The Kings' present and future

[swisshh]

Pre-Reke roster moves had a different team identity than what the team has now--if the team has a team identity beyond Tyreke at all. That is one issue that is probably at the top of the list, beyond just needs, but what idea you are looking for in filling those needs.

One question right now, and this has to do with Cousins/Favors, is if you can be a full court running team with Tyreke, or if this team is going more towards half-court. It has felt to me, over the course of the season, that the team has become more half-court. I think Tyreke can get easier shots if he pushes the ball, but it doesn't seem to be in his instinct always and his lack of vision often leads to rather one dimensional fast breaks.

So, if you're going half-court then I think Cousins is the guy. Favors would be more beneficial in a full-court style, while staying half-court allows Cousins to get inside and establish presence. Cousins just doesn't run the floor as well Favors, and doesn't run it with enough effort to make me think he would get the sort of easy dunks a big man gets when the ball is pushed. In fact, my worry with Cousin's attitude is not conflicts with coaches, but that he looks disinterested or bored too often.

On the other hand, the pre-reke players were built more for running. JT and Hawes do run the court well. Having JT/Favors/Hawes crashing boards and running to the rim creates a problem in full-court basketball for the other team. And the key to full-court is being willing to get back when the ball comes the other way, which a guy like Hawes has shown more effort in doing this year.

The Kings seem to be missing their second-fiddle and this issue may be resolved this draft.

Though the Kings do need that big guy, I think this above quote is Petrie's main idea right now. This is why in spite of need, I sense the Kings going after Wesley Johnson.

 

[bajaden]

Pre-Reke roster moves had a different team identity than what the team has now--if the team has a team identity beyond Tyreke at all. That is one issue that is probably at the top of the list, beyond just needs, but what idea you are looking for in filling those needs.

One question right now, and this has to do with Cousins/Favors, is if you can be a full court running team with Tyreke, or if this team is going more towards half-court. It has felt to me, over the course of the season, that the team has become more half-court. I think Tyreke can get easier shots if he pushes the ball, but it doesn't seem to be in his instinct always and his lack of vision often leads to rather one dimensional fast breaks.

So, if you're going half-court then I think Cousins is the guy. Favors would be more beneficial in a full-court style, while staying half-court allows Cousins to get inside and establish presence. Cousins just doesn't run the floor as well Favors, and doesn't run it with enough effort to make me think he would get the sort of easy dunks a big man gets when the ball is pushed. In fact, my worry with Cousin's attitude is not conflicts with coaches, but that he looks disinterested or bored too often.

On the other hand, the pre-reke players were built more for running. JT and Hawes do run the court well. Having JT/Favors/Hawes crashing boards and running to the rim creates a problem in full-court basketball for the other team. And the key to full-court is being willing to get back when the ball comes the other way, which a guy like Hawes has shown more effort in doing this year.



Though the Kings do need that big guy, I think this above quote is Petrie's main idea right now. This is why in spite of need, I sense the Kings going after Wesley Johnson.

Nothing against Johnson, who I like, but I think it would depend on where the Kings pick. I don't see Johnson going until fifth or sixth in the draft. I've said it before. This is a draft loaded with big men, so I think it would be foolish to pick a SF or a SG unless that player is named Evan Turner.

I hate to keep revisiting this because at some point people are going to think I'm Cousins agent. But I watched him play in over 20 games this season and I didn't see him dogging it. At least not to the point where It leaped out at me. I think there were times when he ran out of gas, which tells me his conditioning needs to improve for the next level. But as far as being able to play on a team that pushes the ball, thats all Kentucky did for most of the year. Both he and Patterson got a lot of fast break baskets.

If your going to ask me who runs the floor faster, Cousins or Favors? Well Favors would get the edge. I think Cousins is ideal in a halfcourt set, but he's certainly capable of getting up and down the floor. Remember, when it comes playoff time, the team with the halfcourt offense, is the team that usually wins.

