I think you would end up with the same problem that Team USA guys have....lack of time playing together which leads to some uneven offense and defense at times and also, some players have a hard time finding a rythmn when it comes to shooting as they are in and out of the lineup. And my 2 cents, USA would win that game or series.
Boogie at the Olympics
- Thread starter Bricklayer
- Start date
Eh. Europeans are only "better suited" to the international style inasmuch as they play it, and most Americans don't. Those Americans who go to play overseas seem to handle the transition just fine... I wonder, if USAB had chosen twelve guys from teams that didn't make the playoffs, and given them a two-month training camp to learn how to play together, and adjust to the international rules and style, how "unsuited" they would look?
Thanks for the response, along with what some others said I have been made aware of a position I didn't know existed. I can see a team made up of US college kids who got thrown together for a relatively short period before getting sent off to the Olympics getting beat by 50 like most US teams beat other teams. No idea why future NBA stars would ever want to put themselves in that position nowadays or why some would expect them to. To each their own I guess...
For other countries and athletes the US basketball team gives them a goal to chase and something to build towards. I don't feel like that would ever be the case with a revolving group of young kids who would be more focused on making the big money in the NBA than representing team USA.
For other countries and athletes the US basketball team gives them a goal to chase and something to build towards. I don't feel like that would ever be the case with a revolving group of young kids who would be more focused on making the big money in the NBA than representing team USA.
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this is all way off-topic imo. When I put my first comment in the thread I didn't anticipate your pointed personal "calling-out" that I should have seen coming if I had put my mind to it. Sorry, my bad. The thread can go back to "Boogie at the Olympics" right after Slim gets the last word on this tangent.
By the way, if I had the power to change it - I would NOT change it. Everyone... the vast majority of people... prefer it this way (send pro ringers to the Olympics) and I accept that, and the Olympics aren't actually being put on just for my benefit. I just don't have to agree right?
By the way, if I had the power to change it - I would NOT change it. Everyone... the vast majority of people... prefer it this way (send pro ringers to the Olympics) and I accept that, and the Olympics aren't actually being put on just for my benefit. I just don't have to agree right?
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The Chinese dominate Ping Pong. USA has Basketball, it is what it is.
As has been mentioned so many USA College players are one and done these days. That leaves a shallow pool of young talented players to build an Olympic team with.
Most of the Olympic teams are pretty good. Most miss the fact that the Serbian Team is in fact a group of All Stars that mostly play in Europe and happen to be Serbian. With Pro Leagues just about everywhere now, even China. How are you going to have an Amateur Olympic Basketball Team?
As has been mentioned so many USA College players are one and done these days. That leaves a shallow pool of young talented players to build an Olympic team with.
Most of the Olympic teams are pretty good. Most miss the fact that the Serbian Team is in fact a group of All Stars that mostly play in Europe and happen to be Serbian. With Pro Leagues just about everywhere now, even China. How are you going to have an Amateur Olympic Basketball Team?
At the same time, our shooters aren't shooting. Melo had a great day and Durant has been good but what has happened to Klay Thompson. I know this is to fiocus on Cousins but it is a team game. I'm watching a replay but George just missed a layup. It's a team failure.
I think Cousins had a string of bad games but I noted he plays well with Melo. Curiously, last night Cuz and Melo were hanging out together. Can't hurt Boogie in any way.
I think Cousins had a string of bad games but I noted he plays well with Melo. Curiously, last night Cuz and Melo were hanging out together. Can't hurt Boogie in any way.
DeAndre hasn't been great either. I see people screaming and asking what good centers the US could bring... But as soon as Lowry comes in things look WAY better for whoever is on the court. I really feel like it's just a poorly constructed lineup most of the time. A few moves here and there I have an inkling we would be way better.
There is way too much emphasis on this Offensive/defense lineup instead of balancing it out and making good lineups. An example would be Draymond and Klay should be together. International ball is way more lenient on screens and Draymond is one of the best at them, throw in his teammate who is pretty good at shooting off of them and poof. Improvement!
There is way too much emphasis on this Offensive/defense lineup instead of balancing it out and making good lineups. An example would be Draymond and Klay should be together. International ball is way more lenient on screens and Draymond is one of the best at them, throw in his teammate who is pretty good at shooting off of them and poof. Improvement!
