Maybe the Kings talked with Stephenson and maybe they even offered him a deal but he was unwilling to take a 1 year deal or he was unwilling to come in at a low salary slot. Maybe we decided that he wasn't enough of a PG. I doubt Vlade hasn't had conversations with players and agents. Lawson probably sees an opportunity to come in here and play.....maybe even start. With a DC suspension looming, Lawson starts for a little bit. On paper, we do need another player who can create off the bench. In that sense, the signing makes sense.
Ty Lawson
- Thread starter dude12
- Start date
The signing and our FA signings in general only make sense, when everything is viewed as some kind of stopgap solution.
Outside of our draft, which I simply can't judge, because I don't watch anything else than the NBA, everything is short term.
Rudy Gay is as good as gone. DMC only has one and a half year left, before the FO needs to make the final decision on trading him or risking to lose him in FA.
Our FA signings hint, that this franchise is basically on hold until the DMC situation is resolved one way or the other.
Utah is much improved. Portland stayed together. Minnesota is one year older and talented beyond belief. Denver is more experienced and didn't trade one of their vets. Dallas will find a way as they always do. Memphis will probably stay healthy. Pelicans will probably stay healthy and they made some smart moves.
With our current roster our chances to reach the Playoffs are slim to nonexistent. Maybe Joerger can work some magic, but we don't have much talent and revamped our roster once again, so we can not compensate our lack of talent with great chemistry and teamwork right out of the gates.
So why this stopgap thing? This simply doesn't look like a last attempt to make the PO and convince DMC to stay.
Outside of our draft, which I simply can't judge, because I don't watch anything else than the NBA, everything is short term.
Rudy Gay is as good as gone. DMC only has one and a half year left, before the FO needs to make the final decision on trading him or risking to lose him in FA.
Our FA signings hint, that this franchise is basically on hold until the DMC situation is resolved one way or the other.
Utah is much improved. Portland stayed together. Minnesota is one year older and talented beyond belief. Denver is more experienced and didn't trade one of their vets. Dallas will find a way as they always do. Memphis will probably stay healthy. Pelicans will probably stay healthy and they made some smart moves.
With our current roster our chances to reach the Playoffs are slim to nonexistent. Maybe Joerger can work some magic, but we don't have much talent and revamped our roster once again, so we can not compensate our lack of talent with great chemistry and teamwork right out of the gates.
So why this stopgap thing? This simply doesn't look like a last attempt to make the PO and convince DMC to stay.
Or.....or.....one can choose to look at it and think that we kept cap flexibility with the signings but were able to do so with capable vets who can help us win now. Anyone can spin it anyway they want. I think we are going to see an uptick in wins simply by becoming a better defensive team. How many teams can say they have the best big man in basketball? Capable guys at other positions, very good depth, a coach who has won with less. It's going to be about defense this year. Defense wins
Difficult to win with defense without great defenders.
Of course there are many ways to look at our team or roster, but this is what a message board is about right?
I think you are way too optimistic. You think I'm too pessimistic. Nothing wrong with that.
I just don't see the capable guys at other positions (outside of Rudy, who sounds like he already checked out mentally and who regressed last season and who isn't a good defender to begin with) or the very good depth.
Best big man in basketball? Yes I think you are right, but that alone doesn't make us a playoff team and AD or KAT aren't that far behind.
Of course there are many ways to look at our team or roster, but this is what a message board is about right?
I think you are way too optimistic. You think I'm too pessimistic. Nothing wrong with that.
I just don't see the capable guys at other positions (outside of Rudy, who sounds like he already checked out mentally and who regressed last season and who isn't a good defender to begin with) or the very good depth.
Best big man in basketball? Yes I think you are right, but that alone doesn't make us a playoff team and AD or KAT aren't that far behind.
The signing is ok. I don't love it I don't hate it, it's only a one year deal.
Doesn't jive with what this forum has been saying in regards to changing culture by bringing in defenders and guys that are good in the locker room. He definitely quit on his team in Denver, I HATE that.
I guess when you address the PG problem in August beggars can't be choosers.
Doesn't jive with what this forum has been saying in regards to changing culture by bringing in defenders and guys that are good in the locker room. He definitely quit on his team in Denver, I HATE that.
I guess when you address the PG problem in August beggars can't be choosers.