 

[LWP777]

This has turned into another Cousin’s debate, but I agree with a lot of your thesis – the team has Evans and Landry, who is a nice player, and several prospects (who could either be pretty good or unable to start for a contender or somewhere in between).


That last group is Hawes, Caspi, Green, and Thompson makes it nearly impossible to peg where this team is at. Not Brockman – who is Reggie Evans 2.0. If 2 or 3 really break out, this team is going to be in a good spot. If they stay on track, they will add depth. If they take the Hawes/Thompson 2010 track, …well then.


Not knowing the pick clouds things even further. If it’s in the top 2, then the Kings could really add the second franchise player they need. Otherwise, it becomes much more of a guessing game where the likelihood of success, player’s ceiling, best player/position of need debate gets really messy really fast.


I like Landry as a piece, but despite what Peaches says … he’s not a number two guy. He’s a good prospect to be a good PF. We know that. Some still think Hawes is an ok prospect to be a good center – and there is a lot of debate on that. Based upon what we’ve seen this year, I think it’s safe to say --- a good NBA doesn’t start Landry and Hawes together. That is two players that don’t rebound well for their position. So even if you are going to project them both out very favorably, I can’t see them playing a lot together.


There is talent here, but this is a team that won about 22% of their games over the past 3 and a half months. There are excuses, but every bad NBA team has them as well. At some point, the numbers are the numbers. We have as many wins at the Wizards, who have experienced an all time train wreck season and are looking up at the Clippers once again in the standings. Progress was made – but it was baby steps. Again help is coming down the road, but this team has a lot of needs. The duration and success of the rebuild turns on the development of that group of question marks … but either way we still need a number two guys and a quality starter in the post that is well above average with rebounding and post defense.

I think this is a really good post. As much as I hate to say it, I think sometimes we overestimate where we are as a franchise. Yes, we made progress from last year, but come on -- that was last year. We won 17 games with half a roster of NBA players that are no longer in the league and a coach who is no longer in the league. Sure it's great that we have a future All-Star in Tyreke but it's all the other mediocre players that scare me. We absolutely must have either JT, Hawes, or Greene step it up next year and become a major force. I think Greene has the most raw upside of the three. JT started to show some flashes towards the end of the year so let's hope he continues that into next year but he most likely will be a decent bench player for his career.

If we can get lucky in the draft and at least draft in the top 4, sign a quality FA and continue to develop the young players then we might be on track to make the playoffs.

 

[Kingster]

I think this is a really good post. As much as I hate to say it, I think sometimes we overestimate where we are as a franchise. Yes, we made progress from last year, but come on -- that was last year. We won 17 games with half a roster of NBA players that are no longer in the league and a coach who is no longer in the league. Sure it's great that we have a future All-Star in Tyreke but it's all the other mediocre players that scare me. We absolutely must have either JT, Hawes, or Greene step it up next year and become a major force. I think Greene has the most raw upside of the three. JT started to show some flashes towards the end of the year so let's hope he continues that into next year but he most likely will be a decent bench player for his career.

If we can get lucky in the draft and at least draft in the top 4, sign a quality FA and continue to develop the young players then we might be on track to make the playoffs.

It's very possible that next year the Kings end up with nearly the same number of wins they had last year. After OKCs second year with Durant, they were still very high in the lottery. They had Durant, Westbrook and Green, and yet they still picked third in the draft and got Harden. They had a ton of talent and still were terrible in the win column. That shows you how important experience is. And that's a sobering fact for the Kings. But the promising fact for the Kings is that we all know OKC rocketed in their third year and are now going to the playoffs.

But, OKC is hardcore. They were willing to deal with the maximum pain to get those high picks. For the most part, they didn't acquire marginal veteran talent that took minutes from their young talent. Will Petrie be willing to do the same? Or, is he going to unload some of the young guys for veterans to get better quicker, but in so doing sacrifice the longer term? It's going to be interesting to see what his strategy is for next year.

