Breton: Latest arena talks offer signs of hope

VF21

Super Moderator Emeritus
SME
#1
http://www.sacbee.com/content/sports/story/14273502p-15083584c.html

Marcos Bretón: Latest arena talks offer sign of hope
By Marcos Bretón -- Bee Columnist
Published 12:01 am PDT Friday, June 30, 2006


Another deal to build an arena in Sacramento failed Thursday, a community quest seemingly as hopeless as hoisting a Kings championship banner at Arco Arena.

The Kings' people and the City and County of Sacramento negotiated hard for 40 days until quitting. For now.

So, of course, that must mean the Kings are leaving Sacramento. It must mean we'll soon see the Las Vegas Kings.

It must mean that Sacramento is a hick place of half-wits who don't get that the Kings are Sacramento.

After all, the Kings are the reason people move to Sacramento, the economic engine driving this rickety bus.

Without the Kings, Sacramento is worthless!

OK, OK, OK. It's time to stop shouting all these untruths in the streets, from a ledge on the Tower Bridge and on talk radio.

Because despite a lack of a deal, there is still reason for optimism.
Indeed, this particular negotiation to fund a new home for the Kings -- and concerts and events for Sacramento -- was unlike any other before it.

This one was legitimate.

There were actual negotiations, for the first time. There were parties involved who knew what they were doing, people who have built stadiums and arenas, such as River Cats owner Art Savage.

There were serious people representing Kings owners Joe and Gavin Maloof, such as former state Assemblyman Darrell Steinberg.

And there was meaningful consensus that an arena could work in downtown Sacramento, agreement that everyone involved wants to see this work, unity that no one wants to see the Kings leave Sacramento.

Steinberg, who seems a cinch to win election to the state Senate in November, said he believes an arena deal can still happen.

"Sacramento has too much of an upside for anyone to give up," he said Thursday.

And the Kings owners agreed: "Yeah, I still think it can happen. We're optimistic," Joe Maloof said Thursday.

So what happened?

The two sides -- the Kings and government officials -- ran out of time to draft an agreement that could have gone to voters on the November ballot.

They were simply too far apart on key issues such as how much the arena would cost, ownership of the arena and myriad details on how arena revenues would be split.

Of course, those are critical issues -- the whole ball of wax, really. And it's hard not to wonder if two diverse cultures at work here can ever get together.

The Maloofs are products of an NBA system in which some owners -- in Indiana, for example -- are used to having their arenas largely subsidized by taxpayers while keeping all the profits, even from concerts.

Meanwhile, elected officials such as County Supervisor Roger Dickinson -- and Sacramento Vice Mayor Rob Fong -- have to worry about voters hostile to public funds used for private arenas.

Why? Because this issue is like immigration in that people feel vehemently one way or the other.

Listen to KHTK 1140 today and you'll likely hear callers screaming about how stupid we are in Sacramento, implying that the city and county should bow and kiss the Maloofs' feet.

But outside public forums whose life's blood flows from the Kings, it's a different story.

Many feel that there shouldn't be a penny of public money spent on arenas for "billionaire" basketball owners.

After years of writing about this, and sometimes being hostile to previous arena proposals that were deeply flawed, I have changed my thoughts.

They've been shaped by the countless Kings fans who love the team, buy season tickets and live and die with their guys -- but still want a fair deal for Sacramento.

I'm with them.

No, the city and county should not assume all the risks of a new arena while the Maloofs reap all the benefits at the same time their casino empire expands in Las Vegas.

But yes, some public money can and should be used for an arena because the Kings are a positive force for this city, a rallying point, a joyful diversion.

Keeping the Kings is obviously not the most important issue facing the Sacramento region, but it's important.

For now, the two sides in the arena issue simply haven't agreed on where the financial intersection should be for public-private arena partnership.

But you know what? In other cities across America, such questions took years to answer. We've had only 40 days of real negotiations.
It's time for at least 40 more because 312 consecutive Arco Arena sellouts demand it. And because Sacramento and the Maloofs would rue the day they ever walked away from each other.

