Marcos Breton: Sacramento arena plan calls on all parties to pay up

Mike0476

Starter
http://www.sacbee.com/2011/09/08/3892751/marcos-breton-sacramento-arena.html

"According to people familiar with the document, the Kings, the NBA and a private developer would contribute $91 million to $156 million in lease payments, upfront money, land and other revenue to pay for an arena."


"The city of Sacramento would contribute the sale of public land, a tax on hotels and taxis, and money from items such as digital advertising and parking valued at $94 million to $123 million."


"And, while residents in the six-county Sacramento region will not be asked to raise their taxes to subsidize a new arena, patrons of the venue will help pay for it. The third pot of money will be fueled by ticket surcharges, naming rights and other revenue sources that could generate $90 million to $121 million."
 
Is there ANYTHING in here that can be scuttled by a thumbs down vote by either a council or the public? Meaning the sale of the land, or imposing a hotel tax increase or distributing the proceeds of said tax?

Or can this all be done by insiders in a smoke filled room (lets hope so).

If a public arena vote is required in any way shape or form, there is no reason to be optimistic... Otis and his buddies from the sacbee comments section will be out in force.
 
I don't want to put the cart in front of the horse on this but this looks like a great deal. Very proud of all the hard work on this. Makes me kinda homesick for Sacramento.
 
Is there ANYTHING in here that can be scuttled by a thumbs down vote by either a council or the public? Meaning the sale of the land, or imposing a hotel tax increase or distributing the proceeds of said tax?

Or can this all be done by insiders in a smoke filled room (lets hope so).

If a public arena vote is required in any way shape or form, there is no reason to be optimistic... Otis and his buddies from the sacbee comments section will be out in force.

KJ has repeatedly insisted that there will be no vote. I think he's determined on that front.
 
I'm not quite sure why the high end on the contributions add up to "only" $400M as we should expect some debt service on the arena. I suppose maybe that will be cleared up tonight.
 
The have some funding sources and I don't think there will be any sacred cows or public votes. Since the Maloofs and NBA have been a partner all along in this, I doubt they are "shocked" by the numbers and 1/3 split. Funding the arena is only part of the puzzle. The devil in the details will be stuff like the existing Arco Arena lease back to the city deal and some of those revenue generating sources the Maloofs might like to get their hands on.

In a way, it was a windfall for Anaheim to have negotiated and made public their deal. Now the numbers just have to compare favorably overall. Some areas higher - others lower. But at least they know what the team is looking for in revenue on a ongoing basis.
 
At this point, the only hurdle might be Maloofs/NBA. It looks like this might pencil and it's viable politically. However, the plan requires taking a chunk out of Kings' margins. Fees on tickets and at one point they were talking merchandise and food and drink (we'll see today if that's still in). Also, the city is banking on getting a big chunk of the parking. In this market, its not easy for a team to hike prices up to make that money back.

To put it another way, there is a reason this plan is very different and outside the box, a lot of NBA owners wouldn't go for it. In most cities, the general public and some private money pays for most of the arena, the team sets tickets, merch, and food as high as they can, and the team gets basically all of the profit on those items (and in the NBA, the team might not make a profit based upon all of the money that comes in - but hopefully that's about to change some.)

I'm sure the NBA and Kings are in the loop and have seen some of the numbers. But if you read KJ's story on NBA.com, it become clear they haven't locked down the team's share yet. Thus, the problems could come in when: (1) we get a plan that just pencils out today; and (2) the team says, fees are too high - knock them down by 25%; and (3) the negotations / funding gets tricky.

However, the upside for Sacramento is the Maloofs. 6 years ago, they would have NEVER gone for this deal. Back then, the Maloofs would have put some money up front, and they would view that as buying most of the backend profits back. However, they aren't liquid now. They might live with the fees, because unlike higher rent or any up front money - they don't have to earn it or have the risk of it not being there when it comes time to pay.

I'll use some made up numbers to explain- If I owned the team, I wouldn't like the deal because you take from me twice. I pay you $10 million a year in rent. Plus, you pull $3 million out of my margins by grabbing fees that I can't earn back because I'm already at my price point. Thus, I'm pretty much paying $13 in rent to play here. However, the Maloofs would have no exposure to the $3 million part. The city collects it, and if ticket sales fall short, that's the city's problem and not the teams. Thus, it's a very good time to have the Maloofs as owners.

In the end, I think Stern is in the loop and knows the old arena model is dead out west and that will spread many places east. So they league and Kings will push the numbers a little to make the best deal, but this can get done. And I think it's at least 50/50 it gets done. So I don't think this will be a deal breaker now.

