Vlade as GM (split)

[kingsboi]

First off I hated, HATED the Papagiannis pick.

But it's worth pointing out that Vlade saw him workout in person before the draft. Georgios had an open workout that a lot of NBA team attended. Also, Ainge was looking to take Papagiannis with the Celtics 16th pick. When he was off the board the Celtics took Yabusele.

Ainge (who is definitely a good GM) saw the same things Vlade did - huge frame but with room to cut fat and add muscle, decent quickness, solid shooting mechanics and range, nice skill set as a roll man and some possible rim protection.

Papa was a swing and a miss presumably (and from the little I've heard) because he wasnt committed to putting in the hard work.

Also, that was a terrible draft at the end of the lottery and down being pretty bare for the most part. I liked LeVert and he'd have been a better pick but I also like Baldwin and he was cut even earlier than Papa.

Obviously not a high point for Divac as GM but considering it as Skal and Bogdan plus a gamble on Papagiannis in exchange for Chriss and it's still a net positive.

Honestly I've never hated Kings draft selections more on draft night. Nobody had Papa as a first round pick (except DX who moved him to #22 I believe based on some intel about Ainge liking him), Malachi was just an inefficient chucker IMO and Skal just looked lost and soft at Kentucky.

I was least upset about Skal at #28 but I still was hoping for DeJounte Murray there.

But that's been one of Vlade's issue so far - good ideas/initial moves with bad follow through. Getting a 1st rounder for Bellinelli? Great move. Taking Richardson with that pick? Boo

Let's hope he gets this draft right.

You said it yourself, that was a putrid draft. Lots of people liked Baldwin at 13 but that wasn't any better than the Papa pick. At 22, with a weak draft as is, it's really not a surprise that Malachi will be out of the league along with Baldwin & Papa sooner rather than later. The Skal pick was strictly an upside pick and hope he can turn into something useful, maybe he still has hopes of being a rotational player but anything more than that and I feel that fans are setting themselves up for disappointment.

Point here is, Vlade and any other GM for that matter won't get every draft pick right. You and I know very well know how much of a crap shoot the draft really is and how many variables that have to be considered for a player to pan out. Fox & Giles were good picks in my opinion, Justin Jackson not so much and Mason was BPA or one of them at least so Vlade is learning as well here. I'm not the biggest Vlade fan as a GM but I do have to cut him some slack and just let his tenure play out before pitchforks and signs come out.

 

[24 rick barry]

First off I hated, HATED the Papagiannis pick.

But it's worth pointing out that Vlade saw him workout in person before the draft. Georgios had an open workout that a lot of NBA team attended. Also, Ainge was looking to take Papagiannis with the Celtics 16th pick. When he was off the board the Celtics took Yabusele.

Ainge (who is definitely a good GM) saw the same things Vlade did - huge frame but with room to cut fat and add muscle, decent quickness, solid shooting mechanics and range, nice skill set as a roll man and some possible rim protection.

Papa was a swing and a miss presumably (and from the little I've heard) because he wasnt committed to putting in the hard work.

Also, that was a terrible draft at the end of the lottery and down being pretty bare for the most part. I liked LeVert and he'd have been a better pick but I also like Baldwin and he was cut even earlier than Papa.

Obviously not a high point for Divac as GM but considering it as Skal and Bogdan plus a gamble on Papagiannis in exchange for Chriss and it's still a net positive.

Honestly I've never hated Kings draft selections more on draft night. Nobody had Papa as a first round pick (except DX who moved him to #22 I believe based on some intel about Ainge liking him), Malachi was just an inefficient chucker IMO and Skal just looked lost and soft at Kentucky.

I was least upset about Skal at #28 but I still was hoping for DeJounte Murray there.

But that's been one of Vlade's issue so far - good ideas/initial moves with bad follow through. Getting a 1st rounder for Bellinelli? Great move. Taking Richardson with that pick? Boo

Let's hope he gets this draft right.

funnykingston-
I always enjoy your posts. Always well reasoned analysis. I so respect your most insightful input. I learn from you. And I'm a fan.
Regards

 

[funkykingston]

funnykingston-
I always enjoy your posts. Always well reasoned analysis. I so respect your most insightful input. I learn from you. And I'm a fan.
Regards

Thanks, I appreciate that. If my ramblings are at all helpful or useful then I'm happy.

