[News] Kings and Schroder agree on three year 45 million dollar contract. No sign and trade

[SacTownKid]

If he really wanted to be vindictive they could renounce his rights. Then he's looking at MLE max with no sign and trade available.

What they do is drag this out to October if they want to be vindictive. As it is it's not appearing like the entire league is lining up to pay Kuminga. This is why the Kings could potentially get boned because the Kings also have no leverage via cap space. I really like Kuminga and he's the best option we've heard the Kings being interested in in a long time, but this has the makings of picking up another BAD contract in the end. If the wins come along then that will take care of itself, but if they don't? Again, there is a reason teams REBUILD. It simply reduces these risks.

 

[cwebb2002]

Just holding out as long as he can for the best offer. But I don’t hear much interest from other teams.

I honestly don't think they know what to do with him. If you are scared to trade him to this team, then you should probably keep and sign him

 

[Section 101]

What they do is drag this out to October if they want to be vindictive. As it is it's not appearing like the entire league is lining up to pay Kuminga. This is why the Kings could potentially get boned because the Kings also have no leverage via cap space. I really like Kuminga and he's the best option we've heard the Kings being interested in in a long time, but this has the makings of picking up another BAD contract in the end. If the wins come along then that will take care of itself, but if they don't? Again, there is a reason teams REBUILD. It simply reduces these risks.

If he was offered 5 year $150 and didn't take then this is all on him and his agents. There's no cap space out there and like we are seeing and the Warriors don't have to agree to a sign and trade. His reality where he has control is take the Warriors offer, take the QO and become unrestricted next year, or sign a MLE offer for 1 year then become unrestricted.

 

[cwebb2002]

If he was offered 5 year $150 and didn't take then this is all on him and his agents. There's no cap space out there and like we are seeing and the Warriors don't have to agree to a sign and trade. His reality where he has control is take the Warriors offer, take the QO and become unrestricted next year, or sign a MLE offer for 1 year then become unrestricted.

So why would he turn down $30M to ride the bench? Why would they offer him $30M to ride the bench? It doesnt add up for me. Was this really the offer extended or is what the warriors put out there to drive away suitors for him? I mean what they are doing with him doesnt make any sense outside of them being clueless with him or them being vindictive (and they have the best team over the last 10 years so not clueless). I think they are trying to paint him as a malcontent to drive business down. Why pay a guy 7-12M and say he isnt contributing to winning (pretty much sums up what Kerr said of him) but at the same time, make it very difficult for him to leave, AND not being active in trying to move such a money pit?

What they do is drag this out to October if they want to be vindictive. As it is it's not appearing like the entire league is lining up to pay Kuminga. This is why the Kings could potentially get boned because the Kings also have no leverage via cap space. I really like Kuminga and he's the best option we've heard the Kings being interested in in a long time, but this has the makings of picking up another BAD contract in the end. If the wins come along then that will take care of itself, but if they don't? Again, there is a reason teams REBUILD. It simply reduces these risks.

Problem is as i see it, no-one really has money except maybe Nets. He probably doesnt want to go there. Im ok if they try and take a big shot and actually try to win OR if they want to rebuild. But i cant watch them be one of these tweener teams for another few years where they have too much talent to get a top 3 pick, not enough talent to make the playoffs (top 6 - no play in) and have zero valuable assets that other teams would actually covet. They need to pick a lane. How is it everyone who comes to Sac forgets how to shoot (players) and forgets how to exec (GMs)?

 

[SacTownKid]

So why would he turn down $30M to ride the bench? Why would they offer him $30M to ride the bench? It doesnt add up for me. Was this really the offer extended or is what the warriors put out there to drive away suitors for him? I mean what they are doing with him doesnt make any sense outside of them being clueless with him or them being vindictive (and they have the best team over the last 10 years so not clueless). I think they are trying to paint him as a malcontent to drive business down. Why pay a guy 7-12M and say he isnt contributing to winning (pretty much sums up what Kerr said of him) but at the same time, make it very difficult for him to leave, AND not being active in trying to move such a money pit?