However, I will say that: (1) I highly doubt the Maloofs will own the team in 5 years; and (2) the new owners will think they realize how the deal will play out, and later we are going to have a Pacers type fight were the team wants change the deal because too much of the profits are going to the city. But that's for another day, in the mean time, we get the team, the arena, and all the downtown growth.

So it's a very strange deal, but our shallow pocketed owners might be just the guys to take it.
 
A question came up about the loan payoff. It's further on down the the process. This is one of those landmine issues and will have to be addressed with a good answer.
 
Maloofs respond:

SACRAMENTO, CALIF., September 8, 2011 – The following is a statement from the Kings organization in response to the Think Big Sacramento Nexus Report released today:



"The Kings organization views The Nexus Report as a very positive step toward the goal of a new entertainment and sports complex that will bring substantial economic benefits to the entire region and we hope will enable the team to continue playing in Sacramento. We were pleased with the report’s conclusion that funding for the project can be achieved using various revenue sources, none of which involve any broad-based tax.



We look forward to continuing to work with all interested parties to bring the project to completion."
 
Maybe the Natomas site will be leased to someone else by the city. Don't know. The problem for the Arean ownership is that if the land is actually given over to the city, it will be viewed as a sale and comes with possible capital gains repercussions for them. Of course, maybe with the market so down, it won't have much of an impact. If so the city could sell all the Natomas land to repay the bond loan, maybe? I'd have to look at numbers if they are available.

Yes, it was a huge benefit to Sacramento to see the lease arragment in Anaheim. Samueli's deal with the Maloofs didn't give them much of the arena revenue streams either. I was shocked at what a small share of revenues they were going to get there and yet they accepted it.

The questions will be how competitive the team can be with reduced revenues. That was a problem for the team before the 1997 city loan and part of the understanding, at that time, is the monetary reduction in debt service on the arena would allow the arena owner to contribute more money to the team ownership. (Yes, there was and is two separate ownership entities).

Captain. I think they are counting hard construction costs and the soft costs that would include construction loan interest. The lease payment amount is stated in terms of today's dollars. Maybe they haven't taken into account some kind of indexed annual increase in that amount. I haven't read the Nexus report yet, but I would think it has a 30-year cash flow pro forma. Although any pro forma will change depending on what is actually negotiated.

We pay a ticket surcharge now of $1 to $2 dollars per ticket dependent on the cost of the ticket, so it's not like that's new. The Maloofs can set their ticket prices at what they think the market will bear and what they need, then the surcharge is added on top of that. They don't lose revenue in that scenario, unless they can't make enough money on their tickets. That's a whole other issue. The surcharge money was never their money in the first place.

I can see some stumbling blocks that naysayers could come up with. I won't discuss them here. But everything selected is not a tax on the general citizens. Hotel taxes should almost never affect locals. Food and beverage tax on a downtown district would affect anybody who dines or drinks in the area, which anyone can choose not to do. You don't have to pay ticket surcharges, unless you want to see an event at the new arena. By the way, back at the time surcharges were added to tickets sold for arena events in 1997, the court already had handed down a decision in a lawsuit that those were not "taxes."

Also, it's not true that other teams that are lessee's in city-owned arenas get all the revenue streams. The benefit to the owners as lessee's is they are no longer responsible for all the considerable costs of operating an arena, nor are they responsible for repairs, replacement and long-term capital needs expenses. They pay rent and they can spend all the money they do make on the team, not on the team and arena needs.

Considering that Arco was building up more and more deferred maintenance, it was probably getting way too expensive to maintain. Making any major investments in the building would have been a ridiculous waste of money anyway for two reason. Property values have declined so much, making improvments to real property a waste of money, unless you plan to stay in the place for a very long time. Secondly, it could not ever be remodeled to NBA standards, so it would be pouring good money after bad at this point.

Gotta run. Sorry fo typos. I'm a terrible typist. :(
 
I don't want to put the cart in front of the horse on this but this looks like a great deal. Very proud of all the hard work on this. Makes me kinda homesick for Sacramento.

+1.

Does anyone know if Sacramento Country Day School is looking for a math teacher? Preferably a department head? I'm sure many will feel the same once that downtown is up and bumpin'.
 
At this point, the only hurdle might be Maloofs/NBA. It looks like this might pencil and it's viable politically. However, the plan requires taking a chunk out of Kings' margins. Fees on tickets and at one point they were talking merchandise and food and drink (we'll see today if that's still in). Also, the city is banking on getting a big chunk of the parking. In this market, its not easy for a team to hike prices up to make that money back.

