Cousins extension?

[KingMilz]

So we can be the next Orlando magic? Count me out

But we are currently the Orlando Magic of the West with even less young talent at least they got Gordan/Fournier/Vuc/Payton, unless things change big time and we are actually a playoff team (as in 500.+ not being 5-10 games below 500. and still making it) I don't see how we are not the Orlando Magic rather than being the next.

The Orlando Magic has actually shown more potential than us as well over the last two years they were 19-13 last season before they had a 9-6 GOAT start collapse afterwards.

 

[mac]

But we are currently the Orlando Magic of the West with even less young talent at least they got Gordan/Fournier/Vuc/Payton, unless things change big time and we are actually a playoff team (as in 500.+ not being 5-10 games below 500. and still making it) I don't see how we are not the Orlando Magic rather than being the next.

The Orlando Magic has actually shown more potential than us as well over the last two years they were 19-13 last season before they had a 9-6 GOAT start collapse afterwards.

Meh the Magic probably had an easy schedule. If the Kings had easy schedules we'd have a championship every year under Cousins! Not our fault the refs hate us.

 

[John Galt]

You don't lowball the face of the franchise imo. Pay that man his money

 

[peacelate]

I wouldn't call 180M a meager offer. If he wants the max, give him the max, but some of you are under the notion that offering slightly below the max is a lowball offer.

 

[DesertFox]

With hometown teams getting an advantage in pay, I'm hoping there's a move away from instantly giving every good player the "max" off the bat.
I have no problem giving him what he deserves, but if a few million more per year is enough to get it done, then I'm fine with that. Because whiel the orginal teams have an advantage in offering more, they also can tie up more cap space.

I'd like to think Cuz is worth taking xx% of the team's budget, but I really don't know. This new "max contract" isn't the same kind max contract that has been thrown to every all-star the last decade.

 

[The Hammer]

Give the man a max deal, but structured in a way that certain goals (max number of technicals, ejections, suspensions, fines, off-court behavior) have to be met. That way you reward him for his talents, skills and contributions but incentivize leadership and good behavior. You make it up to him to reach the max by promoting changes in behavior that are within his control - he can't control whether we win or lose, but he can control the way he carries himself and the choices he makes.

You have Cousins' psychology wrong. That is not the way you manage a player like that. That is making him feel you are treating him with disrespect, like a dog jumping through hoops. That approach only works with stupid people. Cousins would be insulted.

I don't believe those types of contracts are allowed in the NBA anyway, but I could be wrong.

 

[Bricklayer]

I wouldn't call 180M a meager offer. If he wants the max, give him the max, but some of you are under the notion that offering slightly below the max is a lowball offer.

It absolutely is.

You don't "negotiate" with a Top 10 player. Nor a player basically doing you a favor by resigning at all.

This megamax was put into the CBA to be used, and top guys around the league will be popping up with them all over the place. The teams that try to get cheap and withhold part of it will be the ones where their top guys will openly, and with reason, question whether the franchise really is fully behind them. We've lived in that dumpster fire of a place far too long. Time to get out and continue acting like a grown up mature franchise. Got the coach, may take a couple of years, but got him. Got a stable GM. Not known if he's great or not, but he is stable and patient. No more random spastic moves or off the cuff ridiculousness. Now if we're given the chance we fully commit and lock in the franchise guy. And then we have a calm summer for once. No more turnover or threat of it. The pillars will all be in place, and you build around them knowing that they will be, and knowing what you have to build around. The only two times in our history when we even got close to that stability we also eventually made the playoffs, Petrie-Adelman-Webber and Petrie-St.Jean-Richmond.

 

[kupman]

This is a quite an issue. I would like to avoid it by making a trade before the deadline. A quality trade that is.

Cast your stones if you must.

If we do not make a trade, we need to give him (essentially forced) max money making any future trades very difficult. Yes, he is a great talent. But he would also be a max guy who has never experienced a winning record in the NBA and is well known to create headaches. Not easy to trade.

I am tired of playing the "if only" game. I am ready to move in another direction using DMC as our best trade asset.

