Who do we get at the 5th and 6th picks?
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Who do we get at the 5th and 6th picks? 
I just thought there is so much talk about the top 4 what about 5 and 6.
I just thought there is so much talk about the top 4 what about 5 and 6.
I haven't seen Vesely play (he's Czech), but from just reading about him he has the adjectives that Kings management would like - plays hard, outside shooter, slasher, plays D, has potential inside with 6'11" frame. Sounds like a gamer, kind of like a longer Casspi. At the least, he's intriguing on paper.
I forgot about Udoh. He could have star potential. Would instantly improve Kings defense.
Aldrich - no chance to be a star; solid
Monroe - soft
Johnson - hasn't shown he can be a guy that can create his own shot
Patterson - solid competitor, but probably not star material
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I'm doing this assuming Top 4 go in no particular order: Wall, Turner, Cousins, Favors.
Scenario #1 is Wes Johnson cracks the top 4 depending on where ping pong balls drop which would leave one of the forementioned players available for us possibly.
For the rest of the players I'd like to see their combines and personal workouts..
Wes Johnson, Monroe, Ed Davis, Aldrich, Hassan Whiteside(probably a stretch at 5 or 6) should all up for consideration. We might even have the ability to trade down in scenarios to grab one of these players...
Personally if we're out of the top 4, I'm looking at Whiteside or Aldrich. Get a defensive big.
Scenario #1 is Wes Johnson cracks the top 4 depending on where ping pong balls drop which would leave one of the forementioned players available for us possibly.
For the rest of the players I'd like to see their combines and personal workouts..
Wes Johnson, Monroe, Ed Davis, Aldrich, Hassan Whiteside(probably a stretch at 5 or 6) should all up for consideration. We might even have the ability to trade down in scenarios to grab one of these players...
Personally if we're out of the top 4, I'm looking at Whiteside or Aldrich. Get a defensive big.
the sixth pick is the only one you don't want. Johnson is a level above that group he mentioned above. This is a five player draft not a four player draft. Johnson might not even slip to five depending on who drafts before us.
The sixth pick is where the dropoff occurs. I personally would take Udoh with the sixth pick as of now ( I have zero faith that Aldrich transitions into a legit NBA big) I'd also be interested to learn more about Whiteside with that spot as well.
other names that might get mentioned in the sixth spot:
Monroe
Xavier Henry
Aminu
it's kind of a crapshoot after the top five. Fortunately GP generally drafts well so I'm sure he'll do his due diligence if we get pick #6. If we get pick #5 you take whoever is left of favors/johnson/cousins and enjoy your good fortune.
The sixth pick is where the dropoff occurs. I personally would take Udoh with the sixth pick as of now ( I have zero faith that Aldrich transitions into a legit NBA big) I'd also be interested to learn more about Whiteside with that spot as well.
other names that might get mentioned in the sixth spot:
Monroe
Xavier Henry
Aminu
it's kind of a crapshoot after the top five. Fortunately GP generally drafts well so I'm sure he'll do his due diligence if we get pick #6. If we get pick #5 you take whoever is left of favors/johnson/cousins and enjoy your good fortune.
Wes Johnson will probably be the best player available.
I really like him as a player, but I don't think he fits well with our team. If he was a better ball-handler and passer you could think about having him at the SG spot. But those are his areas of weakness which makes him pretty much solely a SF. And with both Donte and Omri as young guys at the 3, I just don't think it would be the best move.
And to point out something...
It's possible that Wes Johnson ends up being picked in the top 4. For instance, if New Jersey ends up having to pick 4th and Cousins is on the board, it's very possible they would pass on Cousins to pick Wes Johnson, since they already have Lopez.
Cole Aldrich will be the best Center available.
He's a pretty vanilla player who isn't all that exciting. But he can play very good man defense, decent weak-side defense, and is an excellent rebounder. So he could end up being a Pryzbilla 2.0, and if he can be that, then he'd be a fantastic fit for our team.
Ekpe Udoh will be the best power forward available.
He's a very good shot-blocker and defender. He played in a zone, so his rebounding numbers don't look great, though he should be a decent rebounder. (He won't be as good as Aldrich)
Offensively he's a good passer, can hit the mid-range jumper, and has very good handles for a big man which allows him to face-up and attack the basket.
He's a good athlete with good skills so is probably the most well-rounded big man available.
