2018 draft fits with this team

[bajaden]

I get your Point and they are fair but other great athletes have been drafted that never made it also.

True true! That's what makes it exciting doesn't it? I honestly believe that the teams with good scouting dept's usually make good decisions come draft time. Scouting has turned into a science of its own, and it requires a lot more than just watching some video, which is all I can do, along with watching entire games. The scouts do a lot of research on the character of a player. They talk to the players high school coach. They talk to his family, his college coach, and anyone that's been a part of his life that they can legally talk to without breaking any rules. How does he react to failure? Do his teammates like playing with him. What is his work ethic. Look, there are usually red flags of some sort that you didn't pay attention to, if one of your picks fail.

In the case of a player like Wiggins, his athleticism and some of his skill set trumped some of the red flags that were there. The same could be said for McLemore. There were a lot of red flags for Thomas Robinson, but I guess the hype trumped them for the Maloof's. Ditto Jimmer! If there's one thing that I've learned over the years, is that skills trump athleticism if that's the choice. The NBA is a league full of people that can can dribble, pass, and shoot the ball. And if you lack one of those skills, then you better be dammed good at the other two, and maybe throw in some athleticism as well. It was easier in the old days when you drafted seniors. By then you had a very good idea of what you were getting. In today's age of one and done, it's harder, but not impossible. The more money you put into your scouting dept, the better decisions your going to get.

I could talk till the cows come home on this subject because it's close and dear to my heart. What I've found is that every NBA scout is a little different in how they approach their job. I've read books by a couple and articles by many of them. All interesting stuff, but at the end of the day, it's a matter of how you process the info, and that's an individual thing. No two pair of eye's seem to see exactly the same thing, nor do any two scouts make the same assumptions. Which is why it's interesting to hear a couple of them on a podcast discussing the same player. It can be very informative.. Anyway, I won't bore you with anymore...

 

[CelticsFan]

In the case of a player like Wiggins, his athleticism and some of his skill set trumped some of the red flags that were there. The same could be said for McLemore. .

You guys are harsh when it comes to Wiggins. You guys realize he's 22 right? He almost averaged 24 ppg as a 21 year old in the NBA last season. He's having a down year this year but he's now also the third option on a good playoff team.

Do most here consider him a bust?

 

[Telemachus]

You guys are harsh when it comes to Wiggins. You guys realize he's 22 right? He almost averaged 24 ppg as a 21 year old in the NBA last season. He's having a down year this year but he's now also the third option on a good playoff team.

Do most here consider him a bust?

I don't think anyone considers Wiggins a bust. He has turned into a very good scorer in the NBA. However, the expectations for him were as a possible superstar and he is nowhere close to that IMO. He looked like he good be a all-defensive talent coming into the league and has been very poor in that dept. His outside shot has improved to go with his ability to attack the rim, but he has become a bit of a black hole on offense. He doesn't seem to make his teammates better.

Now obviously he is still young with time to improve. I guess I question how hard he is willing to work on improving in those areas of weakness.

 

[Joshoua]

Watching Bogdan play makes me want Doncic even more

 

[OffTheWallJamal]

We are currently tied with Atlanta and Orlando for the 1st pick.

 

[ParniValjak]

We are currently tied with Atlanta and Orlando for the 1st pick.

We lost to Atlanta by a far margin too

 

[sactowndog]

True true! That's what makes it exciting doesn't it? I honestly believe that the teams with good scouting dept's usually make good decisions come draft time. Scouting has turned into a science of its own, and it requires a lot more than just watching some video, which is all I can do, along with watching entire games. The scouts do a lot of research on the character of a player. They talk to the players high school coach. They talk to his family, his college coach, and anyone that's been a part of his life that they can legally talk to without breaking any rules. How does he react to failure? Do his teammates like playing with him. What is his work ethic. Look, there are usually red flags of some sort that you didn't pay attention to, if one of your picks fail.