The city would have talked to the league and the Maloofs before releasing how much they may potentially pay. I think this deal is different than others for a number of reasons. But one of the main ones is the NBA is getting a bad reputation for holding cities hostage over arenas. They can't really afford to make a bad public relations move on this one, so in a sense, Sacramento has the upper hand. Whether the Maloofs and league pay 40 million or 50 million is irrelevant. The league will help to make the numbers work for the team. What is relevant is that they appear to pay their fair share without screwing over the city of Sacramento. There are always going to negotiations and fine tuning. That's just business. Not something to fret over.

Not really concerned with the Pacers problems or any other future owners issue when the alternative is to not have a team at all.
 
If I had to use one word to describe the actions of Think Big, I would use "scripted". And I mean that in the best sense of the term. They seem to have firm control over the release of information. There are no surprises. There are no loose cannons shooting off. The funding options are being spoon fed to the public. The big land mine issues are being avoided and side stepped until the momentum of public opinion is has full gain. After years of chaos and blow ups, this is a nice change. The wild card here was going to be the Maloofs and how they respond. And so far, they are in lock step with the script for the most part. This is still very early and those issues like the loan, parking and revenue streams for the Kings will have to be settled. At any one point in time George Maloof could still blow this up. But so far he hasn't and that is a good early sign.

Speaking of parking, I saw in the numbers of 992 onsite arena parking spots. This will have to at least double tha number in order for the premium parking to be enough. It's ok for the average season ticket holder to walk a short distance or take light rail. But premium seating sales is going to be tightly affected by the luxury of parking next to the arena. You and I might scoff at that. But if you are selling a suite or club seating, you have to have that premium parking offered. Although one way to help deal with that is to offer secure offsite parking with limo service to the private club entrances. My idea, so I get credit. :)
 
With so many failed arena attempts in the past, it's very encouraging to see how far we have come. We have come further today than any other new arena attempt in the last decade. Yes, there is still more work to be done but that's why we have the time line given to us by Think Big Sacramento.

For those of you reading that agree with me (and you probably are as this is KF.com) I give you one piece of advice: IGNORE THE NAYSAYERS, CAVE PEOPLE, WHATEVER THEY ARE CALLED. That is what I will be doing.

I will focus on the positive and ignore the negative. Let them give their opinions even if some are factual, not factual or out right lies. The insults is another thing. They have that right but their voices mean nothing. If their voices meant something, then nothing would be accomplished and we would not be where we are today.

Yet they will attack us and say that nothing has been accomplished. If that was the case then why are they getting so angry over this? I'll tell you why.

Because we are one step closer to building a new downtown arena that will host world class events in a world class facility and the Sacramento Kings will continue to be known as the Sacramento Kings and not the Anaheim Royals or anything else.

When the shovel is in the ground and the new arena is built, we can all attend countless world class events and enjoy our quality of life for generations to come. Many jobs will be created and it doesn't matter how much those jobs pay because a job is still a job. We all can't be high salary executives. Those who are negative can either join us or continue to sit behind their monitors voicing their negative opinions on another subject.

I will continue to think big and not think small like some others would like to. I have said it before and I will say it again, we will build a new downtown arena for the Sacramento region.
 
Be aware that nothing is news to the Maloofs or the NBA. Think Big Sacramento is in almost daily contact with the NBA during the process. Don't forget, the NBA has a team of people here in Sacramento helping the Maloofs. Of course the details have to be negotiated, but I think the main points here are pretty well established among all potential partners. That includes local businesses, restaurant owners, hotel owners, the Kings, the NBA, the most likely developer, most likely contractor and most likely arena operator and others.

There have also been plenty of town hall meetings for citizens to express their opinions.

Nobody is likely to find anything that they pretty much didn't hear about already. Bits and pieces of all the ideas have pretty much been leaked out slowly to the public over the last few weeks.

Today it was just presented in a final coherent proposal of what they considered the best funding choices for consideration. And there weren't really any surprises to me. I really must applaud the amount of work that went into the Nexus Report. That little summary is the surface of what must have been intense work for long hours by all the contributing people. One hundred days was an amazingly short time to produce such a well-thought-out plan.

I did notice that resolution of the current loan is still being worked out. That was one complex deal and they have to figure out the best choice for protection of the city, without financially hurting the current arena ownership too badly. I'll guarantee they have lawyers, tax lawyers and bonf counsel all trying to work through those intricate matters.

