[Grades] Grades v. Grizzlies 1/7/2013

Biggest Disappointment of the Night?

  • Cousins

    Votes: 17 45.9%
  • Thomas

    Votes: 7 18.9%
  • Johnson

    Votes: 1 2.7%
  • Jimmer

    Votes: 8 21.6%
  • Reke

    Votes: 1 2.7%
  • Hayes

    Votes: 2 5.4%
  • Honeycutt

    Votes: 1 2.7%

  • Total voters
    37
  • Poll closed .

Bricklayer

Don't Make Me Use The Bat
#31
And replace him with whom? We're not exactly overflowing with productive players over the last three games.

Get healthy soon, Tyreke.
Reke played in this one. You may have already turned it off by the time our genius coach finally decided to insert him, but he played. :)

defintiely not in game shape yet., Still definitely the best guy we had at the positon. Cisco though is now 1-14 over his past three games and has scored 2 total points. I mean. Come on. I'm thinking of trying to walk on at practice tommorow if the production from Cisco and Jimmer is all it takes. Just a complete collapse of the positon. The two top guys are out, and the two guys who filled in are in freefall.
 
#33
You would think that with all the guards that we have on the team at least one of them would show-up. Guess not.

I cannot support the tired theory tonight. The Grizz are the team that played the night before in Phoenix before flying here and playing us. We should have had legs at least as fresh as theirs. Guess not.
 

hrdboild

Moloch in whom I dream Angels!
Staff member
#34
What's encouraging to me abut Thomas Robinson, and this is maybe counter intuitive, is that I see a lot of stubbornness in his game. I see him wrestling with players in the post and getting called for ticky-tack fouls and completely losing his composure. But the athleticism is still there. When he got a bug and decided to rebound the ball last night he actually had his most productive game so far. Waiting for the light to turn on is frustrating, but I don't think it's a matter of him being over-matched physically so much as he's just a fish out of water right now and it's taking him longer to adjust precisely because he's too stubborn to accept his place at the bottom of the totem pole. No question he's been awful so far. The pre-draft consensus that he was one of the more NBA ready players available was clearly misplaced. Physically he belongs in the league but mentally he still has a lot of growing up to do. That sounds superficially like Cousins, and I see some of the same "me against the world" temperament in Robinson, but the two are in a whole different universe talent-wise. Cousins can (and has at times) skate by on pure talent and still be a productive player but at this level guys like that are very rare. Robinson is not so lucky and I think he's starting to figure that out for himself.
 

bajaden

Hall of Famer
#35
Boogie for me. Tonight was his first real test against an upper-echelon frontcourt to show he turned a corner and he faltered again. Being able to only Feast on the Aaron Gray's and Tyler Zeller's of the world won't make us a playoff team and won't help Boogie's cause to be a franchise player. He's got to learn how to deal with physicality and fast.
In fairness, except for Salmons and JT, the whole team played like they were in a fog. As a result I'm going to draw more conclusions from the five good games by Cuz, than the one bad one. The whole team looked very tired to me. While you get paid the same, regardless, it does happen. Your mind says one thing and your body says, go to hell! Lets remember that in the five game span, Cuz went up against Chandler, and then played well against the Celts. And while we didn't win against the Nets and Lopez, Cousins had a good game. So I'm more inclined to just write it off as one of those, got up on the wrong side of the bed games. It happens to everyone. I watched Webb go 2 for 22 one night.

Not just Cuz, but just about everyone except Salmons, was leaving their shots short. Thats usually a sign of tired legs. I'd also like to point out that Memphis is a very good basketball team. You have to bring your A game to beat them, and I think the Kings brought their D game, and I'm being kind.

On another note, Fredette learned from last season and improved in necessary areas. Now the league has taken note, and the league has adjusted, and their paying more attention to Jimmer. As a result, he's finding it tougher to score, and when he does get an open shot, he's missing. Probably because he's starting to press again. Magic Johnson once said, that I have to bring something new to my game every year, because the league is going to take away what I've been doing. The NBA is a league of adjustments. If you can't adjust, then eventually your playing in the D-League, or europe.