In the case of a player like Wiggins, his athleticism and some of his skill set trumped some of the red flags that were there. The same could be said for McLemore. There were a lot of red flags for Thomas Robinson, but I guess the hype trumped them for the Maloof's. Ditto Jimmer! If there's one thing that I've learned over the years, is that skills trump athleticism if that's the choice. The NBA is a league full of people that can can dribble, pass, and shoot the ball. And if you lack one of those skills, then you better be dammed good at the other two, and maybe throw in some athleticism as well. It was easier in the old days when you drafted seniors. By then you had a very good idea of what you were getting. In today's age of one and done, it's harder, but not impossible. The more money you put into your scouting dept, the better decisions your going to get.

I could talk till the cows come home on this subject because it's close and dear to my heart. What I've found is that every NBA scout is a little different in how they approach their job. I've read books by a couple and articles by many of them. All interesting stuff, but at the end of the day, it's a matter of how you process the info, and that's an individual thing. No two pair of eye's seem to see exactly the same thing, nor do any two scouts make the same assumptions. Which is why it's interesting to hear a couple of them on a podcast discussing the same player. It can be very informative.. Anyway, I won't bore you with anymore...

Nah talk away. I find the subject fascinating. I think teams struggle to quantify and account for basketball intelligence on drafting. We also don’t get the medical reports these teams get.

Tatum is a good example of a highly skilled player while Isaac is an example of great athleticism. I’m worried Bagley lacks skill but I acknowledge he could also be the next Malone.

 

[KingsSelecao]

Watching Bogdan play makes me want Doncic even more

The only issue I have with Bogdan is Defense. Bogdan tries hard on D, but is not very athletic and gets eaten alive by faster and bigger Sg's. Mitchell destroyed him tonite.

 

[KingsSelecao]

I don't think anyone considers Wiggins a bust. He has turned into a very good scorer in the NBA. However, the expectations for him were as a possible superstar and he is nowhere close to that IMO. He looked like he good be a all-defensive talent coming into the league and has been very poor in that dept. His outside shot has improved to go with his ability to attack the rim, but he has become a bit of a black hole on offense. He doesn't seem to make his teammates better.

Now obviously he is still young with time to improve. I guess I question how hard he is willing to work on improving in those areas of weakness.

Wiggins is having a great year. Would love to have him on the Kings.

 

[Joshoua]

Nah talk away. I find the subject fascinating. I think teams struggle to quantify and account for basketball intelligence on drafting. We also don’t get the medical reports these teams get.

Tatum is a good example of a highly skilled player while Isaac is an example of great athleticism. I’m worried Bagley lacks skill but I acknowledge he could also be the next Malone.

The motor and the work ethic and attitude that coach K says reminds him of his team USA players erases any concerns I have with Bagley.

The only issue I have with Bogdan is Defense. Bogdan tries hard on D, but is not very athletic and gets eaten alive by faster and bigger Sg's. Mitchell destroyed him tonite.

Mitchell has been destroying everyone so it’s not that bad.

The endless amount of easy points they’d get guys off pick and roll would be enormous. Can see both guys averaging 5apg with Doncic higher than that 6-8apg

 

[206Fan]

I think we can assume that Willie is playing the way the coaching staff wants him to play. Our perimeter defense is bad enough without removing Willie from the picture. It's sort of pick your poison. But I think some of you guys believe that the players have carte blanche to go out and play anyway they want. That's not the case. Willie and everyone else on the team is doing what asked of them. Of course they make mistakes at times, but when, where, and how you play is decided by the coaching staff.

hrmms..almost like these are legitimate concerns regarding the coaching staff. Do you really want your athletic 7fter patrolling the perimeter and away from the basket? oh well.

 

[Reverend]

If we could somehow end up walking away with Doncic I would be extremely hopeful Giles could pan out because a big three of Giles x Fox x Doncic has immense potential to be very fun.

Imagine Doncic and a revitalized Harry Giles running pick and roll how we do now with Bogie and WCS. And if Fox can develop a respectable shot (which I believe he does) then I think he fits somewhere in there alternating ball handling responsibilities with Luka

 

[bajaden]

You guys are harsh when it comes to Wiggins. You guys realize he's 22 right? He almost averaged 24 ppg as a 21 year old in the NBA last season. He's having a down year this year but he's now also the third option on a good playoff team.

Do most here consider him a bust?

I certainly don't consider him a bust! Not by any stretch of the imagination. That wasn't the question. The question was whether you would rather have Wiggins instead of some of the top players in the coming draft. Whether you would trade that pick for Wiggins. I think Wiggins is a very good player, but not a star! At least not yet. I'm not ruling out the possibility that he might become one. However, facts are facts, and the facts are that he's in his 4th year in the league, and it appears he's regressed back to his previous first two years, which tends to make me think that his third year might have been an aberration. Of course that's just a guess, but at this point, Wiggins can't coast on potential, we have to look at results. He's taking more three point shots, and missing more of them. His rebounding is down. His freethrow shooting percentage is down along with his overall percentages and his three point percentage.

The one thing that people thought would be his strength coming out college would be defense, but that hasn't happened. He does have his lowest defensive rating this year at 111, but that's hardly something to rave about. While at the same time he has his lowest offensive rating at 102. So would I rather have him, or Doncic, Bagley, Ayton, or perhaps Porter. All four of those players come into the league with similar expectations as Wiggins. Personally, I'd rather take a flyer on any of them than Wiggins, and no disrespect meant. Here's the thing. Last night I watched a rookie, Mitchell go out and take over a game. You watched him, and there wasn't a doubt in your mind that that dude is going to be a very good player. When is Wiggins going to do that?

 

[bajaden]

hrmms..almost like these are legitimate concerns regarding the coaching staff. Do you really want your athletic 7fter patrolling the perimeter and away from the basket? oh well.

To answer your question, maybe! It depends on what you value the most. Since our perimeter has been full of holes, Willie is the only big on the team that can leave his man, stop the ball, and then get back to his man. Yes, sometimes the Kings pay a price for that, but like it or not, Willie is the best pick and roll big man defender on the team, and it's not even close. Next game just watch Willie and keep track of how many times he stops penetration in the lane and still manages to guard his own man. He doesn't get enough credit for the work he does defensively. As Temple stated. Willie is the best defender on this team. If so, do you want to simply plant him under the basket to try and block shots, and probably get into foul trouble as a result.

The league is going away from big's that play under the basket, and Willie fits into the new look NBA. He's expanding his offensive game to go along with his defensive game. His one area of weakness, not always, but far too often is his rebounding. I won't be surprised if Willie spends a lot of the offseason working on his three pt shot. If he can shoot 35% or above from there, he's basically becomes almost unguardable. There are only a few, very few bigs in the NBA that can keep Willie in front of them out on the perimeter. So most play off of him. If he starts hitting those outside shots with consistency, they can't play off of him, and then he goes right around them, which collapses their defense. Only good things happen when that happens.

Sometimes it appears that some fans (not referring to you) watch Willie put up 20 something points and 10 boards and are disappointed because it doesn't fit the image they have of him in their mind. It's like, how dare he actually try and become a better offensive player. You can't put players in a box. Willie came to the game late, so he's going to be a bit of a late bloomer. I think were starting to see some of that in recent results.

 

[kingsfan1984]

To answer your question, maybe! It depends on what you value the most. Since our perimeter has been full of holes, Willie is the only big on the team that can leave his man, stop the ball, and then get back to his man. Yes, sometimes the Kings pay a price for that, but like it or not, Willie is the best pick and roll big man defender on the team, and it's not even close. Next game just watch Willie and keep track of how many times he stops penetration in the lane and still manages to guard his own man. He doesn't get enough credit for the work he does defensively. As Temple stated. Willie is the best defender on this team. If so, do you want to simply plant him under the basket to try and block shots, and probably get into foul trouble as a result.