 

[pshn80]

But, OKC is hardcore. They were willing to deal with the maximum pain to get those high picks. For the most part, they didn't acquire marginal veteran talent that took minutes from their young talent. Will Petrie be willing to do the same? Or, is he going to unload some of the young guys for veterans to get better quicker, but in so doing sacrifice the longer term? It's going to be interesting to see what his strategy is for next year.

I think your question hits the nail right on the head. We are sorely missing the veteran presence but I don't know what advice to give Petrie. This off season will be very interesting to me.

 

[bajaden]

I think this is a really good post. As much as I hate to say it, I think sometimes we overestimate where we are as a franchise. Yes, we made progress from last year, but come on -- that was last year. We won 17 games with half a roster of NBA players that are no longer in the league and a coach who is no longer in the league. Sure it's great that we have a future All-Star in Tyreke but it's all the other mediocre players that scare me. We absolutely must have either JT, Hawes, or Greene step it up next year and become a major force. I think Greene has the most raw upside of the three. JT started to show some flashes towards the end of the year so let's hope he continues that into next year but he most likely will be a decent bench player for his career.

If we can get lucky in the draft and at least draft in the top 4, sign a quality FA and continue to develop the young players then we might be on track to make the playoffs.

I'm always curious why people make blanket statements about young players that are still developing. Why would you think that JT would be nothing better than a bench player for the rest of his career? I would agree that he had an up and down year. He started well and then went into a slump that lasted a month and a half, but he came out of it. Sometimes people get an image in their mind of a player, and refuse to see the progress. I'm not saying you, but in general. Big men take time. And by and large, it usually takes three years. I'm sure that Landry will be better next year. If the end of the year is any indicator, I think he's made very good progress.

His rotation defense has improved. He's fouling less. He passes the ball very well. He's always one of the first back in transition defense. He's learned to run the pick an roll better. He's without a doubt the best rebounder on the team. For whatever reason, it appears that the light bulb has finally gone on, and he's slowed down his game. He's playing much more under control. In his last ten games he's averaging 14.5 points and 9.5 rebounds a game. Now I'm not saying you can't do that off the bench, but there are starters around the league that don't average that. Those are almost the exact numbers that Al Horford averages, and I don't think he's coming off the bench.

Anyway, I don't think I would pass judgement just yet. As an aside, I noted that in the last three games Jerry Reynolds has commented several times how well JT is playing at the center position. I always get suspicious when someone thats involved in player decisions makes comments like that. It may be that the orgainzation has already made up its mind to go with JT at the center position in the future. For the last ten games or so he's certainly been more consistant than Hawes. Even when JT doesn't score, he continues to do the other little things you need. Hawes at times almost seems disinterested, or, mentally somewhere else. We shall see..

 

[bajaden]

It's very possible that next year the Kings end up with nearly the same number of wins they had last year. After OKCs second year with Durant, they were still very high in the lottery. They had Durant, Westbrook and Green, and yet they still picked third in the draft and got Harden. They had a ton of talent and still were terrible in the win column. That shows you how important experience is. And that's a sobering fact for the Kings. But the promising fact for the Kings is that we all know OKC rocketed in their third year and are now going to the playoffs.

But, OKC is hardcore. They were willing to deal with the maximum pain to get those high picks. For the most part, they didn't acquire marginal veteran talent that took minutes from their young talent. Will Petrie be willing to do the same? Or, is he going to unload some of the young guys for veterans to get better quicker, but in so doing sacrifice the longer term? It's going to be interesting to see what his strategy is for next year.

I really doubt that Petrie will unload any of our promising young players in lieu of veterans. He appears commited to mainly rebuilding through the draft this time. Thats not to say you pass up a great deal if it comes your way. But it would have to be a no brainer. I would be surprised if the team makes the playoffs next year. But thats barring any blockbuster deals that might happen. Like signing LeBron. But I do think the team will improve their record simply by having players with one more year of experience and by adding a couple more pieces to the puzzle. One must assume that Evans, Landry, Thompson, Greene, Casspi, and Beno will all continue to improve their games. Think how much better the team will be if just Evans comes back with a good midrange jumpshot.