 

[AleksandarN]

I have a lot more to say (since I always do where this team is concerned ) but I end with this: If Vlade approves prescient with MPJ and the turns into a perennial all-star, he will NOT be vindicated. He will be lucky. He is stupid to take him whether the player succeeds magnificently or fails miserably. I am betting we don't go down this road by I am only willing to bet Monopoly money.

So let me get this straight if Vlade picks Porter(which I am not a fan of) and turns into a perennial all star he is lucky? How so? Vlade looks at the medical records and Porters drs and King's drs say he is healthy. Then how is he lucky? He would be proven right not lucky. Vlade can't win in your eyes. That my folks is hating.

 

[Mass]

So let me get this straight if Vlade picks Porter(which I am not a fan of) and turns into a perennial all star he is lucky? How so? Vlade looks at the medical records and Porters drs and King's drs say he is healthy. Then how is he lucky? He would be proven right not lucky. Vlade can't win in your eyes. That my folks is hating.

If Vlade does something good he's lucky. If he does something wrong, he's dumb, the worst GM in the history of basketball. That makes perfect sense.

 

[Gguod]

I think that says a lot more than you realize.

I think im pretty self aware on what I want from this team while rebuilding.

Its hard to predict what would have been once different events are set in motion. There is no way to tell if we would have had a better pick than #5 if that Philly trade does not happen, let alone whether we would have #3.

Yeah thats why I did that hypothetical with the same players Vlade drafted. Being #3 AND if we had Fox on our board as the bpa, it opens up a possibility to trade back and pick up extra assets ect but its not the point

You mention extra 2nd rounders, one extra 2nd rounder we have is because of the Hill signing.

And I'd like more. I didnt even include the hypothetical 2nd from demarre carroll trade.

You also mention trying out players, I think Hayes fits that description.

Yeah but I most certainly didnt mean we should only try one player. I wouldve liked to test out multiple players in hopes of getting something really good.

In general this is where I see us: a lot of young guys, some of them more promising, some of them more of projects. Two lottery picks joining that group (#2, Giles). Bunch of expiring contracts. EXTREME cap space flexibility next year. Yes there were things I wish were done differently but I'm not that sure the end product would be that much better positioned for the future than what we have now....

And again Im not satisfied with that. Why would I be satisfied with #2, Giles and #36 when I believe it could've been possible to have #2, Giles #14 #29 #36 and the 2nd from Toronto? If I believe someone more competent wouldve been able to achieve approximetly or close to that, then I'm not satisfied at all. The whole point is that Vlade hasnt done a lot in order to gathering assets. I view it very crucial for a rebuilding team so in my own review I'm obviously going to hold that against him

 

[King Baller]

Hindsight is a beautiful thing It allows one to be a critic and appear so perfectly correct 100% of the time.

Vlade was traded for Kobe.
Barkley was traded for Hornacek, Perry and Kang.
Aldridge was traded for Tyrus Thomas.
Harden was traded for Kevin Martin. Lamb and 2 late 1st round picks.
Pippen was traded for Polynice.
Dirk was traded for Robert Traylor.
Wilt was traded for 3 guys you never heard of.
Rodman was traded for Will Perdue.
Joe Barry Carrol was traded for McHale and Parrish.
Vince Carter was traded for Antawn Jamison.
Gerald Wallace was traded for the pick that became Dame Lillard and a couple others.
Oscar Robertson was traded and his new team won it all.
Moses Malone was traded for Rick Robey.
Elvin Hayes was traded for Jack Marin.
CWebb was traded for the Rock.

 

[Kingster]

I don’t want to get into everything you wrote, but I just take this as an example.

The Papa pick was bad, no doubt about it. But if I remember correctly, people here wanted the great Baldwin instead of Papa. Last time I checked he’s out of the league. So it’s not like he passed on the next Micheal Jordan to pick Papa. Same thing about Richardson. Skal at 28 is bad? He was projected as a lottery pick and he got him at the end of the first round. No one was mad about it after the draft. At 28 you can take a gamble and it’s perdectly fine for me.
Isaiah Cousins bad? 60th pick, you judge it bad? What do you expect from the 60th pick? Come on, not every 60th pick is Isiah Thomas. Who would have you picked here? Who was the great talent he didn’t pick to go with cousins?