If we picked 5th or 6th I'd imagine that we'd pick one of these players. I personally can't choose between them. I think Wes is the best player. I think Aldrich is the best potential fit (solid defensive big-man). I personally like Udoh the best of the three for our team as I really like his game and how he might fit in this team.
I do hope that it doesn't come to that though, as we really need a top 4 pick.
I really like him as a player, but I don't think he fits well with our team. If he was a better ball-handler and passer you could think about having him at the SG spot. But those are his areas of weakness which makes him pretty much solely a SF. And with both Donte and Omri as young guys at the 3, I just don't think it would be the best move.
And to point out something...
It's possible that Wes Johnson ends up being picked in the top 4. For instance, if New Jersey ends up having to pick 4th and Cousins is on the board, it's very possible they would pass on Cousins to pick Wes Johnson, since they already have Lopez.
Cole Aldrich will be the best Center available.
He's a pretty vanilla player who isn't all that exciting. But he can play very good man defense, decent weak-side defense, and is an excellent rebounder. So he could end up being a Pryzbilla 2.0, and if he can be that, then he'd be a fantastic fit for our team.
Ekpe Udoh will be the best power forward available.
He's a very good shot-blocker and defender. He played in a zone, so his rebounding numbers don't look great, though he should be a decent rebounder. (He won't be as good as Aldrich)
Offensively he's a good passer, can hit the mid-range jumper, and has very good handles for a big man which allows him to face-up and attack the basket.
He's a good athlete with good skills so is probably the most well-rounded big man available.
If we picked 5th or 6th I'd imagine that we'd pick one of these players. I personally can't choose between them. I think Wes is the best player. I think Aldrich is the best potential fit (solid defensive big-man). I personally like Udoh the best of the three for our team as I really like his game and how he might fit in this team.
I do hope that it doesn't come to that though, as we really need a top 4 pick.
I agree with you guys this is a 5 player draft and Wes Johnson is one of them. My concern is while I see great potential in Johnson I also see a similar player that we already have that might be better in Donte Greene (especially with his growth).
My question is, say we get #5, Wes Johnson is still on the board.
Do we take Johnson and deal with the wing city or possibly trade Casspi/Greene
or trade #5 for a lower spot in the draft to pick another big that is either most NBA ready (Patterson or Udoh) or a defensive prospect (Whiteside)
My question is, say we get #5, Wes Johnson is still on the board.
Do we take Johnson and deal with the wing city or possibly trade Casspi/Greene
or trade #5 for a lower spot in the draft to pick another big that is either most NBA ready (Patterson or Udoh) or a defensive prospect (Whiteside)
If Donte can increase his game next year to the same extent that he did this year, then I think we have our starting SF. Wes Johnson should be a good defender, but it's just so hard to tell due to the zone that Syracuse plays. We know that Donte is a fantastic defender, so if he can just limit his mistakes and get more consistent with his shot I think we are set.
So for that reason I don't see Wes Johnson on our team next year. It's possible that if he's the player available at 5, that we do select him and try to work a trade.
Patterson is not big enough to be a full-time four. He'll be a 3/4 and so I don't think that we'd pick him up. As far as Whiteside goes, I think a lot of it will come down to the work-outs, and how much time the Front-Office wants to put into a project player. He of course probably has the most upside of any player when it comes to being an interior defender.
I think that Aldrich and Udoh are the two best players who fit some sort of need and can come right away and help the team.
It will really probably come down to the work-outs and what Petrie sees in these players. So if he ends up selecting and keeping Whiteside or Johnson then I'll defer to his expertise, though if I had to guess I would expect to see either Aldrich or Udoh in a Kings uniform at the start of next season.
So for that reason I don't see Wes Johnson on our team next year. It's possible that if he's the player available at 5, that we do select him and try to work a trade.
Patterson is not big enough to be a full-time four. He'll be a 3/4 and so I don't think that we'd pick him up. As far as Whiteside goes, I think a lot of it will come down to the work-outs, and how much time the Front-Office wants to put into a project player. He of course probably has the most upside of any player when it comes to being an interior defender.
I think that Aldrich and Udoh are the two best players who fit some sort of need and can come right away and help the team.
It will really probably come down to the work-outs and what Petrie sees in these players. So if he ends up selecting and keeping Whiteside or Johnson then I'll defer to his expertise, though if I had to guess I would expect to see either Aldrich or Udoh in a Kings uniform at the start of next season.
