Mike Brown Fired

[206Fan]

Fox is possibly one of the bigger enigma's in basketball. When he's rolling and locked in, there's nobody better in basketball. He's a two-way stud that destroys you on both ends. There's no denying his ceiling as a player.

The problem is he just rarely accesses that talent on a game to game basis. He's basically always great; fringe-ish all-star-all-star caliber, but this guy has the talent to better than SGA/Luka if he played the way he should night and night out. He just doesn't though. He coasts through halves, games; and it's just obviously apparent that when he DOES turn it on and make an imprint on the game, it begs the question. Where the **** was that the 1H? Last night another example.

I remember in January of last season, dude was just flat AWFUL. Looked like he could not care any less being on the floor. Meanwhile Domas is working his ass off, night in and night out, trying to will the team to wins through sheer grit. Imagine if Fox played with the sheer hustle/passion/energy that Domas does every game; dude would be a 1st ballot HOF. I seriously can't remember a game where I felt Domas wasn't giving 100% on the floor. He might not always have an amazing game; but dude probably has like a 95% hit rate of all-star/All-nba production.

I love Fox, he's easily one of my favorite players of all-time. But now has to be the time he shows he's the top 10 guy he says he is. You want Kings fans to believe in you as the franchise guy? Go be that dude, game in and game out. Don't coast entire halves. Don't wait for someone to pee you off. Control the game from minute 1 to minute 48. This was supposed to be the breakout season and now the 2nd best coach in franchise history is out the door because of how we started the year. There's no more layers of protection on who to blame; the ball is squarely in his hands on how his Kings career plays out or ends.

But at what point do you call a spade a spade? We've already had 8 years of DeAaron Fox. I remember an early season game last year where Fox had a 2 or 3 game stretch of phenomenal play and looked like a superstar. In a random presser, Mike Brown was absolutely gushing about Fox, but he made it a point to say that Fox could still unlock a whole new tier. I think this tells us that this is something Fox is very much aware of, but I think he just doesn't care enough.

I've been a bit checked out of the Kings this year, and I missed this comment by Mike Brown a week ago after the Denver loss. We are both echoing the same damn sentiment that Mike Brown felt.

https://twitter.com/statuses/1869498734255714533

I think it's time to trade Fox.

 

[ShastaKingsFan]

Ok…if not 5 games in a row at home then when? 6? 10? Coaches don’t get fired in the middle of the season because they went on a winning streak. There is always going to be a loss that breaks things. Otherwise just wait until the offseason. That’s a reasonable viewpoint to have, but I don’t understand why it’s surprising that one of the worst losses in the last few years (which has had its share of unbelievable losses) would be the game to trigger firing.

It's because of what happened on the final play to end that game, what was said afterwards, and what led up to it with Fox. It's an awful gutless look that makes this organization look the worst it has since firing Malone. You lose respect and it makes it a lot harder to recruit good players and coaches when you handle things like this.....and yes, timing and optics matter when it comes to professionalism

 

[ESP47]

But at what point do you call a spade a spade? We've already had 8 years of DeAaron Fox. I remember an early season game last year where Fox had a 2 or 3 game stretch of phenomenal play and looked like a superstar. In a random presser, Mike Brown was absolutely gushing about Fox, but he made it a point to say that Fox could still unlock a whole new tier. I think this tells us that this is something Fox is very much aware of, but I think he just doesn't care enough.

I've been a bit checked out of the Kings this year, and I missed this comment by Mike Brown a week ago after the Denver loss. We are both echoing the same damn sentiment that Mike Brown felt.

https://twitter.com/statuses/1869498734255714533

I think it's time to trade Fox.

Yeah if anything, Brown talking about Fox to the media is because he knows Fox can be that guy and was looking to light a fire under him. I think Brown knows that Fox doesn't lead like the tier 1 superstars lead. He doesn't put in the effort night in and night out that the tier 1 superstars do. He has the same physical abilities that those guys do but he doesn't have the same motivation and desire to win.