Problem is as i see it, no-one really has money except maybe Nets. He probably doesnt want to go there. Im ok if they try and take a big shot and actually try to win OR if they want to rebuild. But i cant watch them be one of these tweener teams for another few years where they have too much talent to get a top 3 pick, not enough talent to make the playoffs (top 6 - no play in) and have zero valuable assets that other teams would actually covet. They need to pick a lane. How is it everyone who comes to Sac forgets how to shoot (players) and forgets how to exec (GMs)?

For the reasons you stated above and because the Kings are always scrambling at the last minute to build an actual team along with recouping talent and using what little value they do have to do it. The Kings never rebuild, they RETOOL. Even when they're young they retool. The Kings were trying to win and Huerter was the exact type of grasp at straws while using too much value to get it that gets this team in trouble. The other unfortunately has been going for the immediate gratification of the classic older mid level PG as well. lol. Did Huerter forget how to shoot? Eh, once the blame gets placed it's usually on the player that isn't filling the need. Amazing, when he shot more times per game the shot seemed to come around in Chicago. The problem was the Kings were NEVER a Kevin Huerter away from anything once the league started to get better around them. The Beam Team wasn't some team full of players just waiting to blossom, they were topped out and ready for primtime.

Building around Fox this last time was a hail mary attempt because they didn't set their team up properly in his cheaper formative years and like this tried to cut corners when he was younger, it bombed, now in their mind it's time to immediately restock the talent supply on big money deals. This is exacly what has put them in a retooling mode because you're too good to be bad, not young enough or have high end young talent to develop, and are limiting your potential cap space to make major change from day 1. They do things like try and trade Devin Carter or Davion Mitchell or whoever before they have even developed or gotten a chance to create value. The Kings instead of building up talent tend to dump it for cheap in trade only to overpay for other talent on the market. Kuminga is a better gamble than usual but we'll see if it happens what the actual cost was if it goes down. If the Kings give up the best star package they can afford to give and he doesn't star, see you in 7 years, haha.

 

[Caccia]

What I don't get is why the Warriors are not interested in Malik Monk. Perhaps they think he is a poor basketball player? My wife thinks he might not fit in the Warriors' offensive system. In any case, they do not actually have a backup point guard, and Steph Curry is not getting any younger. Podziemski is listed as a combo guard, but he only averaged 3.44 assists per game last season.

 

[TheMobb]

What I don't get is why the Warriors are not interested in Malik Monk. Perhaps they think he is a poor basketball player? My wife thinks he might not fit in the Warriors' offensive system. In any case, they do not actually have a backup point guard, and Steph Curry is not getting any younger. Podziemski is listed as a combo guard, but he only averaged 3.44 assists per game last season.

I agree they could use his scoring and playmaking off the bench. I think it’s the aprons, Monk is owed about 3/60M+ and I think it puts teams in a tough spot building their team out.

 

[kingsboi]

there are still moves that will most likely be made here but if the goal is to achieve a top ten pick in the next draft, this signing will certainly help guide the team in that direction.

 

[sactowndog]

I think this off season has shown how hard it is to acquire good forwards via trade or free agency. Especially if you are a small market team that isn’t a free agent destination.

Hopefully if we have high draft picks in the future we finally keep this fact in mind.

 

[Kingster]

Yeah its definetly a weird split. My first thought is his teammates suck and can't finish? But this basically says he's a high volume ball handler and creates a lot of opportunity. Maybe not "good" opportunity though?

My first thought is that he's a "hockey assist" guy. I don't know if that fits with the stats, but that's how I see him. He can get into the paint anytime he chooses and pass to a guy who passes to an open player who takes the shot, but he's not a creative assist guy who delivers the pass for the shot. With Sabonis on this team I can live with that. Leaving Monk and Lavine out of the picture, the only other guy on the team that I see in the paint penetrating mold is Carter, who has some potential in that regard.