Wesley Johnson's overrated. He's an average scorer in the NBA, at best, and in particular I'm really skeptical about his methods of scoring--he's not that good at getting to the line for an "athlete", and he takes more threes than expected for someone who doesn't shoot that well in it. Average passer. I think his real calling card in the NBA is his defense, but I'm not even sure that's a guarantee--he rebounds well for his size, and while he was a deflection master and good weakside shotblocker this year he wasn't either in years past. Overall his skill level to me doesn't put him in lottery contention--I know it's hard to confuse late bloomer with possible "fluke" season, but in cases like this for college I usually opt for the latter. Of course, Brandon Roy being the exception, but the guy had latent dimensions all around in his first three years of college. Anyway, Johnson to me is a talent in the 20s range, at best. Mind you, I don't think he's an absolute bust, but that expectations need to be set accordingly--he's a role player, much like DeMar Derozan ended up being.
We've gotten into Aldrich already. Suffice to say I'm not terribly high on him (mostly because of his potential, or lack thereof) and many draftniks share the same reasoning.
Udoh's another overrated player to me. He's a player who won't make it to the league because of his offense (I think he'll be somewhere between poor and average here in the NBA). He doesn't touch the ball often, but moreover he's not efficient on offense, just being very raw (he doesn't even get to the line that well for an athlete). I'm not even highly convinced about his rebounding ability--it could be average in the league, and in particular, I think he's much more of an offensive rebounder than defensive. So because of that perceived fatal flaw, I'm not sure he can really become that defensive patroller in the league. But let's get into the pros--the reason why some are infatuated with him is largely because of his shotblocking ability. He has a slight wrinkle of passing ability to add to that, but that won't help his stock that much. The problem is, there's many poor defensive rebounders, bad offensive players and all-out shotblockers hanging in the fringes, and Udoh?--what makes that different? I sense another raw guy who might become a bust in the league. I think he's more of a late 20s talent, again--because I think it's more "fluke" season than late bloomer, as with Wesley Johnson.
Al-Farouq Aminu will be an average SF scorer in the NBA, but I believe he's more an inside playing type SF than an outside playing one. He's still finding his bearings here, but he gets to the line fairly well, but isn't a terribly effective foul shooter, and he won't be much of a three point shooter, if at all, at the next level. He's also a bit of a black hole offensively. What will immediately translate to the NBA is his superb rebounding ability--he's excellent at clearing the defensive glass, and also contributes on the offensive boards as well. He's a pretty good disruptor, in particular a good weakside shotblocker, so defensively may be where he truly makes his mark, although offensively he has okay, but not great, skills. He's definitely a role player but with nice defensive potential. Talentwise he'd fall as a mid-1st round pick to me, because his offense is such a mixed bag, but defensively he's got the goods.
We've gotten into Aldrich already. Suffice to say I'm not terribly high on him (mostly because of his potential, or lack thereof) and many draftniks share the same reasoning.
Udoh's another overrated player to me. He's a player who won't make it to the league because of his offense (I think he'll be somewhere between poor and average here in the NBA). He doesn't touch the ball often, but moreover he's not efficient on offense, just being very raw (he doesn't even get to the line that well for an athlete). I'm not even highly convinced about his rebounding ability--it could be average in the league, and in particular, I think he's much more of an offensive rebounder than defensive. So because of that perceived fatal flaw, I'm not sure he can really become that defensive patroller in the league. But let's get into the pros--the reason why some are infatuated with him is largely because of his shotblocking ability. He has a slight wrinkle of passing ability to add to that, but that won't help his stock that much. The problem is, there's many poor defensive rebounders, bad offensive players and all-out shotblockers hanging in the fringes, and Udoh?--what makes that different? I sense another raw guy who might become a bust in the league. I think he's more of a late 20s talent, again--because I think it's more "fluke" season than late bloomer, as with Wesley Johnson.
Al-Farouq Aminu will be an average SF scorer in the NBA, but I believe he's more an inside playing type SF than an outside playing one. He's still finding his bearings here, but he gets to the line fairly well, but isn't a terribly effective foul shooter, and he won't be much of a three point shooter, if at all, at the next level. He's also a bit of a black hole offensively. What will immediately translate to the NBA is his superb rebounding ability--he's excellent at clearing the defensive glass, and also contributes on the offensive boards as well. He's a pretty good disruptor, in particular a good weakside shotblocker, so defensively may be where he truly makes his mark, although offensively he has okay, but not great, skills. He's definitely a role player but with nice defensive potential. Talentwise he'd fall as a mid-1st round pick to me, because his offense is such a mixed bag, but defensively he's got the goods.