What garbage. This guy has horrible character. Maybe he can sell some dope to some of the younger guys, get them started on the road to a garbage career. It's absolutely pathetic that Divac would sign someone like this. He's got to be incredibly desperate and now he's sold his soul for this garbage. Just pathetic. This organization has talked about character and building the right way and now they prove themselves to be as hypocritical as you can get.
The only "locker room" guy DMC needs is a coach who knows whatbthe heck he is doing. All the problems have stemmed from his lack of patience with the incompetence from those above him that are suppose to know more but instead were moronic. With Joeger that problems solved...other issue is talent and Lawson, if Vlade thinks he has his head attached again, helps in that front....fits what roster needs and doesn't cost us any assests.
Part of me wonders if the Kings heard some news from the NBA about their intended scenarios with the Collison situation that prompted them to have an experienced PG on the roster just in case OR if they gave up on the Rudy trade scenario and wanted the full complete team to have time to work together.
Previous seasons are shown that Kings cannot attract quality free agents without severely overpaying them (and sometimes not even then).
Overpaying for some quality player long term, while not knowing how will things with Cuz play out, without any positive culture, with the new coach... I do not see that as a good move.
That is in my mind why culture change is more important than just chasing playoffs.
The stopgap signings so far are focused for that culture change. They provide the flexibility needed in the future to hire those quality free agents once Kings are not dark armpit of the NBA and uncertainty on the coach/player level is cleared.
Lawson signing is an exception, focusing on the other important but secondary objective (in coaches words) to win more games this year.
If nothing else, nobody can accuse Vlade of taking an easy way out by overpaying 1-2 players long term and than doing nothing since he has no more money or flexibility left.
Overpaying for some quality player long term, while not knowing how will things with Cuz play out, without any positive culture, with the new coach... I do not see that as a good move.
That is in my mind why culture change is more important than just chasing playoffs.
The stopgap signings so far are focused for that culture change. They provide the flexibility needed in the future to hire those quality free agents once Kings are not dark armpit of the NBA and uncertainty on the coach/player level is cleared.
Lawson signing is an exception, focusing on the other important but secondary objective (in coaches words) to win more games this year.
If nothing else, nobody can accuse Vlade of taking an easy way out by overpaying 1-2 players long term and than doing nothing since he has no more money or flexibility left.
http://blacksportsonline.com/home/2...-ig-bm-calls-him-deadbeat-in-comments-photos/
Welcome Ty Lawson and your "baby mama"!
Welcome Ty Lawson and your "baby mama"!
Oh I'm so judgmental. Dope and baby mammas. Let's not be judgmental now.
I'm waiting for the Kings' spin: Give him a chance; this could be his last stop, etc., etc. The Kings are so "charitable" giving Lawson another chance. And all the words about "character" go out the window. How far down in the gutter do you want to go, Divac? Is there anymore soul to sell?
I'm waiting for the Kings' spin: Give him a chance; this could be his last stop, etc., etc. The Kings are so "charitable" giving Lawson another chance.
And all the words about "character" go out the window. How far down in the gutter do you want to go, Divac? Is there anymore soul to sell?
I like this move. Talent wise, Ty Lawson was the best point guard left in free agency.
We got him on a cheap, make it or break it deal, and if he doesn't work out, you can waive him pretty easily.
On the flip side, he could prove himself a valuable NBA player and could actually be a good starting point guard in the league.
He is only 28 and is only one year removed from averaging 15pts and almost 10 assists (and that is post George Karl stats).
I can see him displacing DC as the starter, especially if DC has a longer than 8 game suspension coming.
We got him on a cheap, make it or break it deal, and if he doesn't work out, you can waive him pretty easily.
On the flip side, he could prove himself a valuable NBA player and could actually be a good starting point guard in the league.
He is only 28 and is only one year removed from averaging 15pts and almost 10 assists (and that is post George Karl stats).
I can see him displacing DC as the starter, especially if DC has a longer than 8 game suspension coming.
All of you guys saying that this goes against everyone we signed... have you forgotten about Matt Barnes? This dude has just as many problems on and off the court. We needed a PG. We got one. I would wager his contract has a bunch of "if you mess this up in any way you're done" statements in it that would save us from total embarrassment. It's not like he was in a position to argue.