And I'm with Mike. I just ignore the anonymous naysayer comments. They will always be around and they will always be against changes. They choose to be negative people. If the arena gets built, they will just start up complaining about something else. Most of them will never step away from their computers to stand up for something in any meaningful way. Or even against something, because negative bashing on the internet suits their laziness.

I can hardly wait to be at the city council meeting this coming Tuesday. WOOOHOOO, let's go Sacramento! :)
 
I totally understand the "IGNORE THE NAYSAYERS, CAVE PEOPLE, WHATEVER THEY ARE CALLED" philosophy. However, their increasingly frustrated and abusive talk shows the progress we are making. It's exciting, cuz the facts are against them, and they don't know how to respond. It is just another measure in my eyes that things are going well.
 
Awesome. Get this thing done! The breakdown of the funding sources seem very reasonable to me. This thing is a winner. The naysayers make me laugh with their garbage. :D
 
I totally understand the "IGNORE THE NAYSAYERS, CAVE PEOPLE, WHATEVER THEY ARE CALLED" philosophy. However, their increasingly frustrated and abusive talk shows the progress we are making. It's exciting, cuz the facts are against them, and they don't know how to respond. It is just another measure in my eyes that things are going well.

One of them just loves to insult people because they cannot come up with anything else.

For example, they argued that yesterday's event should have shown a financing plan with who will pay exactly what when in fact it clearly states on the Think Big Sacramento web site that the funding options would be presented. The next phase will be the negotiations on those funding options to turn into a financing plan so that funds can be secured in the next phase.

Propose menu of funding options (May 30, 2011 –September 8, 2011)

Select funding options (September 9, 2011 –December 31, 2011)

Secure funding sources (January 1, 2012 –February 29, 2012)

Their frustrations clearly shows their voices mean nothing.

Our voices have been heard and need to be heard again so I hope to see many people from our forum attend next Tuesday's meeting at city hall to show our support.
 
Be aware that nothing is news to the Maloofs or the NBA. Think Big Sacramento is in almost daily contact with the NBA during the process. Don't forget, the NBA has a team of people here in Sacramento helping the Maloofs. Of course the details have to be negotiated, but I think the main points here are pretty well established among all potential partners. That includes local businesses, restaurant owners, hotel owners, the Kings, the NBA, the most likely developer, most likely contractor and most likely arena operator and others.

There have also been plenty of town hall meetings for citizens to express their opinions.

Nobody is likely to find anything that they pretty much didn't hear about already. Bits and pieces of all the ideas have pretty much been leaked out slowly to the public over the last few weeks.

Today it was just presented in a final coherent proposal of what they considered the best funding choices for consideration. And there weren't really any surprises to me. I really must applaud the amount of work that went into the Nexus Report. That little summary is the surface of what must have been intense work for long hours by all the contributing people. One hundred days was an amazingly short time to produce such a well-thought-out plan.

I did notice that resolution of the current loan is still being worked out. That was one complex deal and they have to figure out the best choice for protection of the city, without financially hurting the current arena ownership too badly. I'll guarantee they have lawyers, tax lawyers and bonf counsel all trying to work through those intricate matters.

And I'm with Mike. I just ignore the anonymous naysayer comments. They will always be around and they will always be against changes. They choose to be negative people. If the arena gets built, they will just start up complaining about something else. Most of them will never step away from their computers to stand up for something in any meaningful way. Or even against something, because negative bashing on the internet suits their laziness.

I can hardly wait to be at the city council meeting this coming Tuesday. WOOOHOOO, let's go Sacramento! :)

The guy who brought it up in the Q&A session after the presentation had a suggestion on how to handle this. But he was so far from the microphone I couldn't pick it up. I think it can be handled if both sides want it to be. Just as long as it doesn't appear to put the taxpayer on the hook, it shouldn't be a show stopper.
 
One of them just loves to insult people because they cannot come up with anything else.

For example, they argued that yesterday's event should have shown a financing plan with who will pay exactly what when in fact it clearly states on the Think Big Sacramento web site that the funding options would be presented. The next phase will be the negotiations on those funding options to turn into a financing plan so that funds can be secured in the next phase.

Propose menu of funding options (May 30, 2011 –September 8, 2011)

Select funding options (September 9, 2011 –December 31, 2011)

Secure funding sources (January 1, 2012 –February 29, 2012)

Their frustrations clearly shows their voices mean nothing.

Our voices have been heard and need to be heard again so I hope to see many people from our forum attend next Tuesday's meeting at city hall to show our support.

I believe the person you're referring to you in your post, Mike, also complained that they used too much paper to put the reports on. When you can't argue the report so you start attacking the paper the report is printed on, you know you're toast. I had to laugh out loud at that.