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I don't agree with a lot here, but my question then is who do you consider prime choices for the 5th and 6th spot?
None of the above are going to be selected top four, (with the exception possibly of Wes Johnson, if things played out with New Jersey selecting 4th) because they do either have holes in their game, limited upside, or bust potential. But I don't see any of them falling out of the top 12 or so.
So since you don't think any of the above are better than mid-to-late 1st rounders, who would you select?
Wes Johnson is a terrific athlete with great length and quickness. He's a fantastic rebounder for his position and is a good shooter when his feet are set. So it's not as if he's just an athlete with no skill attached. I don't think he's ever going to be a star player, but he seems to be the type of player who can be a key cog/3rd man on a playoff team.
Also remember that he had to take a year off when he transferred to Syracuse, so he had a lot of time to individually work on his game. I think the hard work he put in really paid off and you could see it on the court this year.
I think you're greatly underestimating Udoh's offensive skills. I think that right now he's a better offensive player than JT. He's far and away a better shot-blocker. On defense the question will be whether or not he'll be able to hold his defensive position in the post. He's not a stick figure, but like most college big-men he'll need to put on muscle. He's going to be a better interior intimidator then any of the current bigs we have now.
As far as his rebounding goes, that might be his poorest attribute, but it's his defensive rebounding that looks to be the biggest issue, and defensive rebounding numbers don't tell the entire tale when you spend all your time playing in a zone.
As far as Aldrich he definitely has a limited ceiling. But I think that his strong points (man defense and rebounding) will translate quite well to the NBA.
None of the above are going to be selected top four, (with the exception possibly of Wes Johnson, if things played out with New Jersey selecting 4th) because they do either have holes in their game, limited upside, or bust potential. But I don't see any of them falling out of the top 12 or so.
So since you don't think any of the above are better than mid-to-late 1st rounders, who would you select?
Wes Johnson is a terrific athlete with great length and quickness. He's a fantastic rebounder for his position and is a good shooter when his feet are set. So it's not as if he's just an athlete with no skill attached. I don't think he's ever going to be a star player, but he seems to be the type of player who can be a key cog/3rd man on a playoff team.
Also remember that he had to take a year off when he transferred to Syracuse, so he had a lot of time to individually work on his game. I think the hard work he put in really paid off and you could see it on the court this year.
I think you're greatly underestimating Udoh's offensive skills. I think that right now he's a better offensive player than JT. He's far and away a better shot-blocker. On defense the question will be whether or not he'll be able to hold his defensive position in the post. He's not a stick figure, but like most college big-men he'll need to put on muscle. He's going to be a better interior intimidator then any of the current bigs we have now.
As far as his rebounding goes, that might be his poorest attribute, but it's his defensive rebounding that looks to be the biggest issue, and defensive rebounding numbers don't tell the entire tale when you spend all your time playing in a zone.
As far as Aldrich he definitely has a limited ceiling. But I think that his strong points (man defense and rebounding) will translate quite well to the NBA.
Aldrich.
He wont be as exciting as Cousins or Favors, but I think he could be just as good a fit. Honestly dont know why everyone hates on him so much, but I'm pretty sure if we did end up drafting him he'd end up being a fan favorite. No 20ppg potential, but the dude should be a double digit rebounder, shotblocker, and good defensive player at the next level.
He wont be as exciting as Cousins or Favors, but I think he could be just as good a fit. Honestly dont know why everyone hates on him so much, but I'm pretty sure if we did end up drafting him he'd end up being a fan favorite. No 20ppg potential, but the dude should be a double digit rebounder, shotblocker, and good defensive player at the next level.
Uncia--I like Greg Monroe quite a bit. Ed Davis is okay to me.
This draft, between picks 5-15, is simply a crapshoot to me with the exception of maybe the two above. I'm skeptical of quite a few guys. Wesley Johnson I said was a roleplayer--and if that's the case he's not the 5th-6th pick, for sure. Udoh is still very raw on offense, and largely is living off his shotblocking and maybe his offensive rebounding skills. Aldrich is a known commodity, if you're in for the gamble you probably don't want to invest in him. The one I like most of those four as I said above is Aminu, but I don't think we need a player of that mold.
