Kings trade JT, Nik and Landry to Sixers (renamed)

[Amit149]

My thoughts on the whole thing is that we are doing the right thing in a dumb way...

Did I wanted us to draft WCS? yes, I certainly did.
But with Mudiay just sitting there, and WCS dropping by every account outside the top-10, the smart and reasonable move would be to take a page from the 76ers playbook, draft Mudiay and trade for WCS with some extras (like the 76ers did with Elfrid Payton...).

Instead we did the right move (drafting WCS) in a dumb way (taking him straight up at 6)...

Same here,
Do I think it was a good move to clear up cap space? yes, I certainly do.
But why should we give up so much to make it happen?

Nik has value, positive value. with rookie contracts getting more and more lucrative, a prospect that does exactly the things the league value most have value, even if he had a crap first season (and I wouldn't go far with how crappy it really was).

JT has value, positive value. with guys getting huge contracts and a lot of teams can't secure their PF/3rd big, JT has a lot of value. Amir Johnson just got 12 mil/per year, Aminu that playing defense and rebounding is all he can do just good 30/4, if JT was out on the market he could've got a deal like the one he have now fairly easy and it's not hard to think on team that might want to take him (Indiana doesn't have a PF and want to invest all of their cap in Monta, Toronto lost Johnson and are shopping Terrence Ross for a while).

Landry has negative value, but his contract isn't huge. it's an overpay- but let's not exaggerate about it. do you really think that giving up a 1st rounder, pick swaps and two guys with positive value is a great and smart move that should be applauded???

Again clearing cap space was the right move, and I totally get where this is coming from. but it was done in a dumb way...

 

[Merdiesel]

Seeing "LaMarcus Aldridge has crossed the Lakers off of his list" scroll on the bottom of ESPN is such a great start to the day.

Let me guess LA, you guys didn't really want him anyways, right? lol

 

[IfAt1st]

I fear the George Karl influence that is being mentioned may be for Ty Lawson.

KF's are all thinking about the free agents that are being talked about - but remember, Karl's brain is stuck on 3 years ago, and 1 mile up in elevation - he simply cannot shake this dependence on his previous players and embrace a new approach to basketball.

 

[lwc]

I fear the George Karl influence that is being mentioned may be for Ty Lawson.

KF's are all thinking about the free agents that are being talked about - but remember, Karl's brain is stuck on 3 years ago, and 1 mile up in elevation - he simply cannot shake this dependence on his previous players and embrace a new approach to basketball.

Would the Kings have the space for Lawson and Matthews?

 

[Sac.Kings]

I'm not too worried about Karl. It's clear to me that Vlade is concerned about filling in the gaps as best as he can and in a way that both makes sense and is financially plausible. Karl is going to coach whatever roster Vlade gives him. If Vlade didn't do a thing with Woj and Fegan attacking from left and right, then Karl has no chance, especially being on thin ice already.

 

[TheGOAT1006]

Would the Kings have the space for Lawson and Matthews?

Question is who would we even trade for Lawson?

I wouldn't want to see us move any of our current pieces. I think they all fit perfectly right now as is. Collison would be the ONLY one I'd be willing to part with but even he would be a great backup PG.

 

[lwc]

Question is who would we even trade for Lawson?

I wouldn't want to see us move any of our current pieces. I think they all fit perfectly right now as is. Collison would be the ONLY one I'd be willing to part with but even he would be a great backup PG.

I have been wondering the same but it just seems as if the Lawson stuff wont go away. Plus, if the choice is between Rondo, Ellis, or Lawson, give me Lawson because he would be the better fit.

 

[captain bill]

Legit talent?

And no, we shipped off useless spare parts to get caproom to spend on pieces we like better. The money is still going to be spent.

Maybe. I've learned I'm not very good at reading the tea leaves when it comes to this front office so I don't know. But Stauskas still has potential, JT is a quality player, and we just shipped off a first round pick and doubled down on the hell we've been in of not being able to trade picks. We also have a chairman who's overseeing a battle between owners who are pissed about spending money on coaches and a FO that has shown no ability to execute any of its plans, Vlade's improved PR notwithstanding. The FO dumped a bunch of assets for cash and is trying to sell the fan base on acquiring FA - for a franchise that has never had success in free agency and is now being run by a crazy person who is getting roasted daily by the national media and who agents apparently hate.

Cash considerations 3.0

 

[LA King Fan II]

Honestly wasnt counting on any og the guys shipped out to be of any help this year. If they were it would be another 27 win season.

As I see it spending money was our only hope. We kept our best players.