The league is going away from big's that play under the basket, and Willie fits into the new look NBA. He's expanding his offensive game to go along with his defensive game. His one area of weakness, not always, but far too often is his rebounding. I won't be surprised if Willie spends a lot of the offseason working on his three pt shot. If he can shoot 35% or above from there, he's basically becomes almost unguardable. There are only a few, very few bigs in the NBA that can keep Willie in front of them out on the perimeter. So most play off of him. If he starts hitting those outside shots with consistency, they can't play off of him, and then he goes right around them, which collapses their defense. Only good things happen when that happens.

Sometimes it appears that some fans (not referring to you) watch Willie put up 20 something points and 10 boards and are disappointed because it doesn't fit the image they have of him in their mind. It's like, how dare he actually try and become a better offensive player. You can't put players in a box. Willie came to the game late, so he's going to be a bit of a late bloomer. I think were starting to see some of that in recent results.

I very much thoight Willie was going to play himself out of the league trying to become an offensive player. Gladly eat crow now and say props to him for believing i himself and working ti make it happen. Love the trajectory he is on now.

 

[hrdboild]

To answer your question, maybe! It depends on what you value the most. Since our perimeter has been full of holes, Willie is the only big on the team that can leave his man, stop the ball, and then get back to his man. Yes, sometimes the Kings pay a price for that, but like it or not, Willie is the best pick and roll big man defender on the team, and it's not even close. Next game just watch Willie and keep track of how many times he stops penetration in the lane and still manages to guard his own man. He doesn't get enough credit for the work he does defensively. As Temple stated. Willie is the best defender on this team. If so, do you want to simply plant him under the basket to try and block shots, and probably get into foul trouble as a result.

The league is going away from big's that play under the basket, and Willie fits into the new look NBA. He's expanding his offensive game to go along with his defensive game. His one area of weakness, not always, but far too often is his rebounding. I won't be surprised if Willie spends a lot of the offseason working on his three pt shot. If he can shoot 35% or above from there, he's basically becomes almost unguardable. There are only a few, very few bigs in the NBA that can keep Willie in front of them out on the perimeter. So most play off of him. If he starts hitting those outside shots with consistency, they can't play off of him, and then he goes right around them, which collapses their defense. Only good things happen when that happens.

Sometimes it appears that some fans (not referring to you) watch Willie put up 20 something points and 10 boards and are disappointed because it doesn't fit the image they have of him in their mind. It's like, how dare he actually try and become a better offensive player. You can't put players in a box. Willie came to the game late, so he's going to be a bit of a late bloomer. I think were starting to see some of that in recent results.

The consistency has been what's missing from him, but he looked good in the game against the Clippers I watched and he's put together a really solid January so far. If he can give us something close to 20 and 10 every night I'd be thrilled! I think a big part of the adjustment for young players in the NBA is learning that there's really no coasting at this level. Even end of the bench guys were the best player on their team everywhere else they've been -- if you're not prepared to bring it every night it shows. I'm pretty sure when we were discussing Willie before he was drafted I mentioned that his defensive skillset guarding pick and rolls was a unique and special skill but I wasn't sure it was more important than a strong presence under the basket...

Well, that was 2015 just after Golden State won their first championship and at the time it still looked a little flukey to me. Could they sustain that insane level of offensive prowess? Obviously that question has been answered now. And while I do think a shotblocker/rebounder inside is still important to close out possessions, those guys aren't really anchoring the defense anymore when every team in the league (well, almost every team) is trying to fire up as many threes in a game as they can. Mobility and versatility and timing and court awareness are so much more important now and that makes Willie's defensive skillset a huge plus. We've suffered from a lack of good options at PF and SF and a team defense is really only as good as it's weakest link but that's not Willie's fault. The league has changed a lot over the last 3 years and it's moving in a direction that makes picking Cauley-Stein where we did look better and better! I've been hot and cold with him over the years, but right now I really like what he's doing.

