Keegan Murray

Tetsujin

Tetsujin

The Game Thread Dude
#901
#901
funkykingston said:
I liked Murray as a prospect but he's definitely NOT who I thought he'd be in the NBA. In college he shot it well, but he was more of an all-around scorer that worked in the post a fair amount. In the NBA he's been primarily a very effective movement shooter.

It's a different role than I envisioned him playing as a rookie.
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I knew Keegan was a good shooter (Kyle Kuzma-ish) but I never thought he was ever going to be this good a shooter (Klay Thompson?!?!?!) let alone as a rookie. The offball movement skills discussion is an interesting one because going into this year I thought that Kris was the better offball player but that might have just been the fact Keegan had the ball in his hands so much at Iowa clouding my perception of him.

I certainly wish he'd be more aggressive with the possessions that he does get and that the Kings would be a little more proactive in finding ways to get him the ball but I'm not sure those paint touches will ever come at this level while he's in lineups with Domantas Sabonis. (if they tried playing Keegan with the second unit a little more, however...)

Defensively, Keegan's taken a bit of a leap as a backside help defender over the last couple of weeks that's been really encouraging. He's still struggling overall when he gets switched onto guards but he's also put together impressive possesions on the ball on defense on occasion that really gives me hope on that side of the ball.

If Keegan inexplicably never improves from this point on, he's still a solid 4th overall pick but nothing about how he's played/how he's put together seems to suggest that he's even remotely close to being a finished product.
 
T

The_Jamal

Hall of Famer
#902
#902
funkykingston said:
I liked Murray as a prospect but he's definitely NOT who I thought he'd be in the NBA. In college he shot it well, but he was more of an all-around scorer that worked in the post a fair amount. In the NBA he's been primarily a very effective movement shooter.

It's a different role than I envisioned him playing as a rookie.
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Yeah he's drastically changed my perception of what I thought he was going to be. I sort of recall us on the forum thinking "Will his shooting actually translate?" and "Can he defend the perimeter?" as the two biggest questions and those have been his best NBA attributes by far lol.

Essentially, I think he's just playing an entirely new position than he did at Iowa. Which is a good thing for us because a 6'9 movement shooter that can defend multiple positions is insanely valuable and rare
 
T

The_Jamal

Hall of Famer
#903
#903
Tetsujin said:
I knew Keegan was a good shooter (Kyle Kuzma-ish) but I never thought he was ever going to be this good a shooter (Klay Thompson?!?!?!) let alone as a rookie. The offball movement skills discussion is an interesting one because going into this year I thought that Kris was the better offball player but that might have just been the fact Keegan had the ball in his hands so much at Iowa clouding my perception of him.

I certainly wish he'd be more aggressive with the possessions that he does get and that the Kings would be a little more proactive in finding ways to get him the ball but I'm not sure those paint touches will ever come at this level while he's in lineups with Domantas Sabonis. (if they tried playing Keegan with the second unit a little more, however...)

Defensively, Keegan's taken a bit of a leap as a backside help defender over the last couple of weeks that's been really encouraging. He's still struggling overall when he gets switched onto guards but he's also put together impressive possesions on the ball on defense on occasion that really gives me hope on that side of the ball.

If Keegan inexplicably never improves from this point on, he's still a solid 4th overall pick but nothing about how he's played/how he's put together seems to suggest that he's even remotely close to being a finished product.
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I think because he's so willing to play in the team concept, he just doesn't look to create his own offense whatsoever. We saw plenty of creation in the SL that actually shocked a lot of us, but there's just not a lot of room when a good chunk of his minutes overlap with Sabonis and Fox. And the Kings are a top 5 offense with him basically being a pure off-ball shooter/cutter, so it's hard to argue with the results

I'd love to see Brown swap in Keegan for Trey Lyles in that bench unit that worked so well for the Magic. Fox-Monk-KZ-Keegan-Metu. Would be a big improvement defensively and I think would give Keegan a little more room to look for his own offense. Long-term, him developing a comfort level of being a confident on-ball scorer would elevate the team another level or 2 up.
 
pdxKingsFan

pdxKingsFan

So Ordinary That It's Truly Quite Extraordinary
Staff member
#904
#904
SLAB

SLAB

Hall of Famer
#905
#905
Tetsujin said:
Not for nothing but Keegan apparently finally gets the splint off his hand in a few weeks. I wonder how much that’s been affecting his finishing ability and the one or two rebounds that get slapped out of his hands every game.
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completely forgot about that.
 
