble
 
with all players healthy....it still isn't a championshiop caliber team...thats the bottom line.....a play for a super talent will have to be made at some point...that is not to discredit this team!
 
quick dog said:
Mobley will probably keep his job as starting Shooting Guard next season because he has broad skills and may be more consistent during stressful periods than his competitors for that position. He would have to screw up to lose his job.

Miller will be Adelman’s first choice for the Power Forward position next year because he is the only big man on the team who can consistently run the high-post offense with creative and accurate passing. He is also a reliable mid-range jump shooter. His job is secure at a height of 7 feet.

Skinner will be the starting Center next year because he is the best inside defender on the team.

House may be retained by the Kings because he is currently the second-best true Point Guard on the team. He has also demonstrated amazing consistency for a new bench player.

Jackson will come off the bench again because he can change a lethargic, poorly played, game instantly with effort and athletic skills. He is the “special cavalry” that all great generals keep in reserve to win close and contested battles.

Thomas will probably be used as a Small Forward behind Peja and a Power Forward behind Brad. I expect Thomas to get significant minutes next year as a result of his tenacity, athleticism, and skills. I still think Brad and Peja will start ahead of him. He will come in with Bobby and do serious damage.

Songaila will play a role similar to Thomas, substituting at either forward position. However, he won’t get much playing time unless he becomes dramatically proficient at the high-post passing game that is so prized by Adelman and “Coachie”. The young Lithuanian's future is in his own hands. If he consistently makes good passes and critical mid-range jump-shots, he has a chance to stay on board and contribute. I think he will.

Ostertag may be retained for mass in the paint and shot-blocking. He will not play much with Skinner and Miller healthy. His ;ethargy this season may have signed his "trade" warrant.

Evans is in a tough spot with Mike, Bobby, Cutino, and Eddie on the team. He will be in almost the same situation as Gerald Wallace was a few years ago, a superior athlete languishing at the end of the bench. I suspect that he will be retained for special occassions because of his athleticism, his ability to play Small Forward, and his ability to defend quick players. Much like Darius, Corliss, and Gregg, his future is in his own hands.

Williamson, like all the other deep bench players, will have to excel to get minutes. He is another "specialist".

Martin – I think he will be waved because we have so many guards. Like other Kings guards before him, he will probably thrive somewhere else.

Daniels – He will be waved because we have so many guards.

Where to start. How about the top.

Mobley has an option, but will probably not take it. I think there's a 30% chance he signs with us and another 20% chance we sign and trade him elsewhere. That leaves a 50% chance we get nothing for him.

Miller isn't a PF. That said, I think you can start Skinner and Brad. Brad plays the high post offense and on defense, you do whatever you can. Skinner and Thomas would be GREAT bench players, but I'm underwhelmed with the possability of them starting. As much as I love Skinner's play, he may have played himself into a trade. His value has been increasing and we're going to have to give up something to get something.

I'd like Thomas in a bench role, but he makes a lot of money. Expect him packaged with someone else to bring in a better player.

Peja - I'm sick of you. I've seen 1 game this year where he played his heart out. Don't know what else to say, when he's on I love him. When he's not, he's useless. B. Skinner is the exact opposite of Peja.

They're not going to "waive" their 1st round pick after one year. Martin will be a King or he will be packaged for another player.

E. Daniels isn't a guard, so it doesn't matter how many guards we have. That said he's a career 12th man, so it really doesn't matter what we do with him.
 
Why don't we, instead of the Suns, model ourselves after the Pistons?

Here, it's easy, let's try:

Brad Miller can be be equivalent of Sheed, the big guy with the jumper
Skinner the poor man's Ben Wallace, the rebounding and shotblocker
Peja/Mobley=Rip, the potent offensive threat that moves well without the ball
Whomever we trade for Peja/Mobley=Prince, athletic perimeter defender, still need to get one of those
Bibby=Billups, the clutch PG who comes up big in big games.

And if we keep Bobby, KThomas in the old Hedo role, and sign another center, our bench would demolish theirs.