About the writer: Reach Marcos Bretón at (916) 321-1096 or mbreton@sacbee.com.
 

VF21

Super Moderator Emeritus
SME
#2
After years of writing about this, and sometimes being hostile to previous arena proposals that were deeply flawed, I have changed my thoughts.

They've been shaped by the countless Kings fans who love the team, buy season tickets and live and die with their guys -- but still want a fair deal for Sacramento.

I'm with them.
Okay, who are you and what have you done with Marcos Breton???????

;)

Seriously, I don't care if it is Marcos. I'm glad to see the Bee coming over to the right side at last.
 
#3
^^^I am as shocked as you. Yesterday I agreed with Bricklayer and today I agree with Breton. What the he** is going on here?
 
#4
:eek: :eek: :eek: :eek: (shock not eek -Shock this is the Bee and Breton)

Perhaps one of the best articles regarding anything Kings I have read in Years from the Bee. Excellent article,
 
#5
He still doesn't get it, in my opinion. He thinks "some" public money is OK to spend on a new arena. We all know it is going to take 75%-80% public funding, and the Maloofs will exact steep concessions for that 20%-25%. If Sacramento was really smart, the city would fund it entirely with public money. Then the city would maintain leverage on the facility.

He still casts the Maloofs as billionaire playboys making more billions at their casino. What's wrong with Grant and Mike talking about the arena deal, by the way? It's the only place in Sacramento where there is a public forum to discuss the issue. I don't hear any other local programs debating the pros and cons of a new venue for the city.
 

VF21

Super Moderator Emeritus
SME
#6
I disagree pretty strongly, Venom. I think Breton is making a fair commentary about what's happening so far. And he's representative of a LOT of people in the area. At least he's willing to admit there might be things he hadn't considered. And, like it or not, a LOT of people still think of the Maloofs as the "billionaire" basketball owners.

Sacramento is NOT going to completely fund the arena. It is NOT going to happen.

Grant and Mike talking about arena funding? Sorry but that would be like trying to discuss quantum physics with the big gold 6 outside Arco.
 
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#7
I disagree pretty strongly, Venom. I think Breton is making a fair commentary about what's happening so far. And he's representative of a LOT of people in the area. At least he's willing to admit there might be things he hadn't considered. And, like it or not, a LOT of people still think of the Maloofs as the "billionaire" basketball owners.

Sacramento is NOT going to completely fund the arena. It is NOT going to happen.

Grant and Mike talking about arena funding? Sorry but that would be like trying to discuss quantum physics with the big gold 6 outside Arco.
Well, the things he hadn't considered before have been evident for 2-3 years now, so I give him zero brownie points for the half-hearted change of mind. But you're right, he is representative of the vast majority of Sacramentans, which is why we will lose the team. I know Sacramento will not completely fund the arena, but it should. It's for Sacramento, not the Maloofs. Dallas funded its new arena, even though Cuban is a "billionaire" playboy.

Grant and Mike just had Roger Dickinson on, which was quite informative, so I think their contribution to the debate is quite valid. They can often sound like pinheads, but there is no other forum that I can think of regular Sacramentans to debate the issue. I applaud them for that.
 
#8
This is why Breton is so right and it's what I have been spewing for weeks and Ask VF, I have gotten pretty heated up about this entire issue. My stake is just the emotional investment of being a Kings fan for 20years. As is everyone else here. So I am allowed to get emotional.

There are so many issues at play here, Pinhead doll 1 and 2 do not know one thing more then you and I. I turned on the radio after I woke up and heard grant saying "lets get a grass roots campaign, I will send in $1000 right now" Come on how the HELL does that help anything.

Then next line is Lamb spewing the same crap over and over and over again. It was the 4th time when he said the same point again that I turned it off. That is not what I call informative radio. Its talk radio, it is what it is.

The bee is alway what it is but this / Bretons points are how most people feel in Sacramento. He didn't really touch the Tax issue, which I wish he would of but overall People here feel they that the current Arco is fine.

