Kings trade Richaun Holmes and 24th overall pick to Mavericks for ????
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I think Holmes could have been an asset next year but damn, that's 2+ years of carrying his contract when we could have really used a productive player at that salary level.
It sucks, but you probably also can't expect Holmes to continue to be a good soldier through it all. It would kill his ability for another contract. I'm going to assume he didn't waive his trade kicker.
It sucks, but you probably also can't expect Holmes to continue to be a good soldier through it all. It would kill his ability for another contract. I'm going to assume he didn't waive his trade kicker.
I didn't know he had one.
While I agree with what you are saying, I think the trade will ultimately be graded by whom we sign. If we bring back Lyles, and get a significant upgrade over Barnes, I'm fine with the trade. We will also have the flexibility of using the TPE to upgrade the roster during the season based on where we are, or use it to pick some asset.
If the end result is a roster quite similar to one last year, well, we just sold our FRP, while also losing any chance of getting anything for Holmes. This might be good for the owners, but not for fans
While I agree with what you are saying, I think the trade will ultimately be graded by whom we sign. If we bring back Lyles, and get a significant upgrade over Barnes, I'm fine with the trade. We will also have the flexibility of using the TPE to upgrade the roster during the season based on where we are, or use it to pick some asset.
If the end result is a roster quite similar to one last year, well, we just sold our FRP, while also losing any chance of getting anything for Holmes. This might be good for the owners, but not for fans
oh yeah if you don't recall when we re-signed him his agent bragged about getting him a ~16m per average deal but it turns out it was like 12.5 with a trade kicker.
It's still unclear to me if we overpaid him or if he actually at that time wanted to be with the Kings since he had a good role here under the Walton regime, but obviously based on results it was a massive overpay.
I think we absolutely need to sign an upgrade over Barnes (I am fine if we then bring back Barnes and Lyles too) at minimum. I'd also like to see us extend Domas if possible this offseason, word is he's willing even though it leaves about 20 million or something on the table.
It's still unclear to me if we overpaid him or if he actually at that time wanted to be with the Kings since he had a good role here under the Walton regime, but obviously based on results it was a massive overpay.
I think we absolutely need to sign an upgrade over Barnes (I am fine if we then bring back Barnes and Lyles too) at minimum. I'd also like to see us extend Domas if possible this offseason, word is he's willing even though it leaves about 20 million or something on the table.
If we become a cap space team, we lose the TPE so yeah we’d lose it if we release the cap hold on Barnes and others.
I think it’s safe to say that the Kings plan to operate as a cap space team since it sounds like they’re offering the room exception to Sasha (and we’d only have the room exception if we are a cap space team).
I think it’s safe to say that the Kings plan to operate as a cap space team since it sounds like they’re offering the room exception to Sasha (and we’d only have the room exception if we are a cap space team).
Oh I knew that thinking we could cheat the cap like that was too good to be true. So in order to spend the full 30 mil we'd have to relinquish the TPE which makes a zillion times sense.
BUT it actually is nice to know if we somehow strike out in FA that we have that in our back pocket. (I'm inclined to think Monte isn't as naive as Vlade though)
BUT it actually is nice to know if we somehow strike out in FA that we have that in our back pocket. (I'm inclined to think Monte isn't as naive as Vlade though)
No clue. I thought ALL free agent negotiations must not occur until June 30th (not even with your own FAs). Maybe the league will nullify the deal or at least penalize the Wolves a draft pick for tampering?
I know that the Kings-Bucks tried to do an early deal for Bogdan and it got leaked early and the Bucks got penalized, while the Kings lost Bogdan for nothing.
I know that the Kings-Bucks tried to do an early deal for Bogdan and it got leaked early and the Bucks got penalized, while the Kings lost Bogdan for nothing.
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He was already on the Timberwolves' roster, so he is being resigned in his status as a member of the team, not as a free agent. The front office had to do it ahead of June 30.
