This is the last post regarding this, i outlined everything more than once now
Not true. New questions are raised, new data points are shared, etc. This is what happens when you’re asked to defend your positions.
Because players tend to avoid situations in which theor scoring is hard. They tend to try to find situations that makes it easier for them to score.
Scoring under the basket against a good rim protector is not easy, which means that the presence of a good rim protector limits slashing.
So in this example, what is the alternative to how offensive teams combat this? Are they just swinging the ball on the perimeter back & forth? Is someone just dribbling at the top of the key and taking nothing but step back 3s? Of course not. The name of the game is to collapse the defense (whether there is an elite rim protector or not) and find the open man.
Sometimes when you collapse the defense, the defenders aren't in a position to give a quality contest in the paint/at the rim which allows the player to finish it themselves. Good rim protectors are able to limit that type of outcome and either force you to take a tough shot at the rim or pass it out. But again, collapsing the defense and getting them in rotation is the name of the game. A C/rim protector for the most part is not "stopping" that initial penetration considering they are usually not out on the perimeter.
Yes, because thats real life consequences.
I see you clipped the rest of my response, so I will ask the question again since you ignored it...
Boston had rim protection on the floor for a much higher % of the minutes. You pointed to rim protection being the reason they lost but fail to recognize they had more rim protection throughout the series. How do you come to terms with that?
Let's break it down further though...
You: "Team X lost because they didn't have enough rim protection"
Me: "But Team Y had even less rim protection than Team X. How can you point to rim protection being the reason they lost?"
You: "Because they lost"
Do you see how your logic breaks down very quickly?
Show me where i redefined anything?
Thats what i mean, you are twisting my words.
As a stathead, do you not agree that there are Teams with guys who an are the exception to the rule.
We are lucky to live in an era with LeBron AND Jokic, and both generate insane stats.
If i negated my terms I wouldn't have wrote, that the rule is still the rule.
More than happy to!
- You made the claim "The main point is, you need, whatever team you have, elite rim protection, to be an elite team in the NBA."
- You didn't formally define what you meant by "elite team" but you followed up that sentence by saying "The teams that are in the finals show that"
- That says to me that you think (at the very least) the two teams that make finals each year are considered "elite teams"
- I then looked at the two teams that made the finals over the past 10 years and it showed that 40% of those teams did not have "elite rim protection"
- So now let's circle back to your original claim. You said "you need...elite rim protection to be an elite team in the NBA." The data negates your claim since 40% of those teams do not have "elite rim protection"
- You then respond saying saying the teams I referenced have some of the best players in the game so they don't count.
- At this point, you have now "redefined" your claim on what makes an elite team. Your definition is no longer "you need...elite rim protection to be an elite team in the NBA." You now have updated your definition to be "you need...elite rim protection to be an elite team in the NBA if you don't have the best or 2nd best player in the game on your roster." You're very clearly redefining your claim by adding qualifiers. It's not even up for debate.
Now since that case is closed & shut, let's assess your updated claim "
you need...elite rim protection to be an elite team in the NBA if you don't have the best or 2nd best player in the game on your roster." There are still 20% of the teams that made the finals that don't have the best or 2nd best player in the the game on their roster. Immediately, the redefined claim breaks down again. Do you want to redefine it again or would you concede that you don't actually need elite rim protection to be an elite team?
So you are the one to change your examples until you are right. I see.
To the contrary, I just showed above how your redefined claim still is not valid.
The point here is that you never formally defined what you think an "
elite team" is. I took a very conservative approach and limited the data to only teams that made the finals in the past 10 years. Personally, I would define an "
elite team" as a team that makes the conference finals (meaning the top 4 teams each year).
If you want to be that rigid in what you think is an "
elite team" (e.g., only teams that make the finals), that's fine. Your redefined claim still does not hold water. If your definition of an "
elite team" is a bit broader (like my definition), there will be even more examples of "
elite teams" that don't have "
elite rim protection."
No matter what your answer is here though, your redefined claim is wrong. The question we're exploring now is really
how wrong your claim is (based on how your define "
elite team").
Its right there. This, again, shows me that you arent really reading my posts.
So I ask you to clarify what you're referencing so I can properly respond and you refuse to give me the reference? Got it...
Cause its always better if your starting C can do this, too. Thats why Sabonis will always limit our defensive ability, and why Domas' weaknesses will always get exposed. In his most important games as a king, even his strengths disappeared.
Well of course it's always better if your starting C can protect the rim at a high level. Just like it's always better if your C is a sniper from the 3PT point. Just like it's always better if your C can dominate the glass. Just like it's always better if your C can be a very efficient, high volume scorer. Just like it's always better if your C can be an elite lob threat. Just like it's always better if your C can run an offense efficiently. Just like it's always better if your C is athletic enough to switch 1-5. This point is universally understood.
What you're not addressing is why is it okay for the Knicks to have a starting C who is a below average defender/rim protector if their backup C is a good defender/rim protector, but it's not okay for the Kings to have starting C who is a below average defender/rim protector if we can acquire a backup C that is a good defender/rim protector?
Again, i outlined my reasons and they are not you disagreeing with me. You are not reading what i am writing and thats okay, nobody has to, but dont throw that ish at me then.
I am thats why i am saying that we agree on most of the things, and you choose to argue on the most petty things.
Oh I'm definitely reading what you are writing. It's just that many of your claims are flawed.
And if the things we are arguing are petty to you, why are you taking the time to respond then?