Yet another "Cousins time bomb?" discussion... (split from game thread)

[IfAt1st]

I'll direct you to my sig.

Unfortunately, "playing tough against the tough teams" (and conversely, playing down to the worse teams) simply will not cut it this year.

They HAVE to find a way to win, pronto, or they will quickly run out of time on the Cousins timebomb.

(Note - this was split out by moderators from the Spurs game thread)

 

[pshn80]

I'll direct you to my sig.

Unfortunately, "playing tough against the tough teams" (and conversely, playing down to the worse teams) simply will not cut it this year.

They HAVE to find a way to win, pronto, or they will quickly run out of time on the Cousins timebomb.

For me Cousins is not a time bomb. He stays, he goes, our problem is the same, putting together a team that is competitive and wins most of the time. Don't worry about Cousins, worry about fielding a team that is in the game and wins more often than it loses.

 

[IfAt1st]

For me Cousins is not a time bomb. He stays, he goes, our problem is the same, putting together a team that is competitive and wins most of the time. Don't worry about Cousins, worry about fielding a team that is in the game and wins more often than it loses.

This statement insinuates that you think this Kings franchise can put together a winner without Cousins.

I'm sincerely curious - is there one data point or observation you could point to over the last 10 years that would support that belief?

 

[Kingster]

This statement insinuates that you think this Kings franchise can put together a winner without Cousins.

I'm sincerely curious - is there one data point or observation you could point to over the last 10 years that would support that belief?

Given that Cousins hasn't been on a winner for the entire 6+ years of his term it would seem to me the onus of the argument should be to prove that the Kings can put together a winner with Cousins. My own view is that the Cousins ship has sailed already, and because of prospective middling draft picks and FA disadvantages, and lack of talent ammo to trade, there are structural reasons to believe that nothing will change going forward with Cousins on this team.

Now maybe I misinterpreted your statement. Maybe you are are saying that it won't make a difference one way or the other, with or without Cousins; that the incompetence of the current management team will bring mediocrity going forward regardless. On the point, I have no argument!

 

[kingsboi]

Given that Cousins hasn't been on a winner for the entire 6+ years of his term it would seem to me the onus of the argument should be to prove that the Kings can put together a winner with Cousins. My own view is that the Cousins ship has sailed already, and because of prospective middling draft picks and FA disadvantages, and lack of talent ammo to trade, there are structural reasons to believe that nothing will change going forward with Cousins on this team.

Now maybe I misinterpreted your statement. Maybe you are are saying that it won't make a difference one way or the other, with or without Cousins; that the incompetence of the current management team will bring mediocrity going forward regardless. On the point, I have no argument!

So I suppose with all that said, especially your last paragraph, the Kings ought to kick start their rebuilding phase sooner rather than later, but...this management hasn't had enough time with the organization yet to show they can build a winner or that they can successfully complete a full rebuild.

 

[Jimbob]

I dislike the idea of losing Cousins. My reasonings, all rehashed, include we wont get equal value in return and even if we do get a star potential player and pieces will they be as loyal to Sacramento as Cuz has been?

I saw a recent article that inferred how Thibs is building the Wolves. Thibs didnt have to build crap. He inhereted a young team with 3 potenial allstars and a top 5 no brainer draft pick in Dunn. Who wouldnt want to coach or play there with that potential. Sacramento has Cousins and scraps, OK, Gay has been pretty good this year. Perhaps many free agents dont want to play with Cuz?? but he has nothing to do with our abysmal draft history.

We may give up on young players early but how many have found success since being traded. Thats why Im happy to see if trading Willi, and Casspi whos not so young can net us a better piece of the puzzel before trading away a top 10 talent in Cuz.

 

[kingwin]

I dislike the idea of losing Cousins. My reasonings, all rehashed, include we wont get equal value in return and even if we do get a star potential player and pieces will they be as loyal to Sacramento as Cuz has been?

I saw a recent article that inferred how Thibs is building the Wolves. Thibs didnt have to build crap. He inhereted a young team with 3 potenial allstars and a top 5 no brainer draft pick in Dunn. Who wouldnt want to coach or play there with that potential. Sacramento has Cousins and scraps, OK, Gay has been pretty good this year. Perhaps many free agents dont want to play with Cuz?? but he has nothing to do with our abysmal draft history.

We may give up on young players early but how many have found success since being traded. Thats why Im happy to see if trading Willi, and Casspi whos not so young can net us a better piece of the puzzel before trading away a top 10 talent in Cuz.

How did Minnesota get those players.....

 

[Jimbob]

How did Minnesota get those players.....

Yes they traded Love and got the rights to Wiggins, however I do think Love even at the time is half the player of Cuz. The Wolves also have had much better recent luck with lottery position.