Nice job Vlade!

 

['89 Kings Fan]

Seeing as how the Warriors payroll just went over a hundred million and David West is interested in a ring.

Dark horse theory: Cap Space for Lee + Barnes.

Also in play now that New Orleans just broke the bank:
Cap Space for Anderson + Gordon.

 

[TheGOAT1006]

No thanks to Eric Gordon

 

[Gilles]

Seeing as how the Warriors payroll just went over a hundred million and David West is interested in a ring.

Dark horse theory: Cap Space for Lee + Barnes.

Also in play now that New Orleans just broke the bank:
Cap Space for Anderson + Gordon.

No PG coming to Kings, deals are DOA.

 

[Livinthedream]

My thoughts on the whole thing is that we are doing the right thing in a dumb way...

Did I wanted us to draft WCS? yes, I certainly did.
But with Mudiay just sitting there, and WCS dropping by every account outside the top-10, the smart and reasonable move would be to take a page from the 76ers playbook, draft Mudiay and trade for WCS with some extras (like the 76ers did with Elfrid Payton...).

Instead we did the right move (drafting WCS) in a dumb way (taking him straight up at 6)...

Same here,
Do I think it was a good move to clear up cap space? yes, I certainly do.
But why should we give up so much to make it happen?

Nik has value, positive value. with rookie contracts getting more and more lucrative, a prospect that does exactly the things the league value most have value, even if he had a crap first season (and I wouldn't go far with how crappy it really was).

JT has value, positive value. with guys getting huge contracts and a lot of teams can't secure their PF/3rd big, JT has a lot of value. Amir Johnson just got 12 mil/per year, Aminu that playing defense and rebounding is all he can do just good 30/4, if JT was out on the market he could've got a deal like the one he have now fairly easy and it's not hard to think on team that might want to take him (Indiana doesn't have a PF and want to invest all of their cap in Monta, Toronto lost Johnson and are shopping Terrence Ross for a while).

Landry has negative value, but his contract isn't huge. it's an overpay- but let's not exaggerate about it. do you really think that giving up a 1st rounder, pick swaps and two guys with positive value is a great and smart move that should be applauded???

Again clearing cap space was the right move, and I totally get where this is coming from. but it was done in a dumb way...

Good post. We all understand the theory behind what the Kings want to do. The problem is how we got here.

I'd be less concerned if we had already met with Matthews and player x and THEN made the cap clearing trade.

 

[Big Cuz 15]

wow, we shipped out sauce, JT, landry and a future pick for cash!? hope that pick is protected if this backfires.

there was a tidbit that they were interested in resigning derrick f'ng williams. WTF-

 

[ovrush]

Matthews is the key here. There are options at pg, but matthews if healthy is the perfect compliment to what we have.

I was nervous when we made the trade but im now cautiously optimistic. Dallas doesnt want to pay him 15m, and doesnt have complimentary pieces in place. Toronto has a surplus of wings, less talent, and is one of the few nba markets that doesn't instantly trump Sac.

Once you have Matthews, you're approaching additional free agents with a pretty solid core. Rondo has lots of guys to pass to in that scenario and Gay is a friend so you probly arent forced to overpay there, theres also other options out there at pg like Beverly/lin/ellis so its not all or nothing.

 

[theclash4u5]

wow, we shipped out sauce, JT, landry and a future pick for cash!? hope that pick is protected if this backfires.

there was a tidbit that they were interested in resigning derrick f'ng williams. WTF-

Top 10 protected. I'm not worried about that. More about the pick swaps in 16 and 17. Gotta hope we don't win the lottery now, which if we finish with 40-45 wins, probably won't happen.

But don't tell the Clippers and Bulls that teams in the 7-13 range never win the lotto.

 

[Rain man]

wow, we shipped out sauce, JT, landry and a future pick for cash!? hope that pick is protected if this backfires.

there was a tidbit that they were interested in resigning derrick f'ng williams. WTF-

We didn't trade for "cash." During the Maloof era we traded assets for "cash" (ie we sent an asset out and someone sent us a sack of money). Teams rarely do that.

Here we traded for cap space. No one sent us a sack of money. Teams do that all the time. The plan is to use that money to sign other players or use it in a trade. The idea is to trade players making a lot of money that you don't use (JT and Landry) so you can use that money on something you actually want.

 

[Peter_Gibbons]

We gave up a very serviceable big in JT. Its worth it if we can spin the cap space into veterans that can turn this into a playoff team now.

Most likely we will get rondo but Matthews at $15 mil per is really too much.

