What becomes of the Kings' expiring contracts? (split)

[Sac.Kings]

Unfortunately, there's next to a 0% chance we're going to take the macro approach this season and truly focus in on developing our core together as the main goal as opposed to adding 2 or 3 extra wins. There's no doubt in my mind that we're going to see Bagley or Giles sitting at least a couple times this season at the end of the game when ZBO as a "hot" offensive game and we feed him down the stretch. Same with Shumpert in lieu of Buddy/Bogdan/JJ at some point this year as well.

WCS should have been traded this off-season as well. It's just hard to see where he fits with us long-term and it makes next to 0 sense to pay him, even if he does have a good year when we have Bagley/Giles/Skal all on team-controlled contracts and all of whom are significantly younger than WCS. I still think there's some upside in WCS game, but we clearly showed we've moved past him with the Bagley pick taking up one of the front-court spots for the next decade and Giles being hyped as a franchise savior.

This is what frustrates me most about Vlade as a GM. He just doesn't understand (or refuses) to set the team up for long-term success. Looking at the roster we're likely heading into the season with, it looks like we're going to be in for another 10-11 man rotation where nobody gets more than 28-30 MPG. Maybe I'll be wrong, but it's hard to believe Shump/Koufos/Randolph aren't involved in the rotation in some fashion taking valuable minutes away from guys we should be developing.

Randolph is almost guaranteed to be traded this season. Expiring contract and a vet big could help a few teams ..

 

[ESP47]

Randolph is almost guaranteed to be traded this season. Expiring contract and a vet big could help a few teams ..

I think people are too bullish on expiring contract trades. They aren't being traded like they used to be and a ton of teams are going to have cap space next year so they'll be even less valuable than usual.

 

[kingsfan101]

I think people are too bullish on expiring contract trades. They aren't being traded like they used to be and a ton of teams are going to have cap space next year so they'll be even less valuable than usual.

Agree. Currently, IMHO, Z-Bo doesn't have value to justify his trade as a player. As an ender he may have a small value, but I think we are overstating it. Plus, teams trading for an ender are looking to either get out of a bad contract, or are looking to rebuild. We might be okay with a slightly bad contract, if the player can contribute, but no rebuilding team will give up young assets or star for a package centered around Z-Bo.

 

[Kingster]

I think people are too bullish on expiring contract trades. They aren't being traded like they used to be and a ton of teams are going to have cap space next year so they'll be even less valuable than usual.

Agree. I'll believe the big high salary FA "get" when I see it; especially when the Kings are not going to be putting "playoff team" on their resume next summer.

 

[CelticsFan]

Randolph is almost guaranteed to be traded this season. Expiring contract and a vet big could help a few teams ..

Last year Tykeke Evans had one of his best seasons in his career. He had an expiring $3.3 million dollar contract but Memphis was unable to trade him at the deadline for a late first.

IMO teams won’t be lining up to trade for Zbo this season. The only way I can see him being traded is if he’s salary filler with some of the Kings young players in a bigger deal

 

[bajaden]

I think people are too bullish on expiring contract trades. They aren't being traded like they used to be and a ton of teams are going to have cap space next year so they'll be even less valuable than usual.

Your correct on the last part, and that's why Randolph is likely to be traded during the season. The Kings are the only team (at the moment) that have any significant capspace left. By the time the trade deadline rolls around, there are going to be some teams that will realize that their dream of reaching the playoff's wasn't reality. And they'll have some players with untenable contracts that they want to unload. With Koufos, Randolph, and Shumpert all on expiring contracts, plus having around 11 mil in cap space, the Kings will be in great position to to make a deal.

No other team will have that kind of flexability. By that time the Kings should have a good idea whether they want to go forward with Willie and Skal as well. When you have cap space, and tradeable assets, there's likely to be a deal. Hopefully for a 1st rd draft pick.

 

[bajaden]

Agree. Currently, IMHO, Z-Bo doesn't have value to justify his trade as a player. As an ender he may have a small value, but I think we are overstating it. Plus, teams trading for an ender are looking to either get out of a bad contract, or are looking to rebuild. We might be okay with a slightly bad contract, if the player can contribute, but no rebuilding team will give up young assets or star for a package centered around Z-Bo.

