SAcbee: Some say lost Arena bid was Calculated

#1
http://www.sacbee.com/101/story/73971.html

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Some say lost arena bid was calculated

Suspicions surround Maloofs, who insist 'we want to stay here.'

By Terri Hardy and Mary Lynne Vellinga - Bee Staff Writers

Last Updated 12:17 am PST Thursday, November 9, 2006
Story appeared in MAIN NEWS section, Page A1

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In July, the downtown railyard was the site of a news conference promoting Measures Q and R. A drawing of the proposed development was included. Sacramento Bee/Randy Pench




The spectacular defeat of two arena measures at the polls Tuesday capped one of the most bizarre and disastrous campaigns in Sacramento County election history.

On the morning after eight out of 10 voters rejected the funding plan, arena proponents and political observers put much of the blame for the debacle squarely at the feet of the owners of the Sacramento Kings and their political adviser, Richie Ross.
The big question floating around town Wednesday was whether Joe and Gavin Maloof's actions in the campaign simply reflected their volatility and lack of political savvy, or whether they systematically sabotaged the campaign because they prefer that a new arena be built next to Arco in North Natomas or want to move the team to another city.

Veteran political consultant David Townsend said he thinks the sabotage was deliberate.

"I know a professional campaign when I see it, and this is a professional campaign," Townsend said. "This is not all by happenstance. ... This was an orchestrated, well-thought-out campaign to tube Q&R."
Whether Ross was behind it or the Maloofs were simply clients out of control, he doesn't know. Ross has not returned Bee phone calls about the campaign.

Gavin Maloof said Wednesday night he didn't "know where we are right now, but the whole process has been trying on all of us."
He added that he and his brother "appreciate all the elected officals who tried to get something going."

"We've said all along we want to stay here," Maloof said. "We've put eight great years toward establishing this fan base and 315 straight sellouts -- and that doesn't just happen."

Robert Waste, professor of public policy at California State University, Sacramento, also saw possible calculation in the Maloofs' stormy departure from arena deal negotiations and the brothers' decision to appear in a Carl's Jr. ad depicting them as billionaires washing down burgers with a $6,000 bottle of wine.

"If they were trying to sabotage (the arena plan) from Day One, I don't think they'd have done anything differently," Waste said.
Voters rejected Measure R, calling for a quarter-cent county sales tax increase, by 80 percent to 20 percent. Measure Q, a companion "quality of life" initiative to spend half the $1.2 billion raised on an arena and half on community projects, was advisory only. It failed 72 percent to 28 percent.

The Maloofs have insisted they were only trying to be honest with voters when Joe Maloof stood up at the Q&R kickoff press conference in the railyard in September and said the arena might have to go somewhere else -- a move that grabbed the day's headlines and undermined the campaign's message.

On Tuesday evening, the Kings owners issued a statement saying they'd done their best to come up with a plan for a badly needed

new arena in Sacramento. They attached a list of seven ideas that were explored since 2000. "None of these efforts have produced the desired result despite countless hours of work and effort," Joe and Gavin Maloof said in their joint statement.
They said they would seek guidance from the NBA on what to do next.

Both the Maloofs and officials from the NBA say the brothers' name and reputation were unfairly smeared in the campaign.
But Townsend, who has experience trying to negotiate with the Maloofs, predicted that no arena deal would get done while the family owns the Kings.

Townsend represented former Sheriff Lou Blanas in 2004 when he and developer Angelo Tsakopoulos were promoting a private plan to rezone thousands of acres in North Natomas for development and to use part of the proceeds for an arena. The plan fell apart after some landowners declined to participate.

"It's my opinion that as long as the Maloofs are in the mix, it will never happen," he said.

In the 2004 negotiations with North Natomas landowners, Townsend said, the Maloofs' "demands reached absurd levels, so the property owners basically said we're not going to pay for all that stuff -- plasma screen TVs everywhere, blah, blah, blah."