Corliss and Tag are both expendable, package their contracts in the Peja or Cuttino trade.

Groom Martin to be the next Rip Hamilton.
 
Actually, I'm not sold on whether Skinner should be our ideal starter. Sheed can create in the post, while Brad cannot. We'd still need a low post threat, as neither Brad nor Skinner can really do that. Skinner would excel in the old Pollard/Keon role though. As long as the new PF was a good shotblocker and rebounder as well, that would be 2/3 (or 4 if Darius could be kept on the cheap, although he wouldn't play much) of our big men that are good enough on D.
 
In all honesty the following are the only players that I think should return next year for sure. The rest Im not so sure about.

Bibby - PG
Mobley - SG
Miller - PF
Skinner - Backup C
 
I tend to agree with Brick on this one, this is just no where near a championship line up. The ONLY palyer I would NOT consider trading is Bibby. Of course I love our guys but every other player could be upgraded with the right trades. More important than upgrades is ballace and fit. Right now the only full sized big man we have who can play down low is Skinner. (Ok Tag sort of but I think we can agree he hardly counts) and while Skinner might complement Brads high post game nicely that means the Kings need to find another big man who can pass and rebound. Pedja's iradic play this year along with his anual vacation in April jsut leaves me with no confidence in him. Replacing him with Kenny at the 3 might be an fine option, but this leavesthe Kings short one sharpshooter, and backing Kenny up with Corrlisis just not going to solve THAT problem. Cat's expiring contract, and inconsistant rebounding, along with irratic shooting agian do not inspire me to say we could not do better, and IF the Kings are planning on Keeping Bobby with MO as the #6 guy that might not be a bad thing. But gaurds are a dime a dozen so who knows. IF GP plans to keep Pedja come hell or high watter that makes Kenny and or Corless gone, to bing in somone who can shoot longballs... I could specualte all day on permutations, but in the end the bottom line is that the rotation next season will be dictated by the trades, over the summer and there will be trades over the summer.
 
HndsmCelt said:
I could specualte all day on permutations, but in the end the bottom line is that the rotation next season will be dictated by the trades, over the summer and there will be trades over the summer.

Yep, and there will be an endless number of threads devoted to predicting the trades and, almost without exception, they will all be wrong.

:D
 
VF21 said:
Yep, and there will be an endless number of threads devoted to predicting the trades and, almost without exception, they will all be wrong.

:D
Yup, ya all know how I feel about trade threads... I may take a Kingsfans vacation when theseason ends untill the start of pre-season. ;)
 
Okay. You guys keep telling me about all of these great low post players. Please list some of them for me. Honestly the only ones I can think of are the following.

Shaq
Duncan-if you count the Banking
Brand
Yao (I guess so)
Amare-Dunkadelic
Curry
Boozer
Pau (not really but will see)

Guys who are jump shooters like our old guy Webber but great players

Dirk
KG
Jermaine (FG% is 45%)
Z
Bosh
Jamison

So yes we might not be able to get any of the guys in the first bracket.

Next we can look at good defenders in the paint that were'nt in the first group.

Ben Wallace
Sheed
Camby
Theo
Pryzbilla (sadly, Good boarder and Shot blocker, 8 against us, 7 last night)
Griffin-Crazy though
Daly
Okafor
Kenyon


Again most of these guys are hard to get or unproven. Ben, Sheed, Daly and Camby are basically impossible to get.

Now I don't think we have the ideal guys but most players in the NBA are shooters nowadays and don't play in the paint.

I still think ideally we keep the guys in the paint we got and we go after better perimeter defenders. Honestly Skinner is a pretty good paint defender. Not perfect but there aren't many great ones. Perimeter defenders are easier to get.

Ideally I'd love to get our hands on Hughes, Artest, or both. With a lineup consisting of

Brad / Skinner
Skinner
Artest for Peja
Hughes for Mobley (S+T) and Thomas
Bibby

Now we would have 2 of the best defenders at the 2/3, both are great rebounders for their size and pretty good passers. (Artest averages 5 and 4 for last 2 years and Hughes averages 6 and 5 (in the Princeton Offence) this year).