 

[KingsFanSince85]

To answer your question, maybe! It depends on what you value the most. Since our perimeter has been full of holes, Willie is the only big on the team that can leave his man, stop the ball, and then get back to his man. Yes, sometimes the Kings pay a price for that, but like it or not, Willie is the best pick and roll big man defender on the team, and it's not even close. Next game just watch Willie and keep track of how many times he stops penetration in the lane and still manages to guard his own man. He doesn't get enough credit for the work he does defensively. As Temple stated. Willie is the best defender on this team. If so, do you want to simply plant him under the basket to try and block shots, and probably get into foul trouble as a result.

The league is going away from big's that play under the basket, and Willie fits into the new look NBA. He's expanding his offensive game to go along with his defensive game. His one area of weakness, not always, but far too often is his rebounding. I won't be surprised if Willie spends a lot of the offseason working on his three pt shot. If he can shoot 35% or above from there, he's basically becomes almost unguardable. There are only a few, very few bigs in the NBA that can keep Willie in front of them out on the perimeter. So most play off of him. If he starts hitting those outside shots with consistency, they can't play off of him, and then he goes right around them, which collapses their defense. Only good things happen when that happens.

Sometimes it appears that some fans (not referring to you) watch Willie put up 20 something points and 10 boards and are disappointed because it doesn't fit the image they have of him in their mind. It's like, how dare he actually try and become a better offensive player. You can't put players in a box. Willie came to the game late, so he's going to be a bit of a late bloomer. I think were starting to see some of that in recent results.

You and I have been in alignment on WCS since the beginning.

Leading up to the draft and even right after it, my position was that he could evolve into an key piece to very good defense due to his size, length and ability to switch on to smaller players. Everyone remembers him running step for step with a small guard at the end of one of UK's tournament games, but it's his lateral movement and ability to switch pick and rolls that make him special. Now, he still has work to do and while he's not elite, he has become a very good defender for the Kings.

Secondly, a couple of seasons ago I made a controversial statement that I felt Willie's offense would develop to the point where he was similar to a Serge Ibaka. People laughed. But we're starting to see it trend that way. He's hitting elbow jumpers and 20 footers with regularity. And we're starting to see him scratch the surface with a 3pt shot. His ability to create off the dribble and turnaround game has improved greatly.

He's at 12.4 ppg (shooting 52%) and 6.6 rpg now. If he can get to a level of 15+ and 7-8 rpg combined with his defensive abilities, we've got a helluva player. I know many would love to see Willie average more rebounds, but considering that it's not a strength AND his defensive strengths keep him away from the basket quite a bit, I think 7-8 rpg is a pretty good number.

All in all, I think we're really starting to see Willie start to turn a corner. The biggest thing he needs is work on is consistentcy, as others have said.

 

[bajaden]

The consistency has been what's missing from him, but he looked good in the game against the Clippers I watched and he's put together a really solid January so far. If he can give us something close to 20 and 10 every night I'd be thrilled! I think a big part of the adjustment for young players in the NBA is learning that there's really no coasting at this level. Even end of the bench guys were the best player on their team everywhere else they've been -- if you're not prepared to bring it every night it shows. I'm pretty sure when we were discussing Willie before he was drafted I mentioned that his defensive skillset guarding pick and rolls was a unique and special skill but I wasn't sure it was more important than a strong presence under the basket...

Well, that was 2015 just after Golden State won their first championship and at the time it still looked a little flukey to me. Could they sustain that insane level of offensive prowess? Obviously that question has been answered now. And while I do think a shotblocker/rebounder inside is still important to close out possessions, those guys aren't really anchoring the defense anymore when every team in the league (well, almost every team) is trying to fire up as many threes in a game as they can. Mobility and versatility and timing and court awareness are so much more important now and that makes Willie's defensive skillset a huge plus. We've suffered from a lack of good options at PF and SF and a team defense is really only as good as it's weakest link but that's not Willie's fault. The league has changed a lot over the last 3 years and it's moving in a direction that makes picking Cauley-Stein where we did look better and better! I've been hot and cold with him over the years, but right now I really like what he's doing.