The failure of the most recent arena effort left plenty of bruised feelings and bitterness in its wake. Some of the Maloofs' most ardent political supporters now say they need to take a break before re-entering the fray.

"The Maloofs need to do outreach; some people's feelings are hurt," said Matt Mahood, president and chief executive officer of the Sacramento Metropolitan Chamber of Commerce.

From the beginning, the negotiations that led to Measures Q and R were characterized by an aggressive timeline and other demands by the team, and repeated setbacks when deal points they thought had been settled were reopened, local officials said.
The Maloofs aren't accepting the blame that the Q&R leaders are dishing in their direction.

The team owners -- backed by the NBA -- maintain the real problem was that the city and county hadn't nailed down a deal with railyard developer Stan Thomas to accommodate an arena. They say the city and county failed to follow through on a pledge to go "arm and arm" with the team to Thomas to try to obtain concessions, including 8,000 parking spaces from which the Maloofs would receive the revenue.

Harvey Benjamin, a high-ranking NBA official, said Thomas recently told him he may not even close escrow on the property from Union Pacific because the city hasn't committed the $300 million needed to build streets and crucial improvements in the first phase of the development.

Benjamin recalled Thomas as saying: " 'I'd like to sit down with you guys. We could work something out, but I don't even have the land myself.' "

Thomas could not be reached for comment, but his local vice president for development, Suheil Totah, said he was in the room, and the conversation did not resemble anything like what Benjamin recalls.

At the Tuesday night Q&R gathering, Totah stood shoulder to shoulder with Sacramento assistant city manager John Dangberg and said the developer and city are working together to come up with money for infrastructure -- and that the issue had nothing to do with why the negotiations with the Maloofs broke down.

"We thought we put a pretty darn good deal on the table," Dangberg said, referring to the city and county's offer to build the Maloofs a $500 million arena. "We put all we could out there, and it didn't work."

Opponents of measures Q and R downplayed the argument that the Maloofs had that much to do with the measures' defeat. They argued that the problem was arrogance on the part of the political and business leaders who assumed that spending more than $500 million in tax dollars on an arena was a priority with Sacramento County voters.

The opposition group Wednesday announced it would start holding town hall forums to unearth people's true concerns and priorities for their city. The first one will be held Jan. 11 at the Oak Park Community Center.

Grantland Johnson, a lobbyist for the Sacramento Central Labor Council, which opposed the arena plan, said the initiatives' creators were out of touch with the everyday lives of residents.

"If you go behind closed doors and have a caucus of the wealthy," he said, "you're going to come up with what they came up with."
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#2
absolutely

If they didnt intentionally make it fail, they couldnt have done a better job at showing they were not in favor of it. It should be private money used to build an arena. Use public money for a portion, but the major part must come from the people who use the arena, as well as the ones who it will be built for, ie the Maloofs. I realize itr will be used for other events as well, and that justifys the public investment of part of the cost
 
#3
If they didnt intentionally make it fail, they couldnt have done a better job at showing they were not in favor of it. It should be private money used to build an arena. Use public money for a portion, but the major part must come from the people who use the arena, as well as the ones who it will be built for, ie the Maloofs. I realize itr will be used for other events as well, and that justifys the public investment of part of the cost
Whatever, just like every other arena in this country was built?? Nice name by the way. Enjoy going to Fresno and San Jose for concerts or other events that would normally be held at Arco Arena because when the Maloofs move it will be leveled and we will have nowhere else to go.
 
#4
Voteno, while I don't like the name, as it already implies your intentions-motives here. I must say I agree with your points above, at least on the principle. With that said it's not reality. In todays sports world you are not going to get the Maloofs to pay 50% or more. Honestly why should and would they? There are plenty of cities waiting right now to offer the kings a free building.

Now if your one that doesn't care if the Kings leave thats fine. There is a price to pay to keep a professional sports team. Lets add a team with possibly one of the better ownership groups in all the major sports. A group that puts a lot of money into Sacto.

