Kings sign Cory Joseph

Entity

Hall of Famer
#31
We did overpay for everybody. But that's necessary to get free agents to come here. Barnes/Dedmon are fairly close to market value, while Joseph/Ariza are clear overpays. That said, we at least kept some flexibility by giving partially guaranteed deals.

People here are already overrating our signings, the same as every year. Don't get me wrong, I am fairly happy with our signings, they make sense. But Ariza has been poor for a while now, Joseph is a very shaky shooter at best, and people are expecting Dedmon to improve exponentially just because he's improved the last two years, but the guy is 29. What you see now is what your get, and he's had his share of injury troubles. I know he picked up basketball late but he's not likely going to shoot better than 38% from three next year.

People are giving Ariza a pass for being demotivated simply because he played for Washington/Phoenix, as if we are a top franchise. The same people wouldn't dream of giving Willie a pass for his inconsistent play despite us being just as dysfunctional, if not moreso, than both of those franchises for most of his tenure here.

Cautiously optimistic. Let's see how things shake out.
the difference this year and years past as far as over value goes. in the past it was for starters. Hill, Zbo, Belineli, Salmons, Rondo...etc. With Rondo and Brad Miller being the best in the last 18 years. Then you drop all the way to Landry. but again all those were starters. we are talking backups here
 
#32
I was hoping for a big star but i am pleased where we are at right now.

No waiting till all but the crumbs are left like years past. I really hope the new players gel as some are right it seems we may have a two deep roster since it seems forever.
 
#33
We did overpay for everybody. But that's necessary to get free agents to come here. Barnes/Dedmon are fairly close to market value, while Joseph/Ariza are clear overpays. That said, we at least kept some flexibility by giving partially guaranteed deals.

People here are already overrating our signings, the same as every year. Don't get me wrong, I am fairly happy with our signings, they make sense. But Ariza has been poor for a while now, Joseph is a very shaky shooter at best, and people are expecting Dedmon to improve exponentially just because he's improved the last two years, but the guy is 29. What you see now is what your get, and he's had his share of injury troubles. I know he picked up basketball late but he's not likely going to shoot better than 38% from three next year.

People are giving Ariza a pass for being demotivated simply because he played for Washington/Phoenix, as if we are a top franchise. The same people wouldn't dream of giving Willie a pass for his inconsistent play despite us being just as dysfunctional, if not moreso, than both of those franchises for most of his tenure here.

Cautiously optimistic. Let's see how things shake out.
Honestly I would have been happier with Corey Brewer coming back on a bargain deal than Ariza but we'll see. I like Joseph as a gritty, defensive backup PG and Dedmon should provide better floor spacing and interior defense than WCS (with Bagley picking up any slack on the glass) and I'm okay with the Barnes deal.

Nothing earth shattering but solid moves that don't hamstring the team financially. But in total the clear message is that any real improvement has to come from the young guys, primarily Fox and Bagley but also hopefully Hield, Giles and maybe Bogdanovic as well as improved team chemistry/maturation. Whether Walton is an improvement over Joeger will also be a question that we'll likely get an answer to fairly early on in the season.
 

Entity

Hall of Famer
#34
Honestly I would have been happier with Corey Brewer coming back on a bargain deal than Ariza but we'll see. I like Joseph as a gritty, defensive backup PG and Dedmon should provide better floor spacing and interior defense than WCS (with Bagley picking up any slack on the glass) and I'm okay with the Barnes deal.

Nothing earth shattering but solid moves that don't hamstring the team financially. But in total the clear message is that any real improvement has to come from the young guys, primarily Fox and Bagley but also hopefully Hield, Giles and maybe Bogdanovic as well as improved team chemistry/maturation. Whether Walton is an improvement over Joeger will also be a question that we'll likely get an answer to fairly early on in the season.
yeah going into this season i saw our biggest asset as being just experience from those guys. I never had in mind of an upgrade over them or signing a star.
 
#35
We did overpay for everybody. But that's necessary to get free agents to come here. Barnes/Dedmon are fairly close to market value, while Joseph/Ariza are clear overpays. That said, we at least kept some flexibility by giving partially guaranteed deals.

People here are already overrating our signings, the same as every year. Don't get me wrong, I am fairly happy with our signings, they make sense. But Ariza has been poor for a while now, Joseph is a very shaky shooter at best, and people are expecting Dedmon to improve exponentially just because he's improved the last two years, but the guy is 29. What you see now is what your get, and he's had his share of injury troubles. I know he picked up basketball late but he's not likely going to shoot better than 38% from three next year.