Can't argue with much you said. I agree with your premise. It's usually culture shock for most college players upon entering the NBA. Both Jackson and Fox have stated that they were surprised how strong everyone was in the NBA. It's one thing to know it, it's quite another to experience it. I also think that although a player was successful in college, he gets a quick reminder that what he got away with in college doesn't fly in the NBA. So adjustments are necessary. In Willie's case, he went from being a wide receiver in football, to a center in the NBA. He's learning new skills, and while those skills work great in practice going up against a teammate, or an assistant coach, he doesn't really know how well it's going to work in a real game. So little by little, a player will try one of his new found skills. Then comes the day when the realization sets in, that what you practiced, actually works. That's the moment that the light goes on.

Every player has his own timetable. Some will get there quicker than others. And of course, some will never get there, and some just won't care. If you have a player with elite athleticism, good BBIQ, a good work ethic, and a fire in his belly, I can almost guarantee you your going to end up with a very good basketball player. How long that takes depends on the starting point. I started watching Willie his freshman year at Kentucky, and it was obvious he was extremely raw when he got there. But I remember Calipari saying he was surprised how quickly Willie picked up things, and how quickly he was improving. I know we want to make the player into what we want him to be, but I'm afraid the player has a say in that, and to fair, it is his career. Quite fair for us to judge the results though.

 

[Sactown ExPat]

I don’t want to make a new thread for it, and this seems to have morphed into a general transactions thread with heavy emphasis on draft, so I am wondering what kind of poison pills we can put in an offer to Jokic this summer that would make it difficult for Denver to match? I assume that Denver will decline thier option to send him to RFA. Frontcourts of Doncic/Willie/Jokic or Bagley/Willie/Jokic with Giles/Skal off the bench are very, very tasty.

 

[ParniValjak]

You and I have been in alignment on WCS since the beginning.

Leading up to the draft and even right after it, my position was that he could evolve into an key piece to very good defense due to his size, length and ability to switch on to smaller players. Everyone remembers him running step for step with a small guard at the end of one of UK's tournament games, but it's his lateral movement and ability to switch pick and rolls that make him special. Now, he still has work to do and while he's not elite, he has become a very good defender for the Kings.

Secondly, a couple of seasons ago I made a controversial statement that I felt Willie's offense would develop to the point where he was similar to a Serge Ibaka. People laughed. But we're starting to see it trend that way. He's hitting elbow jumpers and 20 footers with regularity. And we're starting to see him scratch the surface with a 3pt shot. His ability to create off the dribble and turnaround game has improved greatly.

He's at 12.4 ppg (shooting 52%) and 6.6 rpg now. If he can get to a level of 15+ and 7-8 rpg combined with his defensive abilities, we've got a helluva player. I know many would love to see Willie average more rebounds, but considering that it's not a strength AND his defensive strengths keep him away from the basket quite a bit, I think 7-8 rpg is a pretty good number.

All in all, I think we're really starting to see Willie start to turn a corner. The biggest thing he needs is work on is consistentcy, as others have said.

If 7-8 is a good number, how exactly do you expect the Kings to become a good rebounding team? Fox is good as a rebounder for position. Bogdan and Buddy are OK. Basically your SF and PF would have to be beasts on the board to make up for your big man averaging 7-8 rebounds per game.

 

[ParniValjak]

I don’t want to make a new thread for it, and this seems to have morphed into a general transactions thread with heavy emphasis on draft, so I am wondering what kind of poison pills we can put in an offer to Jokic this summer that would make it difficult for Denver to match? I assume that Denver will decline thier option to send him to RFA. Frontcourts of Doncic/Willie/Jokic or Bagley/Willie/Jokic with Giles/Skal off the bench are very, very tasty.

Why would Denver decline their option? I makes no sense for them to do it. He is their best player and they will want to lock him up for as long as they can and five themselves the best chance of matching any offers.

 

[Sactown ExPat]

Why would Denver decline their option? I makes no sense for them to do it. He is their best player and they will want to lock him up for as long as they can and five themselves the best chance of matching any offers.

Because he will be a UFA in 2019 if they pick up their team option this summer. Better to decline and he becomes an RFA this summer.

