Sasha Watch 2022-2023

Kingz19

Kingz19

Hall of Famer
#31
#31
iowamcnabb said:
is Sasha his middle name?
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Sasha is short hand for Aleksander. Former NBA Sasha’s like Sasha Pavlovic and Sasha Vujacic are also named Aleksander

ockingsfan said:
Well, I think one of the reasons he didn't come over this past off season was due to the fact the he had no clear path to 20-25 minutes per game and that is with very questionable depth at the backup PF/SF (Lyles/Metu/KZ) spot. If he didn't see a clear path to enough minutes with Barnes here and IF we re-sign Barnes this summer, the situation would be the same minutes wise as last off season.

Sasha still has options with his salary in Europe. What he misses on a higher NBA salary, he could ultimately make up and make more on endorsements for a Euroleague MVP.
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Well we don’t really know why it didn’t come to pass this season. The likely reason is he was still under contract with his current club. Those contracts are usually honored before a player comes over. I believe that expires after this season.

The parties ultimately never met last off-season. So I think it never really got to the negotiation and “how much will he play” stage. It’s more likely the Kings wanted to wait and see how he looked this season and how the Kings looked this season. He’s made a major leap this season and it’s a lot more obvious where he would fit in on a Kings team.

I think the kings will definitely try to bring him over next season. I’m less definitive about whether they will stick with Barnes long term, but the HB discussion is a different thread all together
 
Capt. Factorial

Capt. Factorial

ceterum censeo delendum esse Argentum
Staff member
#32
#32
The_Jamal said:
I'm not entirely sure how the draft rights work, but do we need cap space to sign him or do we have "bird rights" to go over the cap on any potential deal?
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We need cap space to sign him. We are currently committed to about $103M next year, but that would not include a cap hold for Harrison Barnes. If we renounce everybody -- including Barnes -- we could open up about $20M in cap room to sign Vezenkov. (This would seem to be a poor strategy, as it would devastate our depth for the sake of signing one player.)

Clearly we will have the MLE ($11M) which we could use - whether that would be much, if any, better than what Vezenkov could secure in Europe I will leave to those with better understandings of European basketball salaries. I do know that European salaries are usually listed "post-taxes" while NBA salaries are "pre-taxes", and that obviously does not favor NBA contracts.
 
Kingz19

Kingz19

Hall of Famer
#33
#33
Capt. Factorial said:
We need cap space to sign him. We are currently committed to about $103M next year, but that would not include a cap hold for Harrison Barnes. If we renounce everybody -- including Barnes -- we could open up about $20M in cap room to sign Vezenkov. (This would seem to be a poor strategy, as it would devastate our depth for the sake of signing one player.)

Clearly we will have the MLE ($11M) which we could use - whether that would be much, if any, better than what Vezenkov could secure in Europe I will leave to those with better understandings of European basketball salaries. I do know that European salaries are usually listed "post-taxes" while NBA salaries are "pre-taxes", and that obviously does not favor NBA contracts.
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Doesn’t the salary cap raise by $10-11 million next offseason? Potentially opening up $30 million+ in that scenario?
 
Capt. Factorial

Capt. Factorial

ceterum censeo delendum esse Argentum
Staff member
#34
#34
Kingz19 said:
Doesn’t the salary cap raise by $10-11 million next offseason? Potentially opening up $30 million+ in that scenario?
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A lot of that gets taken up by our hold for our first round pick and roster holds (hypothetical minimum contracts to fill the roster up to 12 players) since we would only have 7 players under contract. Maybe we squeeze $23M out, tops, and we have to renounce our MLE and BAE to do that, so filling out the roster gets dicey.

The bottom line is that if it's going to take about $15M to get Vezenkov to come over, we will have to lose Barnes and most of our non-minimum back-of-rotation depth (e.g. Lyles, TD, Len) to get him. This might be a bad call. However, if we can get Vezenkov for the MLE, we can retain Barnes as well as most of the depth pieces and still find a way to stay under/close to the luxury tax for a few years even if we give Sabonis a max contract.

My guess is that we offered Sasha the BAE last year, and that didn't get it done. Fair enough. This year I'd negotiate up to the full MLE, but if that's not enough then I'd have to tell him to enjoy Europe, and see if I could trade his rights to a team that would give us value for them.

The entire equation changes if we somehow trade Richaun for expiring contracts, but A) I don't think that can happen, and B) the last few games he has looked like a contributor again so I'm not sure we want to.
 
