Worst trade of 2011 Offseason?

[Heuge]

John Hollinger's take on the Salmons- Udrih swap

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/draft...mnist=hollinger_john&page=threewaydeal-110623

 

[funkykingston]

Pretty much my exact feelings on this deal. The Kings traded a younger, steadier player with a shorter contract who had shown he played well with the young core of the team for a fourth mediocre SF, this one on the downside of his career.

Salmons brings defense but he's undersized at the three, doesn't spread the floor, dominates the ball (he and Tyreke will have fun playing together) and is not an impact player.

Why on earth would you agree to a Beno for Salmons deal straight up, let alone agreeing to drop three spots in the draft to make it happen? I would have rather seen the team stay put at 7 and draft Biyombo than this nonsense.

I am not just bothered or puzzled by this deal. I am downright angry about it. Awful move.

 

[OnYouLikeGlue]

So many things wrong with Hollingers analysis there. He claims they got a worse player based on PER, he's right in that regard, but the improved perimeter defense Salmons brings vs. Beno "The Matador" Udrih cannot be adequately measured with PER.

He argues why go older on a rebuilding team? First 31 vs 29, wow, massive difference. And second getting a little older isn't horrible for a team full of guys who barely reached legal drinking age. By the time the Kings can void Salmons contract he'll only be 34, not a big deal.

Salmons contract really isn't that horrible.

And why does he think Salmons is being brought in to the play SG? He'll be the starting SF for sure, and that was a need for this team.

Is Salmons gonna be the starting SF on a championship contending Kings team? No. Is he the long term solution? No. Is he an immediate upgrade at the position compared to what the Kings had last year? Definitely, he helps solidify a weak perimeter defense and can hit an open three. The big question is can he accept being the 4th/5th option on this team, if he can I think its the perfect fit for now.

 

[Geoff]

Pretty much my exact feelings on this deal. The Kings traded a younger, steadier player with a shorter contract who had shown he played well with the young core of the team for a fourth mediocre SF, this one on the downside of his career.

Salmons brings defense but he's undersized at the three, doesn't spread the floor, dominates the ball (he and Tyreke will have fun playing together) and is not an impact player.

Why on earth would you agree to a Beno for Salmons deal straight up, let alone agreeing to drop three spots in the draft to make it happen? I would have rather seen the team stay put at 7 and draft Biyombo than this nonsense.

I am not just bothered or puzzled by this deal. I am downright angry about it. Awful move.

I'm like "Who kidnapped Petrie and replaced him with Kahn?"

 

[Spike]

Worst of the offseason? Never underestimate the power of:

 

[iowamcnabb]

Is Salmons gonna be the starting SF on a championship contending Kings team? No. Is he the long term solution? No. Is he an immediate upgrade at the position compared to what the Kings had last year? Definitely, he helps solidify a weak perimeter defense and can hit an open three. The big question is can he accept being the 4th/5th option on this team, if he can I think its the perfect fit for now.

Unless he has matured in the last couple years the answer to the question is probably no. That was one of the many knocks on the guy the first go around. The kings apparently didn't love knight, kemba etc or they wouldn't have made such a risky trade.
My biggest concern with this ordeal is team chemistry. We were supposed to add veteran leadership this offseason...

 

[PurpleHaze]

DuhDuhDuhDUNCE!

 

[KingsCitizen]

Worst trade? I don't think so!
First off, Salmons played with Beno and not Evans!
Marcus Thornton is a ball hog. But he worked well with Evans.
I see Salmons as a SG here.
Salmons-Evans backcourt would be a backcourt of ballhogs but it will keep defenses honest.

And btw, we just drafted Honeycutt a legit SF at 35th. Probably a steal in this draft.

 

[Entity]

Salmons will never see SG on this team. He is SF all the way. Evans, Thorton, Salmons, Dalember, Cousins. I like it alot we got our defensive SF and a veteran at the same time.

 

[Boogie-havoc]

So many things wrong with Hollingers analysis there. He claims they got a worse player based on PER, he's right in that regard, but the improved perimeter defense Salmons brings vs. Beno "The Matador" Udrih cannot be adequately measured with PER.

He argues why go older on a rebuilding team? First 31 vs 29, wow, massive difference. And second getting a little older isn't horrible for a team full of guys who barely reached legal drinking age. By the time the Kings can void Salmons contract he'll only be 34, not a big deal.

Salmons contract really isn't that horrible.

And why does he think Salmons is being brought in to the play SG? He'll be the starting SF for sure, and that was a need for this team.

Is Salmons gonna be the starting SF on a championship contending Kings team? No. Is he the long term solution? No. Is he an immediate upgrade at the position compared to what the Kings had last year? Definitely, he helps solidify a weak perimeter defense and can hit an open three. The big question is can he accept being the 4th/5th option on this team, if he can I think its the perfect fit for now.

You just tryin to suger-coat it.. it's a TERRIBLE trade.

You don't see him as our future SF? then why you commit to him for 3 years, adding 11 milion in your wages overall? why trade DOWN in the trade? you could upgrade at SF in the FA even better, AND you get to draft Brandon fvckin Knight at the 7th pick like you wished since he workout with you.

Salmons is a trigger happy-playing only for himself type of player, who gave a push in his contract year and then went right back to his "fvck this" attitude... and the man is only gonna get worst too, a horrible horrible fit in our core of players, honestly godawful fit.

No logic whatsoever, none - we fvcked up big time and we gotta accept it, that is all.

 

[Entity]

Unless he has matured in the last couple years the answer to the question is probably no. That was one of the many knocks on the guy the first go around. The kings apparently didn't love knight, kemba etc or they wouldn't have made such a risky trade.
My biggest concern with this ordeal is team chemistry. We were supposed to add veteran leadership this offseason...

We took the risk because we wanted a shooter at that position. So what did we do? We got the best shooter at that position. Salmons last played on a team that was going nowhere with Kenny Thomas and Brad Miller in the frontcourt and Kevin Martin and Beno. Salmons was probably our second best player on that team and we needed him to score the ball. I love this trade I think we have more to come because we got 5 SF's now lol.

 

[OnYouLikeGlue]

You just tryin to suger-coat it.. it's a TERRIBLE trade.

You don't see him as our future SF? then why you commit to him for 3 years, adding 11 milion in your wages overall? why trade DOWN in the trade? you could upgrade at SF in the FA even better, AND you get to draft Brandon fvckin Knight at the 7th pick like you wished since he workout with you.

Salmons is a trigger happy-playing only for himself type of player, who gave a push in his contract year and then went right back to his "fvck this" attitude... and the man is only gonna get worst too, a horrible horrible fit in our core of players, honestly godawful fit.

No logic whatsoever, none - we fvcked up big time and we gotta accept it, that is all.

I never wanted to draft Knight. LOL

 

[Boogie-havoc]

As 'you' I mean our franchise and FO.

That deal is so silly even without the draft picks, Beno for Salmons straight up, when you can get a SF in FA market and with Beno being a pretty solid and consistent player that you can get decent offers for, is a bad deal for Sacramento.

So trading 3 spots down while missing your most wanted target as a team in the draft, makes this one of the worst trades we'll see this year... only way Petrie could screw it up a little more is trading Jennings for Tyreke and a future first.

 

[OnYouLikeGlue]

And you're assuming they did want Knight.

 

[FaStRmAn]

Salmons will never see SG on this team. He is SF all the way. Evans, Thorton, Salmons, Dalember, Cousins. I like it alot we got our defensive SF and a veteran at the same time.

For sure Salmons is a 3. Not the long term answer but he will do for now.Beno is no great loss. Teams could shut him down easily playing man defense. I still think the Kings are needing a veteran PG to make this team go. I am hoping that free agency is where Petrie plans to find the starter for this engine. I dont think this is the dumbest trade. I think it was a safe way to get a player while still getting the player they wanted all along. They knew they wanted Jimmer and they knew he would last until the 10th pick. So they make a change to get better defensively and perhaps can cut loose one of the dead weight small forwards they have on the roster. If they could trade one of them or add them to a mix that brings back a true PG, I would be overjoyed. The season doesnt start until October. We are in June. Lotsa moves could still be made and they have more to trade.

 

[Entity]

Exactly. All I heard was we wanted Jimmer or Leonard. leonard because he was defenive SF. Well Salmons is a defensive SF with Veteran leadership. I never wanted knight. And could you please name me this SF that would have definatley came to Sacramento as a FA????? All i keep seeing is we could have got this guy and that guy in FA. When was the last time a great FA came to us?

 

[Entity]

For sure Salmons is a 3. Not the long term answer but he will do for now.Beno is no great loss. Teams could shut him down easily playing man defense. I still think the Kings are needing a veteran PG to make this team go. I am hoping that free agency is where Petrie plans to find the starter for this engine. I dont think this is the dumbest trade. I think it was a safe way to get a player while still getting the player they wanted all along. They knew they wanted Jimmer and they knew he would last until the 10th pick. So they make a change to get better defensively and perhaps can cut loose one of the dead weight small forwards they have on the roster. If they could trade one of them or add them to a mix that brings back a true PG, I would be overjoyed. The season doesnt start until October. We are in June. Lotsa moves could still be made and they have more to trade.

we have a starting PG. Do you seriously think that Tyreke and Thorton will not be our starting backcourt. I mean Beno didn't start once we got Thorton. and we won over 50% of our games. Jimmer will get some PT this year I am sure. we may get a vet PG later but he will just be a filler type player not a starter.

 

[jcwkings]

People are overreacting here, first salmons is a good player to have until either one of greene or casppi develop, or we find another sf, he plays good d, can handle the ball, and can hit the spot up 3. Yes back in the day he was a black hole on offense, but at the same time he played with brad miller, kevin martin, beno etc., basically he was the only one on the team who could create a shot for himself, hence he was pretty much our go to guy in the 4th quarters. With tyreke, cousins, thornton and now jimmer, all these guys can create their own shots, he will know his role.

Second if we were going to take a point gaurd, we needed to get rid of beno. I like beno but he is not going to get us to a title, i think jimmer can do everything beno did, but is a much better 3 point shooter. I think drafting Knight would be redundant with what tyreke is, we dont need 2 guys who need the ball in their hand to be good.

 

[mac]

Exactly. All I heard was we wanted Jimmer or Leonard. leonard because he was defenive SF. Well Salmons is a defensive SF with Veteran leadership. I never wanted knight. And could you please name me this SF that would have definatley came to Sacramento as a FA????? All i keep seeing is we could have got this guy and that guy in FA. When was the last time a great FA came to us?

I think one of the bigger concerns is Salmons' track record. Leonard would not have hogged the ball, and as a rookie he probably wouldn't be all pouty and bad for team chemistry. John Salmons when playing for us was unhappy as a bench player, pounded the ball just as much as people criticize Tyreke for doing now, and wasn't that good of an outside shooter.

So imagine if we assume that we're trading last year's Beno for the Salmons who played for us. A consistent guy who could bring up the ball and play off the ball and worked well deferring to Thornton Evans and Cousins, for a guy who was known for being an irritating pouty ballhog, although he does play good D, and you're paying more for Salmons.

Does this mean it won't work? Not necessarily - it may turn out to be good. But nothing is for certain, and based on Salmons attitude and play in the past it certain doesn't excite me that we've got him back.

 

[pilot305]

I'm actually ok with this trade. Beno is useless defensively. Salmons isn't a bad bench player in my opinion. Jimmer...i'm not sure about him. Hope he learns to play some defense.. GO KINGS!

 

[Entity]

I think one of the bigger concerns is Salmons' track record. Leonard would not have hogged the ball, and as a rookie he probably wouldn't be all pouty and bad for team chemistry. John Salmons when playing for us was unhappy as a bench player, pounded the ball just as much as people criticize Tyreke for doing now, and wasn't that good of an outside shooter.

So imagine if we assume that we're trading last year's Beno for the Salmons who played for us. A consistent guy who could bring up the ball and play off the ball and worked well deferring to Thornton Evans and Cousins, for a guy who was known for being an irritating pouty ballhog, although he does play good D, and you're paying more for Salmons.

Does this mean it won't work? Not necessarily - it may turn out to be good. But nothing is for certain, and based on Salmons attitude and play in the past it certain doesn't excite me that we've got him back.

You do realize that Salmons has shot at nearly or over 40% 3-pt for the last 5 years right?

 

[Gary]

Exactly. All I heard was we wanted Jimmer or Leonard. leonard because he was defenive SF. Well Salmons is a defensive SF with Veteran leadership. I never wanted knight. And could you please name me this SF that would have definatley came to Sacramento as a FA????? All i keep seeing is we could have got this guy and that guy in FA. When was the last time a great FA came to us?

Sorry but I LOL'd at that part.. Salmons is a veteran but he's not a leader in any way, shape or form.

 

[SacKings7]

I don't hate this deal as much as some of you. We lost the trade IMO but this will not be the worst trade of the offseason. I just hope Thornton is still in our plans after this...

 

[sdballer]

You do realize that Salmons has shot at nearly or over 40% 3-pt for the last 5 years right?

He's shot over 40% once his entire career. Let's not start overstating johns abilities jet because he's back on our team. Frankly, fans were almost universally thrilled when we finally shipped him out. He's now older, slower, worse defensively, worse shooting, and more expensive. And our new starting small forward.

 

[Entity]

i said he has shot nearly or over 40%. he was over twice. his last year with us and his first year with Chicgo. since then he has been at 38% and 39%. not overstating at all. thats facts. now tell me where i overstated?

 

[Entity]

well he is more of a vet leader than say Omri or Donte lol.

 

[Bricklayer]

Exactly. All I heard was we wanted Jimmer or Leonard. leonard because he was defenive SF. Well Salmons is a defensive SF with Veteran leadership.

Well...he's a defensive SF who's a veteran at least.

 

[sdballer]

He shot over 40% in one year, split between us and Chicago. Since then he's been at 38%. My thing is that he went from being a guy most kings fans hated, to someone who struggled massively as a buck last year, yet now he's a good pick up for us. In the last couple hours he's been called a leader, a great 3 point shooter a great defender and one of the best sf in the league. What? Would any of the fans defending this move ever have suggested trading for salmons to fill our sf hole? No. The reasons are obvious. They don't change because we did trade for him.

 

[rhythmless]

Salmons will never see SG on this team. He is SF all the way. Evans, Thorton, Salmons, Dalember, Cousins. I like it alot we got our defensive SF and a veteran at the same time.

I found a couple sites that disagree with you. You might have heard of them. nba.com, espn.com and basketball-reference.com

 

[Entity]

let me spell it out for you sdballer. now follow me this time. When he was with us he was #2. with chicago actually almost #1 that year. With millwalkee he was #2/#3. Now he is our #5. pretty damn good #5. i didn't say great 3pt shooter but he is better than anybody on our current team if you don't count fredette. defender better than any SF on our team and better SF than anybody on our team. Do you understand what an upgrade is. Did you expect a superstar SF? we got a solid guy at SF now who has. oh and the difference between 41% and 38% is 4 missed shots in a season