While Randolph might have some value to a playoff team that believes it needs a little bit more help off the bench, his biggest value is his expiring contract, and it's size. Both Randolph and Shumpert are due around 11 mil this coming season. I think the problem with Tyreke's salary was that it wasn't big enough to match the salary of a player the other team was trying to get rid of. For instance, if you were trying to unload Deng, who was going to make around 18 mil if memory serves, there was no way to exchange Tyreke for Deng. Not without involving other players.

However, the Kings this season could make that kind of deal because of the larger salaries of both Shumpert and Randolph, and the capspace they have. Not saying they will. It does take two to tango, but the Kings are one of the few teams, if not the only team that has that ability this coming season.

 

[kingsfan101]

However, the Kings this season could make that kind of deal because of the larger salaries of both Shumpert and Randolph, and the capspace they have.

For me, the issue is not what we can offer, but what we can get in return.

While we don't have a first round pick this year, we have a huge number of young prospects (and even some vets) on very team friendly contracts, a plethora of second round picks, multiple expirings with large values. And yes, we are the only team with a sizeable cap space to provide immediate relief and lot of flexibility. So, short of a team looking for a star, first round pick, we are an ideal trade partner.

The issue is what we get in return. Given our huge number of young assets, many of whom we can reasonably hope for as potential stars in near future, we are not really looking for young, marginal talents. They'll take up roster spot, without seeing much time, and we already have a lot of them. No team is giving us their star for what we can offer, or even a potential young stud.

We may be able to snag a decent ranked first round pick for Willie (in a multi player trade), but I don't know how I feel about that. If he's not part of our future, then sure, get the best we can get for him. First round picks are valuable, and can be used to make other trades. However, if we keep the pick, one in the teens (I doubt we get anything higher), is unlikely to help us much. Sure, the kid we draft will be on a rookie contract for 4 years, while Willie will need to get paid after this year. However, unless Willie really blows this year (in which case, we shouldn't trade him anyway), I'm not sure we'll need to overpay for him that much.

Plus, the draft is always dicey. Willie himself was the 6th pick. If all we are doing is turning him into a pick in the teens (in what some folks are projecting to be a weak draft), that's pretty poor return. We may get ourselves a stud or a very nice player there too, but chances are not too bright.

The only worthwhile trades I can think of are either with the Wizards, or Wolves. Wizards might fancy themselves as the 4th/5th best team in the East (and if Kawhi bolts next year, they can legitimately think of contending for ECF. I think Boston and Philly will both be better than them, and maybe even Pacers, but an injury or lucky bounce can swing a close series), but they are paying a pretty penny for Otto. With Willie, they shore up their frontline for the future. We get the 3 we need.

As for Wolves, there have been some rumblings from there about Wiggins and his role, Butler, and even Towns. They are likely to miss the playoffs in the revamped West, and might want to cut ties with a player who hasn't lived up to his contract. While overpaid, he might fit with us, as he fills the position of need, is only 23, and we will need to pay someone anyway to even meet the floor.

As you said though, it takes two to tango.

 

[upinsmoke]

For me, the issue is not what we can offer, but what we can get in return.

While we don't have a first round pick this year, we have a huge number of young prospects (and even some vets) on very team friendly contracts, a plethora of second round picks, multiple expirings with large values. And yes, we are the only team with a sizeable cap space to provide immediate relief and lot of flexibility. So, short of a team looking for a star, first round pick, we are an ideal trade partner.

The issue is what we get in return. Given our huge number of young assets, many of whom we can reasonably hope for as potential stars in near future, we are not really looking for young, marginal talents. They'll take up roster spot, without seeing much time, and we already have a lot of them. No team is giving us their star for what we can offer, or even a potential young stud.

We may be able to snag a decent ranked first round pick for Willie (in a multi player trade), but I don't know how I feel about that. If he's not part of our future, then sure, get the best we can get for him. First round picks are valuable, and can be used to make other trades. However, if we keep the pick, one in the teens (I doubt we get anything higher), is unlikely to help us much. Sure, the kid we draft will be on a rookie contract for 4 years, while Willie will need to get paid after this year. However, unless Willie really blows this year (in which case, we shouldn't trade him anyway), I'm not sure we'll need to overpay for him that much.

