Fire Walton

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iowamcnabb

iowamcnabb

Hall of Famer
#751
#751
If this team was serious about making the play in they have to make a run now and that would require a spark that generally comes after a coaching change. I’m not advocating for it, but I could see the Kings going on a 7 of 8 run again after a change. That probably puts us in the mix. Again, not what I want as I’m back on the tank but if Vivek really wants to get in that’s the only path.
 
SacTownKid

SacTownKid

Hall of Famer
#755
#755
midtowner said:
We have the right coach for what our organization needs right now. Locker room seems cool and the Lins keep coming.
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Don't listen, watch. The games tell us a different story. Body language goes a long way and while Luke is certainly someone nobody can hate on a personal level since he seems like a fairly decent players coach the doubt is creeping in with only brief moments of pride coming through. These are things that can resonate long after that coach is gone if allowed to continue and create bad habits. Which it is being allowed to do.
 
steelevt

steelevt

All-Star
#758
#758
sactowndog said:
If a GM doesn’t have enough control in his organization to prevent a player from being overplayed to the point of being injured then he should quit now!

Good lord how many excuses can we make for the guy in charge.
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why stop the blame there, vivek is his boss. vivek should quit. or better yet fox is the boss of his own body, fox should fire himself :rolleyes:
 
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serbiangoat

Starter
#763
#763
I can't wait to see who the next scapegoat will be next season this year it's been Walton/Cojo/Bjelica and it will be rinse and repeat all over again blaming everyone aside from our "superstars' and more pretending our unproven rookies are rotation players and they eventually wash out of the league in a few years.
 
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Siranthony

Starter
#764
#764
SacTownKid said:
There is still time left but as incompetent as this franchise has been since Vivek took over if there aren't some heads rolling after this season then this can't and won't ever be fixed. They will simply have to luck into a winning atmosphere at some point. My issue is why not give Gentry a little time to assess what he can do. If they fire Walton in the offseason only to hand over the team to Gentry then they wasted precious evaluation potential. They have very little left to even do that at this point but there is still sliver of daylight.
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I dont see Gentry as a plan for our future. Firing a coach mid season is Kangs. Ride it out to the end of the season. Firing anyone now just makes things worse.
 
T

The_Jamal

Hall of Famer
#765
#765
serbiangoat said:
I can't wait to see who the next scapegoat will be next season this year it's been Walton/Cojo/Bjelica and it will be rinse and repeat all over again blaming everyone aside from our "superstars' and more pretending our unproven rookies are rotation players and they eventually wash out of the league in a few years.
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@sactowndog already found him for us, it's McNair. Everything is his fault apparently.
 
hrdboild

hrdboild

Moloch in whom I dream Angels!
Staff member
#766
#766
serbiangoat said:
I can't wait to see who the next scapegoat will be next season this year it's been Walton/Cojo/Bjelica and it will be rinse and repeat all over again blaming everyone aside from our "superstars' and more pretending our unproven rookies are rotation players and they eventually wash out of the league in a few years.
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If we're only going to win 30 games again next season, there legitimately will be some individuals more responsible for our poor performance than others. Will the soliloquys devoted to their various failings be exaggerated to the high heavens? Undoubtedly. It's the internet. You can just assume that 30% of everything written semi-anonymously is hot air. But there's still an element of truth to it. And there's only so much praise you can give to a last place team without feeling disingenuous.
 
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serbiangoat

Starter
#768
#768
Gguod said:
The only objectives for the rest of the season should be to give experience to young players and secure as high draft pick as possible. Still this coach plays Fox and Barnes +40min back to back. I would laugh if I wasnt so pissed
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Team should have tanked at the deadline instead we got "upgrades" and traded away 2nd round picks who had a small chance of turning into productive NBA players while the "upgrades" the Kings got were complete duds and made the team worse than scapegoats Cojo/Bjelly. This is like the 3rd time in 3 years they have done the same thing and it's backfired or had no effect instead of going all out tank.

It's the same mistake every single year from believing the Kings have a superstar player (Cousins/Fox) and paying them like it when they are not #1 guys. On top of that they grossly overpaid average role players who don't help you win at all (Barnes/Gay/Buddy/Dedmon) meaning you can only sign scrubs/expiring contracts and hope they have brief career resurgence.
 
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chief bromden

chief bromden

Starter
#769
#769
serbiangoat said:
Team should have tanked at the deadline instead we got "upgrades" and traded away 2nd round picks who had a small chance of turning into productive NBA players while the "upgrades" the Kings got were complete duds and made the team worse than scapegoats Cojo/Bjelly. This is like the 3rd time in 3 years they have done the same thing and it's backfired or had no effect instead of going all out tank.

It's the same mistake every single year from believing the Kings have a superstar player (Cousins/Fox) and paying them like it when they are not #1 guys. On top of that they grossly overpaid average role players who don't help you win at all (Barnes/Gay/Buddy/Dedmon) meaning you can only sign scrubs/expiring contracts and hope they have brief career resurgence.
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The Kings are tanking though? You are greatly overvaluing second round picks.
 
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serbiangoat

Starter
#770
#770
chief bromden said:
The Kings are tanking though? You are greatly overvaluing second round picks.
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No I'm not there is a tiny chance a 2nd round pick brings a /rotation/good ;player where as what the Kings got is a 0% chance of helping. They're clearly not tanking no tanking team plays their PG 40 minutes back to back they're tanking as a result of being crap not cause they are trying to tank.
 
chief bromden

chief bromden

Starter
#771
#771
serbiangoat said:
No I'm not there is a tiny chance a 2nd round pick brings a /rotation/good ;player where as what the Kings got is a 0% chance of helping. They're clearly not tanking no tanking team plays their PG 40 minutes back to back they're tanking as a result of being crap not cause they are trying to tank.
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So you are upset at the intent of the franchise? If the Kings traded for more 2nd round picks and sat Fox and Tyrese for the rest of the season, then lost 9 in a row... That's better than how they actually have lost 9 in a row?