T

The_Jamal

Hall of Famer
#35
#35
I mean, assuming we don't get involved with the RFA guys, I think Sasha is probably one of the better options we can go get to really address team needs. Just everything about his game screams it'd be so elite next to Sabonis passing.
 
iowamcnabb

iowamcnabb

Hall of Famer
#36
#36
The_Jamal said:
I mean, assuming we don't get involved with the RFA guys, I think Sasha is probably one of the better options we can go get to really address team needs. Just everything about his game screams it'd be so elite next to Sabonis passing.
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are you thinking as a starter? Defense, both interior and on the perimeter has to be addressed if we are going to take the next step. Unless we trade the rights to our first round pick on draft day, a free agent signing is about the only way to improve on that end. If we keep our pick it’s hard to rely on a rookie to be great defensively year one. I have no idea how Monte plans to navigate this offseason
 
kingsboi

kingsboi

Hall of Famer
#37
#37
iowamcnabb said:
are you thinking as a starter? Defense, both interior and on the perimeter has to be addressed if we are going to take the next step. Unless we trade the rights to our first round pick on draft day, a free agent signing is about the only way to improve on that end. If we keep our pick it’s hard to rely on a rookie to be great defensively year one. I have no idea how Monte plans to navigate this offseason
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Mo Bamba for the interior. Options on the perimeter are Okogie, Covington, Eric Gordon & Jasean Tate
 
MizzouKing

MizzouKing

Starter
#39
#39
midtowner said:
I think it’s telling that Mike James is number 2 on the MVP ladder this year. James clearly has NBA talent - but can’t find a role that suits him in the NBA. I think Sasha is smart in that his comments last year suggested he wasn’t thinking of coming to the NBA just because it’s the best league - but that if an interested team offered him a suitable role that could be a possibility.

I don’t watch his games - but his off ball movement, shooting and rebounding are potentially good fits for what the Kings do.
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That is where my thoughts are… why go from being “the man” in Europe (with a starring role and umpteen thousands of fans) to be an unknown coming off the bench in the NBA? Is the prestige really all that? And didn’t Delly take a pay cut to come back and work for Brown? I think Sasha has his head on straight!
 
hrdboild

hrdboild

Moloch in whom I dream Angels!
Staff member
#40
#40
MizzouKing said:
That is where my thoughts are… why go from being “the man” in Europe (with a starring role and umpteen thousands of fans) to be an unknown coming off the bench in the NBA? Is the prestige really all that? And didn’t Delly take a pay cut to come back and work for Brown? I think Sasha has his head on straight!
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I wonder if he'd be more willing to come over next season to play for a successful Kings team instead of non-guaranteed minutes on a perennial loser (which is all we could offer him last summer).
 
2

206Fan

All-Star
#41
#41
hrdboild said:
I wonder if he'd be more willing to come over next season to play for a successful Kings team instead of non-guaranteed minutes on a perennial loser (which is all we could offer him last summer).
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I think the real reason why he opted to stay in Europe last season was because of $$$. He’s 27-years-old, and playing the best basketball of his career. He’ll be 28 next year, and this is the age where good NBA players are already onto their 3rd contracts.

We signed Bogi for 3yrs $36million years back. I don’t think Sasha would settle for anything less than that.
 
S

serbiangoat

Starter
#43
#43
MizzouKing said:
That is where my thoughts are… why go from being “the man” in Europe (with a starring role and umpteen thousands of fans) to be an unknown coming off the bench in the NBA? Is the prestige really all that? And didn’t Delly take a pay cut to come back and work for Brown? I think Sasha has his head on straight!
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I think most guys want to come over for 1 season at least to try it out, there have been plenty of guys to do that, Campazzo did a similar thing where he went from being one of the better PG's playing for Real Madrid to a 3rd stringer and washing out. He can always go back to being the man a season later.
 
T

The_Jamal

Hall of Famer
#44
#44
iowamcnabb said:
are you thinking as a starter? Defense, both interior and on the perimeter has to be addressed if we are going to take the next step. Unless we trade the rights to our first round pick on draft day, a free agent signing is about the only way to improve on that end. If we keep our pick it’s hard to rely on a rookie to be great defensively year one. I have no idea how Monte plans to navigate this offseason
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Assuming Sasha is your MLE target and we bring Barnes back, no. I don't think it would really matter as all of them would have a path to big minutes and rotating at the 3/4 interchangeably. And do we know Sasha is a defensive sieve? Maybe @serbiangoat can talk more about his defense/rebounding

Defense, you pretty much have to go draft at this point. The archetype we need is basically never available in FA or in the trade market. The good news is defense at C is available pretty much every off-season.
 
S

serbiangoat

Starter
#45
#45
The_Jamal said:
Assuming Sasha is your MLE target and we bring Barnes back, no. I don't think it would really matter as all of them would have a path to big minutes and rotating at the 3/4 interchangeably. And do we know Sasha is a defensive sieve? Maybe @serbiangoat can talk more about his defense/rebounding

Defense, you pretty much have to go draft at this point. The archetype we need is basically never available in FA or in the trade market. The good news is defense at C is available pretty much every off-season.
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I would say he's a better rebounder than Bjelly (1st season Kings) but a worse defender. I think on the Kings if Sabonis is the starting C he's better coming off the bench. It's hard to gauge his defense because he's playing a way different role as a #1 option and he will play a completely different role for the Kings. But athletically he will somewhat struggle if your asking him to guard any mobile SF/PF.

His defense won't matter at the end of the day if the Kings are bringing him over it's for his insane and effective quick release/post up ability and good size not anything else. I guess he could be sort of our Kings, Cavs version of Kevin Love minus the passing ability (does make good decisions) and a bit less rebounding (Love is elite rebounder/was).
 
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iowamcnabb

iowamcnabb

Hall of Famer
#46
#46
serbiangoat said:
I would say he's a better rebounder than Bjelly (1st season Kings) but a worse defender. I think on the Kings if Sabonis is the starting C he's better coming off the bench. It's hard to gauge his defense because he's playing a way different role as a #1 option and he will play a completely different role for the Kings. But athletically he will somewhat struggle if your asking him to guard any mobile SF/PF.

His defense won't matter at the end of the day if the Kings are bringing him over it's for his insane and effective quick release/post up ability and good size not anything else. I guess he could be sort of our Kings, Cavs version of Kevin Love minus the passing ability (does make good decisions) and a bit less rebounding (Love is elite rebounder/was).
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I don’t have a strong opinion on Sasha as I haven’t seen anything but highlights but that assessment makes me wonder if we should just sign Love? If he is is a better passer and rebounder and shoots 40 percent from three maybe thats a better option. His age is the downside but he could end up cheaper. And the next question, is either of those a big enough upgrade over Lyles who has played pretty well this year? I’m glad I don’t have to make those decisions because I just don’t know.
 
Kingz19

Kingz19

Hall of Famer
#47
#47
iowamcnabb said:
I don’t have a strong opinion on Sasha as I haven’t seen anything but highlights but that assessment makes me wonder if we should just sign Love? If he is is a better passer and rebounder and shoots 40 percent from three maybe thats a better option. His age is the downside but he could end up cheaper. And the next question, is either of those a big enough upgrade over Lyles who has played pretty well this year? I’m glad I don’t have to make those decisions because I just don’t know.
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Love doesn’t have the potentially elite off ball movement that Vezenkov may offer…and will be 35 next season. We also don’t have the draft rights to Kevin Love and would be an unlikely destination for him when he’s a free agent. I would actually like a passer and rebounder like Love off the bench but I think he’s sure to go fortify a larger market roster. In fact, I’m quite positive he will reunite with LeBron for peanuts next off-season.

I would expect him to be an upgrade over Lyles. This thread would’ve been dead awhile ago if that was even a question.


I don’t think it’s going to be as difficult/tricky/convoluted to bring Sasha over as some are suggesting here. It didn’t happen this off-season likely because they had already chose to spend their MLE on Malik Monk before they even acquired his rights. They couldn’t offer him any decent money even before getting around a buyout with his current contract, which rarely happens with euro players even when they have committed to playing in the NBA. They typically play out their Euroleague contracts. We knew Bogdan was coming, but we had to wait for him to complete his contract.

I think it’s very likely during last offseason it was purely a prospective situation with an eye towards next season. There was never an official meeting and I just don’t think they expected to bring him over for as little as they could legitimately offer him..

I also don’t agree with the salary figures people are throwing out there to get him over.

Then there is the backdrop idea that the Kings absolutely would/should retain Harrison Barnes, as much as we all like him…but that’s a different thread.
 
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iowamcnabb

iowamcnabb

Hall of Famer
#48
#48
Kingz19 said:
Love doesn’t have the potentially elite off ball movement that Vezenkov may offer…and will be 35 next season. We also don’t have the draft rights to Kevin Love and would be an unlikely destination for him when he’s a free agent. I would actually like a passer and rebounder like Love off the bench but I think he’s sure to go fortify a larger market roster. In fact, I’m quite positive he will reunite with LeBron for peanuts next off-season.

I would expect him to be an upgrade over Lyles. This thread would’ve been dead awhile ago if that was even a question.


I don’t think it’s going to be as difficult/tricky/convoluted to bring Sasha over as some are suggesting here. It didn’t happen this off-season likely because they had already chose to spend their MLE on Malik Monk before they even acquired his rights. They couldn’t offer him any decent money even before getting around a buyout with his current contract, which rarely happens with euro players even when they have committed to playing in the NBA. They typically play out their Euroleague contracts. We knew Bogdan was coming, but we had to wait for him to complete his contract.

I think it’s very likely during last offseason it was purely a prospective situation with an eye towards next season. There was never an official meeting and I just don’t think they expected to bring him over for as little as they could legitimately offer him..

I also don’t agree with the salary figures people are throwing out there to get him over.

Then there is the backdrop idea that the Kings absolutely would/should retain Harrison Barnes, as much as we all like him…but that’s a different thread.
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LA is a possibility for Love but I won’t be surprised if he ends up in Sacramento either. He is a Cali native and we are a competitive team. I have no idea if Monte is interested though

He might come over but he was drafted in 2017. Teams have had his rights for 6 years and so I don’t think it’s guaranteed he plays in the NBA. This off-season makes the most sense for him to so.
 
iowamcnabb

iowamcnabb

Hall of Famer
#49
#49
If I was Sasha and loved Europe but wanted to see how I stack up in the worlds best league I would be looking for a 3 year deal. If things don’t work out I could then return to Euro ball at 30.
 
T

The_Jamal

Hall of Famer
#54
#54
Oof. That gives his camp all the leverage in any negotiating tactic if he were to consider coming over at all. But yeah, seems very unlikely he'd ink a new deal mid-season if he had any inclination of coming over.
 
sactowndog

sactowndog

All-Star
#55
#55
serbiangoat said:
I think once he get's here people will realize the reality of it that his game is not made for the NBA, i hope I'm wrong but I can't see it translating at a high level.
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I’m curious why. He would get wide open shots with Fox and Domas kicking out from the paint. Defense could be a real issue.
 
pdxKingsFan

pdxKingsFan

So Ordinary That It's Truly Quite Extraordinary
Staff member
#57
#57
I thought I remember reports of him being offered a significant raise to stay but I couldn't find any news of a new contract after 2021, so maybe contracts are just refreshed on a different timeline? I remember over the summer there was a lot of discussion on why there is no way the BAE would get it done but on twitter lately there's a lot of chatter like it would have. I do know that Euro salaries are reported post-tax whereas in the US they are reported pre-tax and thus 40-50% higher on average than the comparable Euro salary would appear. And from what I can tell Sasha's buyout was at the exact amount an NBA team can pay - so at least he wouldn't be on the hook for it out of his contract - as buyouts over this threshold (I believe 750k) can not be paid by the team and are thus paid by the player back to their original team.
 
ockingsfan

ockingsfan

Starter
#58
#58
iowamcnabb said:
I don’t think that rules out the NBA but it probably makes it unlikely.
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This might actually make it more likely he comes over next season, but will use this to demand a higher salary.

I’m sure his agent is smart enough to use this as leverage on any NBA contract. Pay me a minimum of 3 years/$36+ mil or I’m staying in Europe. The Kings will need to pay him starter money, or he ain’t coming over!
 
pdxKingsFan

pdxKingsFan

So Ordinary That It's Truly Quite Extraordinary
Staff member
#59
#59
ockingsfan said:
This might actually make it more likely he comes over next season, but will use this to demand a higher salary.

I’m sure his agent is smart enough to use this as leverage on any NBA contract. Pay me a minimum of 3 years/$36+ mil or I’m staying in Europe. The Kings will need to pay him starter money, or he ain’t coming over!
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I'm pretty sure they came over last summer with the BAE and he turned it down - although he also wanted a guaranteed role. Obviously he'll be hardballing for the full MLE which is probably fine. Who would we sign with it anyways?
 
kingsboi

kingsboi

Hall of Famer
#60
#60
I don't think he will be coming to the NBA after inking that new deal and why would he? he's in MVP talks in his league, gets big bucks, starter minutes and is a big name in that country. Only reason he would come over would be on the downside of his career to test out how the NBA functions. Kind of like Teodosic did. Played his whole prime overseas.
 
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