In a way this team feels like the Kings of last season. I wonder if others see it too? Their entire goal seems to be based on the we are going to score an ungodly amount of points and dare you to keep up, defense be damned. And with all the talent they have they are barely pulling it off. If players with a clear talent advantage are having a difficult time of it, what chance did the Kings have with more often than not lesser talent than their opponents.
There was a time, a thousand years ago when many felt that the purity of the games mean't everyone competing was an amateur. And amateur was defined by whether you were being paid or not. The Olympic committee decided to ignore the fact that many of the European athlete's were getting retribution through sponsors and advertisers. As far as basketball goes, it was a time when very few European players played in the NBA. Of course times change. The NBA is loaded with players from other countries and the idea of using college players to compete against professionals is ridiculous.
If the spirit of the games is for each country to put it's best players against the other countries best players, then being professional or amateur has nothing to do with it. Getting paid doesn't automatically make you a better player. Talent and hard work does. For some, a gold medal is enough retribution. For others, it's getting paid. Either way, there's some sacrifice being offered. At the end of the day, it's about the honor of representing your country in fair competition. That's all that should matter. Or, you can become a member of the flat earth society.
If the spirit of the games is for each country to put it's best players against the other countries best players, then being professional or amateur has nothing to do with it. Getting paid doesn't automatically make you a better player. Talent and hard work does. For some, a gold medal is enough retribution. For others, it's getting paid. Either way, there's some sacrifice being offered. At the end of the day, it's about the honor of representing your country in fair competition. That's all that should matter. Or, you can become a member of the flat earth society.
I agree with some of you mentioning Coach K has not been balancing lineups very well. My starters would be:
Lowry
Thompson
Durant
Green
Cousins
Sure, Lowry, Thompson, Durant, & Cousins all have a scoring mentality, but Lowry, Thompson, & Cousins have already shown a willingness to defer at this level. Durant...not so much (which is fine), but when you start Durant, Irving, & Anthony together, you suddenly have 3 guys who are looking to go 1 on 1 on a consistent basis and looking to be "the guy." With Lowry looking to setup teammates (more so than Irving) & help spread the floor, Cousins focusing on screening, offensive rebounding, and 2nd chance points, Thompson being a great off the ball scorer, Green focusing on screening, spreading the floor, and finding open teammates, & Durant being the #1 scoring option, you have a very balanced team offensively.
Also, Lowry, Thompson, Green, & Cousins are all great defenders which should help set the tone from the beginning when opposing teams are playing their best lineups. Swapping Irving & Anthony for Lowry & Green makes the defense considerably worse while adding two more ball stoppers offensively.
Then off the bench, you run with this unit (DeRozan & Barnes don't get any minutes if I'm coaching):
Irving
Butler
George
Anthony
Jordan
Butler & Jordan would be the main players deferring on offense although George has shown that he's willing to defer at this level as well or at least play within the team concept. Then you have Irving & Anthony who can be the go-to, selfish chuckers with Butler, George, & Jordan providing the defensive balance.
I'm having trouble understanding Coach K's logic. My lineups seem like they would be much, much more successful, but maybe I'm just crazy...
Lowry
Thompson
Durant
Green
Cousins
Sure, Lowry, Thompson, Durant, & Cousins all have a scoring mentality, but Lowry, Thompson, & Cousins have already shown a willingness to defer at this level. Durant...not so much (which is fine), but when you start Durant, Irving, & Anthony together, you suddenly have 3 guys who are looking to go 1 on 1 on a consistent basis and looking to be "the guy." With Lowry looking to setup teammates (more so than Irving) & help spread the floor, Cousins focusing on screening, offensive rebounding, and 2nd chance points, Thompson being a great off the ball scorer, Green focusing on screening, spreading the floor, and finding open teammates, & Durant being the #1 scoring option, you have a very balanced team offensively.
Also, Lowry, Thompson, Green, & Cousins are all great defenders which should help set the tone from the beginning when opposing teams are playing their best lineups. Swapping Irving & Anthony for Lowry & Green makes the defense considerably worse while adding two more ball stoppers offensively.
