Grade the offseason moves so far
- Thread starter K F Jay
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Dorell Wright is not enough of upgrade, James Johnson is???
big, useless SF contracts still there ( Cisco 6.1M, Salmons 8M, Outlaw 3M), but kings have no decent SF.....
Kings is the worst defense team in the league, and adds AB(No defense), what's this???(why not Kyle Lowry??)
if team adds Kyle Lowry and Dorell Wright, it will be B+ at least.
right now, more unbalanced roster, more backup players, Fail is fair
big, useless SF contracts still there ( Cisco 6.1M, Salmons 8M, Outlaw 3M), but kings have no decent SF.....
Kings is the worst defense team in the league, and adds AB(No defense), what's this???(why not Kyle Lowry??)
if team adds Kyle Lowry and Dorell Wright, it will be B+ at least.
right now, more unbalanced roster, more backup players, Fail is fair
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I know Lowry would have been a great addiction, but it would have cost us our pick. I'd rather have Robinson and Brooks than just Lowry. I agree Wright is a better player than Johnson, but JJ has a chance to be a great defender. Let's see how he plays.
Overall, I want to give Petrie a C. He has not done any disaters, like he did last year, so at least I want to give him a chance and see how it works out. I'm also pretty sure we are not done for this offseason, and we'll se at least another move (a trade).
Overall, I want to give Petrie a C. He has not done any disaters, like he did last year, so at least I want to give him a chance and see how it works out. I'm also pretty sure we are not done for this offseason, and we'll se at least another move (a trade).
Geoff Petrie after the season:
We need a rim protector
We need an upgrade at SF
Results so far
Neither is addressed. We have no rim protector, in fact we had a project that could be one and we waived. We recruited yet another SF but he is not a clear upgrade on what we already have. We just hope he turns into one and if he doesn't we don't lose much.
Given that neither need has been addressed and in the process we have used up all of our cap space, its safe to say that so far the off-season is a failure.
We need a rim protector
We need an upgrade at SF
Results so far
Neither is addressed. We have no rim protector, in fact we had a project that could be one and we waived. We recruited yet another SF but he is not a clear upgrade on what we already have. We just hope he turns into one and if he doesn't we don't lose much.
Given that neither need has been addressed and in the process we have used up all of our cap space, its safe to say that so far the off-season is a failure.
Resigning JT and Drafting TRob with the fifth pick are solid moves. Those are your 2 best power forwards and JT will back up DMC at center. Trading a 2nd for James Johnson is a low risk/low cost move that could work out. JJ comes with a rep of being a good defender. Signing Aaron Brooks provides an experienced PG that has touch on his shot out to the 3 point line.
How is any of the above Fail?
Mass is correct in that Lowry cost Toronto a first round pick. Dorell Wright was traded by GSW to Philly in the Eastern Conference. That is what smart GM's do so their old player has fewer chances to shine against his old club. How would it have looked if Wright was raining threes on Golden State every time they faced the Kings?
Anyhow I voted C but count it as a C+.
KB
How is any of the above Fail?
Mass is correct in that Lowry cost Toronto a first round pick. Dorell Wright was traded by GSW to Philly in the Eastern Conference. That is what smart GM's do so their old player has fewer chances to shine against his old club. How would it have looked if Wright was raining threes on Golden State every time they faced the Kings?
Anyhow I voted C but count it as a C+.
KB
Again it goes back to what Petrie himself stated as main needs. He did not get a rim protector which he stated as a major need. He also did not UPGRADE the SF position, he just added another option there, one that is not a clear upgrade!
Getting JJ is a cheap move that COULD work out and it cost us very little. Then again we were saying the same thing about Outlaw last season and it didn't work out all that well!
I have said that Brooks is a nice, cheap addition. He is a good player that is on a cheap contract BUT he is yet another ball dominant guard added to the roster that is overflowing with them. It creates a bigger mess there with not enough minutes or shots for everyone.
If after draft and free agency you have not addressed what you identified as your 2 biggest needs then how can the off-season be anything but a failure so far?! Building a team is an art and its not just collection of talent regardless of position or fit.
Getting JJ is a cheap move that COULD work out and it cost us very little. Then again we were saying the same thing about Outlaw last season and it didn't work out all that well!
I have said that Brooks is a nice, cheap addition. He is a good player that is on a cheap contract BUT he is yet another ball dominant guard added to the roster that is overflowing with them. It creates a bigger mess there with not enough minutes or shots for everyone.
If after draft and free agency you have not addressed what you identified as your 2 biggest needs then how can the off-season be anything but a failure so far?! Building a team is an art and its not just collection of talent regardless of position or fit.