 

[Bricklayer]

This is a quite an issue. I would like to avoid it by making a trade before the deadline. A quality trade that is.

Cast your stones if you must.

If we do not make a trade, we need to give him (essentially forced) max money making any future trades very difficult. Yes, he is a great talent. But he would also be a max guy who has never experienced a winning record in the NBA and is well known to create headaches. Not easy to trade.

I am tired of playing the "if only" game. I am ready to move in another direction using DMC as our best trade asset.

That's nice. But its also wrong. And its not what's happening.

In 30 years the franchise has only had one player to rival Cousins. In 70 years its only had 2. To say dumping one of those guys in their prime would be ridiculous is an understatement. Thankfully it appears that sort of dumpsterfireism is rapidly drawing to a close now. We may or may not suck in the future, but at least its going to be solid, normal, non-panicked or desperate sucking. We'll just do this the way everybody does this, and miracle of miracles, we'll probably eventually begin to get reasonably similar results. Just wind that clock back up, and this time let's go through 1, 2, 3 seasons with the GM+coach+franchise player all on the same page and in general agreement, and see what a difference that makes.

 

[peacelate]

It absolutely is.

You don't "negotiate" with a Top 10 player. Nor a player basically doing you a favor by resigning at all.

This megamax was put into the CBA to be used, and top guys around the league will be popping up with them all over the place. The teams that try to get cheap and withhold part of it will be the ones where their top guys will openly, and with reason, question whether the franchise really is fully behind them. We've lived in that dumpster fire of a place far too long. Time to get out and continue acting like a grown up mature franchise. Got the coach, may take a couple of years, but got him. Got a stable GM. Not known if he's great or not, but he is stable and patient. No more random spastic moves or off the cuff ridiculousness. Now if we're given the chance we fully commit and lock in the franchise guy. And then we have a calm summer for once. No more turnover or threat of it. The pillars will all be in place, and you build around them knowing that they will be, and knowing what you have to build around. The only two times in our history when we even got close to that stability we also eventually made the playoffs, Petrie-Adelman-Webber and Petrie-St.Jean-Richmond.

Cousins taking the full max which is vastly more than any other team can offer him is doing the Kings a favor? You don't need to offer a guy the max to prove you are 100% behind him. You build a team around him that competes and brings him closer to a championship. I would think the players like Cousins who want to win at all costs would endorse that type of thinking as opposed to $$$$$.

 

[Bricklayer]

Cousins taking the full max which is vastly more than any other team can offer him is doing the Kings a favor? You don't need to offer a guy the max to prove you are 100% behind him. You build a team around him that competes and brings him closer to a championship. I would think the players like Cousins who want to win at all costs would endorse that type of thinking as opposed to $$$$$.

That's really not how it works. Money is signalling, as well as being, well, money. Remember Kevin Love? Remember DWade this summer? Its an important franchise move to not only lock up Cousins, but to signal to the world that we aren't cheap, we aren't uncertain, we aren't playing games. And to Cousins himself who thrives off of loyalty and detests games. No games, no mucking around and squirming in the mud looking for loopholes. You do it loud and proud and lay it on the table. Say here we are, this is our guy, this is our coach, this is our GM. No more dumpster fire. No more chintziness. We're respectable. It wipes out a whole vast swath of the ick and uncertainty. Short circuits 1000 negative stories before they begin. Eliminates any thought of another PDA or Karl coming through town. Drives the Bee brigade into underground snarking. Ends Grant's rants.

Its an important move and statement that we are stable and respectable again as a franchise. it will matter to Cuz, it will matter to agents and players, it will disappoint media who have filled their blogs with weekly Kings = dumpster fire articles.

 

[peacelate]

That's really not how it works. Money is signalling, as well as being, well, money. Remember Kevin Love? Remember DWade this summer? Its an important franchise move to not only lock up Cousins, but to signal to the world that we aren't cheap, we aren't uncertain, we aren't playing games. And to Cousins himself who thrives off of loyalty and detests games. No games, no mucking around and squirming in the mud looking for loopholes. You do it loud and proud and lay it on the table. Say here we are, this is our guy, this is our coach, this is our GM. No more dumpster fire. No more chintziness. We're respectable. It wipes out a whole vast swath of the ick and uncertainty. Short circuits 1000 negative stories before they begin. Eliminates any thought of another PDA or Karl coming through town. Drives the Bee brigade into underground snarking. Ends Grant's rants.