Last thing about the DMC trade. “Apparently” he had a better deal on the teable. You judge him because “apparently” he passed on a better offer. Give me evidence of this, otherwise you can’t use it as an evidence he made a big mistake.
Of course I didn’t like and still don’t like that trade. I don’t like it because I don’t think we got enough in return. Not because “apparently” he had a better deal but he decided to ignore it.

As I recall, Divac himself said he had a better offer. He waited. The offer got reduced. He took it. Does someone recall differently?

 

[Kingster]

When it comes to Divac's mistakes, the two that stick in my craw are the surrendering of next year's 1st round draft pick, and picking Papa. Everybody makes mistakes, even the great Danny Ainge, who passed on Zach LaVine, Julius Randle, and Clint Capela to draft Marcus Smart. It's just that some mistakes are so egregious that it's difficult for one to see any reasonableness to them whatsoever. Giving up a 1st round pick when you're with a team that is a bottom dweller, and picking Papa, fall in that category for me, although I admit that there wasn't a whole lot to choose from after #13 in the Papa draft (D. Murray of San Antonio Spurs of course is a prominent exception). Was it incredible hubris on the part of Divac to believe that next year's 1st round pick wouldn't be very valuable because the Kings would be in the playoffs by then? It's a total head scratcher. But like I've said before, I give him something of a pass for those greenhorn mistakes because, well, he was a greenhorn. I don't give Vivek a pass for hiring a greenhorn to begin with, but that's another story.

What I would like to see going forward is not average performance from Divac. I want to see above average. Good. Or even better, very good. That means that he has to come up with some great moves that outweigh the one's that up to now have been poor. Giles, for one, could help him. If Giles does in fact play like an up and coming star, Divac will look very smart in the trade down that gave him Giles. If Fox looks like a star in the making next year, ditto. And if this year's pick is a home run, the same thing goes. It would also be helpful to his reputation if Divac could get in FA some off the radar players that actually will help the Kings win next year. And instead of getting snookered in a trade, it sure would be nice for once in an eon if the Kings' could be the one that does the snookering. All of the foregoing are hopeful wishes, not realized facts. We're getting much closer to where there is either realized promise or unfounded hope. Next year, the year that coincides with having no 1st round pick, is going to be a telling year for Vlade Divac.

 

[VF21]

When it comes to Divac's mistakes, the two that stick in my craw are the surrendering of next year's #1 pick, and picking Papa. Everybody makes mistakes, even the great Danny Ainge, who passed on Zach LaVine, Julius Randle, and Clint Capela to draft Marcus Smart. It's just that some mistakes are so egregious that it's difficult for one to see any reasonableness to them whatsoever. Giving up the #1 pick when you're with a team that is a bottom dweller, and picking Papa, fall in that category for me, although I admit that there wasn't a whole lot to choose from after #13 in the Papa draft (D. Murray of San Antonio Spurs of course is a prominent exception). Was it incredible hubris on the part of Divac to believe that next year's #1 pick wouldn't be very valuable because the Kings would be in the playoffs by then? It's a total head scratcher. But like I've said before, I give him something of a pass for those greenhorn mistakes because, well, he was a greenhorn. I don't give Vivek a pass for hiring a greenhorn to begin with, but that's another story.

What I would like to see going forward is not average performance from Divac. I want to see above average. Good. Or even better, very good. That means that he has to come up with some great moves that outweigh the one's that up to now have been poor. Giles, for one, could help him. If Giles does in fact play like an up and coming star, Divac will look very smart in the trade down that gave him Giles. If Fox looks like a star in the making next year, ditto. And if this year's pick is a home run, the same thing goes. It would also be helpful to his reputation if Divac could get in FA some off the radar players that actually will help the Kings win next year. And instead of getting snookered in a trade, it sure would be nice for once in an eon if the Kings' could be the one that does the snookering. All of the foregoing are hopeful wishes, not realized facts. We're getting much closer to where there is either realized promise or unfounded hope. Next year, the year that coincides with having no #1 pick, is going to be a telling year for Vlade Divac.