People are giving Ariza a pass for being demotivated simply because he played for Washington/Phoenix, as if we are a top franchise. The same people wouldn't dream of giving Willie a pass for his inconsistent play despite us being just as dysfunctional, if not moreso, than both of those franchises for most of his tenure here.

Cautiously optimistic. Let's see how things shake out.
I’m happy with Dedmon and if he can stay at 38% from 3 and ideally improve his shooting above the break I will be happy. Most of his 3’s came in the corners.

Ariza is okay as a character guy but I would have preferred Morris from Boston. He can swing 3-4 and give minutes defending Lebron.
 
#36
LAC signed Beverley to 3 years 40 mil, just one mil more annually than Joseph. I'd have offered Beverley 46 over 3 years, but who knows, he might have had his heart set on staying in LA. And waiting to make an offer might have been a risk, I guess.
Yeah, I dont think Bev was really on the market, he wanted to go back to LAC. Had he waited out the Kawhi decision, he probably could have gotten 18-20 mil from the Lakers or from just about anyone left on the market. Gave them a discount and decided early to maybe hopefully sway Kawhi to sign there.
 
#37
Role players signed and in place. It’s up to Fox, Bagley and maybe even Giles to take the steps forward in becoming stars. Hield took his game to another level last year. Is it a playoff team? I hope so......up to Walton to continue the progress that Joerger and staff made
 
#39
I’m happy with Dedmon and if he can stay at 38% from 3 and ideally improve his shooting above the break I will be happy. Most of his 3’s came in the corners.

Ariza is okay as a character guy but I would have preferred Morris from Boston. He can swing 3-4 and give minutes defending Lebron.
Why can’t Ariza swing to PF? He almost has a 9’0” standing reach. I wouldn’t touch either of the Morris brothers with their reputation.
 
#41
The rotation looks to be set. I hope they keep Yogi, since is nice to have good depth at PG. I'm not comfortable with Guy or Mason being an injury away from the rotation. Maybe even keep a 4th PG instead of a 3rd SG, and let Mason and Guy battle it out. Fox and Joseph have enough size to play some smallball 2 if things hit the fan.

Mason seemed to be glued to the bench, but still played over 400 minutes last year, which can make a difference in a playoff race.
 
#42
Maybe I’m the only one here, but I’m not so sure Joseph is much of an upgrade over Ferrell. He’s definitely not worth $9.3 mil/year more than Ferrell. That’s for sure.
 
#44
The rotation looks to be set. I hope they keep Yogi, since is nice to have good depth at PG. I'm not comfortable with Guy or Mason being an injury away from the rotation. Maybe even keep a 4th PG instead of a 3rd SG, and let Mason and Guy battle it out. Fox and Joseph have enough size to play some smallball 2 if things hit the fan.

Mason seemed to be glued to the bench, but still played over 400 minutes last year, which can make a difference in a playoff race.
What is the status on Mason and Yogi? Were they waived?
 
#46
So the roster is?

Dedmon, Giles, Swanigan
Bagley, Bjelicia
Barnes, Ariza, Gabriel?
Hield, Bogdanovic, James
Fox, Joseph, Mason/Ferrell
 
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#48
We did overpay for everybody. But that's necessary to get free agents to come here. Barnes/Dedmon are fairly close to market value, while Joseph/Ariza are clear overpays. That said, we at least kept some flexibility by giving partially guaranteed deals.

People here are already overrating our signings, the same as every year. Don't get me wrong, I am fairly happy with our signings, they make sense. But Ariza has been poor for a while now, Joseph is a very shaky shooter at best, and people are expecting Dedmon to improve exponentially just because he's improved the last two years, but the guy is 29. What you see now is what your get, and he's had his share of injury troubles. I know he picked up basketball late but he's not likely going to shoot better than 38% from three next year.

People are giving Ariza a pass for being demotivated simply because he played for Washington/Phoenix, as if we are a top franchise. The same people wouldn't dream of giving Willie a pass for his inconsistent play despite us being just as dysfunctional, if not moreso, than both of those franchises for most of his tenure here.

Cautiously optimistic. Let's see how things shake out.
Overpaid everyone for sure, but all these guys being back-ups (or in a platoon in Dedmon's case), does matter. We aren't relying on these guys for anything other than to give depth and support the already established core. Big difference from the ZBo/Hill year where those guys were expected to be foundation pieces.