If they want to move they will, surely we are not going to stop them. At this point I am just going to enjoy this season while the Kings are here.
 
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#5
Whatever, just like every other arena in this country was built?? Nice name by the way. Enjoy going to Fresno and San Jose for concerts or other events that would normally be held at Arco Arena because when the Maloofs move it will be leveled and we will have nowhere else to go.
Most cities cave into their franchises and publically fund their arenas. Sorry, no way you're getting the Maloofs to pay for this thing. They own the team and have all the leverage.

You're going to have to publically fund this thing somehow. Most cities do it by taxing hotels or rental cars and such and then make the claim that visitors and outsiders would be paying the tax since they use the rental cars and hotels. (not quite sure how effective that would be in sacramento)
 
#6
I'm not sure the loss was "calculated"...

However, I do think it was, in effect, a "first right of refusal" offer. The Maloofs have been offered something like what we just rejected soundly, and they gave us the opportunity to match the offer.

While I'd like to say we politely declined the offer, I think that'd be inaccurate. Nothing quite says, "And the horse you rode in on!" quite like losing 81-19. That number will not substantially change between now and June 2008, which gets them an arena in 2012, but the current arena sounds like it'd be unusuable after 2010, so...

I'm just adding up all the items here; voter requirements, the "discovery" that building an arena in the railyard will require an additional $300 million in infrastructure, the size of our TV market, the lack of corporate presence (according to several publications, we're very close to last in major corporations in Sacramento; funny how 21 years of being major-league hasn't changed that, eh?), the clear and obvious lack of voter will, and on and on...

I'm not saying the Maloofs sabotaged it, and I'm tired of the personal attacks that go on at websites, so I'm now firmly in the camp that says the circumstances are just not conducive to retaining an NBA team in Sacramento.

It's not Wert's fault, or voteno's fault, or VF's fault, or Kennadog's fault, or BMiller's fault, or BigWaxer's fault, or Stern's fault, or Joe's fault, or Fong's fault... It's just the circumstances. It's the perfect storm. We had the voters, local government, the developer, NO corporations, a SMALL TV market, the Maloofs, the NBA... And this huge chasm.

I can't envision these groups engineering a bridge that'll cross that chasm. As soon as one of the parties is happy, one of the others storms out of the room (on Nov 7, it was the turn of the voters to stalk away).

In short, we're done here. Maloofs now say 2-3 years; I'm saying they won't build an arena here because someone already offered them a deal that, economically, is WAY, WAY better than that, even if they end up with lower attendance.

Things are progressing very logically here.
 

Warhawk

Give blood and save a life!
Staff member
#7
Use public money for a portion, but the major part must come from the people who use the arena, as well as the ones who it will be built for, ie the Maloofs.
I think you still fail to understand that without the involvement of MSE, we will still have to build a new facility (since it serves a need and ARCO will be demo'd if the Kings leave) and it will have to be 100% publically financed. Farther in the future. When things cost more. Instead of a public cost of $400 million or so, it's going to be $600-700 million and ALL borne by the public.

Thanks! The Sacramento area residents appreciate your concern for their pocketbook. :rolleyes:
 
#8
I'm just adding up all the items here; voter requirements, the "discovery" that building an arena in the railyard will require an additional $300 million in infrastructure,
No that isn't correct. It wasn't 300 million for the arena infrastructure. It was 300 million for phase 1 of the entire railyard development. They can build the arena next to Arco and it will still 300 million in infrastructure costs to develop phase 1 of the railyard. Get used to nothing getting done there.

I wonder if it would have been a better approach to put the sales tax out there as a railyard redevelopment measure. Instead of touting the arena, just be upfront with the voters that it's going to take a half billion from the city's side to develop the 240 acres. This is the largest city with a huge piece of undeveloped downtown left in the nation. That is an opportunity that has to be seriously considered. Get the railyard project on track first. I think the city used the wrong carrot.
 