Saying "#1 pick" is very misleading. I'm just quoting you because you're the latest to use that phrase. It's NOT the #1 pick. It's the 1st Round pick.

 

[Kingster]

Saying "#1 pick" is very misleading. I'm just quoting you because you're the latest to use that phrase. It's NOT the #1 pick. It's the 1st Round pick.

Yes, you're right. I'll edit the post.

 

[Blob]

I’m weary of reading posts by those who are obsessed with Vlade being the worst GM ever! You guys really lack perspective.

First, and for the record, i’m not a Vlade apologist. I think he has made his share of mistakes. For me, the big ones were getting fleeced of the 2019 1st round pick in a flawed attempt to get Cousins into the playoffs. Second was the bumbling way he handled the Cousins trade. But I don’t hold these mistakes against him as long as he learns from them (i.e. doesn’t repeat them). NBA GMs and Presidents are hired to make big decisions. Only the village idiot would expect all their decisions to be perfect in hindsight. That’s just not grounded in reality. And to continue obsessing about his past mistakes (or perceived mistakes) is like picking at a scab. Nothing good will come from it.

I have no interest in picking at a scab. We can agree on that. I liked the last move Vlade made. In fact I was one of the few fans on this board who recommended and commended the decision to unload Hill for cap space. I didn't care we didn't get a 1st round pick back in return. I wanted the ball in the hands of Boggy more, a better half-court shot creator, and more playing time for Fox and Mason. So the last move Vlade made was positive damage control, creating 9M in cap space this summer.

Then Vlade triggered my ire with his comment that massive underachiever Willie Cauley Stein "could be elite". If Willie is not the worst starting center in the NBA he is in the bottom 5 of starting centers. The effort and efficiency is not there. If our GM is capable of these type of delusions it does not portend well for other player assessments he may make. Then there was the post-season press conference in which he declared our 9-11 finish going into the off-season was a basis for optimism. Absurd!

A 9-11 record prorated over 82 games is a lottery team. This is not something to get excited over. Then if you look at the teams we played over that stretch, many were dregs and many were intentionally trying to lose and won anyway. Fans are too sophisticated, at least I am, to fall for this sophistry. If this is not enough to convince you of his dubious aptitude, Bamba and JJJ did not come to Sacramento for a workout. The poor reputation of this GM precedes him. He repels prospects. We have a new arena, a beautiful training facility, a deep pocket owner and a passionate fan base.

What we lack is competent representative and recruiter to sell agents and players on the merits of playing for the Kings. Not only has this GM performance stifled growth and development with his past decisions, he constricts opportunity prospectively by limiting the filed of prospects who are eager to call Sacramento home. This is not picking at a scab, per se, it is calling it like it is.

 

[Blob]

And I would like to add I have said my peace on Vlade and did not create this thread, though the news today about prospects (JJJ and Bamba) not wanting to come to workout add fuel to the fire (See Lowe Podcast).

And if I had created this thread the title would be "The Unabashed Defense and Support of the Kings GM by Local Media". The driving force of the OP was more about the pass our GM receives from the locals than beating a horse to death. Anyway as long as he takes Bagley or Luka on Thursday he will earn a reprieve from my wrath.....at least until free agency starts.

 

[VF21]

And I would like to add I have said my peace on Vlade and did not create this thread, though the news today about prospects (JJJ and Bamba) not wanting to come to workout add fuel to the fire (See Lowe Podcast).

And if I had created this thread the title would be "The Unabashed Defense and Support of the Kings GM by Local Media". The driving force of the OP was more about the pass our GM receives from the locals than beating a horse to death. Anyway as long as he takes Bagley or Luka on Thursday he will earn a reprieve from my wrath.....at least until free agency starts.

1. I "created" this thread by splitting it out of the Porter thread, and I said so at the time it was done

2. Three word titles are a lot more effective than 12 word titles.

 

[mac]

I have no interest in picking at a scab. We can agree on that. I liked the last move Vlade made. In fact I was one of the few fans on this board who recommended and commended the decision to unload Hill for cap space. I didn't care we didn't get a 1st round pick back in return. I wanted the ball in the hands of Boggy more, a better half-court shot creator, and more playing time for Fox and Mason. So the last move Vlade made was positive damage control, creating 9M in cap space this summer.