 

[Folsomkingsfan]

If 7-8 is a good number, how exactly do you expect the Kings to become a good rebounding team? Fox is good as a rebounder for position. Bogdan and Buddy are OK. Basically your SF and PF would have to be beasts on the board to make up for your big man averaging 7-8 rebounds per game.

Well it's only so low because apparently he spends a lot of time on the perimeter playing defense for some reason.

 

[ParniValjak]

Because he will be a UFA in 2019 if they pick up their team option this summer. Better to decline and he becomes an RFA this summer.

Oh I forgot that he was a 2nd round pick. My bad!

 

[bajaden]

Well it's only so low because apparently he spends a lot of time on the perimeter playing defense for some reason.

Do I detect a bit of cynicism?

 

[sactowndog]

The motor and the work ethic and attitude that coach K says reminds him of his team USA players erases any concerns I have with Bagley.



Mitchell has been destroying everyone so it’s not that bad.

The endless amount of easy points they’d get guys off pick and roll would be enormous. Can see both guys averaging 5apg with Doncic higher than that 6-8apg

If it erases “any” concerns I would suggest you are too confident.

Wing defense is certainly a concern but I’m not sure any of the players address it. That’s one reason passing on OG was such a bummer as he would have fit perfectly with Bogdan.

Bagley, Ayton and Jackson are all 4-5’s and can’t defend the wing. Tre young is too small, Porter has a bad back and Doncic might be too slow.

My dream scenario is we get one and Boston gets 5 and we trade Brown and 1 for 5. Boston takes Ayton and we take Jackson/Bamba.

 

[206Fan]

To answer your question, maybe! It depends on what you value the most. Since our perimeter has been full of holes, Willie is the only big on the team that can leave his man, stop the ball, and then get back to his man. Yes, sometimes the Kings pay a price for that, but like it or not, Willie is the best pick and roll big man defender on the team, and it's not even close. Next game just watch Willie and keep track of how many times he stops penetration in the lane and still manages to guard his own man. He doesn't get enough credit for the work he does defensively. As Temple stated. Willie is the best defender on this team. If so, do you want to simply plant him under the basket to try and block shots, and probably get into foul trouble as a result.

The league is going away from big's that play under the basket, and Willie fits into the new look NBA. He's expanding his offensive game to go along with his defensive game. His one area of weakness, not always, but far too often is his rebounding. I won't be surprised if Willie spends a lot of the offseason working on his three pt shot. If he can shoot 35% or above from there, he's basically becomes almost unguardable. There are only a few, very few bigs in the NBA that can keep Willie in front of them out on the perimeter. So most play off of him. If he starts hitting those outside shots with consistency, they can't play off of him, and then he goes right around them, which collapses their defense. Only good things happen when that happens.

Sometimes it appears that some fans (not referring to you) watch Willie put up 20 something points and 10 boards and are disappointed because it doesn't fit the image they have of him in their mind. It's like, how dare he actually try and become a better offensive player. You can't put players in a box. Willie came to the game late, so he's going to be a bit of a late bloomer. I think were starting to see some of that in recent results.

My problem with having Willie out in the perimeter is that the Kings are such a horrible defensive team that why bother even have him step up when we know that the players don't/won't rotate over? We constantly have the middle lanes open for the drives. It forces help from the weakside..then BAM, there's a wide open shooter at the 3pt line.
How many times have we WCS forced to switch onto the ball handler, then has to run back at his man, and immediately has to run back out to contest a shooter? It shouldn't be on him. Other times, we'll see him defend stretch 4s, and he'll step in their lane and try to go for a steal, while leaving his man wide open. WCS is one of the rare guys who's athletic enough to do all these things, BUT it doesn't mean the Kings should force him to do everything on defense. Switching on defense would be ok if we didn't have liabilities all over the floor. Right now, I feel like we should be making him stay home a lot more instead of stepping out to the perimeter at the 3pt line. Dare the ball handler to shoot the mid-range if necessary. I think Willie is a lot more valuable as a rim protector, rebounder, and someone who can pick cutters under the basket. A lot of our defensive woes are not only on players, but also coaching staff.

Jaren Jackson Jr would be a perfect fit next to WCS on both ends minus the average rebounding. Wouldn't draft him in the top 5 though.

 

[Sactown ExPat]

If it erases “any” concerns I would suggest you are too confident.


My dream scenario is we get one and Boston gets 5 and we trade Brown and 1 for 5. Boston takes Ayton and we take Jackson/Bamba.

That is probably a correct valuation for the #1 if you are just going by a value chart, and Jackson is #5 on my board, but it would be a bummer to pass on maestros like Doncic and Young. Not saying your scenario would not have a bright future, but it would be a tough sell for the front office. The fan base would be pretty bummed.

Also, Bamba is going to be a major slider come June. Mo is a major project, and is unlikely to make any real contributions until his second contract. He has big time highlights, but watching a full Texas game allows for deeper analysis. He just has a long way to go. Imagine Skal without the silky jumper, but longer arms.

 

[ESP47]

If 7-8 is a good number, how exactly do you expect the Kings to become a good rebounding team? Fox is good as a rebounder for position. Bogdan and Buddy are OK. Basically your SF and PF would have to be beasts on the board to make up for your big man averaging 7-8 rebounds per game.

Yeah rebounding woes span across the team. WCS is our best big man but he's also the worst rebounder of the big men. Bogdan is actually a very poor rebounder. 3rd worst on the team.

The only guys that hold their own on the boards are Koufos, Mason and Hield. Everyone else on the team is basically below average.

 

[bajaden]

My problem with having Willie out in the perimeter is that the Kings are such a horrible defensive team that why bother even have him step up when we know that the players don't/won't rotate over? We constantly have the middle lanes open for the drives. It forces help from the weakside..then BAM, there's a wide open shooter at the 3pt line.
How many times have we WCS forced to switch onto the ball handler, then has to run back at his man, and immediately has to run back out to contest a shooter? It shouldn't be on him. Other times, we'll see him defend stretch 4s, and he'll step in their lane and try to go for a steal, while leaving his man wide open. WCS is one of the rare guys who's athletic enough to do all these things, BUT it doesn't mean the Kings should force him to do everything on defense. Switching on defense would be ok if we didn't have liabilities all over the floor. Right now, I feel like we should be making him stay home a lot more instead of stepping out to the perimeter at the 3pt line. Dare the ball handler to shoot the mid-range if necessary. I think Willie is a lot more valuable as a rim protector, rebounder, and someone who can pick cutters under the basket. A lot of our defensive woes are not only on players, but also coaching staff.

Jaren Jackson Jr would be a perfect fit next to WCS on both ends minus the average rebounding. Wouldn't draft him in the top 5 though.

I'm truly trying to follow your logic, but If I may use a metaphor, It's as if you have an electronic engineer who also knows how to do plumbing, and you want to hire him for the plumbing. If we need a rim protector, and rebounder, then go get one, but don't waste the superior talents of a player doing something someone with lesser talent can do. Look around the NBA. The player you describe isn't in great demand anymore. It's all about spreading the floor. Whether on defense or offense, the demands on the center position are far greater today than they used to be. He has to be mobile, be able to shoot the three, be able to handle the ball, be able to pass the ball, and be able to guard multiple positions at times. And, oh yeah, guard the post as well.

The problem isn't Willie, the problem is the people on the floor with Willie. While Willie doesn't block a lot of shots right now, he does affect a lot of shots. Sometimes players change their mind about going to the basket simply because Willie is standing in front of them. Even Westbrook, when one on one with Willie, gave up the ball instead of challenging him. Unfortunately Willie can't be everywhere on the floor, and he certainly can't stop the ball and defend his own back every time. In short, he needs help! I'm not saying that the players aren't there to give that help. I'am saying that its going to take time to get everyone on the same page. Team defense requires trust, chemistry, and a lot of experience. Don't know for sure about the first two, but were considerably short on the last one, especially with the constantly changing lineups.