#9
No that isn't correct. It wasn't 300 million for the arena infrastructure. It was 300 million for phase 1 of the entire railyard development. They can build the arena next to Arco and it will still 300 million in infrastructure costs to develop phase 1 of the railyard. Get used to nothing getting done there.

I wonder if it would have been a better approach to put the sales tax out there as a railyard redevelopment measure. Instead of touting the arena, just be upfront with the voters that it's going to take a half billion from the city's side to develop the 240 acres. This is the largest city with a huge piece of undeveloped downtown left in the nation. That is an opportunity that has to be seriously considered. Get the railyard project on track first. I think the city used the wrong carrot.
Bottom-line, though, it's exactly the same problem: Where was the City suddenly going to get $300 million? My first guess: The 1/4 cent sales tax hike, which means the other 50% raised by the sales tax hikes never would have made it to the coffers of other cities and into the unincorporated areas of the county.

Technically, you're right. But as a practical matter, it makes no difference at all. I think it's well within the realm of possibility that once we'd paid for the general infrastructure, the arena, and all the overruns that well over 75% of the new tax would have ended up in the railyard. Since it was a general tax hike and an advisory arena measure, I think that could have happened quite easily.

It's kind of interesting how, now that the dust is starting to settle a little, we're seeing just how far apart everyone was. Calling it a "chasm" is nothing like an overstatement. It wasn't a matter of "Can we move Big Four 150 feet north?". Not at all. This went to the voters way, way before it was ready, and as a result, I'd say the Kings are as good as gone.

Kudos to the Maloofs for not pulling out the threat card, but, come on, we know they have one in their possession now, don't we? I apply simple logic to conclude that.
 
#10
What is wrong with a 1/4 cent sales tax to develop the railyard? It's too good of an opportunity to avoid. We got flat lied to by those who told us the railyard was going to be developed anyway without the arena. This anti tax sentiment is ruining the future of Sacramento.
 

Bricklayer

Don't Make Me Use The Bat
#11
To the original title I would say absolutely -- and kudos to that pair of writers for being on that topic.

Now Sacrametno has rapidly revealed itself to be nothing more than a blown up version of Albany or Harrisburg, but these things never had a chance anyway. And I simply do not beleive there is any way that that..."campaign" for lack of a better word, could be run by the Maloofs by accident. Too much and too obvious. Actually worrisomely so -- they could have assured defeat with nothing more than benign neglect, and that would have worked to get the arena back over to their obviously preferred Natomas spot. But by seeming to do everything possible to not only assure a loss, but to assure a complete squashing, now the very real concern would be that the Maloofs were/are trying to set the stage for a move by meeting some criteria the other owners will be able to see -- by being able to point to the vote, say to the league "see, we lost 80-20, ain't no way an arena is ever getting built in that hick town". And then its off to Anaheim.
 
#12
Whatever, just like every other arena in this country was built?? Nice name by the way. Enjoy going to Fresno and San Jose for concerts or other events that would normally be held at Arco Arena because when the Maloofs move it will be leveled and we will have nowhere else to go.



No need...

If the Kings leave, Sacramento will turn into a Frenso-like town. People who voted no for a new arena have no sense and obviously don't care about impoving the city. Makes me sick.
 

VF21

Super Moderator Emeritus
SME
#13
I don't think it's a matter of it being calculated per se.

I truly believe the Maloofs were trying to be totally honest when the Q & R campaign was first launched. Joe said then the arena might have to end up being somewhere other than the railyards, and he was lambasted for it. BUT he was being honest with the voters. He was pretty much saying what everyone came to realize later - that there were still significant problems to overcome to locate the arena in the railyards, even if the measures passed.

The fact the Maloofs pulled their support only points out the obvious - that they did not want voters to be under the impression they were truly voting for the railyard arena proposal when there were lots of reasons to believe such a proposal might not ever come to fruition.

