Did Petrie get another steal in thornton?
- Thread starter Demarcus Cousins
- Start date
I'd say yes...yeah, it's probably too early to tell, but Landry was gone at the end of the season and Thornton gave this team a shot in the arm when it really needed it- during the "Here We Stay" game and with Evans out. That alone should make the trade a W for us.
Also, I'd remind everyone that GP turned Peja into Artest, Greene, Casspi, Landry and now Thornton. Seems to be the one trade-line that keeps on paying dividends for this franchise.
Also, I'd remind everyone that GP turned Peja into Artest, Greene, Casspi, Landry and now Thornton. Seems to be the one trade-line that keeps on paying dividends for this franchise.
Defensively, I am interested in seeing him next to Reke. As others have pointed out, in NO he was an undersized SG, and it made it hard for Paul and him to be on the court against bigger 2s. However, Reke can guard any 2 in the league and if Thornton can guard PGs with his speed and strength, they could be a great pairing.
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Marcus Thornton can handle the ball, and set up the offense if need be. Dude has great handles and that will be key in playing with Reke. His being able to get the ball upcourt alongside Reke will be the instrumental in the success of a Reke/Thornton backcourt. Lets see the Lakers try to hid Fisher with a Reke/Thornton backcourt.
If he can play defense it makes a HUGE difference. Anybody paying attenion last year should know he can score -- he basically abveraged 20ppg for the second half of last season. It was the other stuff that was in question. If he can defend as well, that makes him immensely more useful, and whiel its maybe not ideal, it would mean that you could count a Reke/Beno Thornton and maybe some spot minutes from Cisco backcourt as solid enough for the time being without the iffy never know what you are going to get spells that we've had all season long with Head, Jeter, Taylor etc. He's a real life NBA rotation player. Oh, and another thing -- he has a post game and was abusing the Clippers PGs. You know how enormous that could be? That means that when he is teamed with Reke one or the other of them gets to physically abuse the little gnats of the league.
Will say that his offense is stil largely out of the offense -- kind of wild and a lot of quick shots and one on one. Which of course always looks a lot better when they are going in. But he's still new to the offense, and without Reke we kind of need all the punch we can get. An early question will be can he fit into the offense once Reke returns and if Cousins returns to form and starts eating up shots? That's where he might end up being big punch off the bench rather than fighting with those guys for scoring oportunities inthe starting lineup.
Will say that his offense is stil largely out of the offense -- kind of wild and a lot of quick shots and one on one. Which of course always looks a lot better when they are going in. But he's still new to the offense, and without Reke we kind of need all the punch we can get. An early question will be can he fit into the offense once Reke returns and if Cousins returns to form and starts eating up shots? That's where he might end up being big punch off the bench rather than fighting with those guys for scoring oportunities inthe starting lineup.
IMO Thornton is best as a 6th man. Let him take over the offense when our team needs it most. We have enough offense starting moving forward w/ Reke. I don't understand why people think that just because someone comes off the bench, it means they are less valued/worse than a starter. Think of Terry/Crawford/Manu before this season.
If Jermaine Taylor is the kind of guy I think he could be, I would really like to see him starting next to Reke and then having Thornton off the bench.
If Jermaine Taylor is the kind of guy I think he could be, I would really like to see him starting next to Reke and then having Thornton off the bench.
Perhaps I should clarify my comments as I am probably one of the people you are addressing.
I have no problem with Thornton coming off the bench. However, I would be disappointed if it was because he could not play with Reke and Cousins and needed to dominate the ball. Even Bobby Jackson who was more of a scoring guard than a pure point guard, played terrifically with our starting unit and finished a number of games for those teams alongside Bibby, Peja, Webber and Vlade. If we find another great starter and Thornton becomes a great bench player, then that's terrific. However, if he is relegated to the bench because he can't be effective hitting open shots and playing a role within the team, that would be unfortunate for us.