They still have their own 2nd, and now they don't have to lock up roster spots on even more second rounders on top of the second rounders from this season. Empty roster spots have value too...
 
G

Gguod

Bench
#774
#774
chief bromden said:
So you are upset at the intent of the franchise? If the Kings traded for more 2nd round picks and sat Fox and Tyrese for the rest of the season, then lost 9 in a row... That's better than how they actually have lost 9 in a row?
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Yes thats better. That way you dont risk injuries for Fox or Barnes, you can give bigger minutes and role for Haliburton and the other young players thus giving them valuable experience and in the long run you win more games by playing your vets huge minutes vs limited minutes AND giving bigger role to young players. Since at this point of the season all the future wins are meaningless and counter productive, the strategy should be limiting vet minutes and playing the young guys.

Also 2nd round picks by themself arent so valuable but the more you collect them, the more you increase the odds of finding super cheap contributors with restricted rights or being able to move up in the draft or using them to get guys like Davis or good vets when you are ready to be competitive. Thats why you probably shouldnt give two of them for a guy like Delon Wright at this point when the team isnt nearly good enough anyways. You'll easily find a guy like Wright in the free agency or trade market once you are actually ready to compete.

Disregarding the value of 2nd rounders is short sighted. One of them doesnt do you much but four of them can get you better odds in the draft or better options to trade up in the draft/trade for a vet.
 
chief bromden

chief bromden

Starter
#776
#776
Gguod said:
Yes thats better. That way you dont risk injuries for Fox or Barnes, you can give bigger minutes and role for Haliburton and the other young players thus giving them valuable experience and in the long run you win more games by playing your vets huge minutes vs limited minutes AND giving bigger role to young players. Since at this point of the season all the future wins are meaningless and counter productive, the strategy should be limiting vet minutes and playing the young guys.

Also 2nd round picks by themself arent so valuable but the more you collect them, the more you increase the odds of finding super cheap contributors with restricted rights or being able to move up in the draft or using them to get guys like Davis or good vets when you are ready to be competitive. Thats why you probably shouldnt give two of them for a guy like Delon Wright at this point when the team isnt nearly good enough anyways. You'll easily find a guy like Wright in the free agency or trade market once you are actually ready to compete.

Disregarding the value of 2nd rounders is short sighted. One of them doesnt do you much but four of them can get you better odds in the draft or better options to trade up in the draft/trade for a vet.
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Disregarding them? I am honoring their value, which is small. Yeah, you can trade second rounders to move up in the draft... usually in the 2nd round, and usually to make sure you get a guy you are targeting, who still has a very small chance of ever getting a second contract. Why is that more value than having the roster spot to sign an undrafted free agent like Jae'Sean Tate? This worship of 2nd rounders is astounding to me.
 
G

Gguod

Bench
#777
#777
chief bromden said:
Disregarding them? I am honoring their value, which is small. Yeah, you can trade second rounders to move up in the draft... usually in the 2nd round, and usually to make sure you get a guy you are targeting, who still has a very small chance of ever getting a second contract. Why is that more value than having the roster spot to sign an undrafted free agent like Jae'Sean Tate? This worship of 2nd rounders is astounding to me.
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I probably wasnt clear but I wasn't directly talking to you with that 2nd round stuff. To you I was responding to that general strategy stuff like wether we should play Fox&Barnes +40min a game. 2nd round stuff was more in general and a little in response to:
Livinthedream said:
We're talking 2nd round picks. Not lottery picks. 2nd round. Wow .
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But as I said having multiple additional present and future 2nds is only a positive thing. If you are worried about roster spots and don't feel like any worthwhile prospects are left you can very often trade your pick to a future 2nd and that way your asset chest will be the almost the same regardles. If you feel like there is a great prospect left at 32, you can use one additional 2nd to go and get him. You can maybe use multiple to get back in to the late first round ect. If you just want to take multiple bites of the apple you can draft multiple guys and your odds of getting even one 2nd contract player/trade asset will increase.

Having extra 2nds to spare is always a good thing near the trade deadline if you want to either trade for a vet (when you are ready to compete) or dump some salary. Basically the point is that its always a positive when you have them and they shouldnt be thought as close to zero value (i'm not saying you think that way but thats how I think about them: they are not close to zero in value). I'm not saying a single 2nd round pick is some high value asset. I'm saying there is a lot you can do with them and having more is much better than having less so they should be treated as such
 
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ShastaKingsFan

ShastaKingsFan

All-Star
#779
#779
chief bromden said:
So you are upset at the intent of the franchise? If the Kings traded for more 2nd round picks and sat Fox and Tyrese for the rest of the season, then lost 9 in a row... That's better than how they actually have lost 9 in a row?

.
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The intent is questionable, because what if they had not lost 9 in a row twice? What if by chance, they had won....lets say 3-4 of those games? What if by chance, they get "hot" again for a few games the rest of the season?

The whole operation is again, extremely short sighted
 
whozit

whozit

Starter
#780
#780
ShastaKingsFan said:
The intent is questionable, because what if they had not lost 9 in a row twice? What if by chance, they had won....lets say 3-4 of those games? What if by chance, they get "hot" again for a few games the rest of the season?

The whole operation is again, extremely short sighted
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"IF," the most powerful yet meaningless word in the English language.
 
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