S

SCKingsfan

Bench
#906
#906
My sense is that one of his top off-season goals has to be work on taking the ball off the dribble from the perimeter. He hasn't been asked to a lot of it this year, and frankly he's been a bit sloppy when he has, but assuming he's capable of even proficiency in that (and develops the confidence to go along with it, which also seems a bit lacking), then he absolutely becomes a next tier player.
 
T

The_Jamal

Hall of Famer
#907
#907

Typical James Ham

"Brown is hard on you. Do you like that coaching style or do you not like getting thrown under the bus?"

Overall good interview though, seems like an incredibly mature kid who's willing to get better. And that's been reflected with his play over the course of the season.

Really does crack me up how this super monotone dude is a 0.0001% athlete in the world
 
kingsboi

kingsboi

Hall of Famer
#908
#908
The_Jamal said:

Typical James Ham

"Brown is hard on you. Do you like that coaching style or do you not like getting thrown under the bus?"

Overall good interview though, seems like an incredibly mature kid who's willing to get better. And that's been reflected with his play over the course of the season.

Really does crack me up how this super monotone dude is a 0.0001% athlete in the world
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I once read that in order to perfect your craft, one must work at it for up to 10,000 hours and perhaps more. He must of got a head start coming out of the womb compared to his peers who didn't make it.
 
coolhandluke

coolhandluke

Starter
#909
#909
The_Jamal said:

Typical James Ham

"Brown is hard on you. Do you like that coaching style or do you not like getting thrown under the bus?"

Overall good interview though, seems like an incredibly mature kid who's willing to get better. And that's been reflected with his play over the course of the season.

Really does crack me up how this super monotone dude is a 0.0001% athlete in the world
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Happy for Keegan that he got into a team that can bring him along the right way instead of asking him to go fend for himself on the court. Feels strange to talk that way about the Kings. Can we be like the Spurs of old?

Props to Monte on all his first round picks (Tyrese, Davion and Keegan). All of them seem to have a good head on their shoulders and are extremely coachable. Attitude determines altitude.
 
pdxKingsFan

pdxKingsFan

So Ordinary That It's Truly Quite Extraordinary
Staff member
#910
#910
The_Jamal said:
Typical James Ham

"Brown is hard on you. Do you like that coaching style or do you not like getting thrown under the bus?"
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Gee I wonder why they limit his access. That is a toxic question, he handled it like a champ with the "it's what I've always signed up for" type of response. But you can't have a clown like Ham trying to buddy up to a player by suggesting the coach is throwing him under the bus.
 
T

Turgenev

Starter
#911
#911
pdxKingsFan said:
Gee I wonder why they limit his access. That is a toxic question, he handled it like a champ with the "it's what I've always signed up for" type of response. But you can't have a clown like Ham trying to buddy up to a player by suggesting the coach is throwing him under the bus.
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The players probably get tips on individual reporters as part of their media training.
 
Warhawk

Warhawk

Give blood and save a life!
Staff member
#912
#912
kingsboi said:
I once read that in order to perfect your craft, one must work at it for up to 10,000 hours and perhaps more. He must of got a head start coming out of the womb compared to his peers who didn't make it.
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Practicing against his twin, no doubt.
 
TaxMan

TaxMan

Starter
#913
#913
Tetsujin said:
I knew Keegan was a good shooter (Kyle Kuzma-ish) but I never thought he was ever going to be this good a shooter (Klay Thompson?!?!?!) let alone as a rookie. The offball movement skills discussion is an interesting one because going into this year I thought that Kris was the better offball player but that might have just been the fact Keegan had the ball in his hands so much at Iowa clouding my perception of him.

I certainly wish he'd be more aggressive with the possessions that he does get and that the Kings would be a little more proactive in finding ways to get him the ball but I'm not sure those paint touches will ever come at this level while he's in lineups with Domantas Sabonis. (if they tried playing Keegan with the second unit a little more, however...)

Defensively, Keegan's taken a bit of a leap as a backside help defender over the last couple of weeks that's been really encouraging. He's still struggling overall when he gets switched onto guards but he's also put together impressive possesions on the ball on defense on occasion that really gives me hope on that side of the ball.

If Keegan inexplicably never improves from this point on, he's still a solid 4th overall pick but nothing about how he's played/how he's put together seems to suggest that he's even remotely close to being a finished product.
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I think for the rest of the year, this is probably about what Keegan will be. Lethal shooter, maybe a couple short slumps, putting up mostly threes, and steadily improving with his team defense and awareness. However, I really do believe we see a big jump from him next year. I'm guessing they work hard with him over the summer dribble drives, floaters, going up strong, etc. That's all pretty much non-existent right now, but based on his college days seems like it's more a matter of him having a hard time adjusting to NBA athleticism and physicality. If he tightens all that up, I think we could see a really big leap next year.
 
