Updated Lineup
- Thread starter jtt
- Start date
Yeah I'll actually be mad if Grant's starting lineup comes true. Stack up promising youth all over the roster and then basically start Tyreke and the 4 oldest options you have at every other positon, including a trio at SG, SF, PF that can't defend or rebound their positons. Of course Grant is the idiot who's been whooping about how good our Kings players have been for years now, so guess its no surprise that he would want to keep as many of the soft undersized for their position vets as possible out there in the starting lineup. That, as we have learned from Grant and his pint sized partner, always works.
Actually starting him can help with his stamina. The more he sits on the bench the fatter he'll get. Plus, Evans did great starting last year so why the heck can't we start Cousins? We have nothing to lose. When you draft a guy at #5 and you just came off a horrible year, you better start you pick or the GM really screwed up. I remember how I liked Gerald Wallace for so long but he never got a chance to start so he never really developed in Sacto. Once he went to Bobcats he got to start and blossomed.
Really? So playing 20 minutes as a starter would help his stamina better than playing 30 minutes off the bench? I didn't know starting the game made that big a difference. 
Some of y'all are getting too hung up on the starting thing. He will play big minutes barring foul problems or injury. Don't worry about minutes. The starting team is usually your best 5 as a team, and often that includes the vets when your team has a lot of young players (to maintain cohesion on the floor or keep certain skills in the starting 5). I think some are forgetting this.
I don't think a number 5 pick not starting at the first game of the season sinks his chances at getting Rookie of the Year or anything.
And there is also a big difference in circumstances between Cousins and Wallace - team strengths, players ahead of them in the rotation, and team goals. Not even close. And again, it isn't starting, it's the PT. Are you saying Manu isn't a good player because he doesn't start? Or that he never gets a chance to hone his skills? Are you REALLY that hung up on the starting position?
Some of y'all are getting too hung up on the starting thing. He will play big minutes barring foul problems or injury. Don't worry about minutes. The starting team is usually your best 5 as a team, and often that includes the vets when your team has a lot of young players (to maintain cohesion on the floor or keep certain skills in the starting 5). I think some are forgetting this.
I don't think a number 5 pick not starting at the first game of the season sinks his chances at getting Rookie of the Year or anything.
And there is also a big difference in circumstances between Cousins and Wallace - team strengths, players ahead of them in the rotation, and team goals. Not even close. And again, it isn't starting, it's the PT. Are you saying Manu isn't a good player because he doesn't start? Or that he never gets a chance to hone his skills? Are you REALLY that hung up on the starting position?
Landry WAS(maybe)our best PF last year...but not now. Either one of JT, Dalembert or DMC would probably eat his little 6'7 body for lunch, and spit the bones out to gnaw on before dinner. Now...dont get me wrong, I like Mandry, but I think he is Kenny Thomas 2.0 in alot of ways(at least early career K9)with a bit more heart though. But if you want to compete in this league now you can't be starting a 6'7 PF. I think the lineup by season's end should be:
Evans
Garcia
Greene
Dalembert
DMC
Evans
Garcia
Greene
Dalembert
DMC
Really? So playing 20 minutes as a starter would help his stamina better than playing 30 minutes off the bench? I didn't know starting the game made that big a difference.
Some of y'all are getting too hung up on the starting thing. He will play big minutes barring foul problems or injury. Don't worry about minutes. The starting team is usually your best 5 as a team, and often that includes the vets when your team has a lot of young players (to maintain cohesion on the floor or keep certain skills in the starting 5). I think some are forgetting this.
I don't think a number 5 pick not starting at the first game of the season sinks his chances at getting Rookie of the Year or anything.
And there is also a big difference in circumstances between Cousins and Wallace - team strengths, players ahead of them in the rotation, and team goals. Not even close. And again, it isn't starting, it's the PT. Are you saying Manu isn't a good player because he doesn't start? Or that he never gets a chance to hone his skills? Are you REALLY that hung up on the starting position?
Some of y'all are getting too hung up on the starting thing. He will play big minutes barring foul problems or injury. Don't worry about minutes. The starting team is usually your best 5 as a team, and often that includes the vets when your team has a lot of young players (to maintain cohesion on the floor or keep certain skills in the starting 5). I think some are forgetting this.
I don't think a number 5 pick not starting at the first game of the season sinks his chances at getting Rookie of the Year or anything.
And there is also a big difference in circumstances between Cousins and Wallace - team strengths, players ahead of them in the rotation, and team goals. Not even close. And again, it isn't starting, it's the PT. Are you saying Manu isn't a good player because he doesn't start? Or that he never gets a chance to hone his skills? Are you REALLY that hung up on the starting position?
Minor point of clarification...We don't have the same old vets. Most of the veterans people had been whining about the past couple of years have moved on.
Having said that, I'm in no hurry to see a starting lineup of the most tenured players on the team. I'd like to see it mixed up and I'm almost willing to bet that's exactly what Coach Westphal will be doing. He's got a lot of toys in the box to work with.