We could trade Cuz to Boston and get a couple pretty good players and maybe a draft pick. We might even keep our own draft pick and finally beat the oddds in a pretty good draft. That could be a good rebuild start.

More my point in my above thread is I like Cuz, and hate the idea that we would move him because we have had years of pee poor management? I also dont think Thibs is deserving of too much credit considering what he inhereted.

 

[Gliesian]

The Cuz situation is very much a time bomb.
We have until the trade deadline to decide if we will keep Cuz or rebuild. A rebuild is very “bomb-like” since we will be blowing up the team’s core.

Plan A) Keep Cuz

We do this if it looks like we will make the playoffs.

1. Free agents will find us more attractive and we can actually sign good ones.
2. We get the arena rocking.
3. We stop being an embarrassment.
4. Maybe Cuz resigns with us and we win a championship.

Plan B) Trade Cuz

We do this if we won’t make the playoffs. It is assumed Cuz will not resign at the end of his contract.

1. Free agents avoid us like the plague.
2. We go into tank mode and attendance goes down.
3. We fight the 49ers for the worst sports franchise in the U.S.
4. We eventually strike gold and rebuild the right way.


I’m pretty sure this is the consensus of Kings fans. My question for everyone is:
Can you stomach another 2+ years of tanking? Is Joerger capable of tanking? Do you want to read the word “lin” a thousand more times?
I don’t know what is in store for us, but the bomb is ticking and the Kings have only months to defuse it.

 

[Jimbob]

Yeah

The Cuz situation is very much a time bomb.
We have until the trade deadline to decide if we will keep Cuz or rebuild. A rebuild is very “bomb-like” since we will be blowing up the team’s core.

Plan A) Keep Cuz

We do this if it looks like we will make the playoffs.

1. Free agents will find us more attractive and we can actually sign good ones.
2. We get the arena rocking.
3. We stop being an embarrassment.
4. Maybe Cuz resigns with us and we win a championship.

Plan B) Trade Cuz

We do this if we won’t make the playoffs. It is assumed Cuz will not resign at the end of his contract.

1. Free agents avoid us like the plague.
2. We go into tank mode and attendance goes down.
3. We fight the 49ers for the worst sports franchise in the U.S.
4. We eventually strike gold and rebuild the right way.


I’m pretty sure this is the consensus of Kings fans. My question for everyone is:
Can you stomach another 2+ years of tanking? Is Joerger capable of tanking? Do you want to read the word “lin” a thousand more times?
I don’t know what is in store for us, but the bomb is ticking and the Kings have only months to defuse it.[/quote).


I agree with the time bomb theory. We are in a bad position
and Im doubtful we make the playoffs with this current team. Trading Rudy means we get something for him but we become worse and most certainly miss the playoffs and its plan B.

This is why I advocate trading anyone on the Kings before Cousins and Rudy if it can help us now and avoid plan B.

 

[Kingsfan23]

We are close to blowing it up if this doesn't get better in a hurry

 

[Tetsujin]

We are close to blowing it up if this doesn't get better in a hurry

Come on. Don't tell me you were expecting the Kings to have a huge amount of success against the November schedule from hell.

 

[kingsboi]

We are close to blowing it up if this doesn't get better in a hurry

I'd say wait until we are 10-12 games under .500 and then we can start busting out trade scenarios left and right.

 

[Siranthony]

We should have blown it up two years ago. Instead the merry go round continues because a certain player is untrade-able. We could be two tears into our rebuild now.

 

[Letsgokings13]

We are a treadmill team. Not good enough for playoffs, but not bad enough for a good pick. And if we were bad enough, we'd get ****ed out of the pick. Case and point the year we drafted Tyreke. Worst record in the league and we get the worst possible pick.

 

[Chupacabra]

We should have blown it up two years ago. Instead the merry go round continues because a certain player is untrade-able. We could be two tears into our rebuild now.

The problem with our team isnt player-centric. It has been front office-centric up until now. You cant address the problem with the front office by getting rid of players. We wouldnt have had a winning product on the floor in the last decade no matter who the players were.

 

[Kingster]

So I suppose with all that said, especially your last paragraph, the Kings ought to kick start their rebuilding phase sooner rather than later, but...this management hasn't had enough time with the organization yet to show they can build a winner or that they can successfully complete a full rebuild.

That sums it up!

 

[Kingsfan23]

I'd say wait until we are 10-12 games under .500 and then we can start busting out trade scenarios left and right.

I think they'll do that.