Now why? That is the question and what can the Maloofs do to change that opinion?

I think the current Arco deal has left a bad taste with many. Thats has nothing to do with the Maloofs but it is something they need to deal with.

Then you have a Bee columnist this morning on the Rise Guys saying "THE talks broke off because the Maloofs don't want to pay a dime"

To me the Maloofs PR department needs to be replaced and they need an aggressive clear cut plan for dealing with this garbage. The Maloofs need to be more visible on this issue.
 
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#9
I don't think the loan that Jim Thomas got 9 years ago was a bad deal. It was just the first sign that a privately financed arena was a financial burden to the team. The loan was secured just like any other. It will be repaid in full well before the 30 year term. In fact it may be paid off within the next few years one way or the other. The question is will the Kings be here or somehwere else. So not only does the city lose the team, but you'll lose Arco and every event it hosts. The city is going to need a new arena in the near future no matter what happens. Pay now or later - it's all expensive. Once people get used to that idea, it will register.
 
#10
Why would people be upset with the current arena deal? It was 100% built with private money. Of course that's part of the problem. It was built for half the cost of other arenas at that time (read cheap). So cheap that it can't be remodeled, because the foundation won't support it. And second, that's why the team needed a loan to keep going. They were hemorraging red ink.

We got really licky that the city gave them that loan and that when they still had to sell the team, that we were lucky it was the Maloofs. They said they weren't going to move the team. And they are ahead of schedule paying back the city's loan.

Supervisor Dickinson is great to listen to, because he really explains the issues. He said of all the businees negotiations he's been in over the years, an arena is the most complex. But real positive negotiations came out of this last few weeks.

He said they figured out that it would not cost much more to build downtown (many reasons for that). The message I wish people would hear laoud and clear that he spoke about:

He does not feel the timelime for this is tied to when the team might leave. He said the condition and economic viability of Arco is the real pressure. (And there have been numerous independent consultants and egineers that have confirmed this.)

He said that people have to realize that Arco IS privately owned. The City does not and will not own it if the team leaves. The likely scenario if the Kings leave is that the Maloofs would sell the property and Arco would be razed. With an arena on it that no one can operate with any economic viability, the value is the land. That is a hot area for development, because its so close to downtown. Whoever buys almost assuredly raze Arco and make a mint developing the land for something else.

That's it. Gone, no arena, period. Bye-bye to any events, except ones that can be done at Memorial Auditorium, which is extremely limited and also has severe maintenance issues. So he feels the arena is a benefit to the Maloofs, but is just as much a benefit to Sacramento and the region. I hapen to agree with that point of view.

The 2008 ballot is probably too late, I think. We better start praying that there is some genius out there that come up with something.:(
 

Bricklayer

Don't Make Me Use The Bat
#11
I think a real issue has come with two things that looked grand on paper, but became an almost amusing mistake:

1) worshipping the arena. Pumping it up as "Arco Thunder" etc. Now in a fit of irony that whole thing has been turned around so that people cluelessly worship the old bandbox and truly think its the best building in the league.

2) worshipping/buttering up the fans. Sounds like a great idea (except for guys like my brothers who got so sick of it they actually started yelling "shuddup!" at the PA announcer everytime he started blabbing about the best fans in the NBA). But now, in yet more irony, it becomes an excuse for those same fans to develop a complacent arrogance that the Maloofs would obviously NEVER move the team away since I/we are the best, right?
 

VF21

Super Moderator Emeritus
SME
#12
Then you have a Bee columnist this morning on the Rise Guys saying "THE talks broke off because the Maloofs don't want to pay a dime"
It's that kind of totally IRRESPONSIBLE "journalism" that needs to be nipped in the bud the moment it occurs. That "columnist" should be called on the carpet and made to correct it. Mis-statements like that are what cause a majority of the mistrust and problems and I would guess about 90% could be laid right at the feet of various people working for the Sacramento Bee.

