Voisin: Making his point

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[font=verdana,geneva,arial,helvetica,sans-serif]Ailene Voisin: Making his point

Kings guard Mike Bibby deserves to make his first All-Star appearance

By Ailene Voisin -- Bee Sports Columnist
Published 2:15 am PST Monday, February 7, 2005

The little dance Mike Bibby does once in a while after converting a clutch shot? The rare chest bump after an emotional victory?

Freeze the frame.

Attach the image to memory.

That's the extent of his outrageousness.

Yet after all these years and all those subtly spectacular plays, of accepting the role of quiet man behind the scenes, it's time for Bibby to emerge from the shadow of celebrity and add a little flash to his substance.

He belongs on the NBA All-Star team.

He belongs on stage.

"When you talk about point guards in this league, you are talking about (Steve) Nash and (Jason) Kidd, and Mike Bibby is right there," praised Trail Blazers assistant Jim Lynam after Bibby's 35-point outburst Saturday in Portland. "Without a doubt, he belongs on the (All-Star) team."


Trouble is, the voting this year - for both forwards and guards - figures to be closer than Bush-Kerry in Ohio. With Kobe Bryant and Tracy McGrady already named to the Western Conference squad by the fans, the league's coaches on Tuesday will choose three other guards from a heady list of candidates that features Nash, Bibby, Ray Allen and the San Antonio Spurs' electric duo of Manu Ginobili and Tony Parker.

While Nash and Allen are virtual locks - no arguments there - a Bibby-or-Ginobili debate could last until 2008. But we'll designate Bibby a first-time All-Star based on the following numeric formula: (1) the sum of his seven NBA seasons; (2) the bonus points awarded for his continual improvement; (3) the extra bonus points amassed from his proclivity for clutch shots; and (4) the 27.6 points he has averaged these past five games, primarily because of injuries to former All-Stars Chris Webber and Peja Stojakovic and newcomer Cuttino Mobley.

In fact, of all Bibby's attributes - the lethal jumper, the creative drives, the steady floor game - his most impressive characteristic might be his ability to be all things to all coaches and teammates. He morphs into whatever is needed. Shooter. Playmaker. Scorer. Leader. On a Kings team that features several prolific scorers, his current averages (18.4 points, 6.3 assists, 4.4 rebounds) fail to adequately reflect his impact; he will never be a stats man.

"Mike brings the ability to score," added Lynam, "but not the need to score. That combination is very rare."

Studying Bibby throughout the course of a season is akin to taking an art appreciation course. The notebook becomes crammed with useful information long before finals. His style is sneaky-smart. He dinks opponents to death. Excluding those memorable clutch moments, he attacks with the timely jumper, the critical steal, the tantalizing, change-of-pace drive, and assorted running one-handers and muscular layups. Though his 6-foot-2, 190-pound frame is mostly shoulders and hips, he absorbs hits around the basket like a heavyweight, somewhat reminiscent of the much quicker Kevin Johnson.

"You see that Mike's not very big," said Kings player personnel director Jerry Reynolds, "and certainly not the greatest athlete, and you ask, 'How can he score 25?' He just does. He can play with the ball or without the ball. And what I like lately is that without Doug (Christie), Mike is more of a point guard, and I think he's relishing that role. He seems more at ease running the team."

At 27, Bibby's greatest challenges will be improving his on-the-ball defense and becoming an even more forceful floor leader. Of the two, the former issue is less problematic. Bibby can defend. While playing for Larry Brown's Team USA in Puerto Rico in August 2003, his individual defense was superb, ensuring his presence on the floor.

Then, as now, Bibby directed a team with several players capable of dropping 25 points on any given night. The difference is that Brown's roster included athletic shot-blockers and interior defenders who snatched rebounds and ignited the transition game. Rick Adelman's Kings are more of a hybrid; the frontcourt players (Webber and Miller) lack defensive quickness, their value emphasized instead on offense.

Bibby thus is presented with a major dilemma. He has to determine when to shoot, and more delicately, when to deliver the ball ... and to whom.

"That can be hard," he said Sunday, "because we have so many scorers. I have to keep everybody happy."

Miller is most effective when receiving the ball with options, with time to shoot, drive or find cutters, much like Vlade Divac. Stojakovic is best in transition or darting backdoor. Mobley is a dangerous streak shooter who scores in bunches. Yet Webber, his talents immense despite his knee problems, invariably demands the ball at the start of each possession, seemingly intent on shooting or assisting on every play, at times precluding Bibby from utilizing the entire floor and exploiting the skills of his other teammates.