Plus, the draft is always dicey. Willie himself was the 6th pick. If all we are doing is turning him into a pick in the teens (in what some folks are projecting to be a weak draft), that's pretty poor return. We may get ourselves a stud or a very nice player there too, but chances are not too bright.

The only worthwhile trades I can think of are either with the Wizards, or Wolves. Wizards might fancy themselves as the 4th/5th best team in the East (and if Kawhi bolts next year, they can legitimately think of contending for ECF. I think Boston and Philly will both be better than them, and maybe even Pacers, but an injury or lucky bounce can swing a close series), but they are paying a pretty penny for Otto. With Willie, they shore up their frontline for the future. We get the 3 we need.

As for Wolves, there have been some rumblings from there about Wiggins and his role, Butler, and even Towns. They are likely to miss the playoffs in the revamped West, and might want to cut ties with a player who hasn't lived up to his contract. While overpaid, he might fit with us, as he fills the position of need, is only 23, and we will need to pay someone anyway to even meet the floor.

As you said though, it takes two to tango.

I'm not to concerned about acquiring a 1st for this upcoming draft I would take a prospect though. Something along the lines of M. Monk, T. Prince, J. Winslow or Troy Brown to name a few.

 

[ESP47]

Your correct on the last part, and that's why Randolph is likely to be traded during the season. The Kings are the only team (at the moment) that have any significant capspace left. By the time the trade deadline rolls around, there are going to be some teams that will realize that their dream of reaching the playoff's wasn't reality. And they'll have some players with untenable contracts that they want to unload. With Koufos, Randolph, and Shumpert all on expiring contracts, plus having around 11 mil in cap space, the Kings will be in great position to to make a deal.

No other team will have that kind of flexability. By that time the Kings should have a good idea whether they want to go forward with Willie and Skal as well. When you have cap space, and tradeable assets, there's likely to be a deal. Hopefully for a 1st rd draft pick.

The market for 1st round picks for cap space has been nearly dead the last couple years and it's just going to get worse this year because a whole bunch of teams are going to have empty cap space next summer. There is no market for it. If it didn't happen this last year where very few teams had cap space, it's certainly not going to happen going into an offseason where a bunch of teams have space.

I can pretty much guarantee you that the Kings will not be trading ZBo or Shump for anything other than a worse contract + 2nd round picks. I can also guarantee you someone is going to be saying that playing ZBo big minutes is necessary to build his trade value

 

[upinsmoke]

The market for 1st round picks for cap space has been nearly dead the last couple years and it's just going to get worse this year because a whole bunch of teams are going to have empty cap space next summer. There is no market for it. If it didn't happen this last year where very few teams had cap space, it's certainly not going to happen going into an offseason where a bunch of teams have space.

I can pretty much guarantee you that the Kings will not be trading ZBo or Shump for anything other than a worse contract + 2nd round picks. I can also guarantee you someone is going to be saying that playing ZBo big minutes is necessary to build his trade value

Many teams will have cap but Washington and Portland are in cap hell and can be very motivated to clear some space.

 

[kingsfan101]

I'm not to concerned about acquiring a 1st for this upcoming draft I would take a prospect though. Something along the lines of M. Monk, T. Prince, J. Winslow or Troy Brown to name a few.

I would take a prospect at the cost of expirings/cap space in a heart beat.

Getting someone for one of our own prospects is where I am concerned. Exchanging Willie for Malik Monk for example, doesn't help much, as the latter is unlikely to see much time either, or hamper the development of Bogi/Buddy. Sure, if the management feels that Willie is not part of the future, and we risk losing him for nothing, getting someone like Monk would be great, but not if we still have any plans for Willie.

Trading Skal is another issue. He's still on a rookie contract, and per most reports, significantly beefed up. Can he be part of the future when Z-Bo, Kosta, and maybe even Willie are not part of the rotation? We might know better this year. This is one reason I am less inclined to invest in a prospect, except at the 3, where we still have lot of unanswered questions.

 

[VF21]

MOD NOTE: Before anybody gets their panties in a twist, I broke this out from the far-derailed Giles thread for the simple reason this is going to be something we'll be discussing all season (or at least right up until the trade deadline).