 

[Caccia]

My first thought is that he's a "hockey assist" guy. I don't know if that fits with the stats, but that's how I see him. He can get into the paint anytime he chooses and pass to a guy who passes to an open player who takes the shot, but he's not a creative assist guy who delivers the pass for the shot. With Sabonis on this team I can live with that. Leaving Monk and Lavine out of the picture, the only other guy on the team that I see in the paint penetrating mold is Carter, who has some potential in that regard.

Keegan could, but that would require another leap on his part, as I suggested in a different thread.

 

[kingsboi]

I think this off season has shown how hard it is to acquire good forwards via trade or free agency. Especially if you are a small market team that isn’t a free agent destination.

Hopefully if we have high draft picks in the future we finally keep this fact in mind.

just another reason to stock up on second rounders and hope you eventually stumble into a Nembhard, Christie, Herb, etc. I realize agents are dictating where their players end up but it must be done

 

[Caccia]

A Pistons podcaster, Ku Khahil, says that "100% a sign and trade between the Pistons and the Kings will be happening." There are two scenarios: 1) Monk goes the Pistons 2) the Pistons receive "a $14 million TPE, which is a trade exception, that they could either use immediately or they could take into the regular season."

Khahil prefers scenario #1. He also states that the three-team trade among the Kings, Warriors, and Pistons is being held up because a lot of Golden State people do not want to send Jonathan Kuminga to a division rival. The motivation for Detroit is not to lose Schröder for nothing, while the motivation for Sacramento is to ship off Malik Monk and his salary, which increases every year for three years.

https://www.kagstv.com/video/sports...oder/535-56eef10e-5c8a-45f4-b4f6-45919701cc65

 

[sactowndog]

A Pistons podcaster, Ku Khahil, says that "100% a sign and trade between the Pistons and the Kings will be happening." There are two scenarios: 1) Monk goes the Pistons 2) the Pistons receive "a $14 million TPE, which is a trade exception, that they could either use immediately or they could take into the regular season."

Khahil prefers scenario #1. He also states that the three-team trade among the Kings, Warriors, and Pistons is being held up because a lot of Golden State people do not want to send Jonathan Kuminga to a division rival. The motivation for Detroit is not to lose Schröder for nothing, while the motivation for Sacramento is to ship off Malik Monk and his salary, which increases every year for three years.

https://www.kagstv.com/video/sports...oder/535-56eef10e-5c8a-45f4-b4f6-45919701cc65

I will point out that had we not taken back Zach Lavine we would have had more room to sign Kuminga straight away. I am not enough of a cap guru to know the exact amount. Perhaps @Capt. Factorial can clarify what we would have had?

 

[Capt. Factorial]

I will point out that had we not taken back Zach Lavine we would have had more room to sign Kuminga straight away. I am not enough of a cap guru to know the exact amount. Perhaps @Capt. Factorial can clarify what we would have had?

San Antonio didn't have a ton of expiring salary to give back in the Fox trade, so it's not like we could have come into this year with $25M+ in cap space to sign Kuminga outright.

This is a league and a CBA where basically everybody is going to be operating above the cap, that's just the way it is right now. So no, bringing back LaVine didn't really hurt us in the pursuit of Kuminga in an outright deal, that was really never going to happen. Also, LaVine is a better player than Kuminga right now, so...

 

[The_Jamal]

San Antonio didn't have a ton of expiring salary to give back in the Fox trade, so it's not like we could have come into this year with $25M+ in cap space to sign Kuminga outright.

This is a league and a CBA where basically everybody is going to be operating above the cap, that's just the way it is right now. So no, bringing back LaVine didn't really hurt us in the pursuit of Kuminga in an outright deal, that was really never going to happen. Also, LaVine is a better player than Kuminga right now, so...

It is strange how so many people forget that 23/4/4 on elite efficiency is incredibly rare in the NBA. LaVine has problems of course, but it's weird that people treat him like he's a nothing on the floor

 

[Tetsujin]

San Antonio didn't have a ton of expiring salary to give back in the Fox trade, so it's not like we could have come into this year with $25M+ in cap space to sign Kuminga outright.