The Kings in fact would benefit from an even more evolved, assertive Bibby, a Bibby intent on expanding and orchestrating the offense, and his stoic demeanor and understated personality notwithstanding, he can certainly get there. Meantime, he belongs in Denver.

http://www.sacbee.com/content/sports/basketball/kings/story/12266245p-13130296c.html


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i agree bibby definitely deserves it.. if manu makes it, and he doesn't, that's such a shame..

i have seen all these analysts predict manu instead of mike.. i don't get it, though.. looking at the stats, it should be mike.. and mike has been consistent.. he could've been an allstar last year, but wasn't chosen..

well, he deserves it, but i wouldn't be surprised if he doesn't.. the nba likes to go with the "flashy" ones, i guess..
 
My theory is this:

Kobe decides not to play.

They have the 5 spots to fill besides Kobe's.

After those five you have 3 spots that you can pick from any position you want.

As much as they can put Parker's name, he should be the odd man out. I don't believe that he should go AHEAD of Mike as far as PG's are concerned.

Nash replace Kobe, pick Ray Allen, Manu Ginobli and Bibby as your 3 guards.

End of story.

Mike definitely deserves to go, but she didn't have to dig on Chris(yet again) at the end.
 
Ailene -- I know you pop into this board occassionally. For the love of God will you PLEASE quit throwing in the "blame it on Webber" paragraph into EVERY SINGLE ARTICLE no matter who it is about? Please. Enough already.

I'm not even sure you are effectively advancing your cause at this point because you have staked out your position so blatantly that there is never a hint of objectivtiy involved.
 
Elise10 said:
My theory is this:

Kobe decides not to play.

They have the 5 spots to fill besides Kobe's.

After those five you have 3 spots that you can pick from any position you want.

As much as they can put Parker's name, he should be the odd man out. I don't believe that he should go AHEAD of Mike as far as PG's are concerned.

Nash replace Kobe, pick Ray Allen, Manu Ginobli and Bibby as your 3 guards.

End of story.

Mike definitely deserves to go, but she didn't have to dig on Chris(yet again) at the end.

saw that, too.. definitely unnecessary..

and uh, i think there's no way kobe misses the allstar game.. there's just no way.. unless his injury is really that serious..
 
LMM said:
saw that, too.. definitely unnecessary..

and uh, i think there's no way kobe misses the allstar game.. there's just no way.. unless his injury is really that serious..

It's just my theory, one that I spent this weekend trying to figure out how to make it work.

The more time he has off the better for his ankle. Thinking on the positives here
 
Elise10 said:
It's just my theory, one that I spent this weekend trying to figure out how to make it work.

The more time he has off the better for his ankle. Thinking on the positives here
yeah.. i definitely thought about that,too.. when i heard that kobe could be out till mid-feb i started thinking about the allstar break (feb 20)

i think it opens up a spot for mike since nash will be injected in the starting lineup.. if you want a PG backup for nash, you have to go with mike.. then you'd have ray at SG, then if you want manu, he can be a WC..

but i really don't think he'll miss it.. i mean come on, kobe? missing the allstar game? :eek:
 
That would be awesome if Mike were an all star.

I think they should do the positioning by PG, SG, SF, PF, and C, rather than Guard, Forward, Center. That way mike would be almost guaranteed a place, unless they got dumb and thought Tony Parker is better than Mike.
 
I think Bibby might be the best point guard in the League. some of the others, like Jason Kidd, Parker, and Nash have been hyped to death on TV. Bibby reminds me a lot of John Stockton. Stockton was more reluctant to shoot, but Bibby is almost as proficient as Stockton in making plays. I think defense is really Bibby's short suit. All that said, and I realize that it's just an ignorant opinion, I still hope he doesn't make the Allstar team. I don't want to see him injured for nothing, like Brad last year, and I would assume that being excluded again will simply give him something to prove throughout the playoffs.
 
[font=verdana,geneva,arial,helvetica,sans-serif](1) the sum of his seven NBA seasons; (2) the bonus points awarded for his continual improvement; (3) the extra bonus points amassed from his proclivity for clutch shots; and (4) the 27.6 points he has averaged these past five games, primarily because of injuries to former All-Stars Chris Webber and Peja Stojakovic and newcomer Cuttino Mobley. [/font]
bibby has ginobili in number 1, but the rest of the points are definitely arguable for either.
  1. manu only has three years in the nba
  2. manu has continually improved.
  3. manu takes and makes clutch shots, in the paint, at the line, and outside the three pt line.
  4. manu steps up when duncan is out or when opponents focus on tim.
the three best point guards in the west are nash, bibby, and parker in that order. the problem is the shooting guard pool in the west is so strong. a guy like michael finley isn't getting a sniff at the ASG. that decreases the likelihood that both will be in the game.

i wouldn't be upset if bibby were picked over ginobili, but i'd be confused why someone would be upset if manu were picked over bibby. i just don't see the "superiority". bibby has more ppg, manu has higher fg%/ft%/3%, bibby has considerably more assists, manu has more spg. i won't mention anything that is completely subjective like one-on-one or team defense).

i don't really agree with the premise that hype about a player diiminishes what they have or are accomplishing. while jason kidd's worth as a player is questionable because of injuries, steve nash has produced at a high level for the last several years. i would tend to favor an assist-oriented point guard over a scoring point guard (sorry tony), but that's just an opinion.
 