I have no problem with Thornton coming off the bench. However, I would be disappointed if it was because he could not play with Reke and Cousins and needed to dominate the ball. Even Bobby Jackson who was more of a scoring guard than a pure point guard, played terrifically with our starting unit and finished a number of games for those teams alongside Bibby, Peja, Webber and Vlade. If we find another great starter and Thornton becomes a great bench player, then that's terrific. However, if he is relegated to the bench because he can't be effective hitting open shots and playing a role within the team, that would be unfortunate for us.
A player coming off the bench does not mean that they can't play with the starters. A lot of the best 6th men can play very well with the starters (Manu, Terry, etc.), but come in/have come in as 6th men because there is enough offense to start out the games and a bit through the game, the team needs an offensive lift. It's not that he's "relegated" to the bench, he would still get the same amount of minutes, it is simply where the minutes go. Think of it this way: If we were to have Reke, Thornton, and Cuz starting and those were our best offensive players, then there would likely be a point when all 3 are out. That would leave the team without a great offensive player for a pretty good amount of time when all 3 are out. So, yes, Thornton could still play a good amount of minutes with the starters and finish the game (as he did yesterday) while coming off the bench to provide a spark.
Sorry, but I'm not sure if you really read what I wrote. What you just said is what I thought I just clarified with my post. I fully agree with you:
Backup who can play with starters in team concept = Good
Backup because he needs to dominate ball and can't mesh with starters = Bad
Both types of players exist. I hope Thornton is the former both for him and us.
Backup who can play with starters in team concept = Good
Backup because he needs to dominate ball and can't mesh with starters = Bad
Both types of players exist. I hope Thornton is the former both for him and us.
Best case scenario for when/if Tyreke comes back this season is that Thornton and Casspi together stretch the floor enough for Tyreke that he could tip the scale of game balance away from the work-in-progress jumper and further toward the bull doing dance routines in a china shop end of things. Not to say that he needs to stop shooting those, because it needs to improve in game situations, but I'd just like to see less of it. Especially the Tyreke three pointers with 16 seconds on the clock. Hopefully a fixed fascia will alleviate this.
I also agree that pairing him with Reke is, at the very least, a move toward the type of bully ball that we've been hoping for from our backcourt (but have been unable to because of Beno), especially if the shooting as mentioned above can stretch the floor to give either of the guards some room on the low block. I haven't been able to see near enough of Tyreke in the post this season, and for that, I put the blame on Westphal and Co. to go along with our spotty shooting.
While I'd like to see that combo starting on the court, I don't know if we'll see it under Westphal. It's a risky move, because to have both out there, they each have to prove that they can keep the four other guys interested in things while also getting their own. Thornton has shown a bit of an ability to pass these few games (Casspi oop over traffic was sensational), but I'd like to see further, more consistent evidence that he is growing as a playmaker. Because that definitely wasn't his calling card coming in to town.
As for Reke, he's improved as a playmaker this season, but his progress as a point guard has just come to a halt, in my opinion. It's as if the coaching staff just gave up on such a ridiculous notion (that Tyreke can learn to become a PG) and just kept with the 20-5-5 campaign this season. He needs more accountability for the performance of the whole team, I think. And this means more than just dump off passes in the post when his driving lane is cut off or a kickout for an open jumper. Even the simple integration of a more consistent pick & roll game with DMC would be progress in the right direction. The goal at the end of the day is simply a more diverse offense than we currently run.
Just like it's up to Rondo, Rose, and Paul to get their guys going, in position, and to stay involved, Reke needs to be openly expected to run the entire team and not just execute his own game. That's not the feeling I get currently. Hopefully we can get Tyreke back and make progress on this front the rest of the year.
Also, sorry to everyone for the wall
I also agree that pairing him with Reke is, at the very least, a move toward the type of bully ball that we've been hoping for from our backcourt (but have been unable to because of Beno), especially if the shooting as mentioned above can stretch the floor to give either of the guards some room on the low block. I haven't been able to see near enough of Tyreke in the post this season, and for that, I put the blame on Westphal and Co. to go along with our spotty shooting.