I realized very quickly that the "naysayers" really didn't have anything to stand on other than acting like a gang and attacking anyone who comes on "their" message board. I just read and laugh now.
 
I believe the person you're referring to you in your post, Mike, also complained that they used too much paper to put the reports on. When you can't argue the report so you start attacking the paper the report is printed on, you know you're toast. I had to laugh out loud at that.

I realized very quickly that the "naysayers" really didn't have anything to stand on other than acting like a gang and attacking anyone who comes on "their" message board. I just read and laugh now.
Well, I gave up, because when I would provide information that proved they were factually wrong about something, they would never acknowlede it. They would just go to different argument, or go post the same lie in the next thread. Very tiresome people, who generally keep spewing the same lies and or the same misinformation. I have a life and just couldn't keep up with their constant negative diatribes.
 
Im trying to contain my excitement. From what ive read this deal sounds doable. And, it is the farthest we have gotten. Cmon baby, this can get done!
 
Propose menu of funding options (May 30, 2011 –September 8, 2011)

Select funding options (September 9, 2011 –December 31, 2011)

Secure funding sources (January 1, 2012 –February 29, 2012)

Their frustrations clearly shows their voices mean nothing.

I have copied-and-pasted this info many times on SacBee (as LF2A), and it seems to shut them up...so they whine about something else. They HATE facts! They have none, and their only response to our side's facts is that we are KJ suckups who believe all the lies KJ puts out. It's fun! woohoo.
 
I have copied-and-pasted this info many times on SacBee (as LF2A), and it seems to shut them up...so they whine about something else. They HATE facts! They have none, and their only response to our side's facts is that we are KJ suckups who believe all the lies KJ puts out. It's fun! woohoo.

I have noticed that and yet their biggest mouth piece doesn't have a clue as to what he is saying about the time line. So I ignore them. Their voices have fallen on deaf ears.

As I stated before if there was a cure for cancer and we needed to vote to tax ourselves to fund it, the vote would be an easy no because that's how Sacramento is.

Those same people keep asking to hire more law enforcement, fire fighters, staff for schools, etc. yet they have no solutions. It takes revenue to make that happen so that means revenue generated by what the downtown arena will bring or raise taxes. I don't see raising taxes as an option.

They are against the new arena because of their dislike of the Maloofs, high paid athletes and sports in general.

This is and always has been about Sacramento.

I'll end my comments with a quote from Rob Turner, the co-editor-in-chief of Sactown magazine and hope to see you and others from KF.com for this Tuesday night.

An arena project is too important to let voters decide

Sacramento Bee, The (CA) - Wednesday, April 13, 2011
Author: Rob Turner ; Special to The Bee

"After all, we don't ask our citizens to vote on most other major civic projects. This year, for example, the state will close escrow on land downtown for a new county courthouse at a cost of $439 million -- by some estimates the same cost as a new arena. Does anyone remember voting on that? We're also building a billion-dollar expansion of the airport that will include a much-needed new terminal to open later this year.

This list goes on. In 1987, the council voted to spend $751 million (in 2011 dollars) for a "Capital Improvement Plan" that included an expanded library, city parking garages, a new civic center, a marina, land for future redevelopment and other community assets they deemed in the best interests of our city. In 1992, the council voted to spend $80 million ($126 million in today's dollars) to expand our convention center."

That doesn't even include all the times the city has bailed out various arts organizations over the years. Or the times it has invested in downtown by backing luxury hotels like the Hyatt and Sheraton, to which the city contributed, adjusted for inflation, $39 million and $116 million, respectively."
 
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I believe the person you're referring to you in your post, Mike, also complained that they used too much paper to put the reports on. When you can't argue the report so you start attacking the paper the report is printed on, you know you're toast. I had to laugh out loud at that.

I realized very quickly that the "naysayers" really didn't have anything to stand on other than acting like a gang and attacking anyone who comes on "their" message board. I just read and laugh now.

Yeah that would be the same person. Looking for anything to complain about. It's funny how much time they spend on the Bee's forum. All that effort and yet the plan still marches on in the right direction.

Hope to see you and others from KF.com on Tuesday night.
 
sounds great. Hope its all true and goes through without a hitch. Would be an absolute dream to have this pick up pace and get enacted
 
Yeah that would be the same person. Looking for anything to complain about. It's funny how much time they spend on the Bee's forum. All that effort and yet the plan still marches on in the right direction.

It amazes me that they think that, in the big picture, they are truly getting something accomplished by their posts. That city officials take their posts seriously. I wish I was making this up.
 
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