So what will we do with that cap flexibility without Rudy Gay and possibly without DMC? How do the Kings clear the uncertainty and establish themselves as a credible organisation again with just another lottery season and with just another turnmoil caused by constant losing and a rightfully disgruntled superstar and his already disgruntled second fiddle?
I'm honestly suprised how as soon as we sign some low key veterans those guys suddenly become game and culture changers.
The Nets managed to sign Jeremy Lin to a decent contract, while heading into just another season as one of the worst NBA teams.
The Utah Jazz signed quality FA's while missing the PO time and time again with their "not so young anymore" core.
The Pelicans signed a bunch of guys with solid growth potential, that are young enough to head into their prime with their key players.
But somehow it's common sense, that the Kings magically can't sign any quality FA's.
I'm not talking about superstars. I'm talking about guys, that will help your team win.
I'm honestly suprised how as soon as we sign some low key veterans those guys suddenly become game and culture changers.
The Nets managed to sign Jeremy Lin to a decent contract, while heading into just another season as one of the worst NBA teams.
The Utah Jazz signed quality FA's while missing the PO time and time again with their "not so young anymore" core.
The Pelicans signed a bunch of guys with solid growth potential, that are young enough to head into their prime with their key players.
But somehow it's common sense, that the Kings magically can't sign any quality FA's.
I'm not talking about superstars. I'm talking about guys, that will help your team win.
Oh I'm so judgmental. Dope and baby mammas. Let's not be judgmental now.
I'm waiting for the Kings' spin: Give him a chance; this could be his last stop, etc., etc. The Kings are so "charitable" giving Lawson another chance. And all the words about "character" go out the window. How far down in the gutter do you want to go, Divac? Is there anymore soul to sell?
I'm waiting for the Kings' spin: Give him a chance; this could be his last stop, etc., etc. The Kings are so "charitable" giving Lawson another chance.
And all the words about "character" go out the window. How far down in the gutter do you want to go, Divac? Is there anymore soul to sell?
You've asked some good questions, that obviously I don't have all the answers to. So all I can do, is what everyone else is doing, speculate. I've learned not to talk in absolutes because there are none. What a player may have done last year, or what he did a few years ago, might have nothing to do with what he'll do this coming year. Different coach and different system, and that matters more than people think. I'm not saying that to make anyone think that Lawson is going to come in and be great. Frankly I don't know, and neither does anyone else right now. What I do know, is that he's talented, he's played on a playoff team as it's leader, and that right now, for the moment, he's motivated.
Cousins has on occasion, referred to Sacramento as his town, like in hometown. OK, I'm making that connection, but when listening to him, when he's been asked about staying in Sacramento, he's blown it off as if it's not even an option. Being a simple man, I take him at his word, while realizing that yes, he like anyone can change his mind. Point is, he's seems determined to be the man that turns the Kings into contenders. Whether he is or not is open to discussion, but you have to admire his determination. I think Cousins knows what Joerger and Vlade have in mind. He's not living in a vacuum devoid of organizational information. And if so, then he's probably on board. Once again, speculation on my part.
Lastly, while Lawson is not known for his defensive abilities, he has been the leader on a playoff team, which is more than any player on the Kings can say. So, despite his flaws, he's been good enough to accomplish something no one else on the Kings has accomplished in the last ten years. Please don't misunderstand, I seriously doubt that he'll have that kind of impact on the Kings, but I also don't think his signing is a reason to wring our hands in anguish. Vlade has surrounded Cousins, Lawson excluded, with a bunch of blue collar, unselfish players. Players that will go to war for you every night. How that adds up in the win column remains to be seen. But my gut tells me that his is going to be an interesting season to watch, and it may surprise a lot of pundits.
I don't think any of the moves Vlade made were made with the intent of keeping or losing Cousins. I think he has the long range future of the Kings in mind. In all likelyhood, there were some players of recognition that he would have liked to sign, but when he couldn't, he decided not to settle for any long term second bests. Rather than forfeit the future, he put off those kind of signings until next year when the Kings will be one of the few teams with a ton of money in a much better freeagent market. I hope Cousins is here for the long term. But that will be up to him, and if he wants to leave, I can't blame him. I think we'll know that decision at the trade deadline.
