The kings played well but when the game got tight the better team prevailed tonight. IT got killed in the pick and roll or pop or whatever down the stretch not sure if the philosophy of the defense is for It to get caught on every screen but he does. Watch the spurs play the high pick and roll they forced IT towards half court instead of basket down the stretch. Guys had some great individual games but when defenses had to step up the spurs obviously play better team defense. How much longer are people going to use the young excuse for the entire team they aren't rookies anymore guys have been in the league for a bit. We need a play making point guard on defense and offense and a consistent and more consistent 2 guard
[Game] Kings @ Spurs 12/29/13, 4PM PST
- Thread starter Tetsujin
- Start date
Lol he's not a shooter? 50% from the field in college. Sure the NBA and college are really different but shooting translates from the latter to the former. He hasn't found his shot (well, he did, and recently stopped getting shots) and it happens to all shooters. Hell, there were sharpshooters who had rookie years around Ben's level right now.
Names? And how many of them were forced into starting when they were clearly not ready to do so?
If you're truly a fan of his, you need to hope and pray the Kings find someone/anyone else to start at the 2 because if Ben continues much longer, any self-confidence he may have had will be gone. This isn't the YMCA. This is the NBA. He is not even in the same universe as other starting 2 guards.
If you're truly a fan of his, you need to hope and pray the Kings find someone/anyone else to start at the 2 because if Ben continues much longer, any self-confidence he may have had will be gone. This isn't the YMCA. This is the NBA. He is not even in the same universe as other starting 2 guards.
All off the mclemore band wagon!
He shouldn't be out there at the end of games. The dirty little secret is MT was just as bad. Whatever Ben becomes or does not become, he shouldn't be deciding games out there. Why he's even in that position I have no idea.
We had a shooting guard last year. What was his name again?
He shouldn't be out there at the end of games. The dirty little secret is MT was just as bad. Whatever Ben becomes or does not become, he shouldn't be deciding games out there. Why he's even in that position I have no idea.
We had a shooting guard last year. What was his name again?
The hate is on the overall body of work. If you knew this would be the state of his game as of now would you have drafted him at 7? Personally I don't mind tonight's end result as we are not in a must-win season but I want to have confidence in his future other than comparing him to anomalies that also were atrocious as rookies
Holy s***. This thread makes my head hurt reading through it. It's as if the majority of people here can't think for themselves. Ben this, Ben that, all ****ing thread while for some unknown reason, letting numerous other mistakes by others simply pass or get little attention.
Ben was pretty poor tonight, but FFS he did not cause us to lose this game, nor has he shown he's a bust. Very valid argument that he shouldn't be starting right now and isn't ready, and yes he's developing slower than we all hopes but dude is only 20.
You know who forced up some crap at the end of the game? Cuz. He lost his composure a bit. Yet he was a beast all night and it's more gaining experience at this point. He was going up against a HOFer who knows every trick in the book and wrote a few chapters himself.
Know who else threw up crap at the end? IT. Tunnel vision galore. Yeah it's great he went off in the 3rd but I was sitting there saying to myself, great, prepare for others to be frozen out when it counts. And.....it happened, yet again. Just a **** job running the offense and his defense was hot and cold as well. I guess in everyone's bashing of Ben, which I guess is the cool thing to do so everyone jumps in, not one person pointed out the mistakes IT was making on defense. Most glaring one playing off Parker later in the 4th while Parker was up top, just standing there ball watching, back completely turned to Parker and Tony ran from the top to the corner. IT didn't turn his head for 4 secs! Didn't turn his head until the skip pass was in the air and Tony caught and released before IT was in 8-10 ft of him. Somehow though, everyone missed it.
How about Gay getting frozen out down the stretch while our PG ran offense for himself or anyone not named Rudy?
We have a team-wide issue of giving up penetration, sagging off shooters and not recovering in time. IT was guilty of it. Ben was guilty of it. DWill was guilty of it. Rudy was guilty of it. MT was guilty of it. Sometimes the 3's fall, sometimes they don't. Manu drilled a few in crunch time which is why he's a borderline HOFer, but stop acting like Ben was the only one getting caught in those actions during the game. Others did, the Spurs just hasn't turned it up and weren't shooting all that well.
Not an excuse for Ben, he was poor. I'm not against considering other options and bringing him off the bench. But a number in this thread flew off the handle, zeroing in on our 20 yr old as a scapegoat, going up against SA and Manu for the first time while ignoring numerous other mistakes. I'm embarrassed for a few of you. BTW, saying "so and so sucks", is not analysis.
Ben was pretty poor tonight, but FFS he did not cause us to lose this game, nor has he shown he's a bust. Very valid argument that he shouldn't be starting right now and isn't ready, and yes he's developing slower than we all hopes but dude is only 20.
You know who forced up some crap at the end of the game? Cuz. He lost his composure a bit. Yet he was a beast all night and it's more gaining experience at this point. He was going up against a HOFer who knows every trick in the book and wrote a few chapters himself.
Know who else threw up crap at the end? IT. Tunnel vision galore. Yeah it's great he went off in the 3rd but I was sitting there saying to myself, great, prepare for others to be frozen out when it counts. And.....it happened, yet again. Just a **** job running the offense and his defense was hot and cold as well. I guess in everyone's bashing of Ben, which I guess is the cool thing to do so everyone jumps in, not one person pointed out the mistakes IT was making on defense. Most glaring one playing off Parker later in the 4th while Parker was up top, just standing there ball watching, back completely turned to Parker and Tony ran from the top to the corner. IT didn't turn his head for 4 secs! Didn't turn his head until the skip pass was in the air and Tony caught and released before IT was in 8-10 ft of him. Somehow though, everyone missed it.
How about Gay getting frozen out down the stretch while our PG ran offense for himself or anyone not named Rudy?
We have a team-wide issue of giving up penetration, sagging off shooters and not recovering in time. IT was guilty of it. Ben was guilty of it. DWill was guilty of it. Rudy was guilty of it. MT was guilty of it. Sometimes the 3's fall, sometimes they don't. Manu drilled a few in crunch time which is why he's a borderline HOFer, but stop acting like Ben was the only one getting caught in those actions during the game. Others did, the Spurs just hasn't turned it up and weren't shooting all that well.
Not an excuse for Ben, he was poor. I'm not against considering other options and bringing him off the bench. But a number in this thread flew off the handle, zeroing in on our 20 yr old as a scapegoat, going up against SA and Manu for the first time while ignoring numerous other mistakes. I'm embarrassed for a few of you. BTW, saying "so and so sucks", is not analysis.
The recent example was just last year, in Washington's Bradley Beal. Through December, Beal was shooting .353 from the field on 11.9 attempts and .269 from three on 4.2 attempts. (Compare to Ben's .378 on 8.3 attempts and .355 on 3.8 attempts...I think that's before tonight's game.) Beal finished the season much stronger, finishing the year at a total of .410/.386 on very similar attempts. So far this year, while his 2PT% is terrible (.385), his 3PT% is sky-high (.471). Beal did start almost every game on the year, despite his troubles through the first two months.
What happens is things go along perfectly fine until someone makes a comment about how Ben should have had the ball more or Ben should have done this or that... Or, in the reverse, someone will comment on a poor play or decision Ben makes... At that point, reason and rational thought go out the window. The Ben-lievers rally around their guy, refusing to acknowledge that he can or does make mistakes. The group of people who like Ben BUT NOT AS A STARTER immediately go into a retaliatory rage, using every mistake the kid makes to prove he shouldn't be out there.
Ben is not perfect. He's a rookie. He's gonna make rookie mistakes. I desperately wish he could be allowed to make those mistakes coming off the bench, where the microscope wouldn't be quite so harsh. I also desperately wish his most ardent supporters would see that he's making mistakes and not act as though they're always someone else's fault.
Tempers flare and stupid things get said.
I'm right there with you, however, in that I do not think "so and so sucks" adds anything of value to any discussion. If I could, I would probably delete all of those.
If the Ben-lievers would just take it down a notch, I'm fairly certain the BNAAS group would do likewise. Of course, I could be horribly wrong.
Ben is not perfect. He's a rookie. He's gonna make rookie mistakes. I desperately wish he could be allowed to make those mistakes coming off the bench, where the microscope wouldn't be quite so harsh. I also desperately wish his most ardent supporters would see that he's making mistakes and not act as though they're always someone else's fault.
Tempers flare and stupid things get said.
I'm right there with you, however, in that I do not think "so and so sucks" adds anything of value to any discussion. If I could, I would probably delete all of those.
If the Ben-lievers would just take it down a notch, I'm fairly certain the BNAAS group would do likewise. Of course, I could be horribly wrong.
Klay Thompson was also terrible his first 2-3 months. Then started getting it together.
Will Ben? Who knows. I'd have no problem moving him in a package for a PG, a new SG or a defensive 4. Or, I have no problem being patient with him. Part of the issue is the moves our FO made this summer appeared geared towards a rebuild. Now, we look like we're in win now mode after the Rudy trade. While Ben might have fit a rebuild which requires patience, he hurts us in a win now mode where patience doesn't factor in nearly as much.
Will Ben? Who knows. I'd have no problem moving him in a package for a PG, a new SG or a defensive 4. Or, I have no problem being patient with him. Part of the issue is the moves our FO made this summer appeared geared towards a rebuild. Now, we look like we're in win now mode after the Rudy trade. While Ben might have fit a rebuild which requires patience, he hurts us in a win now mode where patience doesn't factor in nearly as much.
It's nearly every game. Not just this game or that game. He gets lit up from behind the 3 point line all the time. It's almost as if it hasn't sunk it yet, that for example, (4) 3 pointers = (6) 2 point makes.
There's no help between him and the proven shooter behind the arc. There is help behind him, if he gets beat off the dribble. Get in their faces and stop allowing clean 3 point looks. Simple. Malone has told him over and over
There's no help between him and the proven shooter behind the arc. There is help behind him, if he gets beat off the dribble. Get in their faces and stop allowing clean 3 point looks. Simple. Malone has told him over and over
My point is that there's no one else. Thornton has been terrible, and definitely has no future here. We had that other guy, but our owners and FO thought they had the next Ray Allen and jumped the gun. Now here we are. Gaping hole in the lineup.
He wasn't the reason we lost though as many have pointed out. Our PG played it about as poorly as possible down the stretch in crunch time. So did everyone else. But I guess this board needs a daily scapegoat. Last week it was bench Rudy. Who will it be next game?
He wasn't the reason we lost though as many have pointed out. Our PG played it about as poorly as possible down the stretch in crunch time. So did everyone else. But I guess this board needs a daily scapegoat. Last week it was bench Rudy. Who will it be next game?
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Captain already gave most recent example. Still I decided to take a look at basketball-reference.com, put arbitrary filter of 2 made threes per game with at least 50 games played and out of 20 owners of the best season-long outside shooting percentages more than half of them didn't get better than .355 as a rookie. Guys with 4-year resumes of excellent shooting in college like Jason Terry (as a freshman shot .577 from 3 in Arizona though in reduced role) and Steve Novak struggled a bit at first.