[Game] 27/82: Kings vs. Nuggets 16 DEC 2024 7pm PT/10pm ET

[Padrino]

Couple of things after last night's game.

1) The Nuggets really carved up the Kings defense in Keegan's absence, and I hesitate to ascribe too much meaning to one game, but right now Keegan seems super important to the Kings' ability to prevent open driving lanes to the basket.

2) I'm perplexed by how much this team is struggling to close out games this season while starting two of the top clutch performers in the entire NBA. I really did not anticipate that being the problem it's been.

 

[Joshyjosh31]

Couple of things after last night's game.

1) The Nuggets really carved up the Kings defense in Keegan's absence, and I hesitate to ascribe too much meaning to one game, but right now Keegan seems super important to the Kings' ability to prevent open driving lanes to the basket.

2) I'm perplexed by how much this team is struggling to close out games this season while starting two of the top clutch performers in the entire NBA. I really did not anticipate that being the problem it's been.

One problem I see is going away from the offense to spam DD post ups even when the offense is clicking same thing happened vs Memphis. Derozan is doing good when we play within the offense but that all falls apart in the fourth

 

[iowamcnabb]

Be careful, or the Len contingent is going to come after you.

But could not agree more. Len is an excellent guy to have as your 3rd C, end of bench depth. Is a pro's pro, seems like he's a great locker room guy. Can give you a good rotation stint here or there. But he's just not someone who you should be relying on for consistent rotation minutes every game.

Brown was going with Lyles for a bit at the 5 before the latest injury. I wonder if he just commits to that most nights with Len coming in occasionally depending on matchups. If the Kings do trade for say Cam Johnson they could go:

Fox
Monk
Deebo
Keegan
Sabonis
Cam
Keon
Devin
Lyles

Mcbuckets
Len
Colby

That’s your 9 man rotation with Doug, Colby and Len getting minutes here and there.

 

[ShastaKingsFan]

Never understood the hand wringing over some end of bench guys like Len. Solid journeyman center who will play depending on matchups and what helps the team. Has some things he does solidly, has some big shortcomings as well. It’s why he’s been in the league this long but he’s a end of bench guy, nothing more.

Len was terrible in his short stint last night. 2 super quick fouls and probably should have had a third in under a minute.
Isaac Jones also was out of sorts against the Denver offense.
I have no problem with how Brown uses the bench and players.

Did you understand the hand wringing when Keon Ellis was being played little and not at all? The point is that you can't really expect anyone to play well with minimal mistakes, when they have little feel for the game, because they don't play in the actual games.

 

[Capt. Factorial]

One problem I see is going away from the offense to spam DD post ups even when the offense is clicking same thing happened vs Memphis. Derozan is doing good when we play within the offense but that all falls apart in the fourth

Yes, DeRozan is a proven poor scorer in the fourth quarter.

 

[ESP47]

Couple of things after last night's game.

1) The Nuggets really carved up the Kings defense in Keegan's absence, and I hesitate to ascribe too much meaning to one game, but right now Keegan seems super important to the Kings' ability to prevent open driving lanes to the basket.

2) I'm perplexed by how much this team is struggling to close out games this season while starting two of the top clutch performers in the entire NBA. I really did not anticipate that being the problem it's been.

I thought Fox was pretty clutch there but DDR just fell flat on his face in the 4th. Can't expect him to be perfect but that was pretty bad. Missed all those easy mid range looks and then completely flubbed that pass that had him wide open to lay in the game winner.

I'm not sure if this game was a wash as far as Keegan/McDermott goes. Yeah Keegan's defense would have helped not allow the Nuggets to seemingly score on the final 10 possessions but it also might not have mattered because odds are that Keegan doesn't have the super efficient game offensively that McDermott had.