For me, if we have to blow up, I'm as interested in getting a top pick this year and winning any games will be a detriment if it goes that route. Ideally you would want your pick/Philly swap top 5

Maybe they will speak with Cousins and judge where his mind is at. If they get the impression he's extremely loyal and will stick around no matter what it might change plans

 

[kingwin]

Yes they traded Love and got the rights to Wiggins, however I do think Love even at the time is half the player of Cuz. The Wolves also have had much better recent luck with lottery position.

We could trade Cuz to Boston and get a couple pretty good players and maybe a draft pick. We might even keep our own draft pick and finally beat the oddds in a pretty good draft. That could be a good rebuild start.

More my point in my above thread is I like Cuz, and hate the idea that we would move him because we have had years of pee poor management? I also dont think Thibs is deserving of too much credit considering what he inhereted.

Yes, I would rather it work out with cuz, but at some point (soon) we may have to realize its best to bottom out and rebuild the right way.

 

[New Era]

We are a treadmill team. Not good enough for playoffs, but not bad enough for a good pick. And if we were bad enough, we'd get ****ed out of the pick. Case and point the year we drafted Tyreke. Worst record in the league and we get the worst possible pick.

Yep. Imagine if we had broken in the top 3 that year. We could have landed Blake Griffen or James Harden. Could have changed the franchise.

 

[kingsboi]

I think they'll do that.

For me, if we have to blow up, I'm as interested in getting a top pick this year and winning any games will be a detriment if it goes that route. Ideally you would want your pick/Philly swap top 5

Maybe they will speak with Cousins and judge where his mind is at. If they get the impression he's extremely loyal and will stick around no matter what it might change plans

A man is as good as his word, for now...Cousins is saying all the right things, wanting to be loyal, retire a King, have his jersey in the rafters, etc. Things can change faster than we think as losses continue to accumulate season after season, changing teammates every season, never having any continuity with your teammates. Actions also speak louder than words, we know Cousins hates losing, so does almost every player in the league with a passion for the game, however, his antics on the court can negate all the positive talk he had with management and I'm not specifically talking about his technicals or complaining to the ref either.

 

[Fora Dragi]

The Cuz situation is very much a time bomb.
We have until the trade deadline to decide if we will keep Cuz or rebuild. A rebuild is very “bomb-like” since we will be blowing up the team’s core.

Plan A) Keep Cuz

We do this if it looks like we will make the playoffs.

1. Free agents will find us more attractive and we can actually sign good ones.
2. We get the arena rocking.
3. We stop being an embarrassment.
4. Maybe Cuz resigns with us and we win a championship.

Plan B) Trade Cuz

We do this if we won’t make the playoffs. It is assumed Cuz will not resign at the end of his contract.

1. Free agents avoid us like the plague.
2. We go into tank mode and attendance goes down.
3. We fight the 49ers for the worst sports franchise in the U.S.
4. We eventually strike gold and rebuild the right way.


I’m pretty sure this is the consensus of Kings fans. My question for everyone is:
Can you stomach another 2+ years of tanking? Is Joerger capable of tanking? Do you want to read the word “lin” a thousand more times?
I don’t know what is in store for us, but the bomb is ticking and the Kings have only months to defuse it.

At some point after seven years of plan A it just might turn out that plan A Is really plan B

 

[Suicide King]

At some point after seven years of plan A it just might turn out that plan A Is really plan B

Your forgetting Plan C where Cousins inexplicably decides to stay long term no matter what. So many possibilities yet to unfold. Who knows WHAT will happen.

 

[Mass]

Yep. Imagine if we had broken in the top 3 that year. We could have landed Blake Griffen or James Harden. Could have changed the franchise.

Or we could have picked Steph Curry instead of Tyreke... I don't think our problem has been our draft position, but the fact that we have not been able to draft well.

 

[twslam07]

If only we signed the best C in the game to a 5 year extension instead of a 4 year one...

 

[New Era]

Or we could have picked Steph Curry instead of Tyreke... I don't think our problem has been our draft position, but the fact that we have not been able to draft well.

I hear you, but to be fair, I don't think anybody projected that Curry would be as good as he has been. At the time, it would have been a huge stretch to draft him over Reke at #4.

 

[Big Cuz 15]

We should have blown it up two years ago. Instead the merry go round continues because a certain player is untrade-able. We could be two tears into our rebuild now.

uhm we did blow it up when gerbil, mully & 35 steps ahead took over. what do you call giving away talent for cap & 2nd round picks?

 

[Big Cuz 15]

Yep. Imagine if we had broken in the top 3 that year. We could have landed Blake Griffen or James Harden. Could have changed the franchise.

imagine if we could've landed

kawhi over jimmer
drummond over trob
giannis over ben

cousins, drummond, giannis kawhi tyreke

poor shooting but i guarantee you the other team isn't going to be scoring much including the current warriors.