So I think Jimmer has to step back, take a deep breath, and realize that he needs to readjust his game. If not now, then in the off-season. He needs to take what the defense gives him, and if he can't score, then make them pay for their attention. He's a hard worker, so I think he'll adjust and be fine. It takes time. I'm sure its been a difficult adjustment for him. He's gone from being the giver, to the reciever. At BYU, he was the one with the ball in his hands, and he was the one that decided what play was going to be run. Now he's depending on someone else to get him the ball when and where he needs it. He's gone from taking 22 shots a game, to hoping someone notices when he's open. He's gone from being the man, to an afterthought.

Not an excuse, just pointing out the difficult adjustment he's had to make. T. Robb showed in the 4th quarter last night what he's capable of if he just stays with what he's good at. I know it was garbage time, but there's no reason he can't do that in crunch time as well. Instead, last night early in the game, when it was still a game, he looked like a bull in a china shop. Out of control, and turning the ball over. You can see the potential there. Lets hope he begins to see it as well.
 
Last edited:

bajaden

Hall of Famer
#38
You would think that with all the guards that we have on the team at least one of them would show-up. Guess not.

I cannot support the tired theory tonight. The Grizz are the team that played the night before in Phoenix before flying here and playing us. We should have had legs at least as fresh as theirs. Guess not.
OK, lets assume that both teams had tired legs. Which is the better team? Which team do you think would win if both brought their A game? If I had to bet money, and I love my Kings, but my bet would have gone down on the Grizz. The Grizzleys are a very very good basketball team, and we showed up with our D game. The result says it all. Crap happens.
 

bajaden

Hall of Famer
#39
What's encouraging to me abut Thomas Robinson, and this is maybe counter intuitive, is that I see a lot of stubbornness in his game. I see him wrestling with players in the post and getting called for ticky-tack fouls and completely losing his composure. But the athleticism is still there. When he got a bug and decided to rebound the ball last night he actually had his most productive game so far. Waiting for the light to turn on is frustrating, but I don't think it's a matter of him being over-matched physically so much as he's just a fish out of water right now and it's taking him longer to adjust precisely because he's too stubborn to accept his place at the bottom of the totem pole. No question he's been awful so far. The pre-draft consensus that he was one of the more NBA ready players available was clearly misplaced. Physically he belongs in the league but mentally he still has a lot of growing up to do. That sounds superficially like Cousins, and I see some of the same "me against the world" temperament in Robinson, but the two are in a whole different universe talent-wise. Cousins can (and has at times) skate by on pure talent and still be a productive player but at this level guys like that are very rare. Robinson is not so lucky and I think he's starting to figure that out for himself.
I remember Uncia03 and I getting together last march for the NCAA tourney, and watching Robinson play. We were both intrigued by his athleticism, his court speed, and his ballhandling, that was above average for a PF. What we questioned, particularly Uncia03, was his skill set, his true height, and his NBA readiness. I can't speak for Uncia03, but I think we both believed him to be more of a project than someone that could come in and make an impact right away. I know I personally questioned those comments that said he was the most NBA ready of the majority of those in the draft.

Even then, prior to the draft, I thought his best position might eventually be SF, because of his quickness, his ability to defend quicker players, and the beginning of a nice looking jumpshot. That opinion wasn't locked in stone, but more of a gut reaction when I watched him play. So, he's actually doing about what I thought he would do. Thats not to be critical of him, because I do think he has the potential to be a good player in the league. Its just going to take some time, something fans are hardpressed to give. In many ways he reminds me of a smaller, quicker version of JT when he came into the league. Playing at light speed, and out of control, when everyone else is playing at normal speed and in control. I hate to say this, but I think JT arrived with a more polished skill set.