Then Vlade triggered my ire with his comment that massive underachiever Willie Cauley Stein "could be elite". If Willie is not the worst starting center in the NBA he is in the bottom 5 of starting centers. The effort and efficiency is not there. If our GM is capable of these type of delusions it does not portend well for other player assessments he may make. Then there was the post-season press conference in which he declared our 9-11 finish going into the off-season was a basis for optimism. Absurd!

A 9-11 record prorated over 82 games is a lottery team. This is not something to get excited over. Then if you look at the teams we played over that stretch, many were dregs and many were intentionally trying to lose and won anyway. Fans are too sophisticated, at least I am, to fall for this sophistry. If this is not enough to convince you of his dubious aptitude, Bamba and JJJ did not come to Sacramento for a workout. The poor reputation of this GM precedes him. He repels prospects. We have a new arena, a beautiful training facility, a deep pocket owner and a passionate fan base.

What we lack is competent representative and recruiter to sell agents and players on the merits of playing for the Kings. Not only has this GM performance stifled growth and development with his past decisions, he constricts opportunity prospectively by limiting the filed of prospects who are eager to call Sacramento home. This is not picking at a scab, per se, it is calling it like it is.

While I share your ire for WCS, I do think what Vlade said was reasonable from a leadership perspective. As you have identified, the whole problem with Stein is his inconsistency and lack of effort. Vlade's comments, taken together with Joerger's were probably aimed at motivating WCS to play to his potential. I don't think you could reasonably expect him to say "yep, WCS sucks, can't wait to trade him". If anything, George Karl was spot on when he said Willie benefited from lots of easy shots created for him, while many on this board and Cousins jumped on Karl for his remarks.

It's also interesting that fans trust Vlade although he hasn't actually shown much acumen as a GM. I guess it's natural to root for a former player, and a favourite at that. But my point is that whenever players go straight to being GMs or coaches the reality is that they receive far more trust and credit than they've actually earned in those roles.

 

[Sac.1989]

Vlade has done an adequate job as our GM. He was never supposed to be here that long in that role but the fact he has made it his own has to be seen as positive, whilst somewhat circumstantial given we hired Scott Perry to take over.

At the end of the day we have wanted continuity in the front office for a long time and we are getting that. Vlade appears to be growing in stature with time. I don't expect any huge errors in judgement from him anymore although he does make me nervous from time to time.

Trading future picks whilst a young team and the management of the Demarcus Cousins trade are obvious black marks but things are trending in the right direction as we are currently building. An astute GM will be able to take us from a collection of assets to a strong playoff team by leveraging what we have and gaining further assets where they can add the most value. I am not sure if Vlade will be here for that but if he is those will be very important decisions which need to be made and made well, simply put, we need to win those trades when we are shipping young talent out to bring in a piece of significant need which every successful rebuilding team has to do at some point. He has certainly earnt the right to continue to finish what he has started, i hope it doesnt end up as another tip to the Lakers.

 

[UK_King]

He's on borrowed time. It's quite worrying that he has the keys to the number 2 pick. This draft will decide the trajectory of this franchise for the next decade.

The noise about how much they love Bagley is terrifying. I honestly see some horrible trade for a "star" like Marc gasol. Seeing Memphis sitting there at 4 gives me the fear. Plus the coaching connection.

They have no patience.

Did anyone see that ESPN trade bogi AND 2 for Devin booker. Good lord what a pile of cr*p

 

[Sac.1989]

He's on borrowed time. It's quite worrying that he has the keys to the number 2 pick. This draft will decide the trajectory of this franchise for the next decade.

The noise about how much they love Bagley is terrifying. I honestly see some horrible trade for a "star" like Marc gasol. Seeing Memphis sitting there at 4 gives me the fear. Plus the coaching connection.

They have no patience.