Drafting Trob is a B. Would much rather have Lowry+ Terrence Jones though. Jones is the same size as Trob and can actually play the 3 if you want him to. And he may be closer to Trob in terms of NBA-readiness than previously thought. (I'm not grading Trob because he hasn't played yet, I'm grading the move or lack thereof)
Trading for Johnson is an B. Could be an A if Johnson develops a shot or steps up his consistency.
Signing Brooks is a C. The team gets more talented and he's cheap. But he's a bad fit and really not necessary since Salmons isn't going anywhere and seemed capable backing up PG. Any minimum salary vet would have provided ample competition for Jimmer.
Re-signing JT is an B. You know what he brings, he fits in, and at a good price. His skillset is a good bet long-term, since he's not undersized and has some athleticism (without relying on it for his game). Drew Gooden is an almost perfect comp, from statistics to offensive game and defensive brain farts.
Not adding a shot blocker is a D. The Johnson acquisition keeps it from being a complete F. And there's a small chance Cuz can add a Bogut-like shotblocking skill, as they are both ground bound and take a ton of charges. If the team added Lowry to man PG this wouldn't have been as large a need either.
And this team still has too many redundant pieces with bad contracts. There's still time to change that, but they have a backlog of Salmons/Garcia/Outlaw/Honeycutt, an overpaid 4th big, and a crowded backcourt, with still gaping holes. Reke might have to play a lot more SF. Until the roster imbalance gets addressed, that's another F.
Overall grades out to a 2.0, a mediocre C. Good enough to get by, easy to improve on, but another crap move or underperformer and management should be in hot water.
Trading for Johnson is an B. Could be an A if Johnson develops a shot or steps up his consistency.
Signing Brooks is a C. The team gets more talented and he's cheap. But he's a bad fit and really not necessary since Salmons isn't going anywhere and seemed capable backing up PG. Any minimum salary vet would have provided ample competition for Jimmer.
Re-signing JT is an B. You know what he brings, he fits in, and at a good price. His skillset is a good bet long-term, since he's not undersized and has some athleticism (without relying on it for his game). Drew Gooden is an almost perfect comp, from statistics to offensive game and defensive brain farts.
Not adding a shot blocker is a D. The Johnson acquisition keeps it from being a complete F. And there's a small chance Cuz can add a Bogut-like shotblocking skill, as they are both ground bound and take a ton of charges. If the team added Lowry to man PG this wouldn't have been as large a need either.
And this team still has too many redundant pieces with bad contracts. There's still time to change that, but they have a backlog of Salmons/Garcia/Outlaw/Honeycutt, an overpaid 4th big, and a crowded backcourt, with still gaping holes. Reke might have to play a lot more SF. Until the roster imbalance gets addressed, that's another F.
Overall grades out to a 2.0, a mediocre C. Good enough to get by, easy to improve on, but another crap move or underperformer and management should be in hot water.
Ok. I'll be the first optimist with a B. 
But first off, who is Darnell Wright? And why is Lowry an "addiction"?. LOL
I'll start with the draft. TRob was probably the concensus 2nd best player in this draft and Petrie got the kid with our pick. TRob is BPA so that's easily an "A".
Next we signed JT, our consistent player to round up our core young bigs rotation, for half the price of Javale McGee. I think that deserves a "B".
So now we have TRob, JT and DMC as our core frontline. This gives us a non-shot blocking core frontline for the long run, so Petrie got a SF who cares to block and defend that is of the same size as TRob for peanuts. Plus JJ doesn't really suck in 3-pt percentage. I think that's a "B".
Then we got Aaron Brooks. Have we forgotten 2010 where Brooks was MIP and everyone was all on board of picking him? Well, now we have Brooks.
A competitive vet that would still complement Reke on offense with his me-first-shoot-first mentality like MT did.
But Brooks, regardless of how selfish he could be, is still a more savvy vet than any of our PGs. That's a "B"
But first off, who is Darnell Wright? And why is Lowry an "addiction"?. LOL
I'll start with the draft. TRob was probably the concensus 2nd best player in this draft and Petrie got the kid with our pick. TRob is BPA so that's easily an "A".
Next we signed JT, our consistent player to round up our core young bigs rotation, for half the price of Javale McGee. I think that deserves a "B".
So now we have TRob, JT and DMC as our core frontline. This gives us a non-shot blocking core frontline for the long run, so Petrie got a SF who cares to block and defend that is of the same size as TRob for peanuts. Plus JJ doesn't really suck in 3-pt percentage. I think that's a "B".
Then we got Aaron Brooks. Have we forgotten 2010 where Brooks was MIP and everyone was all on board of picking him? Well, now we have Brooks.