This draft, between picks 5-15, is simply a crapshoot to me with the exception of maybe the two above. I'm skeptical of quite a few guys. Wesley Johnson I said was a roleplayer--and if that's the case he's not the 5th-6th pick, for sure. Udoh is still very raw on offense, and largely is living off his shotblocking and maybe his offensive rebounding skills. Aldrich is a known commodity, if you're in for the gamble you probably don't want to invest in him. The one I like most of those four as I said above is Aminu, but I don't think we need a player of that mold.
I have to agree.. I do think Patterson though will surprise people.. He will be out of the blocks fast next season (if he gets a chance to play).. He's the type of guy that will give you 13-15ppg 9-10rpg and will be consistent.. Not star material though..
Aldrich is intriguing but he's not someone I would want on this team..
Monroe meh.. Soft like you said.
Johnson I have a feeling will bust.
If we end up getting the 5th or 6th pick it's pretty much a crapshoot who we will get. The draft is 4 deep on the upper tier prospects IMO. I would hate to get left out in the cold again. Let's hope if we are #5 that Johnson works out well and someone ahead of us picks him.
Aldrich is intriguing but he's not someone I would want on this team..
Monroe meh.. Soft like you said.
Johnson I have a feeling will bust.
If we end up getting the 5th or 6th pick it's pretty much a crapshoot who we will get. The draft is 4 deep on the upper tier prospects IMO. I would hate to get left out in the cold again. Let's hope if we are #5 that Johnson works out well and someone ahead of us picks him.
I still think there is a decent chance either Favors or Cousins drops to 5. But if neither do, and we're picking 5 or 6, I would go for Aminu over Johnson.
IMO, Aminu is the darkhorse in this draft in terms of star potential. If I had to bet on anyone outside of Wall, Turner, Cousins, Favors, and Johnson, to become an allstar level talent, I'm picking Aminu.
Johnson doesn't fit with our team at all. And other than Johnson, Aminu IMO would be the BPA. If not Aminu, then Aldrich. He has a lower ceiling than Aminu, but would be a pretty safe pick, and would probably become our starting center next year. I just really hope we aren't having this conversation on the 19th.
IMO, Aminu is the darkhorse in this draft in terms of star potential. If I had to bet on anyone outside of Wall, Turner, Cousins, Favors, and Johnson, to become an allstar level talent, I'm picking Aminu.
Johnson doesn't fit with our team at all. And other than Johnson, Aminu IMO would be the BPA. If not Aminu, then Aldrich. He has a lower ceiling than Aminu, but would be a pretty safe pick, and would probably become our starting center next year. I just really hope we aren't having this conversation on the 19th.
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I too like Aminu. He a tweener though. Im sure id like him as a player but not for this team. I feel like hes going to end up having a hard time on the defensive end. Not quick enough to guard 3's and not big enough to guard 4's. Alot of scoring potential however. If im in the 5-6 range im picking Udoh all day every day. I think hes going to be a defensive stud.
I usually agree with most of you opinions, but in this case your way off base, and I mean big time. first of all Johnson shot 50.2% from the floor, which is pretty darn good for a player thats a jump shooter. He also shot 41.5% from three point range. Thats hardly poor. As a matter of fact thats an excellent average from 3 point range. He's not just a pretty good rebounder, he's an outstanding rebounder for his position. You discard it as though it were nothing. As far as his defense, its hard to comment since Syracuse plays a Zone. But he's a good athlete and there's no reason to believe he can't become a good defender.
Your right on one count. He's not good at getting to the basket, or creating his own shot. And he's certainly not the ballhandler that Turner is. But to compare his skill level with that of DeRozen is insulting.
As far as Udoh is concerned, if you think he has no offense then you just haven't watched him play. And I grant you that he made a huge jump in ability from his sophmore year to his junior year. Number one, thats what a player is suspossed to do. Improve!!. He improved and so did Johnson, and your penalizing them because of it. Where the hell is the logic in that?