Did anyone see that ESPN trade bogi AND 2 for Devin booker. Good lord what a pile of cr*p

Everyone knows that the kings have been a disillusioned franchise for a long time and that Vlade is still a rookie GM more or less. I hope that all this is just the world expecting us to do something stupid and not the reality of the situation. Where there is smoke there is fire but i do feel like when it comes to the kings the whole nation expects us to do the worst in every situation.

This draft is huge and we deserve better. We cant keep giving the organization the benefit of the doubt and losing out time and time again. I really dont want to be reading comments along the lines of, "well vlade is in house and close to the team so we should trust his judgement when it comes to adding pieces, and clearly he knows things we do not and we will know more once the year is over and we can see how ...... performed and fit in"

If Vlade ****s up this draft we are really done. He hasnt done many conventional moves during his time here and i suspect he enjoys doing things his way and somewhat playing the villain. This is not the time to think outside the box. Its a very simple process at the top of the draft.

 

[Pizzaguy93]

 

[Pizzaguy93]

All of you haters...shhhhh

 

[Gguod]

In the last four drafts Vlade has spent majority of our captial on big men. Picks #2, #6, #13, #20 and #29 all big men.

And when asked about that he says Bagley and our other bigs can play 3. I mean its just appalling he thinks the fanbase is so stupid and ignorant he can just say things like that and they would just eat it up. Our fanbase deserves better than that. Draft all the big men you want but when asked about it, dont treat the fanbase like a bunch of idiots who doesnt understand the sport

 

[CelticsFan]

Vlade saying "My team is a super team. Just young."

https://nba.nbcsports.com/2018/06/22/kings-gm-vlade-divac-my-team-is-a-super-team-just-young/

 

[chief bromden]

In the last four drafts Vlade has spent majority of our captial on big men. Picks #2, #6, #13, #20 and #29 all big men.

And when asked about that he says Bagley and our other bigs can play 3. I mean its just appalling he thinks the fanbase is so stupid and ignorant he can just say things like that and they would just eat it up. Our fanbase deserves better than that. Draft all the big men you want but when asked about it, dont treat the fanbase like a bunch of idiots who doesnt understand the sport

Yeah, that press conference was disheartening. I'm hoping that it's just smoke since he can't really say "Yeah, I'm planning on trading some of the bigs." None of the big guys can play the 3, period. Sigh... please be smoke....

 

[fansinceday1]

Yeah, that press conference was disheartening. I'm hoping that it's just smoke since he can't really say "Yeah, I'm planning on trading some of the bigs." None of the big guys can play the 3, period. Sigh... please be smoke....

Couple that press conference with the tweets Dave had from his inside source..........damn!
Yeah, the future is bright! Boy do I have a bridge to sell ya! Haha....

I’ve taken a huge step back so it’s all really amusing and sad at the same time to read the homer posts here at kings fans. Dave had to deal with quite a few of you kingsfans.com blind follower types this morning telling him to stop being a kings hater or to go find a new team because he’s not a “real” kings fan because he doesn’t like the direction of this FO.

 

[Blob]

In the last four drafts Vlade has spent majority of our captial on big men. Picks #2, #6, #13, #20 and #29 all big men.

And when asked about that he says Bagley and our other bigs can play 3. I mean its just appalling he thinks the fanbase is so stupid and ignorant he can just say things like that and they would just eat it up. Our fanbase deserves better than that. Draft all the big men you want but when asked about it, dont treat the fanbase like a bunch of idiots who doesnt understand the sport

If Luka was as great as you want to make it him out to be we would have drafted him! If he was so great why didn't the Suns or Hawks take him? They had no problem passing. Vlade said twice in his press conference the decision to Marvin over Luka was easy. Boom! I came to this same conclusion predraft. The decision in my mind to take Bagley over Luka was a relative no-brainer. I also projected Bagley as combo forward. It is encouraging to me our front office saw it similarly. For critics of the pick (and those in favor) this sets a high bar as their careers unfold. To justify the assessment, the effectiveness of Bagley has should be clearly superior to Luka . Not marginally but significantly.

If Luka could score like Dzanan Musa (to go with other playmaking skills) I would have been as outspoken as the Luka Fans to draft this kid. I grant to you Musa is playing in a lesser league but this guy has the attack mode mentality not there with Luka. Tell me this kid does not have better scoring prowess as Luka and I won't believe you. Musa is probably the guy we wanted at #37 but when he went #29 to the Nets that is when we made the trade. If I have one complaint about yesterday is we should have been more aggressive to trade up and get this kid. Not sure how good he can be, but he is already better than G-Leaguer Jackson.