Ozymandias

Ozymandias

All-Star
#914
#914
I largely disagree with most of the shade being thrown at Keegan but I simply dont care to pick thru it.

The way I see it is, we have a good team and balanced attack(last nights game 6 players score 13 or more), if the Kings had a bad team Keegan could easily be averaging 15ppg on it right now. He averaged 17.4ppg in the october games but we lost 3 out of those 5. We also have so many potential hothands(even Terence Davis dropped 30 on the nets that one game we scored 150 in regulation) it'd be crazy not to let them cook a bit, n check to see whos hot, the Kings average 27.1 assists per game thats 3rd in the league, we're sharing the ball around here..

Ultimately, He's shooting 41% from 3, so the main thing we need from him he's been plenty proficient at, rookie year! More and more we see him actually as the SG in the lineup too. Keegan will be a rookie that hopefully starts 70+ games in a season we break the longest playoff drought in nba history, right? he's doing FINE! Thats what people will remember about his rookie year.. Him getting such a volume of 3's (6 attempts per) could really pay dividends down the line, thats a lot of reps/looks we're getting him.


The biggest headscratcher to me, does he not look like a player who could uptick to 15ish ppg within a season or 2 and then to 20ppg a few seasons after that? cuz to me he still does..

We're only halfway thru too.. I see no reason why he couldnt have the type of month that redefines whats normal and expected, he could uptick to 15ppg in a month to close season --- thing is, we play to win the game.. this is not like some college style showcasing, its a matter of the playoffs..

What if he plays as bad as his biggest detractors on the forum say he does, for a few months, then explodes in the playoffs? There'd genuinely be some confusion around hereo_O... IDK i just see so many scenarios and no reason for concern at this time.
 
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iowamcnabb

iowamcnabb

Hall of Famer
#915
#915
What shade is being thrown his way? I can’t say I’ve seen a ton. A few criticisms here and there but nothing too crazy. He has his flaws and I think fans always want a guy that can iso but all and all he is having a great rookie season. He is learning at a rapid rate just as he did in college. His archetype will always be super valuable in the league
 
R

Remi

Bench
#916
#916
Ozymandias said:
I largely disagree with most of the shade being thrown at Keegan but I simply dont care to pick thru it.
Ultimately, He's shooting 41% from 3, so the main thing we need from him he's been plenty proficient at, rookie year! More and more we see him actually as the SG in the lineup too. Keegan will be a rookie that hopefully starts 70+ games in a season we break the longest playoff drought in nba history, right? he's doing FINE! Thats what people will remember about his rookie year.. Him getting such a volume of 3's in his rookie year (6 attempts per) could really pay dividends down the line, thats a lot of reps/looks we're getting him.
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Yes, Keegan is fine as a rookie and has a room to grow up. But .... If people understand Keegan's flaws and understand that rookie needs to grow and work on his skills, then please fans stop behave like he is a saviour of Kings team.
 
pdxKingsFan

pdxKingsFan

So Ordinary That It's Truly Quite Extraordinary
Staff member
#917
#917
We're hoping he turns into the clear #3 behind Domas and Fox. Hardly expecting a savior!

The thing that impresses me most is he does what he does while contributing to winning play. A lot of those things are the things the guys with the obvious physical tools just never put together. My biggest concern drafting Bagley was that he would be a 20-10 guy on a < .400 team. We would see flashes of brilliance from him but they were almost always flashes of individual brilliance.

Keegan is both a smart player and a hard hat player. He'll get a checklist of things to work on in the offseason and if the way we've seen Fox and Domas pop after one offseason is any indication we should see Keegan make a big leap in Y2.
 
R

Remi

Bench
#918
#918
pdxKingsFan said:
We're hoping he turns into the clear #3 behind Domas and Fox. Hardly expecting a savior!
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Disagree.... On the way media and fans behaving before season and during first half, they still see Keegan as saviour. They needed this hype before season, because majority didnt expected Kings to be so good this year. Or some people needed to have new love, when Hali got traded.
And when I see thread with biggest posts number(now 31st page), this means to me that people are really hyped on this. I do not see so much love and attention for other Kings players...
 