The Athletic writes:
<The timing of this deal is big for the Wolves. Getting a deal done now means they do not have to worry about Reid hitting free agency at the end of this week and an opposing team throwing a big number at him or structuring the deal in a way that would make it difficult for the salary cap-strained Wolves to keep him.>
https://theathletic.com/4639603/2023/06/25/timberwolves-naz-reid-contract/
The Athletic writes:
<The timing of this deal is big for the Wolves. Getting a deal done now means they do not have to worry about Reid hitting free agency at the end of this week and an opposing team throwing a big number at him or structuring the deal in a way that would make it difficult for the salary cap-strained Wolves to keep him.>
https://theathletic.com/4639603/2023/06/25/timberwolves-naz-reid-contract/
If I understand your question correctly - the traded player exception (TPE) cannot be combined with other exceptions or money. The only thing we can do with it, while it exists, is to absorb a contract of Holmes' size (or smaller) in a trade without having to match salary.
In order to use cap space to sign somebody else's free agent, we would need to renounce the TPE.
A Sabonis extension, if we could convince him to do it, does not require cap room. Also, an extension wouldn't affect this year's salary cap situation as Sabonis is currently under contract and his existing salary is part of our 2023 cap number already.
In order to use cap space to sign somebody else's free agent, we would need to renounce the TPE.
A Sabonis extension, if we could convince him to do it, does not require cap room. Also, an extension wouldn't affect this year's salary cap situation as Sabonis is currently under contract and his existing salary is part of our 2023 cap number already.
Doesn’t the “raise and extend” route the Pacers took with Turner require cap space? If I recall, that’s a relatively new CBA wrinkle. That’s why I’ve understood we’ve seen more Sabonis extension chatter since the Kings made the Holmes trade.
https://8points9seconds.com/2023/01/28/myles-turner-extension-good-sides/
https://8points9seconds.com/2023/01/28/myles-turner-extension-good-sides/
You cannot extend a contract that is not already on the books. Hence:
"The Minnesota TimberwolvesTimberwolves frontcourt isn't getting any less crowded. On Sunday, they and big man Naz Reid agreed to a three-year, $42 million extension, with a player option on the final season, his agents told ESPN's Adrian Wojnarowski."
"According to Adrian Wojnarowski, the Timberwolves and Naz Reid have agreed to an extension worth $42 million over three seasons. This comes after the player was involved in trade rumors and linked to multiple teams at last season’s trade deadline."
"Days before he was slated to hit unrestricted free agency, Timberwolves center Naz Reid has agreed to sign a three-year, $42MM contract extension to stay in Minnesota, his agents Jeff Schwartz and Sean Kennedy inform Adrian Wojnarowski of ESPN."
"Center Naz Reid has agreed to a three-year, $42 million contract extension with the Minnesota Timberwolves, according to NBA insider Adrian Wojnarowski of ESPN. Reid would have become an unrestricted free agent on June 30 if he and the Timberwolves didn’t agree to an extension."
"The Minnesota TimberwolvesTimberwolves frontcourt isn't getting any less crowded. On Sunday, they and big man Naz Reid agreed to a three-year, $42 million extension, with a player option on the final season, his agents told ESPN's Adrian Wojnarowski."
"According to Adrian Wojnarowski, the Timberwolves and Naz Reid have agreed to an extension worth $42 million over three seasons. This comes after the player was involved in trade rumors and linked to multiple teams at last season’s trade deadline."
"Days before he was slated to hit unrestricted free agency, Timberwolves center Naz Reid has agreed to sign a three-year, $42MM contract extension to stay in Minnesota, his agents Jeff Schwartz and Sean Kennedy inform Adrian Wojnarowski of ESPN."
"Center Naz Reid has agreed to a three-year, $42 million contract extension with the Minnesota Timberwolves, according to NBA insider Adrian Wojnarowski of ESPN. Reid would have become an unrestricted free agent on June 30 if he and the Timberwolves didn’t agree to an extension."