The real key here is we didn't commit long-term to any of these guys. Ariza can be gone after next year and Dedmon/Joseph can be gone once Fox and Giles get their new payday. I think that played into the money a bit too; we gave these guys big deals, but we also got the flexibility to get out a year early in return. Didn't see many other teams (if any) give those partial guarantees the way we did. The Barnes gave the declining contract too is a nice boost as well; it's pretty rare to see guys agree to it.
 
#49
Maybe I’m the only one here, but I’m not so sure Joseph is much of an upgrade over Ferrell. He’s definitely not worth $9.3 mil/year more than Ferrell. That’s for sure.
I was hoping for just $9 Mil a year. I like the player just not the price. I guess the non guaranteed 3rd year helps. If we make the playoffs, I'd say all these overpays might be worth it
 
#50
According to some we overpaid for everybody. Apparently they are completely in touch with market value of NBA players
I know, right? At this point, if we overpay someone, stating that we overpaid is like saying the sky is blue. So f-ing what. It is what it is. Now if we overpay to an extreme, or overpay the wrong person, then let’s talk about it. Otherwise, yeah, you’re right, the sky is blue.
 
#53
Maybe I’m the only one here, but I’m not so sure Joseph is much of an upgrade over Ferrell. He’s definitely not worth $9.3 mil/year more than Ferrell. That’s for sure.
He's absolutely an upgrade over Yogi

Joseph:

1.53 DRPM (4th among PGs)
0.8 VORP
-0.5 BPM (but 1.4 DBPM, his offense was really bad last season)
20.7% AST rate
7.5% TRB
47.4% TS (ick)
12.8% TOV
13.7% USG rate

Yogi:
-1.45 DRPM (88th among PGs)
-0.1 VORP
-2.3 BPM
17.0% AST rate
5.3% TRB
55% TS
9.5% TOV
16.3% USG

So you're taking a hit with floor spacing, but you're getting a massive defensive upgrade, a better playmaker, a better rebounder and doesn't need the same amount of possessions as Yogi did. Think the fit is great with Bogi off the bench, giving him a good secondary playmaker that can swing over and actually guard SG's. Think its reasonable to expect a bounce-back in his efficiency; he's basically been over 51% TS his entire career. He gets back to that along with the defense, that'll give him a strong impact boost.

Back-up guard was probably the weakest hole on the team. Not only were Yogi and Mason just straight bad, they forced Bogdan to play a role he wasn't suited for and made one of our best players from the previous year less effective.
 

Kingster

Hall of Famer
#54
We did overpay for everybody. But that's necessary to get free agents to come here. Barnes/Dedmon are fairly close to market value, while Joseph/Ariza are clear overpays. That said, we at least kept some flexibility by giving partially guaranteed deals.

People here are already overrating our signings, the same as every year. Don't get me wrong, I am fairly happy with our signings, they make sense. But Ariza has been poor for a while now, Joseph is a very shaky shooter at best, and people are expecting Dedmon to improve exponentially just because he's improved the last two years, but the guy is 29. What you see now is what your get, and he's had his share of injury troubles. I know he picked up basketball late but he's not likely going to shoot better than 38% from three next year.

People are giving Ariza a pass for being demotivated simply because he played for Washington/Phoenix, as if we are a top franchise. The same people wouldn't dream of giving Willie a pass for his inconsistent play despite us being just as dysfunctional, if not moreso, than both of those franchises for most of his tenure here.

Cautiously optimistic. Let's see how things shake out.
That's just crap. Putting the Kings of last year into the same basket as Phoenix and Washington isn't only ridiculous, it's insulting!
 
#55
and just like that, the Kings off season is complete. Vlade added lots of depth with his signings and they are expecting Fox, Buddy & Bagley to take the next step and get the Kings over the hump and into the Postseason.
I think we are almost set.
Not sure we need four point guards:
Fox, CoJo, Yogi, Mason (Guy?)

We need to waive Frank and get another bruiser with exemption or vet min.
 

kingsboi

Hall of Famer
#56
I think we are almost set.
Not sure we need four point guards:
Fox, CoJo, Yogi, Mason (Guy?)

We need to waive Frank and get another bruiser with exemption or vet min.
maybe Vlade does a sign and trade for Willie and one of Mason/Yogi to get that back up big
 

Kingster

Hall of Famer
#57
The Kings needed quality depth to be able to have a fast break offense that can sustain itself through the year. They got it. And they got better outside shooting, which will open up the floor for their two future All Stars in Fox and Bagley. In addition, the Kings got better defensively with Ariza and Joseph and Dedmond and Barnes (if you count him as an addition).

To get to the playoffs next year, Fox needs to play like a legit All Star and Bagley needs to play like a near All-Star. Ambitious goals, but I think it's realistically doable.