Why should the Maloofs support something they didn't think would be the best option for them? Especially with all the other problems. A voter referendum would really have tied both the hands of the city/county and the Maloofs in dealing with the developer. Their bargaining power had been taken away because of the timing of the measures.

Sorry, but I'm not going to blame the Maloofs for this. It was a great rush to think the city/county and the Maloofs had finally found a way to agree on the arena concept, but that was quickly replaced by the knowledge that this was pushed too quickly onto the ballot and was not good for anyone the way it stood.

Sorry, Merdiesel, but people had every right in the world to vote no.
 
#14
It's become clear to me that the Q&R folks were looking to use the tax to pay for most if not all the railyard infrastructure. They had a real problem moving forward with redeveloping the 240 acres without the funds. In itself, I have no problem with them looking to the public to pay for the railyard infrastructure and include the arena. It's a big pill to swallow, but the numbers add up and it makes sense. What they did instead was make this about the arena and in the process downplayed their urgent need of cash to make the purchase of the land from UP move forward. I think they intentionally hid some of these facts and didn't think the public would handle the truth. On top of that they misled everyone into thinking that half of this tax was going back to the cities when they knew that the arena + railyard infrastructure was going to chew up 800-900 million of that tax revenue. And now both projects are on life support and a voting public is angry.
 
#15
What is wrong with a 1/4 cent sales tax to develop the railyard? It's too good of an opportunity to avoid. We got flat lied to by those who told us the railyard was going to be developed anyway without the arena. This anti tax sentiment is ruining the future of Sacramento.
The problem is that would definitely have invoked Prop 218. This thing just failed 81-19, and you think there's a chance they could clear 2/3?

Disclosure: I voted no on 218; it passed by a landslide; I respect the rule of law, which says a specific tax must have a 2/3 majority to pass. Like Romey would say to me: Scoreboard. I voted against 218, so I lost, too.
 
#16
I seriously doubt the city planned to use the sales tax for the infrastructure. For the sales tax to become effective they would have had to enter into agreements with the county and the other cities in the county. They most certainly would NOT have allowed $300,000 million to improve infrastruture in the city of Sacramento. If that is what the city thought they could manage, then they were certainly trying to pull the wool over everyone's eyes.

As to the Maloofs using any "threat," I still don't know how anyone can say that a business moving to another location, because its a better economic deal is a "threat."

They will ultimately go where they need to go to make their franchise economically viable. Any business person would. Its a no brainer. I think the Maloofs have probably had better offers and have been trying to stay here. Unfortunately, Sacramneto may just not be able to come close to being competitive for this particular business. So far doing a deal here hasn't worked. That is not a threat, that is an economic reality.

To expect the Maloofs to stay in Sacramento at a loss, is expecting them to lose money out of the goodness of their heart. We can't expect charity and can't ask for it. That is not economic reality.
 
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#17
As to the Maloofs using any "threat," I still don't know how anyone can say that a business moving to another location, because its a better economic deal is a "threat."
You know that I love your posts, right?

Having said that, I tend to disagree with your total defense of the Maloofs. This is not just a business. It is also about team spirit and city pride. If the Maloofs were primarily interested in making money, they should be selling coffee or distributing beer (oh, wait a second).

I do not expect them to lose money in the interest of me being a fan. However, I do expect that they should show their fans some faith even if that means forgoing signifcant $$$.
 
#18
You know that I love your posts, right?
Having said that, I tend to disagree with your total defense of the Maloofs. This is not just a business. It is also about team spirit and city pride. If the Maloofs were primarily interested in making money, they should be selling coffee or distributing beer (oh, wait a second).

I do not expect them to lose money in the interest of me being a fan. However, I do expect that they should show their fans some faith even if that means forgoing signifcant $$$.
Oh, well thanks. :eek: As much as we'd like that, it just isn't realistic. Not only that, but what's the definition of significant? The Maloofs have been covered red ink a number of years and have written luxury tax checks some years. That's millions. They've donated over $11 million to the community. I don't consider that an insignificant contribution to Sacramento. The value of the publicity to our fair city is in the millions. People all over the world know where we are and something about who we are, because of the Kings and Monarchs.