If we get Rondo for $10 mil and Matthews for $15 mil, we basically traded JT, Nik, landry, a 1st rd pick and the swaps for Matthews. Its going to be a bad trade unless we make the playoffs.

Affalo just agreed to $8 mil a year with a bad team. Why weren't we talking to him?

 

[TheGOAT1006]

Afflalo couldn't even hit open shots with the Blazers...he's not the same. Glad we passed.

 

[Livinthedream]

We gave up a very serviceable big in JT. Its worth it if we can spin the cap space into veterans that can turn this into a playoff team now.

Most likely we will get rondo but Matthews at $15 mil per is really too much.

If we get Rondo for $10 mil and Matthews for $15 mil, we basically traded JT, Nik, landry, a 1st rd pick and the swaps for Matthews. Its going to be a bad trade unless we make the playoffs.

Affalo just agreed to $8 mil a year with a bad team. Why weren't we talking to him?

We make the playoffs for one year, then what? People aren't seeing the long term ramifications. Cousins will absolutely have to be traded. If not this summer, within 2 years.

 

[TheGOAT1006]

We make the playoffs for one year, then what? People aren't seeing the long term ramifications. Cousins will absolutely have to be traded. If not this summer, within 2 years.

How do you figure? The Sixers don't even get the protected pick until 2 years after our obligation to the Bulls. And then all we're doing is swapping picks IF the Sixers choose. We could potentially be picking after them. You guys are acting like we're losing so many picks...we lose one for sure. We keep all of our long term picks and have 2 years until we give up a pick. Woop dee doo! I'll take it all day.

Still have Boogie, Ben, and WCS all under 25 who we can build on.

Lol haven't we been rebuilding long enough and you guys are worried about losing 1 pick years from now, and the potential of Sixers swapping spots with us lol. I plan on us contending, not drafting in the lottery again for Sixers to be wanting to swap picks. Just my take.

 

[Gilles]

Dallas can't pay Wes more than $12 million, if they are giving max to DAJ. They have $33 million tied to 5 players. DAJ's max will bring them up to $51.5 million, which leaves $16 million and Room Exception for Wes, backup PG, wing and big. Even if their entire bench will consist of vet minimum guys, Mavs can only offer $14 million.

Raptors have only 7 rotation players (+2 projects) with Carroll signing and about $11 million in cap space. Toronto will have to renounce Lou Will to get access to that money plus will have no backup PG, now that Vasquez is also gone.

Hopefully Kings and Wes' agent can work out S&T with Portland for minor assets to give him a bit more than $15 million.
$15 million question for Kings: is Wes healthy? $15 million question for Matthews: do I sign for a team, that doesn't have their coach or star player recruiting me?

We make the playoffs for one year, then what? People aren't seeing the long term ramifications. Cousins will absolutely have to be traded. If not this summer, within 2 years.

Why? If you haven't noticed, Divas ignores Karl's ideas forcing GK to coach the team, that he, Vlade, constructed. I'm pretty sure, Karl is gone next off-season, even if Kings make POs, but things are not smooth on personal front.

 

[Amit149]

How do you figure? The Sixers don't even get the protected pick until 2 years after our obligation to the Bulls. And then all we're doing is swapping picks IF the Sixers choose. We could potentially be picking after them. You guys are acting like we're losing so many picks...we lose one for sure. We keep all of our long term picks and have 2 years until we give up a pick. Woop dee doo! I'll take it all day.

Still have Boogie, Ben, and WCS all under 25 who we can build on.

Lol haven't we been rebuilding long enough and you guys are worried about losing 1 pick years from now, and the potential of Sixers swapping spots with us lol. I plan on us contending, not drafting in the lottery again for Sixers to be wanting to swap picks. Just my take.

The thing is you have no building blocks left, it's cool to say: "we have cap space to trade for this guy" but you have nothing left to send back.
If we don't nail this free agency, we are at very bad shape...
there's a reason why reporters are grading this trade for us a F...

 

[Rain man]

We make the playoffs for one year, then what? People aren't seeing the long term ramifications. Cousins will absolutely have to be traded. If not this summer, within 2 years.

Ugh. I am so tired of worrying about "long term ramifications." We have been worrying about long term impacts since 2007, and we haven't won 30 games once. You know what teams get hung up on the future? Bad teams with nothing to like in the present.

We didn't care about draft picks when we were good (did anyone complain about Dan Dickau being a bust?). The Spurs intentionally draft guys who aren't coming to the NBA that year because they don't need rookies. The Cavs and Warriors didn't add helpful pieces in this draft.