Udoh changed schools between his sophmore and junior years. As a result he had to sit out a year. So he spent the entire year working on his game. As a result he came back a more complete player. Now to my simplistic mind, he should get credit for that, not criticized for it. It shows dedication and it also shows he can improve. His FGA was just slightly under 50%. Usually Post players averages are over 50%. But they used him away from the basket alot to utilitize his passing ability in the high post. As a result, a lot of his shots came in the way of jumpshots. Logic tells you that jumpshooters usually shoot a lower percentage than post players. His rebounding was affected by the 2/3 zone that Baylor played. But anyone that know anything about basketball, knows that a zone affects your rebounding. Especially the 2/3 zone Baylor played which had Udoh defending out on the right wing when Lomer's was in the game. If your were to keep track, a lot of Udoh's rebounds came when Lomer's was out of the game and Udoh moved to the center position. So when you consider that on defense he played away from the basket and on offense he also played out in the high post quite a bit, averaging almost 10 rebounds a game doesn't seem that bad to me. You also seem to just discard his shotblocking. Considering that he was one of the top shotblockers in college last year, I find that confusing. I'm not saying that he's without flaws, but to think he can't make it in the NBA is ridiculous.
On Aminu were in agreement. And I would call him a closer comparison to DeRozen, just with more experience. Having to play PF didn't help develop his game in my opinion, and I don't think thats his position in the NBA. He's a freak athlete just like DeRozen, and like a lot of great athletes, he's gotten by on his athleticism and hasn't developed the rest of his game as well as he should have. The Kings have no need for him in my opinion.
Your right on one count. He's not good at getting to the basket, or creating his own shot. And he's certainly not the ballhandler that Turner is. But to compare his skill level with that of DeRozen is insulting.
As far as Udoh is concerned, if you think he has no offense then you just haven't watched him play. And I grant you that he made a huge jump in ability from his sophmore year to his junior year. Number one, thats what a player is suspossed to do. Improve!!. He improved and so did Johnson, and your penalizing them because of it. Where the hell is the logic in that?
Udoh changed schools between his sophmore and junior years. As a result he had to sit out a year. So he spent the entire year working on his game. As a result he came back a more complete player. Now to my simplistic mind, he should get credit for that, not criticized for it. It shows dedication and it also shows he can improve. His FGA was just slightly under 50%. Usually Post players averages are over 50%. But they used him away from the basket alot to utilitize his passing ability in the high post. As a result, a lot of his shots came in the way of jumpshots. Logic tells you that jumpshooters usually shoot a lower percentage than post players. His rebounding was affected by the 2/3 zone that Baylor played. But anyone that know anything about basketball, knows that a zone affects your rebounding. Especially the 2/3 zone Baylor played which had Udoh defending out on the right wing when Lomer's was in the game. If your were to keep track, a lot of Udoh's rebounds came when Lomer's was out of the game and Udoh moved to the center position. So when you consider that on defense he played away from the basket and on offense he also played out in the high post quite a bit, averaging almost 10 rebounds a game doesn't seem that bad to me. You also seem to just discard his shotblocking. Considering that he was one of the top shotblockers in college last year, I find that confusing. I'm not saying that he's without flaws, but to think he can't make it in the NBA is ridiculous.
On Aminu were in agreement. And I would call him a closer comparison to DeRozen, just with more experience. Having to play PF didn't help develop his game in my opinion, and I don't think thats his position in the NBA. He's a freak athlete just like DeRozen, and like a lot of great athletes, he's gotten by on his athleticism and hasn't developed the rest of his game as well as he should have. The Kings have no need for him in my opinion.
^^^
My beef with players like Wesley Johnson and Ekpe Udoh is that I'm a bigger fan of seeing a player's overall body of work rather than sudden, exponential improvements.
I might be harsh on Johnson and Udoh for those reasons, but Johnson in particular has played 30+ minutes in his freshman year, and 25+ minutes his sophomore year--and he didn't impress me that much. What's probably a given in the NBA is that he's an average scorer, athletic, and pretty good rebounder and defender, which will definitely garner him a place in the NBA. The x-factor will definitely be his shooting--if he shoots well and can continue his surge here to the NBA, he can become that ultimate cog piece. If he doesn't, well...he's maybe another Dorell Wright (and I used to like Dorell Wright, a lot). I'm not really sure if he can sustain the shooting, but hey, I've been proven wrong many a time. I just like to make projections, and so far, just color me skeptical. Johnson will definitely have a role in the NBA as a role player in the worst, but as a 5th-6th pick is just where I have my doubts.
Udoh I'll readily admit that I could be wrong about. He's an active, athletic body out there, and that caters to the up-tempo NBA, and unlike other raw players of his ilk he's never really had problems of foul trouble and can decently pass the ball, so those wrinkles will only help him. Has some face-up game too. But between his nondescript seasons at Michigan and this sudden breakout at Baylor, where he did look impressive, I just wonder how well he can score in the NBA...I'm not sold he has a bread and butter besides getting offensive rebounds, dunks off feeds and such. But if he's blocking shots and patrolling the paint, that won't matter. We can certainly use a shotblocker like him, and as you said we'll have to see about his defensive rebounding at the next level. There's a lot of potential for sure, but after seeing so many years of these raw bigs I guess I've just gotten used to discarding them. My bad. I might do a full turn on this one.