 

[SacTownKid]

I think people are too bullish on expiring contract trades. They aren't being traded like they used to be and a ton of teams are going to have cap space next year so they'll be even less valuable than usual.

True, but the Kings should be able to get into the 1st round next year if they try. If the Kings are looking to spend next summer they need to check themselves because they couldn't get anyone being one of 3 teams with money so there is no shot next year that they make a splash.

 

[Telemachus]

True, but the Kings should be able to get into the 1st round next year if they try. If the Kings are looking to spend next summer they need to check themselves because they couldn't get anyone being one of 3 teams with money so there is no shot next year that they make a splash.

Something to consider for next off season is that there could be well over half the league being FAs. Teams may have cap space, but may also have half their roster to fill as well. The Kings will have a ton of cap space while also having most of their roster already settled.

 

[kingsboi]

Vlade has set the Kings up exceptionally as far as giving the team cap flexibility and plenty of youth and use that in order to acquire a star should one become available. The other scenario is the Kings all ready have a star on their roster in one of Fox, Bagley or Giles and then it's just about keeping the talent together.

 

[pdxKingsFan]

Last year Tykeke Evans had one of his best seasons in his career. He had an expiring $3.3 million dollar contract but Memphis was unable to trade him at the deadline for a late first.

IMO teams won’t be lining up to trade for Zbo this season. The only way I can see him being traded is if he’s salary filler with some of the Kings young players in a bigger deal

This was a case of Memphis wanting too high a price and not that teams weren't interested. Also the fact that he was a 3.3 million expiring hurts the value for a pick. Teams typically would trade the pick plus a longer contract.

So the Kings will be in great position to trade Zbo plus Shump or Willie to a team looking to unload 20 million in salary for the cost of a few picks. Then we absorb a bad contract for an extra year or two, essentially kicking the can on free agency until we're hopefully winning enough to make an impact signing.

 

[dude12]

The obvious possibility is that the expiring(s) can be moved for someone on a longer contract that a team is wanting to dump but would have value to us.

A poor example would be a Ryan Anderson type deal for one of our expiring. Poor example because we nor most teams didn’t want that Anderson contract but you get the idea. I’m not going to look through the rosters to find guys but Wiggins kind of fits there, Bazemore if ATL wants out of the deal, etc.

On our end, Zbo or Koufos plus Justin Jackson for a real solid SF upgrade would be an example.

 

[CelticsFan]

This was a case of Memphis wanting too high a price and not that teams weren't interested. Also the fact that he was a 3.3 million expiring hurts the value for a pick. Teams typically would trade the pick plus a longer contract.

So the Kings will be in great position to trade Zbo plus Shump or Willie to a team looking to unload 20 million in salary for the cost of a few picks. Then we absorb a bad contract for an extra year or two, essentially kicking the can on free agency until we're hopefully winning enough to make an impact signing.

I don’t know if I would say they’re in a great position to move them but I hope you’re right. I’m not a Vlade fan but won’t hold it against him if he can’t move them. Someone here suggested they could be potential buyout candidates, I Could see that.

People here have said that Washington is in cap trouble but what are they going to do trade one of their best players in the middle of a playoff run for Zbo and or Shump? The players would demand a trade and the fans would protest. I guess maybe Portland with Turner or Leonard but really at best for what? They aren’t moving Zack Collins in a salary dump so maybe a future protected late round pick. Portland has a real shot at taking a step back this year and could be sellers at the deadline. Maybe Knicks try to move Hardaway in preparation for 19-20 season, I don’t think anyone would take Noah but I dont see them giving a 2019 pick so maybe a heavily protected future pick.

The point is the way I look at it there aren’t many good teams with bad contracts and the bottom teams aren’t in any position to be dumping their bad contracts for their halfway decent young players or picks.

A lot is going to happen between now and the deadline but to start the 18-19 season but can anyone think of a realistic deal that they could see happening? I don’t care if you’re Danny Ainge or Vlade, IMO Zbo and Shup won’t be easy to move.

 

[pdxKingsFan]

I don’t know if I would say they’re in a great position to move them but I hope you’re right. I’m not a Vlade fan but won’t hold it against him if he can’t move them. Someone here suggested they could be potential buyout candidates, I Could see that.