D

Das_Boot

Bench
#919
#919
Remi said:
Disagree.... On the way media and fans behaving before season and during first half, they still see Keegan as saviour. They needed this hype before season, because majority didnt expected Kings to be so good this year. Or some people needed to have new love, when Hali got traded.
And when I see thread with biggest posts number(now 31st page), this means to me that people are really hyped on this. I do not see so much love and attention for other Kings players...
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This thread goes back to July 15th. 5 pages a month isn't exactly noteworthy. The last game thread had 14 pages in less than 48 hours. Are we hyped that our rook is playing well. Of course. And Keegan earning the Western conference rookie of the month honors suggests we're not the only ones taking notice. But no one here is labeling him a franchise savior. Especially with Sabonis firmly slotted in that role. That's as hyperbolic a statement as your Murray sucks comment in the last game thread.
 
R

Remi

Bench
#920
#920
Das_Boot said:
This thread goes back to July 15th. 5 pages a month isn't exactly noteworthy. The last game thread had 14 pages in less than 48 hours. Are we hyped that our rook is playing well. Of course. And Keegan earning the Western conference rookie of the month honors suggests we're not the only ones taking notice. But no one here is labeling him a franchise savior. Especially with Sabonis firmly slotted in that role. That's as hyperbolic a statement as your Murray sucks comment in the last game thread.
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First of all, I like Keegan and I am not his hater, just he has many things which need to be fixed (but it is not a suprise for a rookie) - but I still think that fans hype is overreacted IMHO. Just look to Huerter, Monk, Sabonis, or Fox threads - and you will see difference in post quantities and love they get.

About my comment that Murray sucks on last game - yes, he was playing bad at that time, he had 1 from 5 shots and 0 from 3, with some bad defence. And I dont see a problem to state that player sucks if he really sucks. If you had "love glasses" on you, then maybe you didint see that. By the way, later in the game Keegan started to play better. Just in overal he had 37% shooting ( 20% from 3), 8 points and worst in the team -4.
 
Spike

Spike

Subsidiary Intermediary
Staff member
#921
#921
Remi said:
First of all, I like Keegan and I am not his hater, just he has many things which need to be fixed (but it is not a suprise for a rookie) - but I still think that fans hype is overreacted IMHO. Just look to Huerter, Monk, Sabonis, or Fox threads - and you will see difference in post quantities and love they get.

About my comment that Murray sucks on last game - yes, he was playing bad at that time, he had 1 from 5 shots and 0 from 3, with some bad defence. And I dont see a problem to state that player sucks if he really sucks. If you had "love glasses" on you, then maybe you didint see that. By the way, later in the game Keegan started to play better. Just in overal he had 37% shooting ( 20% from 3), 8 points and worst in the team -4.
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Why say he sucks if he's having a bad game? Players lay eggs from time to time - don't tell me you give your A game every day at work; there are times we all just punch in and punch out, because we're human. The overall picture shows a great investment for what we needed from the pick, and he's frankly performing better than we thought he would.

And it's not surprising that Keegan has 31 pages, but we've been talking about him all year precisely because he's a rookie. We know what the other players give us - we don't know about what Keegan will do / how he'll grow, which is why the thread is continuously evolving.

Fox and Domas have received their "any questions" posts precisely because we know what they can do. And those are a couple pages long when they pop up.
 
R

Remi

Bench
#922
#922
Spike said:
Why say he sucks if he's having a bad game? Players lay eggs from time to time - don't tell me you give your A game every day at work; there are times we all just punch in and punch out, because we're human. The overall picture shows a great investment for what we needed from the pick, and he's frankly performing better than we thought he would.

And it's not surprising that Keegan has 31 pages, but we've been talking about him all year precisely because he's a rookie. We know what the other players give us - we don't know about what Keegan will do / how he'll grow, which is why the thread is continuously evolving.

Fox and Domas have received their "any questions" posts precisely because we know what they can do. And those are a couple pages long when they pop up.
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Xe xe xe, you are funy :D
Asking and on the same giving answer.... If he is having bad game, means he is bad and sucks. Maybe only on that particular game, but he sucks. Why do you deny obvious and clear thing?
Also, people dont know what Keegan will bring and thats why you talk so much about him? :D yes, please talk more and Keegan will listen to you and because of this he will grow up to superstar ... Who knows...
About Domas and Fox - open last year threads, or no - will be enough to open start of this season threads and read them : you will see a lot of not knowing about them and how the are bad...

I dont want to create hate or bad vibe discussion, which will continue through many pages - I just wanted to point to people that no need to be overhyped (like some were/are with Hali and some are now with Keegan).

PEACE! :)
LIGHT THE BEAM! :)
 
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