 

[Tetsujin]

And even Knecht has cooled off a bunch. He had that 5 game hot streak and he has been pretty pedestrian since. Plus he isn’t a plus defender. I liked him and would have been fine with the pick but we need gritty defenders

The Kings literally already have two Dalton Knechts on the roster (6’7+ wing/forward white dudes who are good at shooting) but the massive Kings fans inferiority complex means that we just automatically assume that Knecht is way better than any movement shooter we already have when he’s largely just been Kevin Huerter but playing off of Lebron

 

[Joshyjosh31]

Yes, DeRozan is a proven poor scorer in the fourth quarter.

Spamming iso DD posts up while everyone else stands there resulting in a 17 foot jumper isn’t good offense. Run the offense that’s working this idea that we need to force it to him cause he’s proven is why we suck in clutch moments he’s not Luka, Kyrie, LeBron , or Giannis and those guys are creating for everyone not mid range jump shots with no ball movement

 

[Tetsujin]

Also Kevin Huerter is somehow only three years older than Knecht despite coming into seven years ago lol

 

[Tetsujin]

“I sure wish we had a Josh Hart or Bruce Brown on our team!” -Kings fans who somehow are also vehemently against the Devin Carter pick/ still think Colby is a waste of a roster spot.

 

[Tetsujin]

Couple of things after last night's game.


2) I'm perplexed by how much this team is struggling to close out games this season while starting two of the top clutch performers in the entire NBA. I really did not anticipate that being the problem it's been.

I think it’s a little bit of the closers all cancelling each other out. Fox and Deebo keep deferring to each other and as a result neither guy really gets into god mode.

 

[iowamcnabb]

The Kings literally already have two Dalton Knechts on the roster (6’7+ wing/forward white dudes who are good at shooting) but the massive Kings fans inferiority complex means that we just automatically assume that Knecht is way better than any movement shooter we already have when he’s largely just been Kevin Huerter but playing off of Lebron

honestly I have at least a little bit of that fear regarding Cam Johnson. He has been a better shooter in his career than Kev and way better this season but I worry about some regression in a more limited role if he was to be traded to us. He also probably more solid than great as a defender.

 

[ShastaKingsFan]

The Kings literally already have two Dalton Knechts on the roster (6’7+ wing/forward white dudes who are good at shooting) but the massive Kings fans inferiority complex means that we just automatically assume that Knecht is way better than any movement shooter we already have when he’s largely just been Kevin Huerter but playing off of Lebron

Lets be real here and cut the exaggeration. The Kings aren't likely to have future plans for McDermott and have wanted to trade Huerter. At that point, a really good wing shooter on a rookie contract would have fit the longer term outlook, with the core roster that was in place

 

[iowamcnabb]

21 page game thread has to be one of the biggest of the season

 

[iowamcnabb]

Ham just said according to basketball reference our expected win total based on our analytics is 16 (16-11) good for 5th in the West

 

[Joshyjosh31]

https://twitter.com/statuses/1869093902793523674

this is wild

 

[Mr. S£im Citrus]

Every game, win or loss, is an opportunity to learn. Beats crying into a beer after a loss.

 

[Capt. Factorial]

https://twitter.com/statuses/1869093902793523674

this is wild

As a note, to make posts from X embed, replace x.com with twitter.com after pasting in the URL.

 

[sactowndog]

“I sure wish we had a Josh Hart or Bruce Brown on our team!” -Kings fans who somehow are also vehemently against the Devin Carter pick/ still think Colby is a waste of a roster spot.

Josh Hart while small for a wing with a 8’ 5” standing reach is still 3 inches more than Carter. Not sure how wanting Hart and feeling the Kings didn’t need yet another guard is somehow incongruous.

As for the game last night it was a tough one. Without Trey and Keegan, I thought we were in trouble and we did better than I thought once past the 1st quarter. Loved the passing on that last possession just tough Deebo fumbled the pass. Happens. Was at the game and left feeling like I just went through the wringer.