The dark horse in this is Hawes. I've always supported him, but he didn't show me much improvement this year. A few flashes here and there. But he never put together a string of games that made he think that he crossed over to a new level. If you look at Thompsons last ten games, thats what I'm talking about. Being consistant. Doing all the other little things when your shots not falling. Rebounding, setting picks and playing defense. I still have hope for Hawes, but the clock is starting to wind down.

 

[pshn80]

I'm always curious why people make blanket statements about young players that are still developing. Why would you think that JT would be nothing better than a bench player for the rest of his career? I would agree that he had an up and down year. He started well and then went into a slump that lasted a month and a half, but he came out of it. Sometimes people get an image in their mind of a player, and refuse to see the progress. I'm not saying you, but in general. Big men take time. And by and large, it usually takes three years. I'm sure that Landry will be better next year. If the end of the year is any indicator, I think he's made very good progress.

His rotation defense has improved. He's fouling less. He passes the ball very well. He's always one of the first back in transition defense. He's learned to run the pick an roll better. He's without a doubt the best rebounder on the team. For whatever reason, it appears that the light bulb has finally gone on, and he's slowed down his game. He's playing much more under control. In his last ten games he's averaging 14.5 points and 9.5 rebounds a game. Now I'm not saying you can't do that off the bench, but there are starters around the league that don't average that. Those are almost the exact numbers that Al Horford averages, and I don't think he's coming off the bench.

Anyway, I don't think I would pass judgement just yet. As an aside, I noted that in the last three games Jerry Reynolds has commented several times how well JT is playing at the center position. I always get suspicious when someone thats involved in player decisions makes comments like that. It may be that the orgainzation has already made up its mind to go with JT at the center position in the future. For the last ten games or so he's certainly been more consistant than Hawes. Even when JT doesn't score, he continues to do the other little things you need. Hawes at times almost seems disinterested, or, mentally somewhere else. We shall see..

A month ago my view was that Thompson's potential at best was a bench player. Today I think I may have been wrong. Since he's been playing/starting at center he has as you say played quite well. No matter if that's true, we still need one good big to go with Landry/Hawes/Thompson. Right now I would pick a power forward.

 

[Warhawk]

A month ago my view was that Thompson's potential at best was a bench player. Today I think I may have been wrong. Since he's been playing/starting at center he has as you say played quite well. No matter if that's true, we still need one good big to go with Landry/Hawes/Thompson. Right now I would pick a power forward.

I'd go center. We need a good goalie. Big, intimidating, shotblocking goalie.

 

[King-Da-Yah]

I'd go center. We need a good goalie. Big, intimidating, shotblocking goalie.

+1, but if we can't land Cousins we just have to take Favors, after Favors I want Aldrich. I really really like Johnson, but having only seen him play a couple nice games in his conference tournament, and a phenominal game in the first round, I am not positive he is our guy. Even still his athleticsm makes up a lilttle for his ballhandling (which didn't seem very Reke'esque.

 

[bajaden]

+1, but if we can't land Cousins we just have to take Favors, after Favors I want Aldrich. I really really like Johnson, but having only seen him play a couple nice games in his conference tournament, and a phenominal game in the first round, I am not positive he is our guy. Even still his athleticsm makes up a lilttle for his ballhandling (which didn't seem very Reke'esque.

Your right. Johnsons ballhandling is his weakness. Thats not to say that he's terrible. Just that he's not in the same league with Turner or Wall. Or Evans. Nor is he as good a passer as those three. To my mind, whoever plays along side Evans has to be able to handle the ball and pass the ball. And, shoot the ball. He passes on the last one..