Its an important move and statement that we are stable and respectable again as a franchise. it will matter to Cuz, it will matter to agents and players, it will disappoint media who have filled their blogs with weekly Kings = dumpster fire articles.

Wade left Miami because Riley did not repay Wade after he took numerous paycuts in the past so they could sign free agents like Bosh and James. I don't see how it's cheap to sign a guy to a team friendly deal and use the remainder on obtaining players who can help the team win.

 

[Joshoua]

You don't lowball the face of the franchise imo. Pay that man his money

Why not? It worked for the magic when they low balled Shaq who wanted to stay there.

 

[The Hammer]

Why not? It worked for the magic when they low balled Shaq who wanted to stay there.

Way different era. Different team. Different player.

Do you really think it's in the best interest of a team trying to recover its reputation among free agents and in the nationl press to low ball their first major star's big ol contract extension in 16 years? Aside from the risk of pissing off and losing a guy who has already shown more loyalty than we deserve, the message that sends is exactly the wrong one. Would have negative consequences guaranteed, and disastrous consequences possibly.

 

[King Baller]

PAY THE MAN!!!!!

 

[andjel]

Way different era. Different team. Different player.

Do you really think it's in the best interest of a team trying to recover its reputation among free agents and in the nationl press to low ball their first major star's big ol contract extension in 16 years? Aside from the risk of pissing off and losing a guy who has already shown more loyalty than we deserve, the message that sends is exactly the wrong one. Would have negative consequences guaranteed, and disastrous consequences possibly.

I think Joshua was ironic.

This article http://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/t...o-magic-let-the-lakers-steal-shaquille-oneal/ has a lot of similarities to what we are going through with Cuz right now.

 

[Lopes]

I think Joshua was ironic.

This article http://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/t...o-magic-let-the-lakers-steal-shaquille-oneal/ has a lot of similarities to what we are going through with Cuz right now.

Except the Magic made the playoffs w Shaq. How many top 10 players in the past never made the playoffs?

 

[Joshoua]

Except the Magic made the playoffs w Shaq. How many top 10 players in the past never made the playoffs?

Smh I don't think you get the point

 

[LA King Fan II]

Hopefully on the heels of the club doing the stable and respectable thing, Cuz will show the same kind of behavior on the court and stop the self hurting and team hurting constant pouting.

 

[King Baller]

Except the Magic made the playoffs w Shaq. How many top 10 players in the past never made the playoffs?

How about you cite examples of cases where "top 10" players single handedly made the playoffs?

 

[Amit149]

I really dont get the automatic max argumemt...
The best any other team can offer him is 140/4 we can offer 220/5 why wouldn't you try and get it down? 190/5 is still a far better deal than any other team can offer, you keep praising his loyalty and at the same time worried about him taking a discount to play elsewhere?

This is business, there are obscene sums of money on the line all this "do right by him" talk as if it's insulting to offer someone the best deal he can get and almost 200M is just weird.

 

[chief bromden]

I really dont get the automatic max argumemt...
The best any other team can offer him is 140/4 we can offer 220/5 why wouldn't you try and get it down? 190/5 is still a far better deal than any other team can offer, you keep praising his loyalty and at the same time worried about him taking a discount to play elsewhere?

This is business, there are obscene sums of money on the line all this "do right by him" talk as if it's insulting to offer someone the best deal he can get and almost 200M is just weird.

The players place value on their contracts relative to the other players in the league. Cousins has said multiple times that he thinks he is the best big in the NBA. I would bet he is expecting a Max Contract, and if the Kings don't offer one, he will look at it as a slight to him and go elsewhere, a la Shaq (which is what Joshoua was referring to). Offer the max, if he signs then great, the Kings have an asset that either helps them win going forward, or can be traded. If the Kings don't plan on offering the max (unlikely, right?), they should trade him now before he is an expiring.