There's a reason its rich people who own sports teams. Most of them are wealthy, get wealthy and/or stay wealthy, because they know how to make money, by running a good business. The Maloofs are clearly great business people. No good business person takes money from successful businesses to pour into losing ones (maybe a little money for a sports team). Its just plain bad business and puts all your other businesses at risk.

Me and a lot of Kings fans would like to think there is something special here in Sacramento that the Kings and NBA can't give up. Sorry, that's just dreaming, I know that in my head, and there are clear signs that the honeymoon is over anyway. There are plenty of cities out there that would love to have an NBA franchise that are going to offer the Maloofs more than Sacramento. I suspect some have already.

I was reflecting on Joe's recent comments today. They want to work something out, but they can't wait for 2008, don't think a referendum will work and Arco is only good for a "couple or a few" more years. That's almost saying we can manage here in Sacramento while we find a new place elsewhere.

I think Sacramento and the Kings have, at most, a year to come up with a sucessful plan and the Maloofs just can't wait any longer. Am I mad at the Maloofs? No. I understand, perfectly. At this point, I can't be too mad at the city/county either. I wish they'd bothered to actually sit down and negotiate several years ago, but if they can't come up with something, then they can't.

I said I wouldn't let go of hope, until the NBA announces they've approved a move, but my head is telling me, this just isn't going to happen short of a miracle.

I won't be angry, I'll just be incredibly sad. My hometown team is likely to be gone and the city I've loved for a long time won't have any arena. How anyone can be happy about that outcome, I don't know.:(
 
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#19
However, I do think it was, in effect, a "first right of refusal" offer. The Maloofs have been offered something like what we just rejected soundly, and they gave us the opportunity to match the offer.

While I'd like to say we politely declined the offer, I think that'd be inaccurate. Nothing quite says, "And the horse you rode in on!" quite like losing 81-19. That number will not substantially change between now and June 2008, which gets them an arena in 2012, but the current arena sounds like it'd be unusuable after 2010, so...

I'm just adding up all the items here; voter requirements, the "discovery" that building an arena in the railyard will require an additional $300 million in infrastructure, the size of our TV market, the lack of corporate presence (according to several publications, we're very close to last in major corporations in Sacramento; funny how 21 years of being major-league hasn't changed that, eh?), the clear and obvious lack of voter will, and on and on...

I'm not saying the Maloofs sabotaged it, and I'm tired of the personal attacks that go on at websites, so I'm now firmly in the camp that says the circumstances are just not conducive to retaining an NBA team in Sacramento.

It's not Wert's fault, or voteno's fault, or VF's fault, or Kennadog's fault, or BMiller's fault, or BigWaxer's fault, or Stern's fault, or Joe's fault, or Fong's fault... It's just the circumstances. It's the perfect storm. We had the voters, local government, the developer, NO corporations, a SMALL TV market, the Maloofs, the NBA... And this huge chasm.

I can't envision these groups engineering a bridge that'll cross that chasm. As soon as one of the parties is happy, one of the others storms out of the room (on Nov 7, it was the turn of the voters to stalk away).

In short, we're done here. Maloofs now say 2-3 years; I'm saying they won't build an arena here because someone already offered them a deal that, economically, is WAY, WAY better than that, even if they end up with lower attendance.

Things are progressing very logically here.
We get your point.
 
#20
81-19? I don't think we can really know what people's "no" votes mean at this point. To some, a "no" vote might mean, I'm in favor of public financing and a new arena, but since there is no agreement in existence, I'm not willing to vote "yes" to a deal with no details and no enforcement ability.

Also, Joe Maloofs already said they can't wait until a 2008 ballot and did not think that a ballot referendum was going to work anyway.
 
