I am going to say he isn't. Vlade is a great judge of character, but not a great judge of talent. Clearly, he has swung and missed on his FA pickups and his one big trade could potentially set back the organization for years to come. His pick of WCS looks good, but when you consider how deep this draft was, is that any reason to get excited about his personnel ability? We truly need a GM who commands respect around the league and knows every nook and cranny of the NBA. Vlade is a great ambassador, diplomat, and has a lot to offer in a more global sense, but if he selects the next coach, it could end up being the next big Kings mistake.
Is Vlade the right guy to hire next coach?
- Thread starter DHR
- Start date
Join date: Nov 2013. Total Posts: 15.
Thread Topic: Should Vlade be GM?
Thread Title: Should Vlade hire next coach?
Why the disparity in topic and title? Kings fans are extra apprehensive about the coach before GM narrative (even though 1. Malone was the right choice and 2. Karl WAS chosen by the GM), and far more apprehensive about that than Vlade's track record as GM. Thus by attaching this "coach before GM" thing to Vlade in the thread title, OP is trying to illicit anti-Vlade responses. Clear agenda here.
Thread Topic: Should Vlade be GM?
Thread Title: Should Vlade hire next coach?
Why the disparity in topic and title? Kings fans are extra apprehensive about the coach before GM narrative (even though 1. Malone was the right choice and 2. Karl WAS chosen by the GM), and far more apprehensive about that than Vlade's track record as GM. Thus by attaching this "coach before GM" thing to Vlade in the thread title, OP is trying to illicit anti-Vlade responses. Clear agenda here.
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really swung and missed on Rondo? He is maybe dollar for dollar the best stat stuffer in the league right now. KK is a legit backup big man for a not-unreasonable price, not a homer but not a strikeout either. Belinelli is the big boner but if anybody could say they saw that coming, I'll kiss their ass in front of everybody. Everybody thought that was a solid pickup at the time.
Getting rid of the first round draft pick in 2018 or 2019 will set the organization back for years to come? I'll believe it when I see it. I doubt it.
I was annoyed that there was no deadline deal, but in hindsight - standing pat might have been the most well-considered and professional play available to him. Re-tool in the off-season, not on the fly right now. I'm gonna hand it to Vlade I think he did the right thing.
Only way he shouldn't get an extension is if somehow Vivek lands his dream scenario of making Calipari the head of the Sacramento Wildcats and has to give him the GM + Coach job to do it. I don't think he should, but I think he'd like to and I wouldn't really hate him for it if he pulled it off.
But otherwise - keep Vlade.
Getting rid of the first round draft pick in 2018 or 2019 will set the organization back for years to come? I'll believe it when I see it. I doubt it.
I was annoyed that there was no deadline deal, but in hindsight - standing pat might have been the most well-considered and professional play available to him. Re-tool in the off-season, not on the fly right now. I'm gonna hand it to Vlade I think he did the right thing.
Only way he shouldn't get an extension is if somehow Vivek lands his dream scenario of making Calipari the head of the Sacramento Wildcats and has to give him the GM + Coach job to do it. I don't think he should, but I think he'd like to and I wouldn't really hate him for it if he pulled it off.
But otherwise - keep Vlade.
Yes, he absolutely is.
In fact if anybody else does it will be an absolute ****ing disaster.
Our owner is an idiot. But yes, obviously we want him choosing another coach. Or we want him choosing another front office guy to choose the coach? Like he did with PDA?
We got incredibly lucky Vlade would even want to come in the first place. time to let him choose his coach and get the **** out of his way. He gave us WCS, won the Rondo gmable. Listens to Cousins. Biggest thing he's had to deal with is a holdover coach not of his own choosing.
In fact if anybody else does it will be an absolute ****ing disaster.
Our owner is an idiot. But yes, obviously we want him choosing another coach. Or we want him choosing another front office guy to choose the coach? Like he did with PDA?
We got incredibly lucky Vlade would even want to come in the first place. time to let him choose his coach and get the **** out of his way. He gave us WCS, won the Rondo gmable. Listens to Cousins. Biggest thing he's had to deal with is a holdover coach not of his own choosing.