While I'd like to see that combo starting on the court, I don't know if we'll see it under Westphal. It's a risky move, because to have both out there, they each have to prove that they can keep the four other guys interested in things while also getting their own. Thornton has shown a bit of an ability to pass these few games (Casspi oop over traffic was sensational), but I'd like to see further, more consistent evidence that he is growing as a playmaker. Because that definitely wasn't his calling card coming in to town.
As for Reke, he's improved as a playmaker this season, but his progress as a point guard has just come to a halt, in my opinion. It's as if the coaching staff just gave up on such a ridiculous notion (that Tyreke can learn to become a PG) and just kept with the 20-5-5 campaign this season. He needs more accountability for the performance of the whole team, I think. And this means more than just dump off passes in the post when his driving lane is cut off or a kickout for an open jumper. Even the simple integration of a more consistent pick & roll game with DMC would be progress in the right direction. The goal at the end of the day is simply a more diverse offense than we currently run.
Just like it's up to Rondo, Rose, and Paul to get their guys going, in position, and to stay involved, Reke needs to be openly expected to run the entire team and not just execute his own game. That's not the feeling I get currently. Hopefully we can get Tyreke back and make progress on this front the rest of the year.
Also, sorry to everyone for the wall
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Way too early to tell; i like his aggression though and the fact he can find a shot off the dribble we really don't have enough guys that can do that, so to be honest him and taylor have been a breath of fresh air; especially to watch.
Without Reke we are gonna need him to go off for 20+ every night quite honestly and i don't see him doing that.
Without Reke we are gonna need him to go off for 20+ every night quite honestly and i don't see him doing that.
Jermaine Taylor is starting to make a believer out of me! Thorton has really showed a knack for scoring and his defense was outstanding last night. I can see a Reke - Thorton back court because both can handle the ball, create their own shots, and can pass the ball. That would be a terrific backcourt. Havent seen where we miss Landry yet. He didn't exactly quit on the team, but he certainly wasn't going 1000% either. It was best to part ways with Landry. And now we have the scoring punch we need off the bench. The guard we needed to play defense and drain open shots. I think Petrie did a great job getting Taylor and Thorton.
You don't build a team around little scorers like Jason Terry, JR Smith, and Crawford but damn it sure is fun to watch a King catch fire and take over the game for once. That threat can only help clear out the middle for Tyreke and Cousins to do their thing. I like the added dimension.
Bottom line is that Thorton can be a major impact guy in his role and those are the guys you want. Considering Landry was not mixing well and ready to leave and assuming the price is not too high to retain him - Yes, I think Petrie got a steal.
Bottom line is that Thorton can be a major impact guy in his role and those are the guys you want. Considering Landry was not mixing well and ready to leave and assuming the price is not too high to retain him - Yes, I think Petrie got a steal.
I don't think you can have too much talent. So I don't see a problem with trying to keep both Taylor and Thornton. Lost in the applause of last nights game was the fact that Taylor also had a very nice game. He picked his spots and took what was there. He brings athleticism to a team that desperately needs it. For at least one night, Thornton brought just what the doctor ordered in the fourth quarter. A quarter where the Kings have struggled to score points when they needed them. Not so last night. He wanted the ball, and he did good things with it when he had it.
The team has needed another option on the floor at crunch time, and Thornton fits the bill, because he can score in so many different ways. The more weapons you have, the harder you are to defend. And, as I originally said, he played pretty good defense in college. Last night, for at least one night, he proved me right.
There will be nights in the future, where Tyreke can move to the SF position. Such as when players like Paul Peirce are on the floor. That would allow you to have Thornton and maybe even Taylor on the floor at the same time with Tyreke. Like I said, you can't have too much talent. If Westphal can't figure out how to use it properly, then get someone that can.
The team has needed another option on the floor at crunch time, and Thornton fits the bill, because he can score in so many different ways. The more weapons you have, the harder you are to defend. And, as I originally said, he played pretty good defense in college. Last night, for at least one night, he proved me right.
There will be nights in the future, where Tyreke can move to the SF position. Such as when players like Paul Peirce are on the floor. That would allow you to have Thornton and maybe even Taylor on the floor at the same time with Tyreke. Like I said, you can't have too much talent. If Westphal can't figure out how to use it properly, then get someone that can.