Normally I don't really care for people making comments like I just did above because a player's demeanor isn't always indicative of their effort and desire to win. It's the fact that we can see Fox's demeanor change from half assing it, to most assing it, to full on assing it (Houston game) coupled with Brown's obvious comments to the media about how Fox has another mental level that he needs to unlock that makes me think that Fox just doesn't have the drive that you need from your best or second best player.

 

[iowamcnabb]

do we have any clarity on the other coaches?

 

[pdxKingsFan]

Well of course. How is it a surprise that he got canned because they lost ANOTHER game at home after an unbelievable meltdown. Of course that was the last straw or he would have been fired after the pacers game. I’m not sure how any of that is a shocker.

If he wasn't fired today he'd have been fired by February unless we won 15 of the next 20. They just wanted the next reason. They got it last night.

 

[pdxKingsFan]

You’re kidding me, right? So because Vivek owned the team during both events, that makes him THE common denominator?

You know what else is a common denominator? The team being located in Sacramento. So does that mean WE are responsible too?

C’mon man, you’re smarter than that!

Besides, was Vivek running the team when all this instability and dysfunction first began back in 2006? Nope. Was he running the team when they first started swinging and missing on their draft picks in 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2011, 2012, and 2013? Nope.

Did Vivek fire Adelman? Nope. Did he hire and fire Musselman, Theus, Natt, Westphal, and Smart? Nope.

The Magoofs went through 6 coaches in 8 seasons. Vivek has been through 7 coaches in 12 seasons.

While Vivek has made more than his fair share of mistakes over the past 11 years, there’s still no proof that he’s making these decisions over the head of GM he hired over 4 years ago.

If you can provide proof or at least some sound evidence to the contrary, please do so. Otherwise you can take the “common denominator“ nonsense and shove it. Wild speculation stemming from an anti-Vivek bias/agenda does not constitute proof.

I’m in no way a Vivek apologist. I just believe in being fair. And to this point in time, nobody has been able to bring any damning evidence to the table proving Vivek as the villain. Until proven otherwise, what basis do we have to assume that anyone other than the actual GM, Monte McNair, was responsible for the decision? The idea that Vivek has reportedly meddled in the past doesn’t automatically mean that it’s happening now.

The only concession I’ll make is that ownership has to sign off on McNair’s decision making due to the financial impacts of paying Brown while having to pay a new head coach. But that doesn’t mean that the decision to fire Brown was solely or even largely Vivek’s idea. He very well just be supporting his GM in doing the job he hired him to do.

I'm not a Vivek apologist because I thought he completely hosed us with his first FO hire and the pivot to Vlade and a bunch of shadow GMs lead to one of the worst decisions in franchise history and also cost one of the greatest legends in the Sac era his reputation.

But WTF has he done wrong with Monte and Brown? From what I can tell he let them cook. I personally think the roster shortcomings are on the GM, but it's possible Brown had input. I personally thought Brown was doing FO's bidding by showcasing players for trade (Davion and Huerter being the obvious candidates) but it's possible his odd rotations were his own (un)doing. Maybe Sasha is 100% Brown's fault. Maybe Keon was a complete miss by Brown and he'd have never gotten an opportunity if Kevin and Monk hadn't both gone down. I don't know!

But all of that is on the GM/coach tandem.

If it comes out that Vivek ordered the rotations over the heads of everyone I don't think we won't find out in short order and then we can blame him.

If Vivek fired a guy a few days after Christmas in a less than optimal way who TF cares? Getting fired ALWAYS sucks. Mike Malone can kick effing rocks, we did him dirty but this has nothing to do with that. George Karl can jump off a pier into Tahoe tomorrow for all I care. The fascination with that clown has at least something to do with what happened to Malone.

I don't think Vivek is perfect but for the most part he's stayed in his lane. If he fired Brown as a precursor to cleaning house so be it. The rest of the guys can put up or shut up from here. This team is 13-18 in 12th place but nowhere near bad enough to compete for a high lotto spot and many heads should roll. I feel like Brown got done dirty but at the same point in time everyone else can point the finger at someone else. Fox could point at Brown (maybe). He's next man up. Monte can I guess say same, but if a new coach can't win with his roster he's also shown time for change. Everyone else is ON EFFING NOTICE from here out.