K
He brought it Marco/Kosta/Rondo at roughly a combined 23million + when he could have got the same production (maybe even better) from Seth/Acy and Darren who probably don't even make 10million. Marco and kosta have lost playing time to two scrubs basically and it's debatable if Rondo right now is a better player than DC(I would take DC personally). So he brought in 3 guys who are not even better than the back ups he got for them.
He has not fired Karl and did zero at the trade deadline also........
Vlade's got to show me something before I can say yeah he should be the GM in the future.
He has not fired Karl and did zero at the trade deadline also........
Vlade's got to show me something before I can say yeah he should be the GM in the future.
Hogwash! Vlade, missed as you say, on one of his freeagents, Belinelli! Everyone here raise their hand if they thought Belinelli was a bad pickup prior to this season. What? No one. You don't have a crystal ball when your a GM. For the most part, you have to go with past history, and Belinelli's past history said he was a great pickup. Rondo has been better than expected, and Koufos has been, well, Koufos. I didn't expect Koufos to be anything more than a solid backup, and he has been. You refer to Willie Cauley-Stein and say it was a good choice, but then give no credit to Vlade, saying it was basically luck in a deep draft. How convenient for your analogy.
I have no idea how good or bad Vlade will be going forward, but I don't have much of a problem with what he's done so far. He's been better at bringing some sense of order to the Kings organization than his predecessor. You say he's no judge of talent, yet he was part of the laker's scouting dept in Europe. So someone must have thought he knew something about finding talent.
I have no idea how good or bad Vlade will be going forward, but I don't have much of a problem with what he's done so far. He's been better at bringing some sense of order to the Kings organization than his predecessor. You say he's no judge of talent, yet he was part of the laker's scouting dept in Europe. So someone must have thought he knew something about finding talent.
You lost all credibility with me when you just called WCS a scrub. I'll concede that it's debatable as to who is better overall, Rondo or Collison, depending on what your looking for in a PG, but Rondo has been far better than I, and probably a lot of people around the league thought he would be. Here's an idea. Why don't we just fire everyone. Hell, 9 months is enough time to prove your worth. Get rid of Vlade, Cousins, Gay, Vivek, Karl, the ball boy and all the scrubs as you put it. Lets get rid of the folks selling hotdogs while were at it. Just clean house. Maybe everyone will be happy then.
Well let's first see if Vlade returns to the team in the GM role or if he is going to get the boot. If he stays, I have no choice but to have faith that Vlade can go out there and get a coach that will be here for the forseeable future and not have to worry about firing a coach for a long long time. Stability is a necessity, not a commodity.
It's amazing how some people have the analytical prowess of a peanut.
So according to these guys,
- Rondo was not going to be a good pick up based of half a season in Dallas but conveniently is half a season in Boston before he got traded.
- Kosta Koufos is a bust because you know, he has not played well this season. Conveniently ignore the fact that he is a 7 year veteran tat as been good, consistent contributor on play off teams
- Marco Belinelli has had a career worst season so you know he must be someone that doesn't know how to play. Conveniently ignore the fact that he is a 8 year veteran who has consistently been one of the best spot up shooters in the league in that time and has played good minutes on an NBA championship winning teams.
People need to realize that the free agent signings have not been busts as they like to claim. True, some have struggled but it's plain as daylight why this is the case if anyone bothered to do any analysis. Kosta is not being used to his strengths. Belinelli has arguably been the most misused player on the roster. He is being asked to do something that he is not good at and something that doesn't suit his skillset. Rudy is also getting misused, so it Cousins.
Rondo is loving the freedom of this offensive system that is misusing the rest of the roster. We struggled to score consistently in the last quarter and a half last night against the Clippers and instead of posting up Cousins to draw fouls or create post opportunities for him or others with the defense collapsing, instead we continue to park him on the perimeter. I am not even going to bother about our "defense".....it's a broken record just how amateurish our defensive schemes are.
This roster is tailor made for a half court team that is looking to break when the break is there. Instead we are running at a league leading pace. It's trying to fit square pegs into round holes but some just don't get this. This roster as it stands now, with all it's holes, would be making the play offs this season if they were coached by any of the solid to great coaches out there that coach to the roster and not to their system.
I nearly threw up when I heard our assistant coach on James Ham's podcast the other day say that in their mind it's always a good time to break. That tells me everything that I need to know about this coaching staff.