 

[ShastaKingsFan]

Ham just said according to basketball reference our expected win total based on our analytics is 16 (16-11) good for 5th in the West

Finding ways to lose, in large part because they still haven't figured out how to minimize open 3 pt looks.....and for whatever reason, most teams always seem to shoot their highest % against the Kings

 

[Tetsujin]

Josh Hart while small for a wing with a 8’ 5” standing reach is still 3 inches more than Carter. Not sure how wanting Hart and feeling the Kings didn’t need yet another guard is somehow incongruous.

As for the game last night it was a tough one. Without Trey and Keegan, I thought we were in trouble and we did better than I thought once past the 1st quarter. Loved the passing on that last possession just tough Deebo fumbled the pass. Happens. Was at the game and left feeling like I just went through the wringer.

Standing reach is of course the most important measurement in basketball, given that players play with both feet on the floor and both of their hands directly up at a 180 degree angle at all times.
Carter has a longer wingspan and vastly better explosivity and agility measurements than Hart which is probably worth a few inches unless we’re assuming neither guy ever jumps again.

 

[sactowndog]

Standing reach is of course the most important measurement in basketball, given that players play with both feet on the floor and both of their hands directly up at a 180 degree angle at all times.
Carter has a longer wingspan and vastly better explosivity and agility measurements than Hart which is probably worth a few inches unless we’re assuming neither guy ever jumps again.

So you are telling me you think Carter can guard small forwards? Care to put a charity bet on that point?

 

[The_Jamal]

The Kings literally already have two Dalton Knechts on the roster (6’7+ wing/forward white dudes who are good at shooting) but the massive Kings fans inferiority complex means that we just automatically assume that Knecht is way better than any movement shooter we already have when he’s largely just been Kevin Huerter but playing off of Lebron

And while I like Knecht... the numbers on him aren't pretty.

 

[The_Jamal]

So you are telling me you think Carter can guard small forwards? Care to put a charity bet on that point?

Your obsession with a one off comment made by Monte 4 years ago is pretty funny. No one's suggesting he can guard SF 30 MPG. I very much believe he can survive switches and be flexible in that way

 

[sactowndog]

Your obsession with a one off comment made by Monte 4 years ago is pretty funny. No one's suggesting he can guard SF 30 MPG. I very much believe he can survive switches and be flexible in that way

I’m not sure that is even true. But not sure how to measure it.

 

[Tetsujin]

So you are telling me you think Carter can guard small forwards? Care to put a charity bet on that point?

Considering how switch heavy the Kings are, how would you even quantify “guarding” small forwards at this point? I feel like De’Aaron can “guard” most small forwards in the context of our scheme. Devin has a similar if not stronger build and has shown the ability to thrive guarding up in college.

 

[Tetsujin]

And while I like Knecht... the numbers on him aren't pretty.

The dude is shooting 11% from three for the entire month of December

 

[SacTownKid]

Colby had some good plays last night, especially defending Murray. He did however fall over a few times. It's like his mind is going too fast for him.

I think it was more so gambling for deflections and hustling since yeah, he doesn't have elite coordination. Good for him though, he's laying it out on the line. He's playing up and using his strength well which bodes well for him.

 

[SacTownKid]

I’m not sure that is even true. But not sure how to measure it.

Yeah as long as you weigh someone like Luka/Durant next to a role player like Dort or Wells, go ahead. You likely lose on averages alone if the contest is based on output. Somehow you took Monte's opinion that Carter can play 4 positions as that he can average starters minutes in all of them. That may end up being true, who knows, but clearly that's not what he was suggesting.

 

[ShastaKingsFan]

Yeah as long as you weigh someone like Luka/Durant next to a role player like Dort or Wells, go ahead. You likely lose on averages alone if the contest is based on output. Somehow you took Monte's opinion that Carter can play 4 positions as that he can average starters minutes in all of them. That may end up being true, who knows, but clearly that's not what he was suggesting.

Most GM's exaggerate about the wide range potential of their draft picks. Even Vlade got involved, telling everyone that Marvin Bagley would play some 3.

Kevin Huerter can bring the ball up the court and switch onto a point guard, but is he really playing the 1?