After Vlade botched the Boogie trade, the ownership saw that as a final straw of his blundering ways. They knew he was in over his head. But canning him would be bad PR. He needed help. Hence the hiring of Williams, the man behind the scenes and brains to the operation. Vlade has been reduced to figurehead more or less. Going forward moves he wants to make is going to have to go through the filtering of Williams (and others) or he is going to run into strong resistance. Vlade is the face of the front office but his authority has been stripped. Vlade has an agreeable nature so I don't think he minds deferring. These dynamics give us a chance.

 

[swisshh]

Vlade as GM has been bad and will continue to be so. His best move was the Marquese Chriss trade. He's had a few pivotal moments for the franchise that he's overseen and botched. Dumping salary to change the roster was the right idea but the execution was terrible. The Cousins trade was terrible with terrible timing. This draft has a good chance of haunting the franchise.

I'd say that his FA signings are generally solid, though ZBo became a huge impediment for the team. Tolliver, Kosta, Temple, Carter and such were good. Hill was probably one vet too many but we'll see how the trade works out.

However, when Vlade screws up its a major, major screw up.

 

[burekijogurt]

If Luka was as great as you want to make it him out to be we would have drafted him! If he was so great why didn't the Suns or Hawks take him? They had no problem passing. Vlade said twice in his press conference the decision to Marvin over Luka was easy. Boom! I came to this same conclusion predraft. The decision in my mind to take Bagley over Luka was a relative no-brainer. I also projected Bagley as combo forward. It is encouraging to me our front office saw it similarly. For critics of the pick (and those in favor) this sets a high bar as their careers unfold. To justify the assessment, the effectiveness of Bagley has should be clearly superior to Luka . Not marginally but significantly.

If Luka could score like Dzanan Musa (to go with other playmaking skills) I would have been as outspoken as the Luka Fans to draft this kid. I grant to you Musa is playing in a lesser league but this guy has the attack mode mentality not there with Luka. Tell me this kid does not have better scoring prowess as Luka and I won't believe you. Musa is probably the guy we wanted at #37 but when he went #29 to the Nets that is when we made the trade. If I have one complaint about yesterday is we should have been more aggressive to trade up and get this kid. Not sure how good he can be, but he is already better than G-Leaguer Jackson.

After Vlade botched the Boogie trade, the ownership saw that as a final straw of his blundering ways. They knew he was in over his head. But canning him would be bad PR. He needed help. Hence the hiring of Williams, the man behind the scenes and brains to the operation. Vlade has been reduced to figurehead more or less. Going forward moves he wants to make is going to have to go through the filtering of Williams (and others) or he is going to run into strong resistance. Vlade is the face of the front office but his authority has been stripped. Vlade has an agreeable nature so I don't think he minds deferring. These dynamics give us a chance.

Vlade as GM has been bad and will continue to be so. His best move was the Marquese Chriss trade. He's had a few pivotal moments for the franchise that he's overseen and botched. Dumping salary to change the roster was the right idea but the execution was terrible. The Cousins trade was terrible with terrible timing. This draft has a good chance of haunting the franchise.

I'd say that his FA signings are generally solid, though ZBo became a huge impediment for the team. Tolliver, Kosta, Temple, Carter and such were good. Hill was probably one vet too many but we'll see how the trade works out.

However, when Vlade screws up its a major, major screw up.

Love these two posts back to back.

One argues that the drafting Bagley was a good move and hence cannot be Vlade's since he is a bad GM.
The other argues that drafting Bagely was a bad move and hence obviously Vlade's since he is a bad GM.

Awsome.

 

[VF21]

Couple that press conference with the tweets Dave had from his inside source..........damn!
Yeah, the future is bright! Boy do I have a bridge to sell ya! Haha....

I’ve taken a huge step back so it’s all really amusing and sad at the same time to read the homer posts here at kings fans. Dave had to deal with quite a few of you kingsfans.com blind follower types this morning telling him to stop being a kings hater or to go find a new team because he’s not a “real” kings fan because he doesn’t like the direction of this FO.