Let Vlade pick the coach and let him do his job without interference and I have no doubt we are in the the play offs next year. People around the league might laugh at the Kings for hiring Vlade but I have no doubt that he has done infinitely a better job in his time here than PDA ever came close to doing and if the ownership would just let him do his thing without interference we would be in a LOT better place. The guy GETS IT!
So according to these guys,
- Rondo was not going to be a good pick up based of half a season in Dallas but conveniently is half a season in Boston before he got traded.
- Kosta Koufos is a bust because you know, he has not played well this season. Conveniently ignore the fact that he is a 7 year veteran tat as been good, consistent contributor on play off teams
- Marco Belinelli has had a career worst season so you know he must be someone that doesn't know how to play. Conveniently ignore the fact that he is a 8 year veteran who has consistently been one of the best spot up shooters in the league in that time and has played good minutes on an NBA championship winning teams.
People need to realize that the free agent signings have not been busts as they like to claim. True, some have struggled but it's plain as daylight why this is the case if anyone bothered to do any analysis. Kosta is not being used to his strengths. Belinelli has arguably been the most misused player on the roster. He is being asked to do something that he is not good at and something that doesn't suit his skillset. Rudy is also getting misused, so it Cousins.
Rondo is loving the freedom of this offensive system that is misusing the rest of the roster. We struggled to score consistently in the last quarter and a half last night against the Clippers and instead of posting up Cousins to draw fouls or create post opportunities for him or others with the defense collapsing, instead we continue to park him on the perimeter. I am not even going to bother about our "defense".....it's a broken record just how amateurish our defensive schemes are.
This roster is tailor made for a half court team that is looking to break when the break is there. Instead we are running at a league leading pace. It's trying to fit square pegs into round holes but some just don't get this. This roster as it stands now, with all it's holes, would be making the play offs this season if they were coached by any of the solid to great coaches out there that coach to the roster and not to their system.
I nearly threw up when I heard our assistant coach on James Ham's podcast the other day say that in their mind it's always a good time to break. That tells me everything that I need to know about this coaching staff.
Let Vlade pick the coach and let him do his job without interference and I have no doubt we are in the the play offs next year. People around the league might laugh at the Kings for hiring Vlade but I have no doubt that he has done infinitely a better job in his time here than PDA ever came close to doing and if the ownership would just let him do his thing without interference we would be in a LOT better place. The guy GETS IT!
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I have no idea if Vlade should be what he is or not. But this organization needs an entire basketball culture. A culture that starts from then top (GM) and works through the entire organization. Vlade should hire someone even if it means he is not here after the process is finished. If we have the right type of organization then we can replace a piece (coach or player) and keep moving on the right path. The problem is much bigger than who we draft or who we got in free agency or even who the coach is.
No, actually, the fanbase is suffering from PSTD at this point.
The overall organization has in fact failed to deliver for a solid decade now. But THIS one? THIS group? Not so much. They've only been making decisions for less than a year. Had to hit the ground running, put out numerous brush fires over the summer left to them by the previous regime rather than just concentrating on building. And there have been some positive improvements. We finally didn't blow a draft pick. You own distaste for him doesn't change the fact we won the Rondo gambit as he's had a big bounceback year. We got back Omri on a good deal. Not a single player we dumped has done anything for anyne this season -- that's talent evaluation too. In fact half of them are currently out of the NBA. It hasn't been a perfect run, but then again there is a widespread perception a big chunk of the problem might be a coach that again was a holdover.
THIS organization, THIS brain trust has done just fine since taking over. That haven;t fixed everything, but they've stabilized things and improved us at least a little. If you were going to can every front office who didn't turn you into a playoff team inside their first season then there would be no employed GMs. Ainge would never have lasted to create a title team. Pop would never have lasted long enough to name himself coach. It takes a little time. At the very least more than a single offseason. At the very least this crew not only deserves but NEEDS to get to name its own coach, and start an offseason in full control making alterations to a team it takes responsibility for. Then you see from there.
The overall organization has in fact failed to deliver for a solid decade now. But THIS one? THIS group? Not so much. They've only been making decisions for less than a year. Had to hit the ground running, put out numerous brush fires over the summer left to them by the previous regime rather than just concentrating on building. And there have been some positive improvements. We finally didn't blow a draft pick. You own distaste for him doesn't change the fact we won the Rondo gambit as he's had a big bounceback year. We got back Omri on a good deal. Not a single player we dumped has done anything for anyne this season -- that's talent evaluation too. In fact half of them are currently out of the NBA. It hasn't been a perfect run, but then again there is a widespread perception a big chunk of the problem might be a coach that again was a holdover.