I hope Doug can be a hardass on them until he either earns the job or gets shown the door in a total overhaul this offseason.

 

[206Fan]

Yeah if anything, Brown talking about Fox to the media is because he knows Fox can be that guy and was looking to light a fire under him. I think Brown knows that Fox doesn't lead like the tier 1 superstars lead. He doesn't put in the effort night in and night out that the tier 1 superstars do. He has the same physical abilities that those guys do but he doesn't have the same motivation and desire to win.

Normally I don't really care for people making comments like I just did above because a player's demeanor isn't always indicative of their effort and desire to win. It's the fact that we can see Fox's demeanor change from half assing it, to most assing it, to full on assing it (Houston game) coupled with Brown's obvious comments to the media about how Fox has another mental level that he needs to unlock that makes me think that Fox just doesn't have the drive that you need from your best or second best player.

I am glad all fans are finally on the same page and see past Fox's stats. He's always played with up and down effort.

I think right now is the time to trade him before all of the other teams in the league catch on or he ends up having some type of BenSimmons episode where he seizes all care in the world (remember Fox's horrible January stretch last year that ended with a media boycott?)

Not often in basketball can you point to 1 single play and say that it directly handed a team their lost, but that was the case last night. After the game, he couldn't even muster a crapty "it was my fault" answer. Shows you what type of leadership and mentality he has. We don't need that on our team.

 

[ESP47]

I am glad all fans are finally on the same page and see past Fox's stats. He's always played with up and down effort.

I think right now is the time to trade him before all of the other teams in the league catch on or he ends up having some type of BenSimmons episode where he seizes all care in the world (remember Fox's horrible January stretch last year that ended with a media boycott?)

Not often in basketball can you point to 1 single play and say that it directly handed a team their lost, but that was the case last night. After the game, he couldn't even muster a crapty "it was my fault" answer. Shows you what type of leadership and mentality he has. We don't need that on our team.

I've been a Fox fan since day 1 but he started to lose me with the comments he made about leaving Sac. I can put up with his semi all star level numbers, lackadaisical play at times and inability to lead the team consistently if he wants to be here and knows that part of the problem is on him. But saying you're going to look to go elsewhere if they essentially don't put better players around you when you yourself aren't giving it your all is a tough pill to swallow. Then he goes and plays some of the lowest IQ defense I've ever seen on the final play last night and doesn't even have the maturity to own it after the game. Just not cool. I guarantee you Ant man would have owned it if he made that same mistake. Even if he put up 50 and was the only good player on the floor all night.

Who knows, maybe he owned it in the locker room to his teammates so we don't know but it's really annoying to not see him address the media with maturity.

 

[TaxMan]

It's because of what happened on the final play to end that game, what was said afterwards, and what led up to it with Fox. It's an awful gutless look that makes this organization look the worst it has since firing Malone. You lose respect and it makes it a lot harder to recruit good players and coaches when you handle things like this.....and yes, timing and optics matter when it comes to professionalism

Well, that final play was an absolute crap show. I’m not saying that was Brown‘s fault, but it was yet another collapse by the team. Seems like semantics to me….the last play lost the game, but it was the final nail. I’m mean, yay, if Ivey doesn’t hit the three, or even if fox fouls him but he misses one of the free throws, we win. Brown probably doesn’t get fired today…. but if they continue on the same path he probably gets fired in a week. None of that is surprising to me at all or seems like an embarrassment to the front office.

The reputation of the Sacramento Kings will NEVER CHANGE! It just goes in hibernation. They are fun fodder for all the nba podcast bros, ex-coaches, and other people who don’t otherwise really pay attention to a small market team in the pacific time zone. Mike Brown brought a turnaround to a terrible franchise that became everyone’s beam team darlings. Then when the magic fun wore off and they were a middling playin team that wasn’t quite as fun to watch, they got ignored again…. Did you hear the kings fired Mike Brown?!? Those Kangz are at it again.