I'm not sure Ham knows what he is talking about (surprise). Which also then calls into question everything he has said about Domas's extension being the reason for this deal (which always felt sus since I heard it on Thursday).
On one hand, the TPE is not particularly useful until you are at the cap. On the other hand, we can't use the money the trade freed up and then use the exception, that would be a cheat code - as Cap pointed out - the TPE comes with a cap hold.
From Larry Coon's CBA FAQ:
On one hand, the TPE is not particularly useful until you are at the cap. On the other hand, we can't use the money the trade freed up and then use the exception, that would be a cheat code - as Cap pointed out - the TPE comes with a cap hold.
From Larry Coon's CBA FAQ:
Ham has been claiming since Thursday that was the basis for the Holmes move. While providing a security blanket of sorts, that doesn't feel like the best opportunity to take a leap with this club and instead commits to running it back. To me, giving up the pick feels like we should be taking a big FA swing. But I do understand that the extension could be a backup plan of sorts.
Well, we obviously don't have to use all of our cap space on a renegotiation.
The entire reason that nobody ever thought that Sabonis would sign an extension is that he would be eligible for a contract starting a bit north of $40M as a free agent next year, but we could only give him an extension starting at something like $23.5M (120% of previous salary). That's an obvious no-go.
But with the renegotiate-and-extend gambit, paired with the new CBA's 140% raise in the first year of the extension, there's a lot of room there. It looks like we could give Sabonis a $10M renegotiation-raise to $29.4M for this season, and then extend starting at 140% of that - that's $41M to start. Domas' max salary is 30% of the cap - this year that would be $40.8 but the actual value would be based on next year's salary cap, which we don't know yet. At any rate the 10% cap smoothing introduced in the new CBA means that 30% of the cap can't be any higher than $44.9M - we'd have to give Sabonis about $12.5M in the renegotiation to fully cover that possibility.
The interesting thing is that Domas appears to be eligible for a Designated Veteran extension, which he appears to be eligible for because he was named to the All-NBA third team this year. So...technically we could give him the DV extension (up to 35% of the salary cap in the first season) without having to worry about the 140% rule and therefore without a renegotiation this offseason. It seems odd to blow cap space to avoid using the DV, but I guess there must be reasons. Do we really think we're going to have two guys (Fox + ??) that will be on the DV, and leave Sabonis off it?
Anyway, even with a renegotiation we should be able to retain about $20M of cap space for other purposes.
The entire reason that nobody ever thought that Sabonis would sign an extension is that he would be eligible for a contract starting a bit north of $40M as a free agent next year, but we could only give him an extension starting at something like $23.5M (120% of previous salary). That's an obvious no-go.
But with the renegotiate-and-extend gambit, paired with the new CBA's 140% raise in the first year of the extension, there's a lot of room there. It looks like we could give Sabonis a $10M renegotiation-raise to $29.4M for this season, and then extend starting at 140% of that - that's $41M to start. Domas' max salary is 30% of the cap - this year that would be $40.8 but the actual value would be based on next year's salary cap, which we don't know yet. At any rate the 10% cap smoothing introduced in the new CBA means that 30% of the cap can't be any higher than $44.9M - we'd have to give Sabonis about $12.5M in the renegotiation to fully cover that possibility.
The interesting thing is that Domas appears to be eligible for a Designated Veteran extension, which he appears to be eligible for because he was named to the All-NBA third team this year. So...technically we could give him the DV extension (up to 35% of the salary cap in the first season) without having to worry about the 140% rule and therefore without a renegotiation this offseason. It seems odd to blow cap space to avoid using the DV, but I guess there must be reasons. Do we really think we're going to have two guys (Fox + ??) that will be on the DV, and leave Sabonis off it?
Anyway, even with a renegotiation we should be able to retain about $20M of cap space for other purposes.