People here have said that Washington is in cap trouble but what are they going to do trade one of their best players in the middle of a playoff run for Zbo and or Shump? The players would demand a trade and the fans would protest. I guess maybe Portland with Turner or Leonard but really at best for what? They aren’t moving Zack Collins in a salary dump so maybe a future protected late round pick. Portland has a real shot at taking a step back this year and could be sellers at the deadline. Maybe Knicks try to move Hardaway in preparation for 19-20 season, I don’t think anyone would take Noah but I dont see them giving a 2019 pick so maybe a heavily protected future pick.

The point is the way I look at it there aren’t many good teams with bad contracts and the bottom teams aren’t in any position to be dumping their bad contracts for their halfway decent young players or picks.

A lot is going to happen between now and the deadline but to start the 18-19 season but can anyone think of a realistic deal that they could see happening? I don’t care if you’re Danny Ainge or Vlade, IMO Zbo and Shup won’t be easy to move.

Well Portland is screwed and Dame and CJ aren't going to just sit around while they rebuild, so yeah they would actually be prime for this type of move and I suspect they are going to wind up from 3 seed to the lottery.

I am not sure San Antonio's cap situation after everything went down but they'd have assets to clear space if they need to and want a FA run, Clippers maybe. Teams that are on their way down with a bullet that were playoff contending teams last year and have been lapped by the field.

Washington is a lot trickier situation but yeah - they certainly overspent on Porter and if they decide they want to make a run at Boogie or someone else then yeah, we could help facilitate.

Minnesota is in free fall.

Even like a Denver or OKC if they are in the 6-8 spots may see getting a vet who can play spot minutes and cap relief worth a first.

 

[bajaden]

The market for 1st round picks for cap space has been nearly dead the last couple years and it's just going to get worse this year because a whole bunch of teams are going to have empty cap space next summer. There is no market for it. If it didn't happen this last year where very few teams had cap space, it's certainly not going to happen going into an offseason where a bunch of teams have space.

I can pretty much guarantee you that the Kings will not be trading ZBo or Shump for anything other than a worse contract + 2nd round picks. I can also guarantee you someone is going to be saying that playing ZBo big minutes is necessary to build his trade value

Well, I wasn't talking about the next off season. I don't disagree with you on that. I think where the Kings might have an advantage is during the coming season when only the Kings will have any capspace. As for playing Randolph to increase his trade value, that's ridiculous. I think every team in the NBA knows what Randolph can and can't do. I don't expect Randolph to see many minutes this year, unless were hit with a ton of injuries.

 

[bajaden]

I don’t know if I would say they’re in a great position to move them but I hope you’re right. I’m not a Vlade fan but won’t hold it against him if he can’t move them. Someone here suggested they could be potential buyout candidates, I Could see that.

People here have said that Washington is in cap trouble but what are they going to do trade one of their best players in the middle of a playoff run for Zbo and or Shump? The players would demand a trade and the fans would protest. I guess maybe Portland with Turner or Leonard but really at best for what? They aren’t moving Zack Collins in a salary dump so maybe a future protected late round pick. Portland has a real shot at taking a step back this year and could be sellers at the deadline. Maybe Knicks try to move Hardaway in preparation for 19-20 season, I don’t think anyone would take Noah but I dont see them giving a 2019 pick so maybe a heavily protected future pick.

The point is the way I look at it there aren’t many good teams with bad contracts and the bottom teams aren’t in any position to be dumping their bad contracts for their halfway decent young players or picks.

A lot is going to happen between now and the deadline but to start the 18-19 season but can anyone think of a realistic deal that they could see happening? I don’t care if you’re Danny Ainge or Vlade, IMO Zbo and Shup won’t be easy to move.

I can't see any logical reason for the Kings to buy out any or their expiring contracts. Why would they, they're gone at the end of the year and the Kings don't have a great need for additional capspace. Not saying that need couldn't come up, but at the moment, you just let their contracts expire.

 

[Ozymandias]

I can't see any logical reason for the Kings to buy out any or their expiring contracts. Why would they, they're gone at the end of the year and the Kings don't have a great need for additional capspace. Not saying that need couldn't come up, but at the moment, you just let their contracts expire.

Buyout Z-bo to keep Deyonta Davis on the roster!!!!!!