 

[Sherds]

Even though Browns rotations were very frustrating and puzzling... I can't help but feel that the whole handling of this just reeks as ametuer.

 

[serbiangoat]

Malone should probably move on at this point

Malone needs to be quiet and figure out how to actually compete when Jokic is not doing HOF carries ibefore worrying about Mike Brown and what other organizations do.

 

[pdxKingsFan]

Fox got Mike Brown fired.

Fox can either use that to go supernova and be the Fox we see on his good nights or he is next.

Monte's clock is ticking too.

 

[fansinceday1]

A lot of these comments from ex coaches and players show just what a bad owner Vivek is. He’s a joke. Grant went on his tirade saying as such and it could be taken as sour grapes if his comments are taken alone. But put them together with everything I’m reading on social media,……..yeah, Vivek is a joke. And the kings are still a joke organization.

So Brown goes through practice. Talks to all his players and the media and then he takes off for the airport to go to LA for the next game and that’s when the FO tells him he’s fired? That’s a BS move man. What the hell is wrong with this organization?

 

[pdxKingsFan]

A lot of these comments from ex coaches and players show just what a bad owner Vivek is. He’s a joke. Grant went on his tirade saying as such and it could be taken as sour grapes if his comments are taken alone. But put them together with everything I’m reading on social media,……..yeah, Vivek is a joke. And the kings are still a joke organization.

He might not be a great owner but since he put Monte in charge what has he done that's bad?

I know folks hated the Anjali thing but a) Stockton is one of the best G-League teams and b) there's a good chance some day she takes over and so experience is needed. No better place than NOT the NBA.

 

[TheMobb]

He might not be a great owner but since he put Monte in charge what has he done that's bad?

I know folks hated the Anjali thing but a) Stockton is one of the best G-League teams and b) there's a good chance some day she takes over and so experience is needed. No better place than NOT the NBA.

I thought he had growth but today erased all of that. He’s a joke. He loves the spotlight. loves social media, loves sitting court side with any celebrity who’s willing to go to a game, and loves the attention. Pathetic from a 60 something year old man

 

[ShastaKingsFan]

He might not be a great owner but since he put Monte in charge what has he done that's bad?

I know folks hated the Anjali thing but a) Stockton is one of the best G-League teams and b) there's a good chance some day she takes over and so experience is needed. No better place than NOT the NBA.

That would really be the cherry on top. Maybe it happens in the next 2 seasons? Wonderful

 

[Merdiesel]

This team will never win so long as Vivek owns the team. Sell the team you dork.

 

[MizzouKing]

"Lack of leadership and accountability..." - A good take by Bruno on the leadup to Mike Brown being fired.

it makes me wonder... did the decision get made BY Monte (trying to deflect attention from his own more sizable responsibility for the current mess) or FOR Monte (who is dutifully taking the blame for a meddling owner in over his head)?

https://www.basketballnetwork.net/l...ses-deeper-issues-within-the-sacramento-kings

 

[kingsboi]

It strains credulity that Brown without being fired by McNair without Vivek's approval, tacit or otherwise. Proof isn't needed, especially with the history of this owner and organization.

Malone says it all really here

 

[upinsmoke]

Not to be a gossip but Anjali was Stockton GM for only a few months and likely had to step down because she had signed who turned out to be her boyfriend Jeremy Lamb mid season and that is totally unprofessional. It wasn’t for the puppies. She failed.

I heard something similar too.

 

[pdxKingsFan]

Not to be a gossip but Anjali was Stockton GM for only a few months and likely had to step down because she had signed who turned out to be her boyfriend Jeremy Lamb mid season and that is totally unprofessional. It wasn’t for the puppies. She failed.

Again to that I say better in Stockton than in Sacramento.

 

[fansinceday1]

Again to that I say better in Stockton than in Sacramento.

it definitely lends credence to all the BS we hear about Ranadive and how he runs the kings.