Good article. I agree...Bibby's an All Star. I don't know what else needs to prove that Bibby shouldn't be an All Star. Last week with 3 Kings Starters out, Bibby was playing amazing like an All Star player! IMO, the reason Kings won the games with no Cat, Webb and Pedja is because of Bibby! Of course, Brad, Barnes, Darius and the rest did great too. But Bibby made some big plays not only to himself but his teammates. He has great talent and can even make his teammates better (like Nash and Kidd, IMO). And if you can do that, you're an All Star player in my book. The reason people don't realize how good Bibby is is because he's teammates with good players: Pedja, Webber, Miller, Mobley. Players who are All Star caliber too. He's always the quiet one in the mix. (Hehe...Cuttino's right, Kings have the best starting 5 in the NBA! ;))

GO BIBBY! You're an All Star to me regardless of what happen. :)
 
I agree with Brick. The first thing I thought when I read this article was how absurd her digs on Webber are getting. I just read the article and I was about to come online to ask if anyone else had noticed how obvious it is getting, and how frustrating.
 
Manu has been insane this year, it is really fun to watch him play and I think he is def playing at an all-star level this year. That being said I think Bibby is too, and he's definately been snubbed in other years. Ginobili is gonna get his All-star appearances in the future, Mike has earned the right to be there. If Manu is picked I wouldn't say it's unfair though.
 
Elise10 said:
My theory is this:

Kobe decides not to play.

They have the 5 spots to fill besides Kobe's.

After those five you have 3 spots that you can pick from any position you want.

As much as they can put Parker's name, he should be the odd man out. I don't believe that he should go AHEAD of Mike as far as PG's are concerned.

Nash replace Kobe, pick Ray Allen, Manu Ginobli and Bibby as your 3 guards.

End of story.

Mike definitely deserves to go, but she didn't have to dig on Chris(yet again) at the end.

that is was EXACTLY what i was gonna say...i already thought that through myself...Kobe won't play...he'd be an idiot if he does....

but to Manu Ginobili's defense...he's without a doubt been having an allstar year...my only real concern is that the coaches choose Tony Parker...who also continues to improve with each year...over Mike

but we shall see tomorrow
 
"Yet Webber, his talents immense despite his knee problems, invariably demands the ball at the start of each possession, seemingly intent on shooting or assisting on every play, at times precluding Bibby from utilizing the entire floor and exploiting the skills of his other teammates."

We should make it a drinking game or something. Sheesh! :rolleyes:
 
Dave McNulla said:
i wouldn't be upset if bibby were picked over ginobili, but i'd be confused why someone would be upset if manu were picked over bibby.

mmm i agree with ya Dave

but hopefully both Manu and Mike can be elected
 
its very difficult to compare mike and manu, and not because their stats are so different, but simply because they play different positions and provide different things for their respective teams. comparing mike bibby and tony parker, tho, shouldnt be as difficult. i believe mike is the superior player, but tony has his upsides as well. he's incredibly quick, and has good court vision, but he's also wildly inconsistent. bibby is the much more controlled, consistent, and clutch of the two, so bibby most definitely gets the nod over parker. bibby and ginobili is a toss-up, tho. theyre both playing like all stars, so its just a matter of making that tough decision: which one? i'd say bibby, based solely on his efforts at stepping it up when 3 of our starters went down. ginobili hasnt faced that kinda pressure yet, but mike proved he deserves his spot with his play last week.

not that i even want any king to play in the allstar game. no more injuries, dammit! ;)
 
Padrino said:
its very difficult to compare mike and manu, and not because their stats are so different, but simply because they play different positions and provide different things for their respective teams. comparing mike bibby and tony parker, tho, shouldnt be as difficult. i believe mike is the superior player, but tony has his upsides as well. he's incredibly quick, and has good court vision, but he's also wildly inconsistent. bibby is the much more controlled, consistent, and clutch of the two, so bibby most definitely gets the nod over parker. bibby and ginobili is a toss-up, tho. theyre both playing like all stars, so its just a matter of making that tough decision: which one? i'd say bibby, based solely on his efforts at stepping it up when 3 of our starters went down. ginobili hasnt faced that kinda pressure yet, but mike proved he deserves his spot with his play last week.