This is a league and a CBA where basically everybody is going to be operating above the cap, that's just the way it is right now. So no, bringing back LaVine didn't really hurt us in the pursuit of Kuminga in an outright deal, that was really never going to happen. Also, LaVine is a better player than Kuminga right now, so...

But you’re forgetting who you’re talking to. Being tall is more important than being good at basketball

 

[iowamcnabb]

I’m sure I’ve just missed the reason but why has the sign and trade for Schroder not been completed? Are we only trading Monk to the Pistons if we get Kuminga? Even if the Kuminga deal falls through would Scott not want to clear the space so he has a midlevel available? He’s made it clear that Monk is not his type of player, if there is no reasonable return for him he should just get off the money.

 

[The_Jamal]

I’m sure I’ve just missed the reason but why has the sign and trade for Schroder not been completed? Are we only trading Monk to the Pistons if we get Kuminga? Even if the Kuminga deal falls through would Scott not want to clear the space so he has a midlevel available? He’s made it clear that Monk is not his type of player, if there is no reasonable return for him he should just get off the money.

Yeah, the longer this drags on, the more interesting it gets. I assume we'd have some finality by now if GS was completely out on trading us Kuminga.

 

[Capt. Factorial]

But you’re forgetting who you’re talking to. Being tall is more important than being good at basketball

Kuminga came from the "top prospects opting out of NBA Combine measurements" era, so there's no way to know how big he really is, but he's listed at 6'8", which isn't that tall for a PF who might slide to the wing a bit. Not remotely sure what his wingspan or standing reach might be, though.

 

[Capt. Factorial]

I’m sure I’ve just missed the reason but why has the sign and trade for Schroder not been completed? Are we only trading Monk to the Pistons if we get Kuminga? Even if the Kuminga deal falls through would Scott not want to clear the space so he has a midlevel available? He’s made it clear that Monk is not his type of player, if there is no reasonable return for him he should just get off the money.

Schröder is a "done deal" from the Schröder point of view - meaning he will be signing a deal, they already know how big the deal will be, he'll be a King, etc.

The only question is how the deal is structured. It looks right now that the deal will either be a S&T with Monk going back or a S&T into a trade exception that the Kings hold. Either way that allows the Kings to retain their MLE. But the whole thing is dependent on what the Kings can manage to do on whatever other fronts they are currently pursuing, including most obviously Kuminga.

It may be a bit difficult to understand what is going on from the Pistons' side, so we should work through it:

The Kings approached Schröder and offered him a contract worth basically the full MLE (and a starting slot!) which Schröder accepted. There's really nothing Detroit can do about this, because Dennis can just outright join the Kings. But Detroit doesn't want to get left with nothing, so they start talking sign-and-trade scenarios. The simplest, of course, is to trade Schröder into an existing trade exception that the Kings have, which creates a trade exception for Detroit. The Kings' motivation to do this would be to retain their MLE. The other option being considered is trading Monk back. This would free up some future salary and a roster spot for the Kings, so there's some motivation on the Kings side to do it, but most likely the Kings think that sending Monk back just to retain their MLE (and sign "who knows" with it) might not be better than just holding on to Monk and seeing what else they can do with him. Including, of course, the Kuminga thing. There might be other avenues we don't really know about.

So anyway, Schröder will definitely be here, but the deal structure isn't final because we're still weighing our options.

 

[sactowndog]

San Antonio didn't have a ton of expiring salary to give back in the Fox trade, so it's not like we could have come into this year with $25M+ in cap space to sign Kuminga outright.

This is a league and a CBA where basically everybody is going to be operating above the cap, that's just the way it is right now. So no, bringing back LaVine didn't really hurt us in the pursuit of Kuminga in an outright deal, that was really never going to happen. Also, LaVine is a better player than Kuminga right now, so...

San Antonio had quite a bit of open cap space and did not need to send out salary. The threat was they could just sign him later.

From the New York Times

Shockingly, the 2025-26 Spurs have less than a max slot. They are looking at about $28 million in cap space before adding potential draft picks, so it projects to be more like $15 million to $20 million (plus the $8.8 million room exception), as their own pick and the Hawks’ unprotected selection could come at a big combined price tag. While they could open up more spending power in 2025, I am fascinated to see how their front office thinks about 2026, because they could have massive space before Victor Wembanyama’s inevitable extension begins in 2027.

 

[Capt. Factorial]

San Antonio had quite a bit of open cap space and did not need to send out salary. The threat was they could just sign him later.

The threat of signing him later has nothing to do with what their cap space/contract situation was at the time. San Antonio absolutely could not have taken Fox into cap space back at the deadline. They had to send salary back to Kings (or, as it turned out, the Bulls) to comply with the traded player exception in the CBA. Their ability to have cap space to sign him two summers in the future is irrelevant to that point.

From the New York Times

Shockingly, the 2025-26 Spurs have less than a max slot. They are looking at about $28 million in cap space before adding potential draft picks, so it projects to be more like $15 million to $20 million (plus the $8.8 million room exception), as their own pick and the Hawks’ unprotected selection could come at a big combined price tag. While they could open up more spending power in 2025, I am fascinated to see how their front office thinks about 2026, because they could have massive space before Victor Wembanyama’s inevitable extension begins in 2027.

Again, their ability to open up cap space in the summer of 2026 has nothing to do with their cap space situation in February of 2025.

 

[sactowndog]

The threat of signing him later has nothing to do with what their cap space/contract situation was at the time. San Antonio absolutely could not have taken Fox into cap space back at the deadline. They had to send salary back to Kings (or, as it turned out, the Bulls) to comply with the traded player exception in the CBA. Their ability to have cap space to sign him two summers in the future is irrelevant to that point.



Again, their ability to open up cap space in the summer of 2026 has nothing to do with their cap space situation in February of 2025.

Okay but the Kings could have looked for an expiring contract. They didn’t have to take on one of the worst contracts in the NBA

 

[Capt. Factorial]

Okay but the Kings could have looked for an expiring contract. They didn’t have to take on one of the worst contracts in the NBA

The Spurs didn't have expiring contracts. OK, they may have had like one or two min deals, but they legitimately had at least 10 non-expiring contracts at the time of the trade. They wanted to send out guys like Devin Vassell (4 years as of today), Keldon Johnson (2 years as of today), and Zach Collins (one year as of today). There just wasn't a deal out there to trade Fox for cap space.

 

[pdxKingsFan]

The Spurs didn't have expiring contracts. OK, they may have had like one or two min deals, but they legitimately had at least 10 non-expiring contracts at the time of the trade. They wanted to send out guys like Devin Vassell (4 years as of today), Keldon Johnson (2 years as of today), and Zach Collins (one year as of today). There just wasn't a deal out there to trade Fox for cap space.

The Spurs were trying to force us to take on bad money with the Fox deal and to me that was one of the most objectionable parts of it. Who knows how much the Kings really wanted Zach based on stuff Peja has said, who knows if we had just accepted more of their trash if we could have extracted picks, but the fact is at the time Fox was causing the team morale to tank and we were dropping winnable games coming off a hot-streak after Doug stepped in and his team had us over the barrel and the Spurs basically got to play who blinks first.

That's where we're at with the Warriors now. If Kuminga re-signs with them no real harm done, but then they are giving big money to a malcontent who they also don't see any future with just so they "don't lose him for nothing" and we've seen that have a long history of not playing out well. Sign and trades usually return garbage as we all should know from when we let Tyreke and Thomas go. Hell even Chicago got very little when we took on DDR - the Spurs netted the rewards for being a team with some cap space to absorb HB and got the pick swap as a bonus (still find it amazing that any Fox deal didn't either kill that swap or switch it to give us the right to swap but eh).

I kind of just want this to end so we can move on to whatever our next plan is, but I am also enjoying seeing Dubs fans get twisted up about this.