The point is that we have a unique opportunity to get much better right now. If it costs us a draft pick in 2018, so be it. If the move pans out, you will never swap with Philly and won't care about that mid 20s pick in 2018. If it doesn't pan out, you are probably trading Cousins, Gay, and whoever else you acquire in one of the next two off seasons, and getting a slew of "future pieces" that way.

But to keep holding "future pieces" at the expense of getting better now is silly. We have done it for 8 years with no luck. The rebuild is over. We need to act to build a contender around boogie now. If it fails, blow it all up in 2 years. But if you think cousins is sticking around for another contract while we hoard future pieces, you are wrong. If you want to build around Coudins, you need to do it now, and with potential impact players- not JT and a 2018 draft pick.

 

[lawlman91]

I'll put in different names:
- Josh Smith - Smith/Moreland/Trill round em up around DMC and we make sure no one drives easy
- Belinelli - Creates space for our bigs (legit SG)
- Rodney Stuckey - Can run in Karls 2 PG system (should be cheaper than Rondo)

Belinelli sounds like a slightly better fit than Beverley. If we can get either Bel or Bev, and then a big man, we've got ourselves a team.

 

[TheGOAT1006]

The thing is you have no building blocks left, it's cool to say: "we have cap space to trade for this guy" but you have nothing left to send back.
If we don't nail this free agency, we are at very bad shape...
there's a reason why reporters are grading this trade for us a F...

I completely agree with you, we have to nail this FA. We have no more pieces for trades unless we give away the pieces we want to keep. BUT all we lost was Stauskas as far as long term plans, potentially. Landry and JT were never in the long term plans. We lose a first rounder years from now. At what point do we start getting better NOW?? Or are we still stuck on worrying about potential rookies we could draft in 2018, 2019, 2020? It was a risk, but I like it. It puts us in the game of at least trying to compete NOW.

 

[ovrush]

The other thing to consider over the next couple days is depth. Collison was actually better than any of the fa pg options available when he was on the court last year. The wheels came off for us when he or cuz or rudy were hurt.

We'll never win with cuz out, but if we can add depth behind collison and rudy we should be able to stay tough through injuries to anyone but cuz. Matthews gives wing depth to cover gay and can play with gay. We dont really need a rondo level splash. Collison as a starter is fine. Go get a Beverly who will embrace splitting time with collison and is cheaper and safer than rondo. Then you take any money saved and try to find a low post scorer to backup cuz when he's off the floor. Carlos boozer might work. Keep his minutes low and if boogie takes a night off it doesnt break how you run the team.

If our staring five was the 5th best in the league last yearcwhen healthy, we just need depth behind our big 3 that ensures our entire play style isnt changed anytime one goes off the floor.

 

[TheGOAT1006]

Belinelli sounds like a slightly better fit than Beverley. If we can get either Bel or Bev, and then a big man, we've got ourselves a team.

Exactly. Let's say Rondo and Matthews don't pan out.

If we get any GOOD serviceable players be it Beverly, Belinelli, Koufos, Brewer. We would still be better off than had we kept Stauskas, LAndry, JT and a 2018 first rounder.

That's a playoff team right there w/ good fitting pieces.

 

[ninjabiscuit]

Can you think of a player that has ever come back from an Achilles injury the same? This isn't the same Wesley Matthews we're talking about. It's a huge risk financially, and even more considering his injury.

http://www.insidesocal.com/lakers/2...kins-details-how-he-overcame-achilles-injury/

 

[lawlman91]

The other thing to consider over the next couple days is depth. Collison was actually better than any of the fa pg options available when he was on the court last year. The wheels came off for us when he or cuz or rudy were hurt.

We'll never win with cuz out, but if we can add depth behind collison and rudy we should be able to stay tough through injuries to anyone but cuz. Matthews gives wing depth to cover gay and can play with gay. We dont really need a rondo level splash. Collison as a starter is fine. Go get a Beverly who will embrace splitting time with collison and is cheaper and safer than rondo. Then you take any money saved and try to find a low post scorer to backup cuz when he's off the floor. Carlos boozer might work. Keep his minutes low and if boogie takes a night off it doesnt break how you run the team.

If our staring five was the 5th best in the league last yearcwhen healthy, we just need depth behind our big 3 that ensures our entire play style isnt changed anytime one goes off the floor.

This is good. I didn't know we were capable of affording a wing, a point, and a low post scorer. I thought we could only choose two.

If we could only get two, I'd get a (shooting wing OR and shooting point) AND a (low post scoring big man).