P.S. I've done these sort of thumbnail reports over the past year, and I haven't always got them right. Looking over my past reports I've gotten Toney Douglas, Marcus Thornton, Darren Collison, and Wayne Ellington wrong, so don't always take my opinion for granted. But there's so many variables, such as playing time and trust, that could make a player look good.
My beef with players like Wesley Johnson and Ekpe Udoh is that I'm a bigger fan of seeing a player's overall body of work rather than sudden, exponential improvements.
I might be harsh on Johnson and Udoh for those reasons, but Johnson in particular has played 30+ minutes in his freshman year, and 25+ minutes his sophomore year--and he didn't impress me that much. What's probably a given in the NBA is that he's an average scorer, athletic, and pretty good rebounder and defender, which will definitely garner him a place in the NBA. The x-factor will definitely be his shooting--if he shoots well and can continue his surge here to the NBA, he can become that ultimate cog piece. If he doesn't, well...he's maybe another Dorell Wright (and I used to like Dorell Wright, a lot). I'm not really sure if he can sustain the shooting, but hey, I've been proven wrong many a time. I just like to make projections, and so far, just color me skeptical. Johnson will definitely have a role in the NBA as a role player in the worst, but as a 5th-6th pick is just where I have my doubts.
Udoh I'll readily admit that I could be wrong about. He's an active, athletic body out there, and that caters to the up-tempo NBA, and unlike other raw players of his ilk he's never really had problems of foul trouble and can decently pass the ball, so those wrinkles will only help him. Has some face-up game too. But between his nondescript seasons at Michigan and this sudden breakout at Baylor, where he did look impressive, I just wonder how well he can score in the NBA...I'm not sold he has a bread and butter besides getting offensive rebounds, dunks off feeds and such. But if he's blocking shots and patrolling the paint, that won't matter. We can certainly use a shotblocker like him, and as you said we'll have to see about his defensive rebounding at the next level. There's a lot of potential for sure, but after seeing so many years of these raw bigs I guess I've just gotten used to discarding them. My bad. I might do a full turn on this one.
P.S. I've done these sort of thumbnail reports over the past year, and I haven't always got them right. Looking over my past reports I've gotten Toney Douglas, Marcus Thornton, Darren Collison, and Wayne Ellington wrong, so don't always take my opinion for granted. But there's so many variables, such as playing time and trust, that could make a player look good.
What i REALLY DONT UNDERSTAND is how people can falsely critisize Udoh for not have an offensive game and then totally underplay Cole Aldrich's utter lack of offensive skill. Udoh does alot of nice things on the offensive end. He has a nice shot outside of 15 feet. He can put the ball on the floor. He has a better low post game than Aldrich. Udoh is also a pretty good passer. Aldrich is a robot with 2 moves and he cant shoot.
Fair enough. To be honest, if I had to put my money on one of the two players, it would be Udoh. He does have something you can't teach, and thats height. Add in that he's a good athlete and seems to have a pretty good basketball IQ. But more than that, my gut just tells me that he's going to be a good player in the NBA. Johnsons lack of ballhandling, which in turn affects his ability to create for himself and get to the basket is my biggest concern. And while he shot the ball very well this year, he did improve dramaticly over his prior years. So one does have to wonder if his shooting stats were a reflection of hard work, or if he just got on a roll.
Having said all that. If Johnson can become a good defender, I see a place for him in the league. At worse he could be another Doug Christie. Of course one would hope for more than that if your picking him in the lottery.
As I said, I've always respected your opinions. Just thought you were a little too harsh this time. Except for Aminu.
Having said all that. If Johnson can become a good defender, I see a place for him in the league. At worse he could be another Doug Christie. Of course one would hope for more than that if your picking him in the lottery.
As I said, I've always respected your opinions. Just thought you were a little too harsh this time. Except for Aminu.
That's a good point. It's probably that Aldrich is a better rebounder. But from what I could tell, the difference in rebounding between Aldrich and Udoh (where Aldrich is somewhat better) is a lot less than the difference in offensive ability between Aldrich and Udoh (where Udoh seems a lot better).
