KING DEMAR

DDR didn't do much when he went to SAS. They picked up +1 wins from the season before. Chicago on the other hand was great in his first year but year 2 and 3 at Chicago were uneventful..

I hope this isn't one of those big name moves that screwed up the spacing, meanwhile not helping the team he went to, I.E. The Kings!
They needed to try something...... can't fault em for that. Not worth worrying about til the season is well underway
 
Makes more sense. Thanks!

I’m honestly not in love with the move…at least not yet. I’d like it more if we followed it up for a 3&D starting PF allowing DeRozan to come off the bench, but I thought I saw that there are incentives in DeRozan’s contract if he makes an all star team. That very likely means he’s not going to accept that type of role on our team and is going to expect/demand to start. It’s going to be really interesting to see how a Fox-DeRozan-Sabonis lineup works offensively. Two of those three “stars” aren’t good floor spacers and two of those three “stars” aren’t defenders.

The 2031 pick swap is not ideal but it is a “pick swap” and not a “pick” so there’s that. However, even with sending out this pick swap, McNair has set himself up to be in a position where he can trade 4 1sts next offseason (assuming our 2025 pick conveys to ATL).

We’ll have to see how it plays out on the court but the cost to take this swing is relatively low compared to trading for someone like Markkanen, Ingram, etc. so we’re not “stuck” or “all in.” If it doesn’t work out, we have options.
Damar ain’t coming off the bench, man, what the hell kinda take is that?
 
Yeah, I think what this ultimately does is ups the Kings "talent threshold" to really start to line up with the OKC/Mavs/Wolves etc in the West. Are we there yet? No. Are we a perfectly constructed roster yet? Nope. But I think you throw in a DDR for just the cost of a declining HB, that starts to really close that gap.

I just like the theory of making a "win now" move, without sacrificing the future too. That's the perfect way to go about it and leaves your options open if we need to pivot. Or just go keep adding.

In terms of overall needs for this team... it's starting to get pretty small. Basically a "better' back-up C and a wing 3 and D spacer? What other holes does this squad have now?

Out of curiosity, for you:

This deal as is.

Or Huerter+HB+2 FRP for Grant?
Did you mean Ingram? My proposed trade for Grant was less than that.
 
I don’t quite understand the “all star incentive” thing since in my opinion it incentives DeRozan to jack up more shots if anything. Should have been some incentive tied to team success. For Kings to be effective when everyone healthy I’d like to see this scoring distribution:

Fox 22-26 p
DeRozan 18-20
Murray 16-18
Monk 14-16
Sabonis 14-16
watching Keon play tonight I think you are underrating what he might do
 
Even if DeRozan has a dropoff in production, he is miles ahead of what Barnes provides. Keegan can focus on defense and sniping threes, and who better to learn creating offense from.
Exactly. HB’s athleticism took a huge hit last year. He was a step slower and definitely lost any burst he still had left (recall his huge breakaway dunk against the W’s in the playoffs the year before last….that explosion/bounce was gone last year). The old man euro step moves seemed to be all he had left around the rim. He was a solid King over the years but the writing was on the wall. I think he’s now into his nomad/grizzled vet bench leader phase of his career.
 
Exactly. HB’s athleticism took a huge hit last year. He was a step slower and definitely lost any burst he still had left (recall his huge breakaway dunk against the W’s in the playoffs the year before last….that explosion/bounce was gone last year). The old man euro step moves seemed to be all he had left around the rim. He was a solid King over the years but the writing was on the wall. I think he’s now into his nomad/grizzled vet bench leader phase of his career.
Derozan is a couple years older than Barnes and still looks in his prime. Just goes to show you can't judge everyone the same, based on age
 
Yeah, I think what this ultimately does is ups the Kings "talent threshold" to really start to line up with the OKC/Mavs/Wolves etc in the West. Are we there yet? No. Are we a perfectly constructed roster yet? Nope. But I think you throw in a DDR for just the cost of a declining HB, that starts to really close that gap.

I just like the theory of making a "win now" move, without sacrificing the future too. That's the perfect way to go about it and leaves your options open if we need to pivot. Or just go keep adding.

In terms of overall needs for this team... it's starting to get pretty small. Basically a "better' back-up C and a wing 3 and D spacer? What other holes does this squad have now?

Out of curiosity, for you:

This deal as is.

Or Huerter+HB+2 FRP for Grant?
spacing is a legit issue with Fox and Sabonis

But you will move Keegs to the 4 and Keon can shoot the 3. I actually like DeRozan on the floor with Huerter and Monk. It will make our non Fox minutes more productive.
 

pdxKingsFan

So Ordinary That It's Truly Quite Extraordinary
Staff member
DDR didn't do much when he went to SAS. They picked up +1 wins from the season before. Chicago on the other hand was great in his first year but year 2 and 3 at Chicago were uneventful..

I hope this isn't one of those big name moves that screwed up the spacing, meanwhile not helping the team he went to, I.E. The Kings!
The cost of acquiring him was basically nothing (barring something ridiculous with the future pick swap) and if all reporting is correct we're still below the tax line, we may have even temporarily shaved some salary depending on the final numbers.
 

pdxKingsFan

So Ordinary That It's Truly Quite Extraordinary
Staff member
I don’t quite understand the “all star incentive” thing since in my opinion it incentives DeRozan to jack up more shots if anything. Should have been some incentive tied to team success.
The all star incentives are in almost every player contract league wide. Not the same as giving Buddy a bonus for 3pt shots attempted with no minimum % hit.

I think you see them reported as "likely" vs. "unlikely" with the former counting against the cap proactively.
 