As far as Cousins starting, I don't think he will for the simple reason I think, as mentioned above, he has to work on his conditioning and stamina. And I think we can afford to let him get his toe in the water first, since we're not in desperate and immediate need for him to start right out of the gate.
I've got a lot of faith in our coaching staff and I think they'll be doing a lot of work to keep the players getting adequate minutes wihile keeping fresh legs available. I've seen that before and it can win us at least a handful of games if done properly...
By midseason, I suspect we'll start to see shorter rotations and more consistency in the starting lineups, and that's just fine by me.
Having said that, I'm in no hurry to see a starting lineup of the most tenured players on the team. I'd like to see it mixed up and I'm almost willing to bet that's exactly what Coach Westphal will be doing. He's got a lot of toys in the box to work with.
As far as Cousins starting, I don't think he will for the simple reason I think, as mentioned above, he has to work on his conditioning and stamina. And I think we can afford to let him get his toe in the water first, since we're not in desperate and immediate need for him to start right out of the gate.
I've got a lot of faith in our coaching staff and I think they'll be doing a lot of work to keep the players getting adequate minutes wihile keeping fresh legs available. I've seen that before and it can win us at least a handful of games if done properly...
By midseason, I suspect we'll start to see shorter rotations and more consistency in the starting lineups, and that's just fine by me.
I was reading all the posts with interest but must say that it doesnt really matter who will start..the strongest performance of our young guys will define the starting 5 during the first 15ยด-20games.
Currently beside of Reke all positions are open.
I am actually quite happy we are all having these discussions since it means in reality that we have beside of our "starters" a good and very solid bench that will be able to jump in when needed.
I really see the whole situatuin very relaxed and just hope that all of our guys will be healthy for the season opener.
!GO KINGS!
Currently beside of Reke all positions are open.
I am actually quite happy we are all having these discussions since it means in reality that we have beside of our "starters" a good and very solid bench that will be able to jump in when needed.
I really see the whole situatuin very relaxed and just hope that all of our guys will be healthy for the season opener.
!GO KINGS!
How many times have we heard... it matters less who starts, than who finishes. Obviously, our one legit star and most likely a host of seasoned vets (Landry, Beno, Dalembert, Garcia) will start or at least be on the floor at crunch time. Depending on matchups from time-to-time the likes of DMC, Casspi, Donte, JT will have their moments starting or finishing games. Let's GO KINGS!! I'm ready for a great (or at least exciting!) 2010-11 season.
1.Landry is not 6'7. He is an honest 6'9, still a bit undersized for a PF, but not Barkley status.
2. I would love to see Dalembert (or JT right now) eat Landry for lunch. Dalembert's shotblocking and pretty good rebounding are nice, but Landry is definitely the better player. He is an extremely smart player (Dally has been known to do some bonehead things), can score inside and out, plays with the hustle, toughness, and intensity that we are looking for, and can at least hold his own on man defense. That's just comparing the two players, but when you try and move Dalembert out of position to PF, there is just no reason why he is the better choice over Landry.
2. I would love to see Dalembert (or JT right now) eat Landry for lunch. Dalembert's shotblocking and pretty good rebounding are nice, but Landry is definitely the better player. He is an extremely smart player (Dally has been known to do some bonehead things), can score inside and out, plays with the hustle, toughness, and intensity that we are looking for, and can at least hold his own on man defense. That's just comparing the two players, but when you try and move Dalembert out of position to PF, there is just no reason why he is the better choice over Landry.
Im pretty surprised that anyone would be down on Landry. I think hes awesome. I also think that we have a loaded front court and that what Landry brings to the table is best served off of the bench. If our bench is Dalembert, Landry, Casspi, Wright, Beno...we might have the best bench in the league.
I agree with you that Landry is a very good and smart player. But even Dally at the PF position (next to Cousins) provides some huge benefits over Landry. The rebounding rate is about double. The shot blocking doesn't even compare. We've probably had this discussion before, but having a serious shot blocker has a huge impact on the game. Just bends the whole game. Landry is not a bad defender, but he's not a shot blocker. Dally is an elite one. I know it's unorthodox, but I remain very intrigued about a Cousins/Dally front line. I think he can guard PFs, especially within the team that would be around him.
Again, the main advantage of a Cous/Dally frontline is just monster interior D. Plain and simple. You just won't get pushed around, and you have a couple of big swatters back there, one of them being elite.
Again, the main advantage of a Cous/Dally frontline is just monster interior D. Plain and simple. You just won't get pushed around, and you have a couple of big swatters back there, one of them being elite.
Ok, I understand what you are trying to say, but the rebounding rate is not doubled nor would Dally's shotblocking be used to its fullest. Dally would not get the same amount of rebounds he averages as he would usually play with a PF with much lesser rebounding ability than Cousins and the difference in rebounding numbers between just Landry and Dalembert would not be that great with both being at PF. Now onto his shotblocking: Dalembert is a basket protector and so he needs to stay basically right underneath the basket and block shots. Dally does not have the agility or quickness of other great shotblocking PFs. Against power forwards, he will have to move out to AT LEAST the elbow and actually often in the modern NBA, all the way out to the 3 point line. This isn't even mentioning that his 1 on 1 D against PFs would be much worse than Landry's.
