SacTownKid
Hall of Famer
For reference, Bjelica in the small unit has raised his -19 to a -7 in literally less than a quarter of ball.
Kings scrimmages televised 7/22 & 7/25
- Thread starter PurpleHaze
- Start date
SacTownKid
Hall of Famer
Now they're going at Giles in pick and roll.
Tetsujin
The Game Thread Dude
Bjeli works best in the Draymond death lineup role even they have pretty much nothing in common as players.
SacTownKid
Hall of Famer
Giles gets some offense in the small unit though. That's a good thing. That will eventually transition into all aspects.
SacTownKid
Hall of Famer
They could draw up a nice little big to small lob pass backdoor play that will be good for a few points as needed.
With Harry, even if the jumper doesn't develop, putting him with a bunch of great cutters is going to give him offensive gravity regardless. Draymond has talked about it a lot that he loves when bigs sag off him because it just gives him clear looks at passing lanes.
Tetsujin
The Game Thread Dude
Feels like we can say that about everyone on the entire roster.
SacTownKid
Hall of Famer
See, when Harry has some chances offensively that confidence shoots way up. Now help your franchise guard out a little there coach. I really, really hope the conclusion Walton draws from this isn't Joseph > Fox. Giles > Holmes. But that's what some coaches do. In reality it's all combinations and luckily for him his most talented combination could potentially be his best one as well.
SacTownKid
Hall of Famer
Yep. I like how Doc practically ran on the floor to throw in the towel. He should have done it sooner though. He let Kawhi take some punching on that run. This could damage his starters confidence heading into the next 8. haha.
SacTownKid
Hall of Famer
We've been saying this same thing all season. I'll believe when I see it.
Peja
Bench
“F it, we deserved this win”
SacTownKid
Hall of Famer
The NBA is all about advanced metrics these days right? Rarely do you find as clear cut a situation as what's going on here when it comes to playing one way vs. another. It's even in the numbers here! I mean, if this doesn't seal the deal honestly, they're legit trolling us. Vivek will end up ripping off a mask to reveal:
Kings fans say that Fox plays better with a secondary ballhandler so can't play with Buddy. Buddy literally is the primary ballhandler on the second unit (for better or worse..)
SacTownKid
Hall of Famer
And it's not true. This is why in theory that bench role should be Bogdans spot if it's an either/or thing. Bogdan has seen his point duties disappear next to Fox, and that's unfortunate for him and the team. Buddy to his credit has done better and better in pick and roll creating plays but you really want him shooting almost always off that screen.
Over the entire season with a minimum 5 game and 24 minute qualifier the best net rating combo on the year is Ariza, Barnes, Holmes, Buddy, and Fox with a +22.0. The next one down that features Fox is Holmes, Barnes, Bogdan, Buddy, and Fox with a +15. Out of the 5 positive net rating units on this list with Fox in them 4 have Buddy next to Fox.
https://stats.nba.com/lineups/advanced/?Season=2019-20&SeasonType=Regular Season&TeamID=1610612758&CF=MIN*GE*24:GP*GE*5&sort=NET_RATING&dir=1
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So you mean to tell me the sharp-shooter who's excellent in transition and one of the best C&S players in the NBA is really good with our franchise PG who's excellent in transition and is one of the best in the NBA at collapsing defenses and getting to the rim? Noooooooooooo
burekijogurt
Starter
Does that mean, though, that our record in the last 20 games (13-7) since Fox/Buddy duo was broken up would have been even better if the pairing remained?
Volblorx8634
Bench
Hard to compare those stats to those last 20 games because Holmes was out though, right?
Has there been an indication of starting lineup? Possibility of Buddy back in? Idk which I would prefer
burekijogurt
Starter
Yeah its hard to translate those 5 man lineups to full game / team dynamics conclusions. For example, if you drop the minute requirement from the above link from 24 by 1 minute to 23, 2 new lineups show up in the 5 most effective lineups by net ratng. For what it is worth, Fox and Buddy ARE in those 2 new lineups.
SacTownKid
Hall of Famer
The record could mean a lot of things but in the end it's still the end result of what those stats tell you. It also largely is what you make of it. For instance, was that last 20 record tremendous success or was what we saw earlier in the year just complete and utter abject failure? Like most middle season muck heading into a slightly easier schedule do to other teams injuries and such you have to somewhat be cautious of what those results were and how you got there. Like a young team blazing into the offseason only to find out once the next year got started what you saw might not have been all that it seemed to be. The stats simply tell us that your team is typically finding most of its success in these combinations and it's probably wise to discover if it's real or not before it's too late. The stats say this team is more competitive in the minutes it plays smaller. The eyes test in these first 3 preseason games tells the same story. Again, it might be wise to look more into that considering the stats also tell you playing any other way unless in specific variations results in losing the point battle on average. Some matchups might be different but overall that's what it says.
Also getting back to Buddy real quick. It's funny because in reality with the way Walton is playing his team the only thing that might be saving his job is... Buddy Hield. How many games this season has he had to rely on Buddy going on a complete tear offensively to bring his team back into things? We saw it in the Clipps preseason game on full display. Is this all going completely over his head here?
SacTownKid
Hall of Famer
That's the thing, even in small doses most of the numbers come back the same but that's why you have to put some type of baseline on things. Otherwise you could be just distorting numbers for your reasoning. I could give two craps if this team does better playing the freaking towel boy. If it works it works.
Yes, 5 man units with Walton can be a tricky thing because he's has flown by the seat of his pants far too often this season, injuries or not. Here's the difference though and why his 5 man units actually probably do tell some truth. He's fairly consistent in his pants flying. He'll usually stick with a rotation for multiple games before fiddling. That gives more indication that the stats are reliable. It's when you do things like what Joerger did that mess things up. He would play people 2 minutes here, 2 minutes there. 1 player's in the rotation 1 game out the next, in the next 2, out the next 2 and so on. Looking back I wonder sometimes if Joerger wasn't actually doing that on purpose to cover some of those results. If so very slick of him. Bravo.
I mean, putting your best players that compliment each others skill-sets will make the team play better, yes. Apparently that's a hot take though.
The team won more games because Fox started getting in a rhythm and recovering from his injuries, we got excellent production out of Bazemore and Len, Giles was productive on offense at least, Harrison Barnes started shooting the cover off the ball once he moved to the 4. And for the most part, we stayed healthy with a consistent 9 man rotation of:
Fox || CoJo
Bogdan || Buddy
Barnes || Bazemore
Bjelica || Barnes
Giles || Len (Holmes when he came back)
And yeah, Buddy started playing reaaalllly well once he got moved to the bench. Because he's our 2nd best player and that generally happens with really good players. They play well. One mistake I felt Walton made was he ended up platooning Bogdan and Buddy far too often rather than getting them time together on the court. Just not a good long-term strategy to keep your best players from actually playing with each other.
Again, think about the strengths of both players. Bogi as a secondary ball-handler and playmaker makes way more sense as the lead guy off the bench because he's a good passer/ball-handler that can run the offense. That's not Buddy's strength whatsoever and its a role he's forced into because CoJo doesn't do anything with shot creation or playmaking.
Problem is half the people here don't agree that Buddy is one of our best players and would be ready to trade him for random guys averaging 8 points.
Volblorx8634
Bench
Buddy to the Kings is what Westbrook used to be on the Thunder: he's the type of player who can keep you in games and oftentimes be the reason you win a game, but he can be (sometimes just as often) the person who takes you out of the game. With both of them it comes down to poor decision making and shot selection at times, and almost constant defensive mistakes.
I think Buddy would thrive if playing with other ball handlers and good team defenders. Hence why he should thrive if playing with Fox (ball handler) and Bazemore (new and improved Ariza), Barnes, and Holmes (good team and individual defenders). And that's what we saw last year.
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