THIS organization, THIS brain trust has done just fine since taking over. That haven;t fixed everything, but they've stabilized things and improved us at least a little. If you were going to can every front office who didn't turn you into a playoff team inside their first season then there would be no employed GMs. Ainge would never have lasted to create a title team. Pop would never have lasted long enough to name himself coach. It takes a little time. At the very least more than a single offseason. At the very least this crew not only deserves but NEEDS to get to name its own coach, and start an offseason in full control making alterations to a team it takes responsibility for. Then you see from there.
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His Sixers trade was freaking terrible.
Carl Landry only had 2 years left, and we could've used a stretch provision...2.6m until 19/20 season.
Jason Thompson only had 1 year left because his final year is only 2.6m guaranteed.
Stauskas is a project to say the most.
So we give up Carl Landry+Jason Thompson+Nik Stauskas+2018/19 1st round pick+ 2016 1st round swap+2017 1st round swap for.............NOTHING.
Actually no, we gave it all up for a slim shot at Wesley Matthews!!!
That was a dumbass decision by Vlade no matter what way you put it. Vlade basically traded away a 1st round+rookie+pick swaps for a prayer at Wesley Matthews who didn't even come here.
How is this justifiable in any way??
It's like playing Poker with a blindfold on, then going all in...
I guess it will take 10 years for people to actually see how bad this trade was if the Kings don't make the playoffs.
Carl Landry only had 2 years left, and we could've used a stretch provision...2.6m until 19/20 season.
Jason Thompson only had 1 year left because his final year is only 2.6m guaranteed.
Stauskas is a project to say the most.
So we give up Carl Landry+Jason Thompson+Nik Stauskas+2018/19 1st round pick+ 2016 1st round swap+2017 1st round swap for.............NOTHING.
Actually no, we gave it all up for a slim shot at Wesley Matthews!!!
That was a dumbass decision by Vlade no matter what way you put it. Vlade basically traded away a 1st round+rookie+pick swaps for a prayer at Wesley Matthews who didn't even come here.
How is this justifiable in any way??
It's like playing Poker with a blindfold on, then going all in...
I guess it will take 10 years for people to actually see how bad this trade was if the Kings don't make the playoffs.
Here's my problem with that terrible trade he made, he panicked. He made that trade in order to get a shot at Wesley Matthews...the guy coming off an Achilles injury. What would happen if he just waited a bit? Don't you think there would've been some other team out there willing to at least take Stauskas+Landry for a bench player? It seemed like a rush move because he wanted to get them all out of the way.
This feels a lot like the George Karl hire. Panicked, then screwed up. Hinkie fleeced us. Hell, he even got rid of JT...
This feels a lot like the George Karl hire. Panicked, then screwed up. Hinkie fleeced us. Hell, he even got rid of JT...
It was a good trade then, still a good trade.
We gave up utter garbage, and 1 single future pick. If you are a GM with any balls at all, anything at all from the waist down, you plan on making 2019 a reasonably late pick. You gave up no talent at all. No players who will be in the league. The pick swaps were an illusion for the dim witted. There were no pick swaps. Will be no pick swaps. It was a single future first to take a big chunk of our clogging garbage off our hands and let us start fresh.
Vlade got handed a huge mess with a loaded ticking clock on his franchise player. Thank god he has more balls than most pundits and is going to take his shots.
We gave up utter garbage, and 1 single future pick. If you are a GM with any balls at all, anything at all from the waist down, you plan on making 2019 a reasonably late pick. You gave up no talent at all. No players who will be in the league. The pick swaps were an illusion for the dim witted. There were no pick swaps. Will be no pick swaps. It was a single future first to take a big chunk of our clogging garbage off our hands and let us start fresh.
Vlade got handed a huge mess with a loaded ticking clock on his franchise player. Thank god he has more balls than most pundits and is going to take his shots.
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There's nothing wrong with that trade if he brings in the right coach and yes there isn't anyone more qualified to make that decision be it in consultation with a new GM or whatever Vlade knows what we need more than anyone.