Athleticism can be both a blessing and a curse. Too often players with great athleticism are able to get by strictly on that athleticism. The one's that realize that they also need skills, become the Michael Jordans and Kobe Bryants of the world. The one's that don't, become the Gerald Green's and Tyrus Thomas of the world. At this point, its all up to T. Robb. He has a lot of work to do. He seems to be a determined young man, so I think he'll be just fine.
 
#40
Recent conversation with Mac got me interested in a little project. How would Cousins and Robinson compare in their first 30 games as professionals?

Usually don't like per stats, but for the sake of this comparison, I put both guys on a Per/30 min scale. Cousins was at 25 MPG his first 30 games and Robinson at 15

Thomas Robinson:
9.1 PPG
8.1 TRB
1.25 Steals
0.81 Blocks
1.25 APG
42 FG%
2.56 TO
3.75 Fouls/game
8.6 shots attempted

Cousins:
13.6 PPG
9.1 RPG
0.81 Steals
1.7 APG
0.744 BPG
41 FG%
2.88 TOV
4.8 Fouls
12.7 Shots attempted

While PER stats are purely hypothetical, it might shock a few people to see how similar they are if they were given the same role as rookies. Give Trob the same amount of time/shots as Cousins got as a rook and we'd likely be looking at very similar production from both guys.

Purpose of this is not to compare the two players, but to get people to understand that rookie bigs take time to acclimate to the NBA game. No one should be worried about Robinson 30 games in. Where we start to worry is if we don't see improvement 100 games into his career like Cousins did after struggling the first few months
These stats aren't even comparable. I don't even think you can consider Robinson a "big". He's too small to play PF and too big and unskilled to play SF.

Cousins was going against the Gasols, Gortats, and Howards of the league. Robinson is going against the Speights and Hansbroughs of the league. I can't ever see a situation where Robinson would be able to guard a Gasol or Randolph type player. He and Webber have similar height and weight stats, yet Webber would make him look like a midget on the court.

Lets throw stats out and just use our eyes. Cousins wowed us all the time his rookie year. He could look really bad at moments and he could look like a future HOF player at other moments. Robinson almost never wows us. We might get one really solid play from him every 3 games or so but we almost never get 5 solid minutes in a row from the guy. He has basically zero post moves, can't shoot, can't finish and is probably too small to play D on almost any starting PF in the league. I just don't see how he can start bringing the team more positives than negatives. I hope I'm wrong though.
 
#41
I remember Uncia03 and I getting together last march for the NCAA tourney, and watching Robinson play. We were both intrigued by his athleticism, his court speed, and his ballhandling, that was above average for a PF. What we questioned, particularly Uncia03, was his skill set, his true height, and his NBA readiness. I can't speak for Uncia03, but I think we both believed him to be more of a project than someone that could come in and make an impact right away. I know I personally questioned those comments that said he was the most NBA ready of the majority of those in the draft.

Even then, prior to the draft, I thought his best position might eventually be SF, because of his quickness, his ability to defend quicker players, and the beginning of a nice looking jumpshot. That opinion wasn't locked in stone, but more of a gut reaction when I watched him play. So, he's actually doing about what I thought he would do. Thats not to be critical of him, because I do think he has the potential to be a good player in the league. Its just going to take some time, something fans are hardpressed to give. In many ways he reminds me of a smaller, quicker version of JT when he came into the league. Playing at light speed, and out of control, when everyone else is playing at normal speed and in control. I hate to say this, but I think JT arrived with a more polished skill set.

Athleticism can be both a blessing and a curse. Too often players with great athleticism are able to get by strictly on that athleticism. The one's that realize that they also need skills, become the Michael Jordans and Kobe Bryants of the world. The one's that don't, become the Gerald Green's and Tyrus Thomas of the world. At this point, its all up to T. Robb. He has a lot of work to do. He seems to be a determined young man, so I think he'll be just fine.
To be honest though, I'd take this over what TRob gives us (see 0:18ish)

 
Last edited by a moderator: