sixers trading iguodala

[KingsCitizen]

If the CBA next season won't drastically change, how about trading for both AI and Granger. Their combined salary is around 26M and Kings are projected to be around a 26M payroll next season. Plus Dally is our own player, which I believe allow us to re-sign him to certain amounts that can go beyond the cap. Sign Dally to a 10M range and Kings will only get a payroll of 62M. And that is without even trading any salaries on this team. Except that our possible pick, which I would say will be traded in this process.

Probable trade scenarios:
Granger for our pick(if somehow we land top 3) = rebuilding + salary dump for Indiana. I believe they are high on Kanter.

AI for Casspi and future pick = salary dump?

Lineup:
PG - Evans/Udrih
SG - AI/Cisco
SF - Granger/Greene
PF - Cousins/JT
C - Dalembert/Whiteside


Probably dreaming, but Riley just pulled a donkey from a hat last season.

 

[The Basketball Kings]

Lineup:
PG - Evans/Udrih
SG - AI/Cisco
SF - Granger/Greene
PF - Cousins/JT
C - Dalembert/Whiteside


Probably dreaming, but Riley just pulled a donkey from a hat last season.

...Only in our wildest dreams. Man would that rock. Only problem is that Evans/AI can't hit a jumper from 3 to save their life. That would probably cause some issues. We need at least 2 of the 3 starting wing players to be a threat from deep.

 

[Uncia03]

If the CBA next season won't drastically change, how about trading for both AI and Granger. Their combined salary is around 26M and Kings are projected to be around a 26M payroll next season. Plus Dally is our own player, which I believe allow us to re-sign him to certain amounts that can go beyond the cap. Sign Dally to a 10M range and Kings will only get a payroll of 62M. And that is without even trading any salaries on this team. Except that our possible pick, which I would say will be traded in this process.

Probable trade scenarios:
Granger for our pick(if somehow we land top 3) = rebuilding + salary dump for Indiana. I believe they are high on Kanter.

AI for Casspi and future pick = salary dump?

Lineup:
PG - Evans/Udrih
SG - AI/Cisco
SF - Granger/Greene
PF - Cousins/JT
C - Dalembert/Whiteside


Probably dreaming, but Riley just pulled a donkey from a hat last season.

I don't think you'd find anyone here who would object to the line-up you've suggested here. That would be the best starting line-up in the NBA, and I can't think of another that comes close. The amount of offensive, defense, veteran presence, and sheer physicality should just dominate other starting units.

If we got a #1/#2 pick, I could possibly see Indiana maybe making a deal if they could unload Posey's contract on us (7 mil), as well as getting that top pick, and maybe Casspi.

I just can't imagine that Philly wants to get rid of AI so badly that they'd do it for pretty much cap relief.
If they are interested in Thorton, and want an upgrade over Jodie Meeks, then perhaps some sort of sign-and-trade with Thorton to get AI, while giving the 76ers cap relief and a future 1st + 2nds.

Love the idea of somehow getting AI and Granger while re-signing Dalembert, and I'd mortgage as many future draft-picks and trade anyone except Tyreke and Cousins to do it. And because of all those reasons, as much as you could possibly cobble together some "reasonable" scenarios that this could happen, I don't believe there is any possible way that we'd see something so spectacular take place this off-season.

With all that being said:

Replacing Thorton with Granger isn't that much of an upgrade. Granger would allow for AI to slide to the SG spot, which I think he is better suited, and would provide our line-up with better defense, as Granger at the SF spot is better defensively than Thorton at the SG spot.

But Thorton is just as good a shooter as Granger, and he has shown to have a nose to get into the lane and rebound well for his size.

So though I like an AI/Granger combination more than an AI/Thorton combination, I feel very confident that the team could make very deep runs with an AI/Thorton combination at the 2/3 spots.

Also, I mentioned earlier, that if you managed to get AI, then you could start looking for a shooting SF who can play some defense, that in time could take the SF role, moving Thorton to be a Jason Terry type off the bench, and allow AI to play the SG spot.