Next the Bench.

Bobby
Evans
Corliss
Martin
Darius

After that is questionable. Bobby, Darius, and Evans would be a pretty effective bench. IDK we still would need a better backup center.

Additionally if we were to keep Peja, we could use a better post presence.......I don't think any are available though. Post men are like Diamonds, they are very tough to find.

I also think the league is going in a different direction, smaller, faster and better passing teams I think will succeed. We definitely need better defenders but we need to be able to score with all the teams in the league. Case 1 is definitely 1 that would definitely contend with all the big teams but it might be hard to pull.
 
HndsmCelt said:
Yup, ya all know how I feel about trade threads... I may take a Kingsfans vacation when theseason ends untill the start of pre-season. ;)

And miss all the fun that we will have ?:eek:
 
Do the Kings need a dominant big-man like Duncan or Shack to win the NBA title? Doesn't it boil down to that? Short of a miracle in the NBA Draft, I don't see how that can happen for the Kings. If the Kings can't win by team skills and a little luck, I don't see how we win the whole enchalade.

I still think there is an outside chance that the Kings could pull it off this year with a full squad.
 
piksi said:
And miss all the fun that we will have ?:eek:
If you define fun as reading through page after page of sophmoric suggetions like Trade House, Tag, Daniels and Martin for Yao... the salerys match! Or send Miller to Utah for Boozer and picks, uh... yeha I'll pass on all that fun.
 
There are no "dominant big men" available this year. Bogut is kinda like a really good Vlade. Unless there are some high school guys I'm missing i just don't see any available that are in college right now. May is the best post player in college and I love UNC, but he isn't tall enough, doesn't have long enough arms, etc. etc. for the NBA.
 
I would like to see what Petrie/Adelman's mutation of the Princeton offense could do against the "dominant" big man teams if we had the "right" makeup of two athletic, good rebounding big men up front who would benefit from much of the playmaking of a highpost center on cuts to the hoop who could also rebound and play some D and a pass first, good shooting PG paired with a slashing, athletic SG who could play some D as well as fill it up on Offense. Right now we have maybe two of those five in Miller and Bibby (with the jury still out on Mobley but not looking good at this point). Five should beat any one or two.
 
bigbadred00 said:
I'd love to see PP in a Kings uniform. Boston is on the slide again :).

First, you might want to be careful about using that first phrase...or am I the only one who had to read it twice? ;)

Paul Pierce is not the sole answer to our problems IMHO. In fact, no ONE player is going to solve the Kings' woes. We need at least one player with the defensive skills and focus of Doug Christie (and I actually think Kevin could learn to fit that role), we need a GOOD backup for Mike in case Bobby gets hurt again (assuming his left wrist gets back enough so he can still be first off the bench), we need at least one more BIG man who can body up against other PFs in the league and wrestle for some boards. In addition, we could use either a consistent Peja OR a new SF with a combination of skills like Peja, Dirk and perhaps Ron Artest.

I am becoming more and more convinced that we are going to see a number of new players next season. At this point I have to think the most likely returnee, despite his defensive failings, will be Mike Bibby. Brad also brings a lot to the table, if he can stay healthy and I think Skinner has been a true find. I've made no secret of my preference for Cuttino and what he brings, so I'd like to see him stay, too, and I don't see us getting rid of Kevin at this point. Other than that I'm not emotionally invested in any of the rest of the players to the point where I would be throwing myself off the bridge if they were traded. The team is changing and since it's doing it already, might as well make it really interesting!
 
HndsmCelt said:
If you define fun as reading through page after page of sophmoric suggetions like Trade House, Tag, Daniels and Martin for Yao... the salerys match! Or send Miller to Utah for Boozer and picks, uh... yeha I'll pass on all that fun.


I is a good "sanity check" at least
 
I'll join the fun and play internet GM!

--The Current Team--

---The Starters---​

Mike Bibby- He's a keeper, no way we let him go.

Cuttino Mobley- I'll say resign him, and see if we can get anything in return. No arguments if we have no takers, I like the Cat.