 

[mac]

How about you cite examples of cases where "top 10" players single handedly made the playoffs?

I do think this idea of "single-handedly" is very subjective. The majority of role players don't look good... until they do. The whole "well let's see where Kings player X is now or Kings coach Y is now" doesn't really tell you the whole story, because where they are now is a function of their success as part of a team in the past. It's pretty much the same argument that people make when saying Kawhi Leonard wouldn't be the same player he is today if he were drafted by the Kings.

Also, in most cases top players are thought of as such precisely because they play a big part in enabling their teams to win a fair number of games.

Now given that Cousins is still our greatest asset, the essential thing is not to let him walk for free. If you're truly about winning, then you try and get Cousins as cheap as possible and use the remaining space to get better players. We're not an established playoff team, proven vets aren't queuing up to take minimum salaries to help us out in a title run. We're far from being one piece away from a championship. If you lose cap flexibility then the situation isn't going to change much. You'll have a lack of talent due to drafting lower as we fight and continually miss the playoffs or make first round exits, and the notion that Cousins has to do it all by himself will continue.

I won't pretend to know Cousins' mind, but if he's truly competitive and about winning then you hope he sees the rationale in "lowballing" him. But if it takes the max to keep him then so be it, it'll be better for our future.

 

[Big Cuz 15]

lmfao ppl saying offer less than the max to a future HOF player who is the most dominant big man in the game right now and haven't hit his prime yet. yes -- lets insult him by doing that. we still have big papa to fill in his spot when he decides to bolt.

 

[andjel]

The players place value on their contracts relative to the other players in the league. Cousins has said multiple times that he thinks he is the best big in the NBA. I would bet he is expecting a Max Contract, and if the Kings don't offer one, he will look at it as a slight to him and go elsewhere, a la Shaq (which is what Joshoua was referring to). Offer the max, if he signs then great, the Kings have an asset that either helps them win going forward, or can be traded. If the Kings don't plan on offering the max (unlikely, right?), they should trade him now before he is an expiring.

Well, if the insiders article about Shaq-Orlando negotiation was of any insight, it is not necessary to offer max outright, it is enough to be willing to do that and show love/respect during negotiation.

 

[andjel]

ok, I want to lock Cuz with Kings like most of folks, but there is a reason why negotiations exist.

I do not believe that offering less than max is necessarily an insult. It is not about penny pinching, it is also about capability to add talent around the player which is what most of the players also want (beside $$$).

Now if push comes to shove, Kings should negotiate in good faith (show love/respect) and be willing to offer max if that is what it takes from the Cuz side.

 

[Big Cuz 15]

Well, if the insiders article about Shaq-Orlando negotiation was of any insight, it is not necessary to offer max outright, it is enough to be willing to do that and show love/respect during negotiation.

you realize we have no leverage right? that orlando team went to the finals, had pieces around him to compete for a title. we have .... *crickets chirping*... oh thats right, joerger. yeah, go ahead and negotiate.

 

[Amit149]

you realize we have no leverage right? that orlando team went to the finals, had pieces around him to compete for a title. we have .... *crickets chirping*... oh thats right, joerger. yeah, go ahead and negotiate.

The way you view this franchise is quite sad.

We can offer him the most money- that's leverage, it doesnt mean we need to outbid ourselves.
He says he wants to stay here that's leverage.

What's the alternative for him if you think he wants to stay here? taking less money on a shorter deal to go somewhere else?

 

[peacelate]

How about you cite examples of cases where "top 10" players single handedly made the playoffs?

Dwayne Wade led the Heat to the playoffs with little talent.

Roster 2008-2009

Roster 2009-2010

 

[Suicide King]

If the relationship between DMC and Vlade is good enough then a lot of this becomes much easier.

1) You let Boogie know what he means to the franchise and you are willing to do what is necessary to retain him.

2) You ascertain if he just wants to remain here, get paid and hang his jersey, or does he want to try and win a championship.

3) If championship ( why wouldnt it be his goal) you have laid out yes we will pay the max, or we can work together to pay you handsomely while leaving us room to put pieces around you for a title.

You Do Not Lowball him. You go into it with mutual respect and goals and come out on the same page.