Cousins has on occasion, referred to Sacramento as his town, like in hometown. OK, I'm making that connection, but when listening to him, when he's been asked about staying in Sacramento, he's blown it off as if it's not even an option. Being a simple man, I take him at his word, while realizing that yes, he like anyone can change his mind. Point is, he's seems determined to be the man that turns the Kings into contenders. Whether he is or not is open to discussion, but you have to admire his determination. I think Cousins knows what Joerger and Vlade have in mind. He's not living in a vacuum devoid of organizational information. And if so, then he's probably on board. Once again, speculation on my part.
Lastly, while Lawson is not known for his defensive abilities, he has been the leader on a playoff team, which is more than any player on the Kings can say. So, despite his flaws, he's been good enough to accomplish something no one else on the Kings has accomplished in the last ten years. Please don't misunderstand, I seriously doubt that he'll have that kind of impact on the Kings, but I also don't think his signing is a reason to wring our hands in anguish. Vlade has surrounded Cousins, Lawson excluded, with a bunch of blue collar, unselfish players. Players that will go to war for you every night. How that adds up in the win column remains to be seen. But my gut tells me that his is going to be an interesting season to watch, and it may surprise a lot of pundits.
I don't think any of the moves Vlade made were made with the intent of keeping or losing Cousins. I think he has the long range future of the Kings in mind. In all likelyhood, there were some players of recognition that he would have liked to sign, but when he couldn't, he decided not to settle for any long term second bests. Rather than forfeit the future, he put off those kind of signings until next year when the Kings will be one of the few teams with a ton of money in a much better freeagent market. I hope Cousins is here for the long term. But that will be up to him, and if he wants to leave, I can't blame him. I think we'll know that decision at the trade deadline.
Until very recently Ty Lawson wasn't anybody's 'low key" veteran. I have no respect for the "man", but the two situations he was in last year were terrible fits for a ball dominant PG, playing alongside tow of the most ball dominant wings in the game today (Harden/George). Even if he weren't tipsy and having to aim for the second hoop from the left everytime he shot, you could hardly find a worse match for him style/skillwise. Much like the Rondo thing, put in a more appropriate system, his play could bounce back toward former levels.
Otherwise signing lowkey vets points toward Vlade reading this the same way I do: for years now the Kings haven't merely lacked talent/coaching, we've actually hired all kinds of guys who were net NEGATIVES. Merely eliminating the negatives, getting the right coach, and giving him a stack of hardworking defensive minded coachable vets can add wins by not subtracting them. Not enough wins to challenge the Warriors. But enough to not be stupidly awful again. Enough to maybe grind out .500 the good old fashioned way, through grit and teamwork. And then have the ability to clear as much capspace as we want next year, no matter what we decided we are going to do.
I'm not trying to pick on you, but I wanted to address something you mentioned. That's about being either negative or positive. Where I will disagree with anyone, and this is from a player's prospective, having been a baseball player, is that negative thoughts will destroy a players career. If you go up to bat doubting that you'll get a hit, you won't! If you take a jumpshot doubting that it will go in, it won't! People have been critical of some players thinking that they're arrogant and conceded, when in fact, they're confident to the extent that they believe no one can beat them. They believe that they're better than any other player on the court, and that's the right attitude. Negativism will destroy a team. Nothing good comes of it. Any battle you go into thinking your going to lose, is already lost.
Now, don't misunderstand me. If you critique the results of a game, and find negatives there, that's not being negative. That's after the fact, and fair game. I have no problem being critical of results, because were dealing with facts. What I have a problem with, is creating a climate of negativism before we've even played a game. I realize that it's only peoples opinion, and their entitled to it. But some on this forum are very inconsistent, and play both sides of the fence when it favors them to do so. Those people (not you) have lost my respect, not that it matters to them. I tend to be positive because I'm a competitor and I don't know any other way. And believe me, I understand people being skeptical. But I don't think you can accomplish anything by thinking you can't.
Now, don't misunderstand me. If you critique the results of a game, and find negatives there, that's not being negative. That's after the fact, and fair game. I have no problem being critical of results, because were dealing with facts. What I have a problem with, is creating a climate of negativism before we've even played a game. I realize that it's only peoples opinion, and their entitled to it. But some on this forum are very inconsistent, and play both sides of the fence when it favors them to do so. Those people (not you) have lost my respect, not that it matters to them. I tend to be positive because I'm a competitor and I don't know any other way. And believe me, I understand people being skeptical. But I don't think you can accomplish anything by thinking you can't.