Last edited:
Best 5
Looks like maybe this thread evolved to which group of 5 Kings would make the best team.
It comes down to what you believe is most important to success.
Some believe that Veteran presence is key. Not to beat a dead horse but the most experienced guys we have haven't shown ability to win so I discount value of veteran experience for our team altogether. Time for change.
Some believe scoring is most important so Landry should start. Again we did fine scoring last year but people always outscore us so we always lose.
Some believe size is very important and I would agree there is some truth to that. The Lakers starting lineup is the biggest in the league. Ron Artest at 260 lbs at SF, Pau at 7' and 250 lbs is as long as you can get for PF. Bynum at 7' and 285 lbs is a load. They dominate the boards and shotblocking and win big for a reason.
I think that scoring is what a lot of teams in the NBA can do but few are really solid on defense.
With Dally and Cousins we have that balance of defense and scoring with Lakers size.
At 6'11" and 250 lbs Dally is really PF size rather than Center and Cousins is definitely Center size. I don't see why Dally and Cousins wouldn't make the best combo of size, defense and scoring for us.
So best 5 are:
Evans, Garcia/Beno, Donte, Dally, Cousins.
I believe that Beno is more consistent than Garcia on offense but Garcia is better on defense so it's a draw in my book. I just believe that defense is really important and that you got to have the right size to avoid mismatches on defense.
Besides Garcia, we have a great deal with salaries for our talent. I just want the Kings to show that they can still kick butt without high salaried guys so they can get a superstar veteran to jump on bandwagon next year to lead us to some championships.
Looks like maybe this thread evolved to which group of 5 Kings would make the best team.
It comes down to what you believe is most important to success.
Some believe that Veteran presence is key. Not to beat a dead horse but the most experienced guys we have haven't shown ability to win so I discount value of veteran experience for our team altogether. Time for change.
Some believe scoring is most important so Landry should start. Again we did fine scoring last year but people always outscore us so we always lose.
Some believe size is very important and I would agree there is some truth to that. The Lakers starting lineup is the biggest in the league. Ron Artest at 260 lbs at SF, Pau at 7' and 250 lbs is as long as you can get for PF. Bynum at 7' and 285 lbs is a load. They dominate the boards and shotblocking and win big for a reason.
I think that scoring is what a lot of teams in the NBA can do but few are really solid on defense.
With Dally and Cousins we have that balance of defense and scoring with Lakers size.
At 6'11" and 250 lbs Dally is really PF size rather than Center and Cousins is definitely Center size. I don't see why Dally and Cousins wouldn't make the best combo of size, defense and scoring for us.
So best 5 are:
Evans, Garcia/Beno, Donte, Dally, Cousins.
I believe that Beno is more consistent than Garcia on offense but Garcia is better on defense so it's a draw in my book. I just believe that defense is really important and that you got to have the right size to avoid mismatches on defense.
Besides Garcia, we have a great deal with salaries for our talent. I just want the Kings to show that they can still kick butt without high salaried guys so they can get a superstar veteran to jump on bandwagon next year to lead us to some championships.
You make some good points, but I'm not sure I buy that he would be worse at 1 on 1 D against PFs, or at least against most PFs. David West for example might give him a bit of trouble. I do think he could handle Pau ok though. And, I hadn't said this explicitly before, but, we could play a modified form of D that allows Dally to sag when his man goes out that far. Few PFs are a real threat from three pt range. And obviously we wouldn't play that lineup against them (Dirk, or Odom at times, for example). I do think he could do ok agianst Duncan/Amare. It would be interesting to get some Philly fans input on this. I'm sure they must have put him on some PFs last year.
Mind you I'm not necessarily advocating this, rather at this point, I am intrigued by the idea. To me what is intriguing is that you completely shut down the area within 15 feet of the basket. Hey, I'm just glad I can even fantasize about this kind of thing. And you know what, this may be a symptom of being big man deficient for so long. Now that we've got all these new toys, you want to see how they all fit together.
Mind you I'm not necessarily advocating this, rather at this point, I am intrigued by the idea. To me what is intriguing is that you completely shut down the area within 15 feet of the basket. Hey, I'm just glad I can even fantasize about this kind of thing. And you know what, this may be a symptom of being big man deficient for so long. Now that we've got all these new toys, you want to see how they all fit together.
Ok look we are agreeing about the Dally/Cuz thing for the most part. But this last sentence? Are you serious? A superstar vet to lead us to the promised land? Do you want to re-state that? Tyreke will be the alpha dog on this team for as long as he is here. Period. Perhaps some time has passed and we have forgotten just how good this kid is. I know, it's hard to take in. It's hard to believe how good he was last year. But get this, he's going to be even better next year. He will be the one leading us to championships. He will be the guy taking the last shot for a while.