A competitive vet that would still complement Reke on offense with his me-first-shoot-first mentality like MT did.
But Brooks, regardless of how selfish he could be, is still a more savvy vet than any of our PGs. That's a "B"
#5 <=> Lowry + #14 + #15
if dreams come true
Cousins John Henson( or someone who is shotblocker)
JT Hayes(or can spend minimum salary to add DJ)
Terrence Jones JJ
reke MT
Lowry IT
9 men rotation
more balanced, more stable, all team needs is filled. having size, can defense.
and now
Cousins
JT Hayes TRob
JJ Garcia Salmons Honeycutt
reke MT
AB IT
AB is not bad, but he needs shots, he needs minutes
kings already have 3 guards need shot and minutes, BTW two of them doesnt defense(now have another one).
if dreams come true
Cousins John Henson( or someone who is shotblocker)
JT Hayes(or can spend minimum salary to add DJ)
Terrence Jones JJ
reke MT
Lowry IT
9 men rotation
more balanced, more stable, all team needs is filled. having size, can defense.
and now
Cousins
JT Hayes TRob
JJ Garcia Salmons Honeycutt
reke MT
AB IT
AB is not bad, but he needs shots, he needs minutes
kings already have 3 guards need shot and minutes, BTW two of them doesnt defense(now have another one).
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Grade: Incomplete.
There are probably other trades that will occur. In the meantime, the Kings have obviously increased their talent with three worthwhile additions - Robinson, Brooks, Johnson. The talent is better, and at the least it's a better bench. Point guard position now has depth. Robinson will be a nice reliever for Thompson and rebounding should be even better than last year. Johnson is a question mark for me. Supposedly he can play D. We'll see. Outside shooting remains a question, especially in the starting lineup if you assume Tyreke is at the 2 and Johnson at the 3. There still are imbalances, especially with Thornton appearing to be the odd man out. That's where hopefully some trades will occur.
There are probably other trades that will occur. In the meantime, the Kings have obviously increased their talent with three worthwhile additions - Robinson, Brooks, Johnson. The talent is better, and at the least it's a better bench. Point guard position now has depth. Robinson will be a nice reliever for Thompson and rebounding should be even better than last year. Johnson is a question mark for me. Supposedly he can play D. We'll see. Outside shooting remains a question, especially in the starting lineup if you assume Tyreke is at the 2 and Johnson at the 3. There still are imbalances, especially with Thornton appearing to be the odd man out. That's where hopefully some trades will occur.
I think petrie did a solid job this offseason. Trob, resigning jt, jj for a second rd pick which would have probably been sold anyway. There should not be surprises as he's been in th e league for a few years. We just need stability from that position. Ab is a good signing for 1 mill. Basically
Trying out for the position.
If jj pans out, we'll have el flaco, salmons, outlaw there. El flaco will not be back so we have 3 players at the 3. We're positioned well in case Ab does not work out.
Trying out for the position.
If jj pans out, we'll have el flaco, salmons, outlaw there. El flaco will not be back so we have 3 players at the 3. We're positioned well in case Ab does not work out.
D- he resigned JT and picked up what everyone says is the second best player in the draft. That's not to say we are automatically worse because we could actually play the exact same players we played last year and they are a year better. Rather he didn't address stated needs at all he cut a long term project after year 2 without putting him on the floor to grow in those 2 years(maybe because we were winning so much and had to make every game count for that 27th spot in the league) he brought in more shoot first players and didn't resign Twill who wanted to be here and filled a need and on and on.
Will we be better then last year its almost inevitable but he made 2 no brainer moves and he could have screwed up those also I guess. D- yay.
Will we be better then last year its almost inevitable but he made 2 no brainer moves and he could have screwed up those also I guess. D- yay.
1.Resigning Thompson: B
Great third big but he will be starter at pf and thats not ideal.
2.Drafting Robinson: D
Bad fit next to Cousins and not an upgrade from Thompson. Yes he slipped to 5 but he should have been traded.
3.Johnson trade: C
Small upgrade at SF, probably not starter caliber. If he and Evans play big minutes together then its downgrade because of bad shooting.
4.Brooks signing: D
Too similar to Thomas, you don't want undersized rotation at any position. Both are bad fit with our second best player(Thornton).
If we instead got Lowry or even Hinrich they could defend both guard positions very well and shoot a bit. That would be much better option because of our terrible defense at both guard positions.
Positive is good contract.
5.Trading 2nd round pick: C
We don't need more young assets or projects.
6.Waiving Whiteside: D
He may be overall bad player but hes young and already one of the best in probably most valued individual skill in todays basketball.