Well, what exactly soon to be 23-year old prospect Ekpe Udoh does on the offensive end at NBA level? Shooting? Well if you take out high percentage finishes is he really shooting that well with his .505 2pt-FG%(.685FT%)? Obviously he went a long way from .443 2pt-FG% and .589 FT% he shot as a sophomore but if you tell me something's wrong with Aldrich's shot, well, something is cause he was making .792 of his FTs as a sophomore(pretty decent indicator of shooting ability). Aldrich was moved away from the basket to free up space for Morris brothers so his bread and butter, finishes, dipped in numbers but he still shot .562 2pt-FG%(.598 as a sophomore). His jumpshot is not pretty but it has very high release point and mysteriously it goes in too often.
Who cares. We're getting the #2 pick and draftin Evan Turner with it.
Yes you heard it hear first. So you can save yourselves a lot of time and energy and just accept that fact.
As for #33, I dunno. But Jimmer Fredette would be a nice pick-up in that range.
C: Hawes, Thompson
PF: Landry, Brockman
SF: Greene, Casspi, Nocioni
SG: Turner, Garcia
PG: Evans, Beno, Fredette
Then look at the free agent market to sign a big man. Carlos Boozer would be the biggest, most likely target with our cap space, but that's IF we want to blow our money on him, I don't think we do. David Lee could be a potential target and fill many needs, but is NOT an elite defender which is something we need up front. Tyrus Thomas MIGHT be had, but we might have to overspend to get him via RFA status. Udonis Haslem would be solid and affordable while being efficient, a great rebounder and solid defender, but kinda a bad fit due to age/situation. Ian Mahimni looks like an interesting prospect that could be had on the relative cheap. Amir Johnson also falls into the low risk/high reward field. Just say no to Channing Frye. Amare, Dirk, Bosh IMO are pipe dreams.
So I say we target both Mahimni(3 years 8 million with just one year guaranteed and Tyrus Thomas(5 years at 35 million on a front loaded deal[starting around 9-10 million) to make it hard for the Bobcats to match).
Finish off the roster as so:
C: Hawes, Thompson, Mahimni
PF: Landry, Thomas, Brockman
SF: Greene, Casspi, Nocioni
SG: Turner, Garcia
PG: Evans, Udrih, Fredette
With an available 4-6 million left over for trade manuevers throughout the season to maybe snatch up a prospect and/or future pick by absorbing a contract a teams wants moved.
Yes you heard it hear first. So you can save yourselves a lot of time and energy and just accept that fact.
As for #33, I dunno. But Jimmer Fredette would be a nice pick-up in that range.
C: Hawes, Thompson
PF: Landry, Brockman
SF: Greene, Casspi, Nocioni
SG: Turner, Garcia
PG: Evans, Beno, Fredette
Then look at the free agent market to sign a big man. Carlos Boozer would be the biggest, most likely target with our cap space, but that's IF we want to blow our money on him, I don't think we do. David Lee could be a potential target and fill many needs, but is NOT an elite defender which is something we need up front. Tyrus Thomas MIGHT be had, but we might have to overspend to get him via RFA status. Udonis Haslem would be solid and affordable while being efficient, a great rebounder and solid defender, but kinda a bad fit due to age/situation. Ian Mahimni looks like an interesting prospect that could be had on the relative cheap. Amir Johnson also falls into the low risk/high reward field. Just say no to Channing Frye. Amare, Dirk, Bosh IMO are pipe dreams.
So I say we target both Mahimni(3 years 8 million with just one year guaranteed and Tyrus Thomas(5 years at 35 million on a front loaded deal[starting around 9-10 million) to make it hard for the Bobcats to match).
Finish off the roster as so:
C: Hawes, Thompson, Mahimni
PF: Landry, Thomas, Brockman
SF: Greene, Casspi, Nocioni
SG: Turner, Garcia
PG: Evans, Udrih, Fredette
With an available 4-6 million left over for trade manuevers throughout the season to maybe snatch up a prospect and/or future pick by absorbing a contract a teams wants moved.
Wes Johnson's shooting is really what makes me secure in taking him. He has the ideal mechanics and hits with consistency from mid range and 3, and it's only going to get better from here on out. Add that with his ability to be active off the ball and a good passer, you have the ideal complimentary player. The big problems with Johnson though, is 5 or 6 too high for a player that doesn't really create their own offense? And he's a SF, we already have a bunch of SF's.