 

[Capt. Factorial]

"Lack of leadership and accountability..." - A good take by Bruno on the leadup to Mike Brown being fired.

it makes me wonder... did the decision get made BY Monte (trying to deflect attention from his own more sizable responsibility for the current mess) or FOR Monte (who is dutifully taking the blame for a meddling owner in over his head)?

https://www.basketballnetwork.net/l...ses-deeper-issues-within-the-sacramento-kings

From the article's subhead:

"the franchise once again blames the coach for organizational failures"

Sorry, I don't see organizational failures here. I see failures on the court.

Whine all you want about how "we don't have a 6'9" wing who shoots 43% from deep and plays top-5 defense" while ignoring that this is exactly the hardest player phenotype to find. But we have good players. This team, more or less, won 48 games two years ago, and 46 games last year. By all appearances, the roster got BETTER this year. But now we can't close out a game to save our lives. We can't defend a three. We can't hit a three. We're dropping close games at a ridiculous rate. This team - not the imaginary team that McNair failed to build out of rainbows and wishes, but this team - should by all rights be five games over .500, not five games under. That's not on Monte. As many reasons as one may have to dislike him, that's not on Vivek. That's on the players and the coaches, not the organization. Just a comically lazy take from the media, from whom I expect no better, but still.

"Organizational failures" - as if had there been better coffee and donuts in the breakroom then De'Aaron could get off his ass and play defense on the final play of the game. "Organizational failures".

 

[pdxKingsFan]

it definitely lends credence to all the BS we hear about Ranadive and how he runs the kings.

Again I ask since he hired Monte what has he done to show he is a bad owner? He had growing pains and set the franchise back absolutely. The last ~5 years he has been pretty hands off. Giving your adult child a low level management job (yes, it is when your dad owns the franchise) is something every billionaire would do including multiple "good" owners in the NBA so let that slide. If she screwed up, she screwed up.

What has he done lately to merit the bad owner tag? I think he has mostly been a check signer, but he is also passionate, attends games, and seems to care and want to build a winner. Being disappointed with Brown but still having the balls to fire him knowing he just extended him shows maybe he isn't the cheap ass everyone says. I don't think Brown should be first to go but as long as Fox and Monte are not "safe" it was a fair choice. After last night something had to give. One of those people had to go.

 

[Capt. Factorial]

Not to be a gossip but Anjali was Stockton GM for only a few months and likely had to step down because she had signed who turned out to be her boyfriend Jeremy Lamb mid season and that is totally unprofessional. It wasn’t for the puppies. She failed.

I think we've all heard that she and Lamb are/were an item. Are you implying here that they were an item BEFORE she signed him to the team?

 

[ockingsfan]

This team was clearly not going anywhere this year with this coach and roster combination. Clearly either Brown lost the locker room or these players are just plain unfocused and lackadaisical. If we kept the course, the Kings would have missed the playoffs (10-12 seed) and possibly lose their lottery pick in the processes.

I for one would rather make the changes now then to waste the rest of this season languishing in the 10-12 spot, jockeying for a play-in spot and ultimately missing the playoffs again.

Let's blow this clown up now and see if we can salvage this season and make a run with Doug Christie as the coach. If we make a run and get in the playoffs then we have a direction, but if it blows up in our faces, we can keep our lottery pick. Either way we will see what direction this team goes as the season finishes out. If this doesn't light a fire under these players, nothing will.

 

[pdxKingsFan]

From the article's subhead:

"the franchise once again blames the coach for organizational failures"

Sorry, I don't see organizational failures here. I see failures on the court.

Whine all you want about how "we don't have a 6'9" wing who shoots 43% from deep and plays top-5 defense" while ignoring that this is exactly the hardest player phenotype to find. But we have good players. This team, more or less, won 48 games two years ago, and 46 games last year. By all appearances, the roster got BETTER this year. But now we can't close out a game to save our lives. We can't defend a three. We can't hit a three. We're dropping close games at a ridiculous rate. This team - not the imaginary team that McNair failed to build out of rainbows and wishes, but this team - should by all rights be five games over .500, not five games under. That's not on Monte. As many reasons as one may have to dislike him, that's not on Vivek. That's on the players and the coaches, not the organization. Just a comically lazy take from the media, from whom I expect no better, but still.