I think that Capt Factorial mentioned drafting DeAndre Liggins in the 2nd round, and I think that would be a good fit to groom him into that role down the line.

So as much as I like an AI/Granger combination, I don't see it happening, but that's OK, because just getting AI along-side Thorton and Evans should give us what we need to make a splash in the play-offs next year.

 

[DesertFox]

I almost feel stupid for arguing against having 4 young second tier stars, but that's a starting lineup with 4 guys who are used to having the ball a lot.
AI can probably tone down his shots, and Granger can become more of a spot shooter, but still, these are four guys who have had their eyes on being the man.

Yes, it is a long and athletic lineup, but you have to think there will be some youthful conflict there, at least with the Celts their stars were older and chasing a ring.

 

[funkykingston]

Obviously all of this hinges on what Indiana and Philly want back for trading AI and Granger. It seems far fetched that the Kings could land both (even one of the two might be a tall order) but if the ping-pong balls bounce their way the combination of a top 2 pick and intriguing young guy like Casspi and the ability to absorb a ton of salary could possibly get it done.

That starting lineup would be dominant on the defensive end and have oodles of ballhandling, rebounding and scoring potential. The lack of three point shooting would be a concern as Granger/Iguodala is less potent than Thornton/any of Garcia, Casspi or Greene from range and thus a downgrade over what we saw at the end of this year.

But the big thing for me is that Thornton absolutely energized this team. I'd worry that it was too small a sample size but he did the same thing last year in Nola when given the opportunity. AND he'd come at a lower price (albeit for more years) than Granger.

I love the idea of this lineup, but I think practically speaking going after Iguodala by dangling cap relief and Casspi, resigning Thornton and using that lottery pick is probably the more prudent move.

 

[pdxKingsFan]

Wait, now we're talking about trading the #1 or #2 pick if we got it??? Did Derrick Williams undeclare?

 

[funkykingston]

Wait, now we're talking about trading the #1 or #2 pick if we got it??? Did Derrick Williams undeclare?

If the target is Granger, I'm not sure how else that would get done without dealing Evans or Cousins. There were rumors that Indiana was thinking of dealing Granger at the deadline but unlike Philly I serously doubt they are looking for a salary dump. They would want back young talent.

I have concerns about Williams (is he a big 3 or a small 4, who can he defend on the NBA level, will he develop a midrange game etc) but he has undeniable talent. But Granger is a known commodity and a borderline star player. I'm not saying whether the Kings should or shouldn't go after him, but I think a top 2 or 3 pick would absolutely be necessary to pry him from Indiana if they did.

For that matter, what if the Kings get the 2nd pick and the team drafting first takes Williams? I'd rather have Granger than Irving

 

[Big Cuz 15]

it would be insane if we got granger this summer for casspi + capspace.

 

[funkykingston]

it would be insane if we got granger this summer for casspi + capspace.

I just don't see it. Indy doesn't seem desperate to get his contract off the books and if they DID trade him they'd move George to the starting SF so no real need for Casspi. Until more whispers come out from Indiana I'm still putting a trade for Granger (especially one where the Kings give up so little) in the realm of pipe dream. Iguodala on the other hand? That could be doable.

 

[Big Cuz 15]

I just don't see it. Indy doesn't seem desperate to get his contract off the books and if they DID trade him they'd move George to the starting SF so no real need for Casspi. Until more whispers come out from Indiana I'm still putting a trade for Granger (especially one where the Kings give up so little) in the realm of pipe dream. Iguodala on the other hand? That could be doable.

lol, i'm not saying its doable but if we can that would be awesome.

 

[hiero]

I don't get this obsession with trying to turn donte into a 3pt chucker. he's horrible at shooting and decision making. 3 pt shooting isn't what wins playoffs. you just need one good clutch shooter and we have that in Marcus Thornton and we have guys that can score in the paint off posts and drives.

playing amazing defense and getting to the line and scoring easy buckets is how you win in the playoffs. plus we can grab a good shooter for the bench in the 2nd round or work a trade that keeps casspi as a 3pt shooter off the bench. the mavericks haven't won it all with the best 3pt shooter in the game and a bench full of 3pt shooters because they never had defense. that's why they lost in the finals. plus this was a weird series and winning a big series off a ton of 3pt shooting is definitely the exception and not the rule. mavs won the series cuz they had defensive stoppers in Marion and Chandler and maybe Haywood.

I would much rather add one of the best defensive players in the game than 3pt shooting and anyone who wouldn't doesn't know basketball. especially for us to make the playoffs we need to take that next step defensively and get a guy who can really shut down the best wings in the league, something the Kings have never had and donte is constantly disappointing, frankly I'm done trying to care about donte or expect him to ever be anything but a dumb immature brat who doesn't get it. and he can't shoot 3's for crap so stop trying to force him into being our 3pt shooter and just move on.


whoever said 2/3 of your pg/sg/sf have to be 3pt shooters is flat out wrong, 3pt shooters don't win championships... efficient scoring and defensive shutdown players do.



if we had 1 or 2 I'd rather have Derrick Williams than iggy or granger. if were picking anything below that 3-8 I'd rather trade the pick for iggy. I like granger a lot too but he'd be a lot harder to get and probably wouldn't be worth it, especially for Derrick Williams, who would be a perfect fit.

 

[Kingster]

Consider that, if Petrie were to acquire Igoudala, he would probably gather additional talent that would compliment the acquisition. For example, please note the additions of "The Jimmer" and Josh McRoberts that I suggested above. I also believe that starting Thompson and bringing Dalembert off the bench might help some. Wouldn't this suffice?

Fair point. But someone's got to come out of the lineup when, say, a Jimmer goes in. I always think about the players that will typically play the last 8 minutes of the game. Who would those players be? Presumably, Iggy, Dally, Tyreke, Cousins and Thornton. That just wouldn't work in my opinion. Not a chance because of poor outside shooting of the first three. But just using Jimmer as an example, would he be replacing any of those players during the last 8 minutes? Highly unlikely. Continuing with this line of thought, maybe you take out one of Iggy, Dally, or Tyreke in the last 8 minutes. Let's say you take out Tyreke. Nope. That's just not politically feasible to take out the ROY out of the last 8 minutes of games. Then take out Iggy. Nope. We just spent millions on the guy. How can you justify that if you just signed the guy? Presumably, we've signed him to a lot of money; would we not play him the last 8 minutes? Same thing goes for Dally. This is where the amount you sign him for is key. If you sign him for $10 million plus, then he better be in there during the last 8 minutes; otherwise you overpaid in my view. Now if you sign him for less, then great, he's a very nice role player that can help you out depending on matchups, but still he can't be in there with Iggy and Tyreke.

 

[sidney]

Fair point. But someone's got to come out of the lineup when, say, a Jimmer goes in. I always think about the players that will typically play the last 8 minutes of the game. Who would those players be? Presumably, Iggy, Dally, Tyreke, Cousins and Thornton. That just wouldn't work in my opinion. Not a chance because of poor outside shooting of the first three. But just using Jimmer as an example, would he be replacing any of those players during the last 8 minutes? Highly unlikely. Continuing with this line of thought, maybe you take out one of Iggy, Dally, or Tyreke in the last 8 minutes. Let's say you take out Tyreke. Nope. That's just not politically feasible to take out the ROY out of the last 8 minutes of games. Then take out Iggy. Nope. We just spent millions on the guy. How can you justify that if you just signed the guy? Presumably, we've signed him to a lot of money; would we not play him the last 8 minutes? Same thing goes for Dally. This is where the amount you sign him for is key. If you sign him for $10 million plus, then he better be in there during the last 8 minutes; otherwise you overpaid in my view. Now if you sign him for less, then great, he's a very nice role player that can help you out depending on matchups, but still he can't be in there with Iggy and Tyreke.

Option 1) Get Cousins the ball in the post or let Tyreke drive to the hoop
Option 2) Get the ball the Thornton who can create his outside shot
Option 3) If the opposing team clogs the middle, pull Cousins out to the elbow and capitalize on the fact that all 5 of the starters are decent to elite passers to create ball movement, hit cutters, set screens to get wide open high % shots, etc.

It'd be great if Tyreke improves the jumper. Yes, a second strong outside shooter would do wonders, but we wouldn't be SOL even if he doesn't. Just use other strengths. Almost more important is that AI would be playing great defense on the other team's best wing which would put less pressure on the offense.

 

[rainmaker]

Looks like Philly and GS are in trade talks. Iggy going to GS, Monta going to Philly. Bad news if it happens. He's at the top of my list along with AK. Really like it for GS though.

 

[ParniValjak]

Looks like Philly and GS are in trade talks. Iggy going to GS, Monta going to Philly. Bad news if it happens. He's at the top of my list along with AK. Really like it for GS though.

I tend to like it for both teams.

Philly needs a genuine scorer who can get it done and Ellis is a scoring machine. For GS, they need a defensive wing player who can do a bit of everything and he appears to be a great fit next to Curry.

One of those trades that makes sense for both teams.

 

[KingsCitizen]

This is actually a sound trade if it would push through.

Ellis would not be forced to guard bigger guards if paired with Evan Turner who is actually another good combo guard that should be capable to team with Ellis in the backcourt.

Iggy would give GS a legit SG with size real toughness on defense.

In the end, the Warriors will be the winner of this trade. The only way this works for Philly is if Turner grows into a good fit with Ellis. Otherwise, its a pure gamble for them.

 

[Vlade4GM]

The reason Turner didn't fit was because he couldn't get the ball enough with Iggy and Holiday. I don't think that problem is remedied with Ellis, in fact, it's even worse.

 

[rainmaker]

This is actually a sound trade if it would push through.

Ellis would not be forced to guard bigger guards if paired with Evan Turner who is actually another good combo guard that should be capable to team with Ellis in the backcourt.

Iggy would give GS a legit SG with size real toughness on defense.

In the end, the Warriors will be the winner of this trade. The only way this works for Philly is if Turner grows into a good fit with Ellis. Otherwise, its a pure gamble for them.

It would be a Holiday/Ellis backcourt, with Turner running the 3. They would have problems defensively.

 

[est.1999]

^^^ exactly.

 

[EastCoastKingsFan88]

It's tough for me to keep up with Kings rumors here in NY, but wasn't part of the reason Philly wanted to unload Iggy was to shed salary? Ellis makes $3million less than Iggy over the next few years but still at $11 million per I believe. That's what came to mind when I saw this.

 

[funkykingston]

This would be a really good deal for the Warriors and an odd one for the Sixers. Either they'd push Holiday to the bench, which seems unlikely given he's a guy they are trying to build for the future with or they'd start he and Ellis giving them a tiny backcourt that would get killed defensively and where both guys would want to dominate the ball. And to cap it all off (no pun intended), they save very little money in the deal.

I just don't see why the trade makes sense for them. Then again, this is the team that gave us Dalembert for Nocioni and Hawes so who knows?

 

[bajaden]

This would be a really good deal for the Warriors and an odd one for the Sixers. Either they'd push Holiday to the bench, which seems unlikely given he's a guy they are trying to build for the future with or they'd start he and Ellis giving them a tiny backcourt that would get killed defensively and where both guys would want to dominate the ball. And to cap it all off (no pun intended), they save very little money in the deal.

I just don't see why the trade makes sense for them. Then again, this is the team that gave us Dalembert for Nocioni and Hawes so who knows?

I think Holiday would go to the bench, and Turner and Ellis would start. Turner is more versatile than Ellis, and, unselfish. I still think Turner is going to be a very good player once given a chance. Ellis is very good at playing off the ball, and Turner is a very good distributer of the ball. So it might work. In essence, at least from the offensive side of the ball, Turner can do just about everything Iggy did, so no loss there, and in the process they gain scoring. Now on the defensive side of the ball. Well thats another matter.

 

[kingsboi]

I think both guys could use a change of scenery and it would do them some good. It would benefit Ellis where he won't have to shoot 30 plus times a game to keep his team in it but maybe he's just that type of player? as for Iggy on GS you can clearly see where they want to go with the teams direction and that is become more defensively orientated. They will lose some offense but it could benefit both teams if this trade were to go down.

 

[est.1999]

Am I the only one who thinks holiday will be or already is philly's best player? I can't see how it makes sense to bench him.

 

[bajaden]

Am I the only one who thinks holiday will be or already is philly's best player? I can't see how it makes sense to bench him.

If he is indeed Philly's best player, then Philly is in serious trouble. Thats not a knock on Holiday, who I like, thats a knock on the 76er's. I'm still very high on Turner. He's a player that needs to have the ball in his hands to be most effective, and that wasn't the way they used him. Turner was basicly the PG at Ohio St., Or call him a point forward if you will. If Iggy leaves, it will allow him to play more to his strengths.

 

[est.1999]

I really like holiday's overall game. He's like a mini tyreke with a better jumpshot and a little better at decision making. Tyreke clearly has the advantage with his size and physical gifts and has way more upside. I just really like how Jrue always looks aware of his surroundings and he's always alert.

 

[Arby's Roast Beef]

Iggy is one of the most massively underrated players in the league. Top 5 2-way player in this league. Actually, I'm hearing the Clippers might be in on these talks for Kaman, and that's smart...they sorely need an elite SF, and Iggy can put them over the top if their coach doesn't get in the way.

As for the concerns about Holiday, I slightly share some of them...even though he had that typical PG breakout at the end of his rookie year, the year as a whole was quite meh for him. But he really grew this season, and I think he's a viable starter. He's probably not a star, but you could do worse with your 3rd option. He shows signs of a 2-way game and he has quite a few good tricks to his game, so he has a very sustainable style.

 

[kingsboi]

Laugh out loud at the latest rumor of a Iguodala-Kaman swap. That would be high way robbery for LA, Kaman can't stay healthy and he's always in a suit. Iguodala barely ever gets injured, he's reliable and very durable.

 

[Bricklayer]

They aren't sending Holiday to the bench. They love him there. It would be the tiny backcourt. The thing is Philly desperately needs a #1, the top dog scorer. So this might give that to them. Might. Its really hard to tell what Monta will do out of the duck and chuck. But as much as they need that scorer, its hard to see Ellis being a Doug Collins sort of guy. If they were brining back Larry Brwon to create a new Iverson type team, maybe. But undisciplined players and Collins do not mix.

As an aside, if these rumors have nay legs it would put aside the idea that Philly is just going to give away Iggy for finances. They are looking to take a step up into serious playoff team, want talent back, not just cap room. You don't hire a Collins to captain a rebuild.

 

[Dr. Spaceman]

The fact that they're shopping him around and they're not honing in on a deal with the Warriors is encouraging. Perhaps we can step up. Would Beno, Casspi and next's year's first (plus possibly a second rounder if needed) be able to net Iggy? Phildelphia cuts Iggy's cap hit in half while still gaining good talent in return, as well as a possible lottery pick in a stronger draft. You as the Kings keep the #7 pick and draft Jimmer, who becomes your Beno off the bench -- only with that nice little bonus of actually having a three-point shot.

Do I think next year's pick is likely in the lottery? No, but perhaps Philly looks at how bad our record was this year, they realize that Westphal is still the coach, and maybe they take the gamble. The fact that they willingly traded us Sam Dalembert in exchange for Spencer Hawes as the principal figure in the return (not to mention Noc) tells me it's not...unlikely.