starks and bigbadred discuss offense v. defense (split from trade thread)

[Bricklayer]

Why do I repeat this every year since '02-'03 season.

Well you can likely repeat it all you want and without it somehow becoming true. There can be an argument whether we were the BEST defensive team -- most of the stats say we were, but if somebody wants to argue not its possible. But that we weren't great? There really is no argument for that outside of "I just didn't think so". You just can't lead the league in Opp FG% Opp3tFg%, be 2nd in Def Efficency etc. unless you're damn good. We just played at a higher pace.

What I think taints that year for so many people was our disorganized collapse after Webb went down in the playoffs.

 

[BigWaxer]

What I think taints that year for so many people was our disorganized collapse after Webb went down in the playoffs.

I can buy that, I am still so bitter about that entire season I don't know if I will ever recover...

We have talked about this same point before so no need rehashing last years points. Just one of those things I cannot bring myself to agree with. And to be honest I could very well be wrong! Of course I will never admit it!

 

[KingKong]

Whether or not we were the best defensive team that year is debatable, but you cannot question the commitment to defense that year.... It was the only season I have seen the Kings actually care about defending.

 

[dukeswh]

Make up play-off finals, two fantasy teams, who would win?
Team A: great offense; zero defense
Bibby
Nash
Peja
Nowitzki
Iglauskas

Team B: great defense, bad offense (exception Artest):
E. Snow
Bowen
Artest
Howard
B. Wallace

I don't think Eric Snow is a great defender. Replace him with either Billups or JKidd and Team A will not stand a chance.

Bowen will shut down Nash, Artest will shut down Peja, Nowitzki may score more,Ilgauskas vs. B. Wallace ......., Bibby might score some too but it will be cancelled out cause Billups/JKidd will light him up on the other end, Artest will have his way with Peja. And rebounding? Take Team A's frontline (Peja, Nowitzki, Ilgauskas) vs. Team B's (Artest, Howard, Wallace), the former will be slaughtered on the glass. So even if Team B has an awful shooting night, they get to shoot more because of their rebounding, and through GREAT defense they can also limit Team A's scoring, whereas if team A has a bad shooting night........ you get the picture. And this is where i believe great defensive teams are able to excel than great offensive teams.

Offense can get you so far as the players' hot hand. When they start getting cold, or other teams start making adjustments to their offensive game, there will be nothing to catch them once they start crashing down.

Team b wins.

 

[pdxKingsFan]

I won't go so far as to say "Defense is overrated" but I think comparing defense's importance in Basketball to Football is downright silly. Ideally in basketball you are striving for a good balance between the two with the 5 guys you keep on the court, in football defensive and offensive personel are completely separate so the only tradeoffs to be made are due to salary cap considerations.

Just about the only thing that they have in common is that sometimes a ball control oriented offense can make the defense look better than it actually is by controlling the flow of the game and limiting the opposing team's total possessions and a wide open high scoring offense can make a good defense look worse than it is by giving the other team more total possesions.

 

[bigbadred00]

I won't go so far as to say "Defense is overrated" but I think comparing defense's importance in Basketball to Football is downright silly. Ideally in basketball you are striving for a good balance between the two with the 5 guys you keep on the court, in football defensive and offensive personel are completely separate so the only tradeoffs to be made are due to salary cap considerations.

Just about the only thing that they have in common is that sometimes a ball control oriented offense can make the defense look better than it actually is by controlling the flow of the game and limiting the opposing team's total possessions and a wide open high scoring offense can make a good defense look worse than it is by giving the other team more total possesions.

that's not the point. it's that defence wins in all sports. great offences without a D are bound to lose. happens all the time. i like to watch a team with good O, but teams with good O without a D never win titles

 

[rexb_kings]

i'll say what wins a championship...it takes HEART!!! and it's playing it on both sides of the court..Offense and Defense!! and with HEART and determination a team also needs a CLUTCHNESS (if there's such a word). Clutch in defense...a key defensive stop and clutch on offense...is making the shot under pressure.

As a player this is what separates the Superstars from the rest. (MJ, Magic, Bird, Hakeem, TD)

 

[BMiller52]

i'll say what wins a championship...it takes HEART!!! and it's playing it on both sides of the court..Offense and Defense!! and with HEART and determination a team also needs a CLUTCHNESS (if there's such a word). Clutch in defense...a key defensive stop and clutch on offense...is making the shot under pressure.

As a player this is what separates the Superstars from the rest. (MJ, Magic, Bird, Hakeem, TD)

Mike and Ron!

 

[Bricklayer]

i'll say what wins a championship...it takes HEART!!! and it's playing it on both sides of the court..Offense and Defense!! and with HEART and determination a team also needs a CLUTCHNESS (if there's such a word). Clutch in defense...a key defensive stop and clutch on offense...is making the shot under pressure.

As a player this is what separates the Superstars from the rest. (MJ, Magic, Bird, Hakeem, TD)

I actually think the heart issue might tie into the defense issue a bit -- it takes a lot of heart and effort to play great defense. To really lay it on the line.

And also I think that ties into one of the reasons WHY defense is always winning championships -- you can crank up the defense (and rebounding) on effort, heart, determination. On offense, no matter how hard you try, you might be missing your shots. In fact it actually requires a bit of control to stay settled and calm and hit them. So you get a team with heart, a team that plays defense, and at the biggest moments in the biggest games they can swell up, start swarming, leaving it all on the floor, and make it incredibly difficult on the other team.