#21
I have avoided the arena issue thus far. I normally tune out when people go over the same bits of it over and over. I was tired of it and I always figured that the populace would bend over for the Maloofs in the end. What I didn't expect was how much the Maloofs wanted them to bend over and that not only Sacramento, but in cities through out the country, that the populace would not just bend over one more time for sports owners.

I don't think the sports owners were ready for this response. The Maloofs certainly were not. After many years of being treated very kindly by the local press and public, they went a bit far with this Arena deal, the media finally stopped kissing their butt and the Maloofs and their PR were so... astonished by even being questioned that they lashed out through various channels. And now that the measures are failed and people ask the Maloofs what to do, they say "We don't have a plan B." Which in some cases is true, and a sign that they and I think other sports owners just had gotten use to the public caving in to their whims, but there is always a plan B and it is always "move somewhere else." The problem is now, looking at the current trend, where else do yuo move? This is happening other places, what other major city is going to do the bending over if Seattle and San Francisco won't? Well owners are eyeing nearby subarbs, because I think they realize... things have changed. The public isn't as easy to bully anymore.

And on a side note, those of you who do not live in the area(though I don't know why you'd be in the thread if you don't live here), be glad you don't have to listen to the Maloofs PR minions. Right now there is a lot of name calling and finger pointing, and most of it is coming from the local station.
 
#22
I have avoided the arena issue thus far. I normally tune out when people go over the same bits of it over and over. I was tired of it and I always figured that the populace would bend over for the Maloofs in the end. What I didn't expect was how much the Maloofs wanted them to bend over and that not only Sacramento, but in cities through out the country, that the populace would not just bend over one more time for sports owners.

I don't think the sports owners were ready for this response. The Maloofs certainly were not. After many years of being treated very kindly by the local press and public, they went a bit far with this Arena deal, the media finally stopped kissing their butt and the Maloofs and their PR were so... astonished by even being questioned that they lashed out through various channels. And now that the measures are failed and people ask the Maloofs what to do, they say "We don't have a plan B." Which in some cases is true, and a sign that they and I think other sports owners just had gotten use to the public caving in to their whims, but there is always a plan B and it is always "move somewhere else." The problem is now, looking at the current trend, where else do yuo move? This is happening other places, what other major city is going to do the bending over if Seattle and San Francisco won't? Well owners are eyeing nearby subarbs, because I think they realize... things have changed. The public isn't as easy to bully anymore.

And on a side note, those of you who do not live in the area(though I don't know why you'd be in the thread if you don't live here), be glad you don't have to listen to the Maloofs PR minions. Right now there is a lot of name calling and finger pointing, and most of it is coming from the local station.
For some reason the Maloofs have been taking a beating locally for some time. Long before the current negotiations. And I'd say the bild of the name-calling started with the Bee and the anti-arena folks.

Charlotte and Memphis just built arenas with all public money. Where will the Maloofs go? I guarantee you, there will be takers. Anaheim is dying for a team and is a far richer and bigger market. Las Vegas really wants a team. Kansas City has a brand new, publicly financed arena and would love to have the Kings back. They are sorry they ever let them go. I'm sure there are others.

If Sacramento doesn't want to participate in an arena deal that will keep the Kings here, fine. That's reality. But don't think the Kings won't leave. And out of curiousity, do you care that the city will have no sports and entertainment venue? Because Arco will be gone.
 
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#23
Totally agree with the post right above mine. What sacramento just did is not something new. We are not a cowtown for voting down this huge tax increase. It's happening in a lot of other cities that are much bigger than ours. How many times did the voters of SF shoot down the Giants? How bout the 49ers? Look at the troubles the A's are having. And thats just here in CA. Seattle, Portland, Orlando, New Jersey, etc. Cities are tired of being held over the fire for new publicly financed arenas. Add CA's growing hatred of tax increases and new bond proposals and you had an impossible situation.
 
#24
Orlando just agreed to an arena deal. Portland was a private financing deal that went bankrupt (couldn't make a go of it without public help).