Very good points! Comparing Bibby to Manu is simply unfair to both of them. Don't tell any Spurs fans, but I love watching Ginobili play. I became fascinated with his style during the Olympics and he's been on my list of favorite non-Kings since then. There is a tremendous difference between point guards and shooting guards in the pure sense and I think it's unfortunate that they have to be compared to each other.
 
VF21 said:
Very good points! Comparing Bibby to Manu is simply unfair to both of them. Don't tell any Spurs fans, but I love watching Ginobili play. I became fascinated with his style during the Olympics and he's been on my list of favorite non-Kings since then. There is a tremendous difference between point guards and shooting guards in the pure sense and I think it's unfortunate that they have to be compared to each other.

i love the guy, too. even when he was unproven, i could tell he was gonna be big someday. i just didnt expect it to be so soon. i've always thought he would fit in great in our offense. it frightens me to think that he could conceivably have been a king. he was picked second to last overall in the draft 3 years ago, if i remember correctly, and tho i dont remember if the kings even had a second round choice 3 years ago, i imagine we coulda picked him up. second to last choice.....geeez....thats a goddam steal. probably the greatest steal in draft-day history.
 
I finally figured it out guys - Piksi is actually Voisin in disguise.
icon12.gif
 
Bricklayer said:
Ailene -- I know you pop into this board occassionally. For the love of God will you PLEASE quit throwing in the "blame it on Webber" paragraph into EVERY SINGLE ARTICLE no matter who it is about? Please. Enough already.

I'm not even sure you are effectively advancing your cause at this point because you have staked out your position so blatantly that there is never a hint of objectivtiy involved.


OOOOOOO

someone's getting called out :D

i agree brick. that was NOT cool at the end, not cool at all
 
Doubt seriously that Bibby ever exerts superiority over Web by insisting on being involved in every play. I think Bibby deserves to be named to the all-star team according to his stats, hustle and unselfish play. Could his defensive weaknesses prohibit the final calculation from going in his favor?

If Kobe does play, he should be hung by his toenails by the entire Laker organization!
Personally, I share Voisin's views on Web's halfcourt play. He does always insist on the ball during sets, whether or not he shoots first and asks questions later. Just watch any game.
 
He ALWAYS insists on the ball? Au contraire. Watch the Blazers game again - carefully. I saw more than just a few times when Webber set screens and didn't even touch the ball.

Sorry to burst your bubble like that, but if you're going to rag on the guy could you at least be accurate?
 
albeitrue said:
Personally, I share Voisin's views on Web's halfcourt play. He does always insist on the ball during sets, whether or not he shoots first and asks questions later. Just watch any game.
hehe... that's true. He wants to be an organizer of every play.
 
Bibby is a victim of the West's overload on Power Forwards and Shooting Guards. They'll likely only be one real PG on the West with Nash. I don't know if the coaches would even care if they only have one PG in an exhibition game. Bibby is now one of the top 3 point guards in the league, at least for the past couple of weeks. I had been harsh on him for not playing like a real point guard and instead just being an undersized shooting guard, but since the Christie trade he's actually gone back to passing and setting up teammates instead of just running off of screens and picks looking for a jumper.
 
VF21 said:
He ALWAYS insists on the ball? Au contraire. Watch the Blazers game again - carefully. I saw more than just a few times when Webber set screens and didn't even touch the ball.

Sorry to burst your bubble like that, but if you're going to rag on the guy could you at least be accurate?
Okay, I can change that to USUALLY insists on the ball; Usually is more accurate, and I'm all for accurate. :o
 
And THAT is the offense. That's the way it works.

BIbby giving the ball to Webber is how the Princeton offense runs. How its ALWAYS run. Forget the Kings, I actually watched it being played AT PRINCETON. High post big man is the primary weapon. That's not an aberration. That's not selfish. That's the offense.

And here's why it works if you can find a magical big man who can shoot and pass -- every single team in the league is set up and used to defend PGs handling the ball and passing. Every single PG is used to their man being the distributor. They know how to defend a standard offense. But systems such as the Princeton offense, or even to a lesser degree the triangle turn the whole thing on its head and make it very difficult to defend them. Big men who aren't used to guarding guys out on the floor are suddenly faced with a 6'9" point PF, guards used to stopping the man with the ball are suddenly chasing around a shooter without the ball and having to guard back door plays from weird sources. It makes things veryb uncomfortable for an opposing team who sees it only a few times a year.

Mike is not SUSPOSED to handle the ball all of the time. He's handling it more without Doug as a co-PG, but he's not susposed to run the offense. Webb is. That's how our system works. That's how we're special. That is "Kings basketball".
 
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