"Organizational failures" - as if had there been better coffee and donuts in the breakroom then De'Aaron could get off his ass and play defense on the final play of the game. "Organizational failures".

Only nit to pick I have here is someone made the decision to let size go. I don't think it was Vivek but it was Monte or Brown. Guys like Metu, Nemi and as far as guards/wings TD go were flawed but their replacements were smaller and worse.

 

[MizzouKing]

From the article's subhead:

"the franchise once again blames the coach for organizational failures"

Sorry, I don't see organizational failures here. I see failures on the court.

Whine all you want about how "we don't have a 6'9" wing who shoots 43% from deep and plays top-5 defense" while ignoring that this is exactly the hardest player phenotype to find. But we have good players. This team, more or less, won 48 games two years ago, and 46 games last year. By all appearances, the roster got BETTER this year. But now we can't close out a game to save our lives. We can't defend a three. We can't hit a three. We're dropping close games at a ridiculous rate. This team - not the imaginary team that McNair failed to build out of rainbows and wishes, but this team - should by all rights be five games over .500, not five games under. That's not on Monte. As many reasons as one may have to dislike him, that's not on Vivek. That's on the players and the coaches, not the organization. Just a comically lazy take from the media, from whom I expect no better, but still.

"Organizational failures" - as if had there been better coffee and donuts in the breakroom then De'Aaron could get off his ass and play defense on the final play of the game. "Organizational failures".

Yeah, the subhead is a little misleading but the actual article takes a look at how the current state owes itself to more than one source.

 

[pdxKingsFan]

Yeah, the subhead is a little misleading but the actual article takes a look at how the current state owes itself to more than one source.

It seems hyperfixated on not bringing mid-level PF (some with ridiculous contracts, one who wants to be a PG) while neglecting that maybe Brown screwed up with Sasha. I do agree with Cap that the players that can "fix" the Kings are all basically #1 overall pick generational unicorns. Thinking Jerami Grant or Ben Simmons would have been the play this summer I think we might be even worse. Hell I'm not even convinced DDR is the problem if Huerter and Keegan were shooting even 1-2 3AT per game better we win how many more games?

Monte isn't off the hot seat, but there is plenty of blame to pass around.

Going back to Mike Malone though is unnecessary.

 

[TaxMan]

From the article's subhead:

"the franchise once again blames the coach for organizational failures"

Sorry, I don't see organizational failures here. I see failures on the court.

Whine all you want about how "we don't have a 6'9" wing who shoots 43% from deep and plays top-5 defense" while ignoring that this is exactly the hardest player phenotype to find. But we have good players. This team, more or less, won 48 games two years ago, and 46 games last year. By all appearances, the roster got BETTER this year. But now we can't close out a game to save our lives. We can't defend a three. We can't hit a three. We're dropping close games at a ridiculous rate. This team - not the imaginary team that McNair failed to build out of rainbows and wishes, but this team - should by all rights be five games over .500, not five games under. That's not on Monte. As many reasons as one may have to dislike him, that's not on Vivek. That's on the players and the coaches, not the organization. Just a comically lazy take from the media, from whom I expect no better, but still.

"Organizational failures" - as if had there been better coffee and donuts in the breakroom then De'Aaron could get off his ass and play defense on the final play of the game. "Organizational failures".

Totally agree….as I said in a prior post, the Kings (and Vivek) will always be the easy target. It’s so easy to laugh and point at the ’clownshow’ kangz without any evidence. Their reputation is a stench that will never be shaken no matter any evidence to the contrary (or lack of supporting evidence for the takes). The lack of knowledge of the situation is on full display. Now if word comes out in the coming weeks that this was an actual Vivek blunder then I will eat my words and pile on.

I can understand how people would disagree with me, but from my perspective in watching this team (and there aren’t many that are as observant than all of us on kingsfans) this was a totally defensible decision. It is a decision that screams desperation for sure, but something had to be done.