To me the Maloofs PR department needs to be replaced and they need an aggressive clear cut plan for dealing with this garbage. The Maloofs need to be more visible on this issue.
I agree in part. They need a spokesperson out front who will speak for them but they do NOT need to be more visible. That's actually been part of the problem. They are too visible in too many different scenarios. The whole constant tie-in to the Palms is a big problem, and I'm really surprised they haven't realized how much harm they're doing themselves in the arena of the arena.

People aren't going to want to give up their hard-earned tax dollars so the "billionaire" casino owners can have somewhere else to impress their Hollywood-type friends. Joe and Gavin need to be LESS visible, especially in the areas of touting themselves and their playboy lifestyle if they want to have anyone in Sacramento take them seriously.

Just my three cents, of course...
 
#13
It's that kind of totally IRRESPONSIBLE "journalism" that needs to be nipped in the bud the moment it occurs. That "columnist" should be called on the carpet and made to correct it. Mis-statements like that are what cause a majority of the mistrust and problems and I would guess about 90% could be laid right at the feet of various people working for the Sacramento Bee.



I agree in part. They need a spokesperson out front who will speak for them but they do NOT need to be more visible. That's actually been part of the problem. They are too visible in too many different scenarios. The whole constant tie-in to the Palms is a big problem, and I'm really surprised they haven't realized how much harm they're doing themselves in the arena of the arena.

People aren't going to want to give up their hard-earned tax dollars so the "billionaire" casino owners can have somewhere else to impress their Hollywood-type friends. Joe and Gavin need to be LESS visible, especially in the areas of touting themselves and their playboy lifestyle if they want to have anyone in Sacramento take them seriously.

Just my three cents, of course...
Agreed the Maloofs have never asked for the city to pay 100% of the cost..never. They've always talked about contributing at least 20%.

And I agree, the PR push for an arena financed with any public funding should most definitely not come from MS & E. I don't think people want to see them asking for money. This is a city/county/region decision and the push and discussion has to take place there. And its going to have to happen about an arena whether or not the Kings leave. In which case, the city will have to do it with NO money from rich billionaires at all. Yeah, that will show the Maloofs!:rolleyes:
 
#14
I think a real issue has come with two things that looked grand on paper, but became an almost amusing mistake:

1) worshipping the arena. Pumping it up as "Arco Thunder" etc. Now in a fit of irony that whole thing has been turned around so that people cluelessly worship the old bandbox and truly think its the best building in the league.

2) worshipping/buttering up the fans. Sounds like a great idea (except for guys like my brothers who got so sick of it they actually started yelling "shuddup!" at the PA announcer everytime he started blabbing about the best fans in the NBA). But now, in yet more irony, it becomes an excuse for those same fans to develop a complacent arrogance that the Maloofs would obviously NEVER move the team away since I/we are the best, right?
Yeah, I do think this has added to the misperceptions or misunderstandings, especially the second. So the folks who don't want to do anything and will end up with no arena in Sacramento will then wail about how those rich billionaires "screwed over" the best fans in the NBA.:rolleyes: A real Pyrrhic victory, to say the least.
 
#15
I think Dickinson is correct that the Maloofs would sell off Arco and it's land to pay off the loan and lien and pocket the rest. I can't see keeping the arena given that the lifespan of the building is rapidly expiring. So what's at stake here is not just the Kings & Monarchs, it's all of the events held at Arco. It's like taking the region back 30 years.
 
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#17
Then you have a Bee columnist this morning on the Rise Guys saying "THE talks broke off because the Maloofs don't want to pay a dime"

And right after that he said that im sure many people will call up and try and correct me but they dont know anything. Only what the Billionaire Maloof family want them too. That they have everybody brainwashed here. :rolleyes:
 
#19
Let me guess...it was Graswich, wasn't it?

;)
Wow, good guess! ;) Since the Maloofs have always expected and said they would pay a portion, I was tempted to call up and correct him. Or at least ask if he was actually at any of the negotiations. He just hates the Maloof and has no objectivity about them at all. Course, he doesn't have to be objective about anything, because he's a columnist, not a reporter. :rolleyes: