IIRC it was something like MKG, Davis, TRob and (Beal?) didn't want to work out for us because they were somewhat consensus top 4. Then Barnes and maybe Drummond or someone else didn't want to either because it would be some sort of signal that they were inferior. They were all vying for top 4 - nobody really wanted to play for us, and who could blame them.
[Grades] Grades v. Pistons 11/15/2013
- Thread starter Bricklayer
- Start date
Drummond DID work out for us.
That was what made it all the worse. We had him in. Worked him out. And ****ed up anyway.
You know the biggest irony? Many years ago after foolishly letting Gerald Wallace escape via expansion draft, Geoff looked back at that whole thing in entirely the wrong light, and said he was never going to take anybody he hadn't had a chance to work out again. Queue his final season, he brings in this giant mega athlete, works him out, then come draft day gulps, blinks, and TAKES A GUY HE DIDN'T work out. After a decade of saying he'd never do it again. And sure enough it bites him and us in the ass. Except he gets off easy. One year later he is forcefully retired. But the Kings...I won't let this go because of the epic level of that mistake. You can't get guys like Drummond anywhere but the draft. A pairing of Cousins/Drummond could have a serious chance to be the best frontcourt since Robinson/Duncan. You might be able to win titles with that frontcourt. But no. Of course not.
That was what made it all the worse. We had him in. Worked him out. And ****ed up anyway.
You know the biggest irony? Many years ago after foolishly letting Gerald Wallace escape via expansion draft, Geoff looked back at that whole thing in entirely the wrong light, and said he was never going to take anybody he hadn't had a chance to work out again. Queue his final season, he brings in this giant mega athlete, works him out, then come draft day gulps, blinks, and TAKES A GUY HE DIDN'T work out. After a decade of saying he'd never do it again. And sure enough it bites him and us in the ass. Except he gets off easy. One year later he is forcefully retired. But the Kings...I won't let this go because of the epic level of that mistake. You can't get guys like Drummond anywhere but the draft. A pairing of Cousins/Drummond could have a serious chance to be the best frontcourt since Robinson/Duncan. You might be able to win titles with that frontcourt. But no. Of course not.
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Major League might explain drafting TRob over Drummond. Maybe the Maloofs meddled in the drafting decisions again with an eye towards sucking as much as possible.
Overall, this Kings team isn't very good. I hope there are some trades soon to keep the season interesting.
Why wasn't N'Diaye tried on Drummond last night (besides him being terrible)? ... at least he has some length. Hayes is not worth playing anymore, he's been on the bench far too much the past couple of years to be effective on the court - might as well throw Shareef out there.
Overall, this Kings team isn't very good. I hope there are some trades soon to keep the season interesting.
Why wasn't N'Diaye tried on Drummond last night (besides him being terrible)? ... at least he has some length. Hayes is not worth playing anymore, he's been on the bench far too much the past couple of years to be effective on the court - might as well throw Shareef out there.
I'm one of the few left that think Jimmer can be a positive contributor to the team, but I still think playing Thornton was the right call. One of the worst things Smart did last year was change the lineups around mid-game when a shooter was having a bad shooting night. It meant players were looking over their shoulder after each miss to see if the coach was about to yank them off the court. A coach having confidence in his scorers, even when they have off nights is going to lead to better performances down the road.
The Kings were right with the Pistons until the very end of the 3rd quarter; then Cousins goes out; there is no Thompson; and Drummond acts like he's the only big man on the floor; which he is. Why no Thompson?
ESPN should do more Kings games. Cousins played harder in this game than any game in which I've ever seen him. He was a man on the defensive and offensive end. He was mentally tough; he didn't let the refs get him out of his game. If we get this kind of effort out of Cousins for most nights, it will be a successful season. Couldn't be happier with what he did out there. Now, please sir, I'd like some more.
Thompson played the best defensive game I think I've ever seen him play. He played like he used to as a rookie, with all-out effort, not a sense of an entitlement that he's been seen to carry over these last few years. I'd give him 100% on effort except for one play in which he looked to the ref for just a second after not agreeing with a call; the result was his man got behind him for a layup down the floor. Old habits die hard. Still, I'd take that effort out of Thompson any day.
As for the rest, they would have had to play near the very top of their respective games to pull this out because of the size disadvantage in the 4th quarter. They didn't. It didn't help Vasquez any to play the last game against the slowest team in the league in the Nets, in which there were large gaps of space to make nice passes to wide open teammates. This game was just the opposite. Detroit's D was very good, the space wasn't there for the passes, the men were covered much better, but Vasquez didn't seem to realize it. When you get a ton of TOs from your "passing pg", you're in trouble. IT had a great first half I thought; a pretty mediocre 2nd half. He made some TOs you just can't do coming down the stretch.
It's not just coincidence that Portland and Detroit defeated the Kings decisively. The Kings are deprived in athleticism, especially long athleticism. I don't see how they overcome that deficit against athletic teams. You either have it or you don't. Hopefully, Patterson will be back soon. Otherwise, it's a tank by virtue of injury and a top 5 pick is guaranteed.
ESPN should do more Kings games. Cousins played harder in this game than any game in which I've ever seen him. He was a man on the defensive and offensive end. He was mentally tough; he didn't let the refs get him out of his game. If we get this kind of effort out of Cousins for most nights, it will be a successful season. Couldn't be happier with what he did out there. Now, please sir, I'd like some more.
Thompson played the best defensive game I think I've ever seen him play. He played like he used to as a rookie, with all-out effort, not a sense of an entitlement that he's been seen to carry over these last few years. I'd give him 100% on effort except for one play in which he looked to the ref for just a second after not agreeing with a call; the result was his man got behind him for a layup down the floor. Old habits die hard. Still, I'd take that effort out of Thompson any day.
As for the rest, they would have had to play near the very top of their respective games to pull this out because of the size disadvantage in the 4th quarter. They didn't. It didn't help Vasquez any to play the last game against the slowest team in the league in the Nets, in which there were large gaps of space to make nice passes to wide open teammates. This game was just the opposite. Detroit's D was very good, the space wasn't there for the passes, the men were covered much better, but Vasquez didn't seem to realize it. When you get a ton of TOs from your "passing pg", you're in trouble. IT had a great first half I thought; a pretty mediocre 2nd half. He made some TOs you just can't do coming down the stretch.
It's not just coincidence that Portland and Detroit defeated the Kings decisively. The Kings are deprived in athleticism, especially long athleticism. I don't see how they overcome that deficit against athletic teams. You either have it or you don't. Hopefully, Patterson will be back soon. Otherwise, it's a tank by virtue of injury and a top 5 pick is guaranteed.
It's amazing what a great owner, a decent coach, and a big pocket full of cash will do to who I think is basically a very good guy. Whether or not they read Boogie correctly, his anger has always about not getting respect. That's my short and dirty pop psych analysis. Brick was absolutely correct in pushing for the extension before the season. Now Boogie's value has concretely been demonstrated by the FO. He'll do what he can and now obviously needs help.
Just for the record, I never criticized Drummond's talent. I was worried about his desire, which was his problem in highschool and in his one year in college. I wasn't alone in that criticism, as most NBA scouts felt the same way. I said in one of my posts that if someone could light a fire under him, they'd have on hell of a basketball player. The problem is, you just never know. As they say, hindsight is 100%.
Bricky will vote for any athletic player thats 7 feet tall with long arm's. 
He was in love with Thabeet as well. Thabeet's problem, which is the same problem that Whiteside had, as does Fab Melo, is zero BBIQ and little feel for the game. Doesn't mean they can't become productive players. It does happen, but it definitely takes time. That was never the question with Drummond. There were some that felt he didn't really like playing basketball, but happened to be good at it. Whatever the reason, there were times where he just disappeared in games and became a bystander. If not for those games, he probably would have been a top 2 or 3 pick.
He was in love with Thabeet as well. Thabeet's problem, which is the same problem that Whiteside had, as does Fab Melo, is zero BBIQ and little feel for the game. Doesn't mean they can't become productive players. It does happen, but it definitely takes time. That was never the question with Drummond. There were some that felt he didn't really like playing basketball, but happened to be good at it. Whatever the reason, there were times where he just disappeared in games and became a bystander. If not for those games, he probably would have been a top 2 or 3 pick.Just for the record, when it was our turn to pick, my first choice would have been Barnes, and my second choice would have been Lillard. Simply because I had watched both players play a lot, I had similar reservations about Thomas as I did Drummond, just for different reasons. If my only choice would have been between the two of them, I probably would have drafted Thomas. Not because I'm afraid to take a risk, but I didn't think the franchise was in a position at that time to take a risk. Of course now, I'd take Drummond. I have a crystal ball ordered, so in the future, I'll make better choices.