He's already had a significant impact. That's how he earned the starting job
I was responding to Keon being left off as a 14-16ppg scoring distributor. I don't think he cracks more than 10ppg next year. He's a limited scorer that lacks aggression. Even in his best month (April), he barely averaged 10.5ppg with an injured Monk.

I see him as our starting 3&D SG who doesn't see much run in the 4th quarter unless we need his defense.

I think Keon did an adequate enough job as a 3&D role player, but it would be nice if we could upgrade the starting SG spot. He's probably a bottom 5 starting SG in the NBA if we're being honest. But the starting SG position is the least of our concerns right now. As I said, I think he did an adequate enough job.
 

pdxKingsFan

So Ordinary That It's Truly Quite Extraordinary
Staff member
I was responding to Keon being left off as a 14-16ppg scoring distributor. I don't think he cracks more than 10ppg next year. He's a limited scorer that lacks aggression. Even in his best month (April), he barely averaged 10.5ppg with an injured Monk.

I see him as our starting 3&D SG who doesn't see much run in the 4th quarter unless we need his defense.

I think Keon did an adequate enough job as a 3&D role player, but it would be nice if we could upgrade the starting SG spot. He's probably a bottom 5 starting SG in the NBA if we're being honest. But the starting SG position is the least of our concerns right now. As I said, I think he did an adequate enough job.
If Keon is starting it is because of his defense. If we want more scoring we've already got that and can put him on the second unit. Devin Carter could also potentially win out this spot in a year or two as well.

But there's no reason he can't take and make a few more 3s a game which would push him into 14ppg territory.
 

kingsboi

Hall of Famer
Clearly Monte was looking at those iso's, as he should have been. That's where the Kings needed help and they just got one of the better iso creators in the game. It kind of looks like Monte is pivoting back a little. I think he's kind of trying to build his own little version of the Celtics. 2 main iso threats, scoring, a skilled passing big, and legit guard defense with Carter and Keon like the C's have with Jrue and Derrick White.
haven't we learned anything over the years? trying to emulate current champions does not work, you need to work with the core pieces you have and plug and play players that may or may not fit the mold. it's experimentation from there really
 
If Keon is starting it is because of his defense. If we want more scoring we've already got that and can put him on the second unit. Devin Carter could also potentially win out this spot in a year or two as well.

But there's no reason he can't take and make a few more 3s a game which would push him into 14ppg territory.
The Kings defensive core is certainly at the SG and F spot. Keon, Carter, and Keegan are pretty much that backbone as of now.
 
I was responding to Keon being left off as a 14-16ppg scoring distributor. I don't think he cracks more than 10ppg next year. He's a limited scorer that lacks aggression. Even in his best month (April), he barely averaged 10.5ppg with an injured Monk.

I see him as our starting 3&D SG who doesn't see much run in the 4th quarter unless we need his defense.

I think Keon did an adequate enough job as a 3&D role player, but it would be nice if we could upgrade the starting SG spot. He's probably a bottom 5 starting SG in the NBA if we're being honest. But the starting SG position is the least of our concerns right now. As I said, I think he did an adequate enough job.
He's already one of the better defensive guards in the league and he can shoot. Some of his value to this team is not taking too many shots, which is even more so now with the addition of DeRozan
 
Bulls = Chris Duarte, two second-round picks

Kings = DeMar DeRozan on three-year, $74 million contract

Spurs = Harrison Barnes, unprotected 2031 pick swap via Kings
 

pdxKingsFan

So Ordinary That It's Truly Quite Extraordinary
Staff member
The Kings defensive core is certainly at the SG and F spot. Keon, Carter, and Keegan are pretty much that backbone as of now.
Would be nice to get a truer "4" in the defensive mold but it seems like we'll have enough to play on both the main and second units. Plus give different looks to different teams (if Brown is willing, which to be honest, deviation from the way isn't his strong suit).
 
haven't we learned anything over the years? trying to emulate current champions does not work, you need to work with the core pieces you have and plug and play players that may or may not fit the mold. it's experimentation from there really
I think more than that it's Monte saw what was going on, too much pressure was on Fox to create. The Kings now have two players that historically hit around or above that 80-85th percentile in isolation. Barnes was actually better than both, he just refused to do it. Both of these guys have recent history of not only doing it, but putting up All Star level production when doing it. We'll see what the defense looks like and spacing. That's the issue on paper here. Still, better than destroying the future for a max ender contract player. That's what deadlines are for.
 
If Keon is starting it is because of his defense. If we want more scoring we've already got that and can put him on the second unit. Devin Carter could also potentially win out this spot in a year or two as well.

But there's no reason he can't take and make a few more 3s a game which would push him into 14ppg territory.
Keegan averaged about 15ppg this past season... the same guy who half the fanbase thinks can become Paul George 2.0. Even Malik only averaged a little bit over 15ppg, and he's our 2nd most dynamic scorer.

Not seeing any type of possibility for Keon to jump from 5.4ppg to the 14ppg reign. I think people are setting themselves up for disappointment when it comes to Keon if they expect him to be anything other than a solid role player next year.
 

pdxKingsFan

So Ordinary That It's Truly Quite Extraordinary
Staff member
Keegan averaged about 15ppg this past season... the same guy who half the fanbase thinks can become Paul George 2.0. Even Malik only averaged a little bit over 15ppg, and he's our 2nd most dynamic scorer.

Not seeing any type of possibility for Keon to jump from 5.4ppg to the 14ppg reign. I think people are setting themselves up for disappointment when it comes to Keon if they expect him to be anything other than a solid role player next year.
I don't expect him to be a scorer but if he averaged 10 as a starter and gets 2-3 more shots a game and hits close to 40% that's also not cray-cray.