Overall: F
Because of wrong team direction if such thing even exists here.
We got center with potential to become best offensive bigman in the league in 1 or 2 years and yet they decide to go run and gun smallball.
All we need is some sort of defensive anchor and lots of shooters.
This will be third season straight where we had enough core talent to make playoffs but failed miserably because of Maloofs saving money and Petrie doing wrong moves.
Great third big but he will be starter at pf and thats not ideal.
2.Drafting Robinson: D
Bad fit next to Cousins and not an upgrade from Thompson. Yes he slipped to 5 but he should have been traded.
3.Johnson trade: C
Small upgrade at SF, probably not starter caliber. If he and Evans play big minutes together then its downgrade because of bad shooting.
4.Brooks signing: D
Too similar to Thomas, you don't want undersized rotation at any position. Both are bad fit with our second best player(Thornton).
If we instead got Lowry or even Hinrich they could defend both guard positions very well and shoot a bit. That would be much better option because of our terrible defense at both guard positions.
Positive is good contract.
5.Trading 2nd round pick: C
We don't need more young assets or projects.
6.Waiving Whiteside: D
He may be overall bad player but hes young and already one of the best in probably most valued individual skill in todays basketball.
Overall: F
Because of wrong team direction if such thing even exists here.
We got center with potential to become best offensive bigman in the league in 1 or 2 years and yet they decide to go run and gun smallball.
All we need is some sort of defensive anchor and lots of shooters.
This will be third season straight where we had enough core talent to make playoffs but failed miserably because of Maloofs saving money and Petrie doing wrong moves.
Kings needed defense. Johnson was the best SF available who would come to Sacramento and is a defensive upgrade plus 3-pt shooting.
Petrie tried to get Brooks a year ago and couldn't swing a deal (maybe Kings had no one Rockets wanted! ever think of that?). He brings experience, good decision making, a better defender than IT and Jimmer, not needing the ball all the time and can shoot from anywhere out to 3pt line.
TRob will be big time rebounder and defender on front court line and can run the break and shoot from all over.
Hmmm, sounds like defensive improvements to me. Some of you negative spouters keep forgetting how many of the top SF had chances to go to current playoff teams and ones who will have chance to get deep in playoffs. So don't let the ugly head of reality get in the way of your downplaying everything just so you can see yourself spout off.
Petrie tried to get Brooks a year ago and couldn't swing a deal (maybe Kings had no one Rockets wanted! ever think of that?). He brings experience, good decision making, a better defender than IT and Jimmer, not needing the ball all the time and can shoot from anywhere out to 3pt line.
TRob will be big time rebounder and defender on front court line and can run the break and shoot from all over.
Hmmm, sounds like defensive improvements to me. Some of you negative spouters keep forgetting how many of the top SF had chances to go to current playoff teams and ones who will have chance to get deep in playoffs. So don't let the ugly head of reality get in the way of your downplaying everything just so you can see yourself spout off.
I didn't vote! We still have two months before training camp, so whats the point of making a judgement now when its possible more deal might be made. But I'll comment on what was done. First off, Brooks is 5'10.5" without shoes, so he's essentially 6' in shoes. So while he's not a giant, he's as tall as others like Chris Paul, Ty Lawson, etc. He's a very good athlete with a 39" vertical. In his last good year with Houston, he shot close to 40% from the three, he averaged over 5 assists a game and just over 2 turnovers a game. If he has a weakness, its his defense, which is surprising since he's athletic enough to be a good defender. Maybe no one demanded it from him.
Its been stated many times so far that Petrie failed to get a shotblocker, but yet, James Johnson was the leading shotblocker in the NBA last season from the SF position at 1.4 blocks, in 24 minutes of playing time per game. If you put him up against everyone else in a per 48 minute contest, the only players that come in ahead of him are centers, like Howard, Bynum, etc. So tell me this! Why is getting Kirilenko as a shotblocking SF OK, but getting Johnson isn't? Yeah, the jury may still be out, but at least he's proved he can block shots, and defend the ball.
At the moment the bottom line is, we got rid of Greene and Whiteside, and replaced them with Brooks and Johnson. So folks, in my mind, thats an improvement. And anyone that thinks we should have hung on to Whiteside, needs to take off the blinders and watch him play. I've never been more disappointed in a player. He absolutely stunk the place out in his first two games. So I was not surprised to see him gone. I wish him well, but I hope he has some other skills to fall back on, because he may not be playing in the NBA very long. Maybe he and Thabeet can open up a clothing store for long and tall people.
I will admit to feeling some stress with T Robb after his first 4 games, but in game 5 he looked like the T Robb I saw in college. Still a long way from where he needs to go, but at least my short term fears were abated. Anyway, I'll come back and revisit this thread before the beginning of training camp. Right now, its way too early...
Its been stated many times so far that Petrie failed to get a shotblocker, but yet, James Johnson was the leading shotblocker in the NBA last season from the SF position at 1.4 blocks, in 24 minutes of playing time per game. If you put him up against everyone else in a per 48 minute contest, the only players that come in ahead of him are centers, like Howard, Bynum, etc. So tell me this! Why is getting Kirilenko as a shotblocking SF OK, but getting Johnson isn't? Yeah, the jury may still be out, but at least he's proved he can block shots, and defend the ball.
At the moment the bottom line is, we got rid of Greene and Whiteside, and replaced them with Brooks and Johnson. So folks, in my mind, thats an improvement. And anyone that thinks we should have hung on to Whiteside, needs to take off the blinders and watch him play. I've never been more disappointed in a player. He absolutely stunk the place out in his first two games. So I was not surprised to see him gone. I wish him well, but I hope he has some other skills to fall back on, because he may not be playing in the NBA very long. Maybe he and Thabeet can open up a clothing store for long and tall people.
I will admit to feeling some stress with T Robb after his first 4 games, but in game 5 he looked like the T Robb I saw in college. Still a long way from where he needs to go, but at least my short term fears were abated. Anyway, I'll come back and revisit this thread before the beginning of training camp. Right now, its way too early...
Improved the overall roster. Kings aren't getting a game changer in free agency, never have...maybe Divac, but paid good money for him.....plus if they didn't get Webber, Vlade wouldn't have been as effective.... Neither has OKC, Grizz, Spurs, or any other small market. They either drafted or traded for their top players. The thing that people don't realize is the Kings need Garcia and Salmons' contracts to leave room to resign Evans and Cousins. Those two, plus Thorton are our hope for a good team. If they trade Garcia and Salmons for a longer contract, they won't be able to resign Evans and Cousins. Plus, the Kings got Thompson and Brooks at a discount. Looks good moving forward in my eyes.
And please ... every team want a top shot blocker and a great PG with size. Why would one of those players come to the Kings when they could go to a better team? There wasn't one I would want that was a FA anyways. Honestly, I like the size and charge taking abilities of Cousins anyways. You know you get the ball. However, my dream line-up is Cousins and Ibaka. I'd be good with an Evans for Ibaka trade.
And please ... every team want a top shot blocker and a great PG with size. Why would one of those players come to the Kings when they could go to a better team? There wasn't one I would want that was a FA anyways. Honestly, I like the size and charge taking abilities of Cousins anyways. You know you get the ball. However, my dream line-up is Cousins and Ibaka.
I'd be good with an Evans for Ibaka trade.
I actually went to Wikipedia and came up with a mess of grading systems not only throughout the world but even within the US. What I was looking for was a simple answer to the absence of an "E" grade. Why jump from "D" to "F?" "F" makes sense as it is "Fail" but then why not an A, B, C, D, E, and F? Ahhh, the mysteries of life.
Already have had 4 years of 25 wins or less. At this point Petrie needs to bring this roster together and instead we have more question marks in Robinson, Brooks, and Johnson. We still have roster clutter with roles and playing time yet to be defined. It would not surprise me to see another pathetic season and if so this one goes directly on Petrie.
It's not a dream world trade to think that Lowry + Dalembert + mid 1st rounder(s) for #5 + Hayes + change was there for us. Adding two proven vets as starters that are great defenders would have gone a long way towards stabilizing this team and defining roles. Instead we'll be watching Robinson develop over the next couple of years. Cue up the "he's still a rookie. give him a chance to grow" comments in the post game blowout threads. I hope it works out and in the long run Robinson may be worth way more than that package but this team has got to start winning. It's getting pathetic.
I like the JT deal and think the Johnson trade is interesting and worth the risk, but I hope Petrie is right about taking Robinson over a vet package.
It's not a dream world trade to think that Lowry + Dalembert + mid 1st rounder(s) for #5 + Hayes + change was there for us. Adding two proven vets as starters that are great defenders would have gone a long way towards stabilizing this team and defining roles. Instead we'll be watching Robinson develop over the next couple of years. Cue up the "he's still a rookie. give him a chance to grow" comments in the post game blowout threads. I hope it works out and in the long run Robinson may be worth way more than that package but this team has got to start winning. It's getting pathetic.
I like the JT deal and think the Johnson trade is interesting and worth the risk, but I hope Petrie is right about taking Robinson over a vet package.