Lets be clear! Drummond isn't an offensive monster. Most of his points came on offensive rebound putbacks. Its damm hard to defend that. That's not intended to denigrate Drummond, but to say he's not that hard to defend one on one in the post simply because he's not that skilled yet. Where Drummond hurt us was on the boards, both offensively and defensively. Where we really got killed is when both JT and Cuz were on the bench, and Patterson was in the lockerroom. It was like a bunch of highschool seniors playing a bunch of 4th graders in the post. Mbah a Moute was our tallest player on the court, and I didn't see a big S on his chest.
Baja, I thought I remembered you saying before the draft that you hadn't got to see Lillard much. From what I remember, you weren't a big fan. You said he wasn't a real PG or something to that effect... Forgive me if I'm mistaken, will have to go back and look at the thread again.
EDIT: Found what I remembered.
http://kingsfans.com/threads/trade-idea-tyreke-to-portland-for-the-6th-pick.46189/#post-908901
Sorry Baja
EDIT: Found what I remembered.
http://kingsfans.com/threads/trade-idea-tyreke-to-portland-for-the-6th-pick.46189/#post-908901
Sorry Baja
Baja, I thought I remembered you saying before the draft that you hadn't got to see Lillard much. From what I remember, you weren't a big fan. You said he wasn't a real PG or something to that effect... Forgive me if I'm mistaken, will have to go back and look at the thread again.
EDIT: Found what I remembered.
http://kingsfans.com/threads/trade-idea-tyreke-to-portland-for-the-6th-pick.46189/#post-908901
Sorry Baja
EDIT: Found what I remembered.
http://kingsfans.com/threads/trade-idea-tyreke-to-portland-for-the-6th-pick.46189/#post-908901
Sorry Baja
I made no bones about who I wanted in that draft, and hoped that somehow he would slide down to us, and that was Gilchrist. However, at the moment we were going to make our choice, my pick would have been Barnes. I know that some on this forum wern't that high on Barnes, but I aways thought he would be a good player, but not necessarily a great player. I was never that high on Thomas, but there was a period of time where I tried to talk myself into him. Fortunately, Uncia03 slapped me around a bit, and brought me to my senses.
I think I saw Lillard play three times, and I was impressed with his demeanor and court presence. But I wasn't about to make a post saying he was the best thing since sliced cheese without enough info to back it up. Doesn't mean I didn't like him. Once I saw him play in summer league, I realized that he was a far better athlete than he appeared to be on TV, and that he did have more PG skills than I had seen. Of course once we drafted Thomas, I tried to become a glass is half full guy. One can only hope!.
Did you watch the game? Cousins blocked three shots and affected many more last night. By my count he blocked 4 shots. Of course the scorer doesn't have the ability to replay in slow mo, and it was very difficult to tell in real time in a crowd. I also thought that JT did a very good job on defense. The killer in the game, where they just put some separation between us and them was when JT and Cuz were both on the bench and our frontcourt consisted of Hayes and Mbah a Moute. We were just killed in the post in every way possible.
The problem with Robinson, is that regardless of what he did in college, he doesn't have the size to be a consistent force at the 4 position in the NBA..and he doesn't have the skills to play 3. He's smaller than Patrick Patterson.
If you don't have length, you better have a lot of girth and strength..or elite skills. He doesn't have any of those. It was really a bad pick.
To miss on Lillard, Drummond,..Leonard, Barnes, Clay Thompson. It's a bit mind boggeling
If you don't have length, you better have a lot of girth and strength..or elite skills. He doesn't have any of those. It was really a bad pick.
To miss on Lillard, Drummond,..Leonard, Barnes, Clay Thompson. It's a bit mind boggeling
Baja, I thought I remembered you saying before the draft that you hadn't got to see Lillard much. From what I remember, you weren't a big fan. You said he wasn't a real PG or something to that effect... Forgive me if I'm mistaken, will have to go back and look at the thread again.
EDIT: Found what I remembered.
http://kingsfans.com/threads/trade-idea-tyreke-to-portland-for-the-6th-pick.46189/#post-908901
Sorry Baja
EDIT: Found what I remembered.
http://kingsfans.com/threads/trade-idea-tyreke-to-portland-for-the-6th-pick.46189/#post-908901
Sorry Baja
Now, you are twisting your own facts for whatever reason.
You only saw him play a few times. That was your statement before. And you said you did not know why we should even draft him other than for trade.
Now, suddenly because Lillard has turned to be a very good player, he was your second choice because you've seen him PLAY A LOT before?
Which one is it?
You only saw him play a few times. That was your statement before. And you said you did not know why we should even draft him other than for trade.
Now, suddenly because Lillard has turned to be a very good player, he was your second choice because you've seen him PLAY A LOT before?
Which one is it?
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