Yeah we'll show those darn Maloofs. They'll be really upset when they go to another city where they'll get a better deal and new arena. And they will. And then, if we want an arena at all in Sacramento, it'll have to be 100% public financing. That'll teach them a lesson.
 
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#26
I'm curious about the basic, and widely held, assumption that the Maloofs are "great" business men. I don't think that we really know that. Their father certainly was, because he built an empire in New Mexico. The Maloof brothers leveraged that into a small casino in Vegas, and then later the Palms. But, I have a feeling their assets are highly leveraged. I do not think it is any coincidence that Petrie had to start reigning in the roster when the Maloofs put up the Palms. Now, the Maloofs have some nice assets, but I do not think they are swimming in cash by any means.

Why do I think that they are not as financially sound as purported to be? Their thinking is too short term, and they simply do not strike me as good, decisive business men. Why would any business man prefer a Natomas site to the revitalized railyards? That's short money. Sure, they're going to maintain the status quo, but they are not going to grow the business or the revenue pool. A revitalized railyards allows the city to start recruiting the big corporations, which leads to the luxury boxes, better TV contracts, and a more affluent fanbase. Right now the city does not have much firepower in recruiting the big corporations, but that revitalized downtown would be the crown jewel. That, plus some tax incentives, and maybe we could snag a corporate headquarters from another city. We are talking about a 30 year lease here, so I think we should be able to have a little strategic thinking/planning. Another Natomas site does nothing for the city or the team, but it keeps the current cash flow steady for the Maloofs due to the ridiculous amount of parking spots and the control they could exert around the immediate area.

But most of all they just do not strike me as sound business men. They are not well educated, cannot speak well, and most of the time do not dress well. These are all superficial criteria, to an extent. The one that really stands out is their inability to speak about business, or anything else really, intelligently. Cuban and Gates were dropouts, and dress deplorably, but as soon as they open their mouth it is pretty obvious they know their stuff. They can break down a deal, or their company's financials, down to the smallest degree or indicator. Guys like Jerry Jones or Trump are slickster jerks w/ the same public persona as the Maloofs, but they can explain their position intelligently and emphatically. I just think there is something missing to the Maloof brothers, and that perhaps their wealth/business sense is not as great as imagined. So, I think a petulant, calculated attempt to lose this ballot measure is not beyond the scope. These are guys who are clearly immature, and couple that with their absolute inability to articulate anything, and they might have seen this as their only chance to move out of Sacramento w/out looking like total jerks.
 
#27
Great points in the second paragraph -lost me a bit in the final paragraph. The points in the 2nd paragraph are things that I wish people would discuss more - not just here, but in the primary media sources.
 
#28
Tear them down all you like. At the end of the day they still own the Kings and have ultimate say in their business. The hard question is whether all the nitpicking matters enough to tell them to leave. Just be aware that telling a team to leave is a VERY powerful message that might make you feel better for awhile, but does some long term damage to the city's image.
 
#29
Sorry, Merdiesel, but people had every right in the world to vote no.
I was about to say the same thing before reading the rest of the thread. People are not dumb no matter how they vote. Its our right to vote yes or no, thats why it is called a democracy. Nobody is ever going to agree with everything.

Even if this issue/measure makes a lot of sense to us, to someone else it may not and we have to respect their right to feel that way.
 
#30
venom: interesting thought that you proposed

I am sure there will be a lot of discussion about your viewpoints. I also have to question how great of businessmen they really are. Especially with their antics during the negotiations. There were much better ways that they could have handled themselves.

I am curious if anyone has the answer to this question. The Maloofs have said that they have tried many times to get an arena financed over the last 6 or so years. Have they ever agreed or suggested that they put up a substantial amount of money to finace an arena. I am not asking if they have suggested that they pay over haf of the money. I know that answer. Have they ever suggested or implied that they should contribute a sizeable portiong of an arena cost, or have they always felt that someone else should pay all the costs associated with a new arena.