You are assuming that we have a) losing season b) assumption a leads to the turmoil c) Cuz leaves because of it, including Gay.
If that is taken as a certainty, there is no arguing from me. But that is not a certainty, and I do not see a better way to avoid it than what we are doing. Signing Johnson or Lin I do not see as a moves that will make Kings playoff team more than Joerger doing the cultural approach.
To answer your "how do the Kings..." question, even if the most probable a) happens, just avoiding b and c as a consequence is the way to show Kings as a credible organization (Jazz make case for that, more later).
Players/agents/managers talk. While winning is important, it is not the only thing. We can suspect about Karl/Team drama, got it confirmed half way through the season.... I bet players and agents knew that way before us.
You know that two of those low key veterans were voted as the best teammates by their respective teams and have a stellar multi-year history in NBA. What else they could do to satisfy your criteria that they are good culture changers (nobody was talking about them as a game changers).
35 years old Joe Johnson (11 mil per year/ 2 years), Jeremy Lin (12 mil per year/ 3 years) (big market team btw, endorsements and market count), for the rest, can you please narrow it down whom do you consider game changer on any of those teams?
I do not see anyone who is noticeably more game changer than Afflalo or starter material on any west conference playoff team or long term contract quality player.
Did not follow Utah Jazz "not so young anymore" comment considering that their core is 25 years old. Insiders are more than aware that what was between them and playoff was the lack of PG due to the injuries for the last two season. They are the example how win/loss are not the only thing that can make the team relevant, showing the blueprint for the kings success the next year.
If that is taken as a certainty, there is no arguing from me. But that is not a certainty, and I do not see a better way to avoid it than what we are doing. Signing Johnson or Lin I do not see as a moves that will make Kings playoff team more than Joerger doing the cultural approach.
To answer your "how do the Kings..." question, even if the most probable a) happens, just avoiding b and c as a consequence is the way to show Kings as a credible organization (Jazz make case for that, more later).
Players/agents/managers talk. While winning is important, it is not the only thing. We can suspect about Karl/Team drama, got it confirmed half way through the season.... I bet players and agents knew that way before us.
You know that two of those low key veterans were voted as the best teammates by their respective teams and have a stellar multi-year history in NBA. What else they could do to satisfy your criteria that they are good culture changers (nobody was talking about them as a game changers).
35 years old Joe Johnson (11 mil per year/ 2 years), Jeremy Lin (12 mil per year/ 3 years) (big market team btw, endorsements and market count), for the rest, can you please narrow it down whom do you consider game changer on any of those teams?
I do not see anyone who is noticeably more game changer than Afflalo or starter material on any west conference playoff team or long term contract quality player.
Did not follow Utah Jazz "not so young anymore" comment considering that their core is 25 years old. Insiders are more than aware that what was between them and playoff was the lack of PG due to the injuries for the last two season. They are the example how win/loss are not the only thing that can make the team relevant, showing the blueprint for the kings success the next year.
I think you've struck on it. I think Vlade is trying to make the team respectable enough, that we'll be able to attract some of the better freeagents next offseason. After reading a hit piece on Fansidesd, it's obvious to me that people outside the Sacramento area have an image in their mind that has to be changed before the Kings become an attractive alternative again. If we can somehow grind out a 500 record this year, no mean feat by the way, I think the Kings will be looked at in a different light. Lawson wasn't my favorite choice as a backup PG, but he may be motivated enough to be better than any of the other options, barring a trade.
Oh I'm so judgmental. Dope and baby mammas. Let's not be judgmental now.
I'm waiting for the Kings' spin: Give him a chance; this could be his last stop, etc., etc. The Kings are so "charitable" giving Lawson another chance. And all the words about "character" go out the window. How far down in the gutter do you want to go, Divac? Is there anymore soul to sell?
I'm waiting for the Kings' spin: Give him a chance; this could be his last stop, etc., etc. The Kings are so "charitable" giving Lawson another chance.
And all the words about "character" go out the window. How far down in the gutter do you want to go, Divac? Is there anymore soul to sell?