Didn't Dave admit those tweets were fictional? I believe that was posted on here during the draft yesterday.

But hey - either way? Don't let it dissuade you from bashing Vlade. What could have he done right, in your humble opinion?

If you're so amused and sad at the same time by the posts here, you could always try StR.

 

[allrightythen]

Couple that press conference with the tweets Dave had from his inside source..........damn!
Yeah, the future is bright! Boy do I have a bridge to sell ya! Haha....

I’ve taken a huge step back so it’s all really amusing and sad at the same time to read the homer posts here at kings fans. Dave had to deal with quite a few of you kingsfans.com blind follower types this morning telling him to stop being a kings hater or to go find a new team because he’s not a “real” kings fan because he doesn’t like the direction of this FO.

You come back from your huge "step back" to come and insult people who see things different than you? Superiority complex much? Or did you just feel the need to swoop in to defend Dave's honor?

I get the negativity towards the Kings front office. They haven't done much that has worked yet and they may never. Ownership isn't trustworthy either for that matter so I can understand not buying what they are selling. Why in the world do you feel the need to prop yourself up by calling people homers, saying it's amusing and sad to read opinions of people who want to see things in a positive light?

 

[Gguod]

If Luka was as great as you want to make it him out to be we would have drafted him! If he was so great why didn't the Suns or Hawks take him? They had no problem passing. Vlade said twice in his press conference the decision to Marvin over Luka was easy. Boom! I came to this same conclusion predraft.

If Damian Lillard were so good, why didnt we take him instead of Robinson? If Klay Thompson were so great why didnt we take him instead of Jimmer? Stauskas? Mclemore? Papa G? This franchise has drafted horribly for the past 10 years. Someone wrote something like that if Kings just took the fan favourite on these past drafts, they would be far better off than they are now. Thats pretty horrible drafting. The part of the fanbase that refuses to just blindly trust the current regime will be furious in instances like this where they pass on an obvious choise at #2 and instead just go wild.

The decision in my mind to take Bagley over Luka was a relative no-brainer. I also projected Bagley as combo forward. It is encouraging to me our front office saw it similarly. For critics of the pick (and those in favor) this sets a high bar as their careers unfold. To justify the assessment, the effectiveness of Bagley has should be clearly superior to Luka . Not marginally but significantly.

If I remember correctly, you were very loud on Tatum being a bust last year. Im not sure how your evaluation/projection is supposed to make me feel any better.

As I've said multiple times, there are numerous well argumented concerns on the value of players like Bagley. You are more than welcome to tackle one of them.

If Luka could score like Dzanan Musa (to go with other playmaking skills) I would have been as outspoken as the Luka Fans to draft this kid. I grant to you Musa is playing in a lesser league but this guy has the attack mode mentality not there with Luka. Tell me this kid does not have better scoring prowess as Luka and I won't believe you. Musa is probably the guy we wanted at #37 but when he went #29 to the Nets that is when we made the trade. If I have one complaint about yesterday is we should have been more aggressive to trade up and get this kid. Not sure how good he can be, but he is already better than G-Leaguer Jackson.

The fact that you are talking about Musa and Doncic in the same sentence as prospects is just ridiculous and reveals how valuable your opinion really is. Doncic is playing on a whole different level than Musa. Doncic has shown elite qualities on highest european level, qualities that are extremely valuable in todays Nba. But again yout talent evaluation hasnt exactly been brilliant.

After Vlade botched the Boogie trade, the ownership saw that as a final straw of his blundering ways. They knew he was in over his head. But canning him would be bad PR. He needed help. Hence the hiring of Williams, the man behind the scenes and brains to the operation. Vlade has been reduced to figurehead more or less. Going forward moves he wants to make is going to have to go through the filtering of Williams (and others) or he is going to run into strong resistance. Vlade is the face of the front office but his authority has been stripped. Vlade has an agreeable nature so I don't think he minds deferring. These dynamics give us a chance.

I would like to see some other sources claiming that is tha case. I have no idea where you habe drawn those conclusions, no idea how reliable they are so probably best to not comment on them