Peja- I'm down on Peja, he's playing with no passion at all. I say shop him, see what we could get, but only trade if something good (Equal value) is coming in.

Kenny Thomas- Move to bench, or trade. He's to small to be out full time PF.

Brad Miller- Same boat as Bibby.

---The Bench---​


Bobby Jackson- Take the option, shop him in a packaged deal (Thomas? Williamson?) and see what we could get.

Brian Skinner- Our lone interior presence. Keep him, and he's now our backup PF/C.

Darius Songaila- Sign him. And his role depends on what goes on after that. If Thomas is traded, and hopefully a good PF is brought in he's a good backup. If Thomas isn't shipped out, and someone is brought in, hes the odd-man-out and eventual trade bait. If Thomas isn't traded and no-one is brought in he stays.

Corliss Williamson-
Trade. He's undersized, and to much of a one-on-one player for our system.

Maurice Evans- Keep, but only if the price is right.

Kevin Martin- 11th/12th man for another year. Give the kid time to develop, he still has potential...Hit the weights!

Eddie House- A good 3rd guard who can play in an emergency. If there's room...Keep him.

Greg Ostertag- Had his chance. Failed. Good-bye.

Erik Daniels- As good as gone, hope you had a good time!

--The Draft--

Any interior player. Attempt to trade up to get a good inside player...Josh Boone? Wayne Simien?


--Potential Free Agents--

Bobby Simmons, G/F, Clippers-- MLE, maybe? I think he would be a good fit, as he can shoot lights out, but only if The Cat leaves.

Stromile Swift, PF, Memphis-- Would solve some interior problems, but I don't think he's going to be leaving Memohis. He is unrestricted though, so maybe?

Dan Gadzurich, C, Milwaukee-- Rebounder, with not a lot of offensive skill. I think would be a nice signing.

Reggie Evans, PF, Seatle,-- Great rebounder, that I wouldn't mind see starting PF.

Mark Madsen, PF, Minnesota-- You hate him until he's on your team. But hustle only gets you so far, and I'm not sure he'd got off the bench. Probably a 10th-12th man.

Sharif Abdur-Rahim, F, Portland-- If this guy is willing to play for the MLE I say take him up. Doesn't solve our interior problem, though. But I still think he's worth a MLE.

Kwame Brown, PF, Washington-- Worth the gamble? Washington thinks so, and I don't think he's getting away.

Micheal Ruffin, PF, Washington-- A Madsen-esq player. Don't think he'd get far with out system. Again 10th-12th man.

Jeff McInnis, PG, Cleveland-- Hmmm. If we either let Jackson walk, or trade him, do we take McInnis? He's out of Cleveland. He's a good defender, a good passer, and I think would be an excellent backup.

Tyson Chandler, PF, Chicago-- Bulls going to let go of him? If they do he would be an excellent choice to help our rebounding woes. And he;s still very young.

Damon Stoudamire, PG, Portland-- Is he willing to play second fiddle to Bibby, and would he fit our offense? I think is B-Jax is traded or just let go he would be another option for backup.

More to come, as I come across players I like....
 
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SLAB said:
I'll join the fun and play internet GM!
Tyson Chandler, PF, Chicago-- Bulls going to let go of him? If they do he would be an excellent choice to help our rebounding woes. And he;s still very young.

More to come, as I come across players I like....

DROOL, I would be ecstatic if we could somehow grab him. :p
 
First round picks do not get waived.. they have three year guaranteed contracts. Unless you really really really suck. Kevin Martin will not be waived.. Traded maybe

Also, the Kings cannot go for a contract over 2.5 million annually I believe... They are over the cap after all.
 
HndsmCelt said:
Yup, ya all know how I feel about trade threads... I may take a Kingsfans vacation when theseason ends untill the start of pre-season. ;)


the Lounge is great fun in the offseason....and you don't have to read ridiculous trades! ;)
 
Although a good thread in heart. We have no idea what is gonna happen in the off season.

I suspect we are gonna see major movement with our starters. I think Bibby, Bjax, Bmiller are about the only safe ones on the team.
 
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