You can keep playing for the draft but those days are numbered. The future pick swaps will soon be moot and no pick this year is going to help us win now - which In case you missed it is the plan.
Even if we had a solid pick this summer we'd be flipping it for some sg help.
You can keep playing for the draft but those days are numbered. The future pick swaps will soon be moot and no pick this year is going to help us win now - which In case you missed it is the plan.
Even if we had a solid pick this summer we'd be flipping it for some sg help.
I remain oddly eager for KMart to sign with us, so we can take a look at him even as part of the answer NEXT year.
He may be done. Possible. But I keep coming back to the fact he was still averaging 20ppg last year and all we need is 12-14 and hit your threes for it to be a clear useful upgrade. If he could just do that, it would strengthen our summer position considerably.
How are the pick swaps an illusion for the dim witted?? Are you talking about yourself here?!?!
One of the many things stopping the Pau Gasol trade was the fact that Philly had to approve it! That's a joke right there.
So what if we miss the playoffs this year? Is that still a good trade?
FOR WESLEY MATTHEWS who didn't even come here!
It's a consensus that Vlade is probably one of the worst GMs right now.. the same guy who said he probably won't draft Porzingis because he's too raw..(I pleaded for him here).
One of the many things stopping the Pau Gasol trade was the fact that Philly had to approve it! That's a joke right there.
So what if we miss the playoffs this year? Is that still a good trade?
FOR WESLEY MATTHEWS who didn't even come here!
It's a consensus that Vlade is probably one of the worst GMs right now.. the same guy who said he probably won't draft Porzingis because he's too raw..(I pleaded for him here).
K
We gave up garbage to sign more garbage that's more expensive and longer term deals while hampering us in the future in regards to draft picks. Again the trio of Rondo/BellyKk have been given every chance to turn this around and yet there back ups Darren/Seth/Acy have matched or out performed them while being on shorter leashes and having less chance to get into a rhythm.
I keep seeing this thing how the Rondo gamble paid off.....if it did that's the worst gamble of all time cause all hes done is inflate his value while
having limited impact in regards to w/l overall. He took over from Darren a guy making less that could actually be a better player now.
Koufos is currently last in the big man rotation despite being a favourite of Karl's and Marco is challenging or even surpassing eMpTy and Sessions in terms of horrible.
I keep seeing this thing how the Rondo gamble paid off.....if it did that's the worst gamble of all time cause all hes done is inflate his value while
having limited impact in regards to w/l overall. He took over from Darren a guy making less that could actually be a better player now.
Koufos is currently last in the big man rotation despite being a favourite of Karl's and Marco is challenging or even surpassing eMpTy and Sessions in terms of horrible.
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I want the quote where Vlade said that about Porzingis. And while you're at it post the one where Phil Jackson said Zingis would take years to develop and called him Shawn Bradley. So what you pleaded for him. After his workout he wasn't getting past NY or Orlando. And the pick swap will never happen.
So you knew in July that marco would have his worst year ever. If people knew curry would out perform marco why has he been dleague bound since day 1. Let me guess you also knew Danny Green would suck as well making Pop a fool for paying him more than a rookie backup who is outplaying him.
So you knew in July that marco would have his worst year ever. If people knew curry would out perform marco why has he been dleague bound since day 1. Let me guess you also knew Danny Green would suck as well making Pop a fool for paying him more than a rookie backup who is outplaying him.
K
It has nothing to do with knowing I have never claimed I knew anything but have explain what's occured. Sometimes the investments you make look good at the time but turn out garbage, after losing money you don't walk away and say well that still was a good investment when you just lost or wasted everything you put it. Barring a miracles turnaround Vlades off season investments have been garbage at this point in time.
It's not about what looks good at the start of the season it's where you are come playoffs. I guess every high lottery draft pick that was a bust looked good at the time as well so therefore you can't blame the person that picked them going by your logic.
It's not about what looks good at the start of the season it's where you are come playoffs. I guess every high lottery draft pick that was a bust looked good at the time as well so therefore you can't blame the person that picked them going by your logic.
Vlade had a terrific off-season picking up the pieces of what PDA and Mullin left. The players he brought in all have value in the league as opposed to what we had the previous year which is players with negative value. The fact that Karl mismanaged the roster is on the previous regime. Once Vlade puts his own coach in place this roster will be better. I'll be interested in what he does at the SG position.