Then off the bench, you run with this unit (DeRozan & Barnes don't get any minutes if I'm coaching):
Irving
Butler
George
Anthony
Jordan
Butler & Jordan would be the main players deferring on offense although George has shown that he's willing to defer at this level as well or at least play within the team concept. Then you have Irving & Anthony who can be the go-to, selfish chuckers with Butler, George, & Jordan providing the defensive balance.
I'm having trouble understanding Coach K's logic. My lineups seem like they would be much, much more successful, but maybe I'm just crazy...
I see a lot of criticism being flung around at pretty much everyone, but the one thing everyone seems to have in common is a lack of faith in Coach K right now and wishing that Pop had already taken over. I like both of your lineups just fine and would be happy with them. The biggest issue I see now is Kyrie needs a lot more help on the pick and roll than he is getting. We have a bunch of good tools that I think could help him but instead play him with the "offensive" lineup. He just has been playing it terribly and it makes everyone scramble from almost the instant the ball crosses half court. He is constantly way behind his man and guarding no one which sends all his team into weird spots trying to stop penetration which is then followed up by no kind of help or rotation. So ugly.
edit: Check out the highlights from todays game, most of the ones involving the other team start when Kyrie makes some strange choices. http://www.nbcolympics.com/news/united-states-closes-out-pool-play-win-over-france
edit: Check out the highlights from todays game, most of the ones involving the other team start when Kyrie makes some strange choices. http://www.nbcolympics.com/news/united-states-closes-out-pool-play-win-over-france
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I can see Coach K with a Warrior style death lineup with Kyrie, Klay, George, Durant, Green. Teams are just running screen and pop with Cousins and DJ and those guys aren't going out to challenge. If you arent going to feed the post with Cousins his value in a lineup drops, he is just not used to being a garbage guy.
Cousins is playing like garbage on both ends. He's doing a nice job of getting offensive rebounds and putbacks but he's constantly turning the ball over and completely flubbing his post moves against smaller guys. That spin move he tried to do on Lauvergne was awful. That matchup should have led to him absolutely destroying France and instead he did nothing with it.
Maybe I'm missing something, but I thought the idea was for every country to sent their best athlete's to compete. If some of those happen to be considered professional, then so be it. Being called a professional is nothing more than a label, and that label alone doesn't make you a great competitor. Frankly I get a little tired of these sanctimonious people preaching the purity of the games. Your putting five players on the floor against another five players on the floor and with one basketball. Once the ball goes up, labels don't matter. In basketball the US sets the standard, just like Austria and the Swiss set the standard in skiing. Someday, maybe today, the world will catch up, but until then, yeah, I'll beat my chest and scream USA.
One final note: Being the competitor that I'am, if I were an athlete in the Olympics, I would want to compete against the very best in the world. I wouldn't want to win a gold medal while going up against a bunch of 18 year old college students all the while knowing that if the US had sent it's best players, I wouldn't be standing on a stage, wearing a gold medal and listening to my national anthem. To think otherwise is idealistic BS.
One final note: Being the competitor that I'am, if I were an athlete in the Olympics, I would want to compete against the very best in the world. I wouldn't want to win a gold medal while going up against a bunch of 18 year old college students all the while knowing that if the US had sent it's best players, I wouldn't be standing on a stage, wearing a gold medal and listening to my national anthem. To think otherwise is idealistic BS.
Exactly my thoughts when I had read this thread earlier. The other countries are bringing their very best to represent their country proudly and hopefully come home with gold. To think we are somehow so far superior that we should send lesser talent to compete in the Olympics is absolutely ridiculous. Also if we would have sent any lesser talent to Rio we would have already lost AT LEAST 2 games.
Here's an article from a few years ago that touches on the subject. It is just a matter of perspective, opinion, point of view. It's all fine - not a life or death thing.. just a discussion that has more than one side to it.
http://www.cnn.com/2012/07/22/opinion/greene-olympics-amateurs/
http://www.cnn.com/2012/07/22/opinion/greene-olympics-amateurs/
listening to Fran Fraschilla earlier today when Argentina played versus Spain, he absolutely roasted Cousins saying he had no interest in playing any defense in the games he's watched and that you can't put him out there to cover the pick and roll, which is true...just kind of surprising coming from him who is usually known as a guy that isn't bias towards any one player(s)
